Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...
Anderson easily, he's not making decisions based on political climates and instead prefers doing the right thing... that's the type of leader that's ideal.
That's why George W. Bush was America's greatest president!
Who do you think is the logical choice for the human council member and why?
Débuté par
tommyt_1994
, oct. 15 2010 09:26
#76
Guest_Shandepared_*
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:52
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That's why George W. Bush was America's greatest president!
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#77
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:52
Barquiel
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tommyt_1994 wrote...
While renegades often get shafted.
I can't think of a single example...
#78
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:52
Xilizhra
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Clearly our opinion differs here as well.Shandepared wrote...
Xilizhra wrote...
I think the best explanation is that Renegades care about nothing but getting the job done; thus, they get nothing but the job done.
This kind of logic would work well in a book about a paragon and a renegade Spectre but it is not good in a video game.
#79
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:53
FuturePasTimeCE
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who cares... who will logically disengage a annoying dampener of super headaches?
#80
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:55
Count Viceroy
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Barquiel wrote...
tommyt_1994 wrote...
While renegades often get shafted.
I can't think of a single example...
Killing of the rachni?
#81
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Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:56
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Barquiel wrote...
I can't think of a single example...
Killed Helena Blake? Nothing .
Killed Fist? Nothing.
Killed Shiala? Shorter conversation with a stranger.
Killed Rana? Nothing.
Killed the Council? Don't even get to see the new one.
Killed the rachni queen? Nothing.
Killed Lord Darius? Nothing. (could be a glitch though, since there were supposed to be news reports)
Didn't give the geth data to Tali? Nothing.
Gianna got killed? Nothing.
You see in many cases a renegade import is the same as a non-import, which kind of defeats the fun of importing.
Xilizhra wrote...
Clearly our opinion differs here as well.
If you play renegade you don't benefit as much from the import process. This undermines the Mass Effect series' main selling point.
Modifié par Shandepared, 15 octobre 2010 - 11:57 .
#82
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:56
Casuist
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Count Viceroy wrote...
Most if not all games reward the good path, and only punish the bad one. There's a few exceptions, the witcher being one of them. There's not a single bad outcome so far regarding any paragon decision. The rachni had the potential to be one, but no.
There's no gameplay punishment or reward of either approach (what, aliens don't like you? I thought that was the point), which is as it should be. The paragon vs. renegade dichotomy bears no inherent strategic imbalance. Playing either perspective invariably generally doesn't make sense.
#83
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:56
Therion942
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Udina of course.
Logic never got in the way of me doing what the hell I want though.
Logic never got in the way of me doing what the hell I want though.
#84
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:56
Nightwriter
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Count Viceroy wrote...
Most if not all games reward the good path, and only punish the bad one. There's a few exceptions, the witcher being one of them. There's not a single bad outcome so far regarding any paragon decision. The rachni had the potential to be one, but no.
I don't think it's BioWare's intention to punish either party.
But we can't do anything to help the fact that being a jerk pisses people off and killing people makes them dead. So renegades get pissed off people and less content.
However, I don't argue that the rachni example is a case of them rewarding a paragon decision.
#85
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:58
Casuist
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Um... if you want characters to be around in the next game... typically it makes sense not to kill them. If minor content cameos are enough for you to want to change your roleplay, you can't be particularly invested in that role.
#86
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:59
Count Viceroy
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Nightwriter wrote...
But we can't do anything to help the fact that being a jerk pisses people off and killing people makes them dead. So renegades get pissed off people and less content.
However, I don't argue that the rachni example is a case of them rewarding a paragon decision.
No ones arguing the fact that renegades kill of more people and thus get less content, which is btw kinda ridiculous. Mainly its the fact that the paragon/good decisions *NEVER* backfire. Ever.
We don't know about the rachni yet, they could be good and they could also be bad, but why would a paragon decision turn bad? they'll be allies and that'll be that. Renegades will never see that.
Modifié par Count Viceroy, 16 octobre 2010 - 12:02 .
#87
Posté 15 octobre 2010 - 11:59
Xilizhra
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And why do you want to have this happen? I'm all for Renegades getting more content, but I like what I have with Paragons now.
#89
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:07
philiposophy
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Not taking renegade interrupts can lead to harder fights on Garrus recruitment, Mordin loyalty and Miranda loyalty missions. It is not entirely accurate to say that renegade choices never pay off and that paragon ones always do.
#90
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Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:08
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Nightwriter wrote...
But we can't do anything to help the fact that being a jerk pisses people off and killing people makes them dead. So renegades get pissed off people and less content.
Why am I not surprised it is left entirely up to me to provide rational alternatives?
Killed Shiala? You meet Elyzabeth Beynam.
Killed Gianna? You meet Miss Matsuo.
Killed the rachni queen? Maybe you get interviewed about the Peak 15 incident since with the rachni queen dead the Council opted to make what happened their public, to punish Binary-Helix? Or maybe with word of this getting back to Tuchanka resulting in extra brownie points?
Killed the Council? MEET THE NEW COUNCIL.
Killed Balak? You get an email from Simon Atwell. (alternative or perhaps in addition to this if you let Balak go then you get a message from him on Franklin and the colony of Watson is a total loss because there are NO kill codes available for the missiles)
Killed Helena Blake? At least a news report on the curtailing of smuggling would be nice, something that acknowledges that you completed that quest.
If you killed Fist then that should be brought up somewhere, perhaps with Miss Al'Jilani who uses it as an example of Shepard abusing his power (you weren't a Spectre at that point). Dialog would change a bit if Wrex was actually the one who killed him.
Not sure what to do about Rana Thanoptis. So I'm drawing a blank on that one.
Modifié par Shandepared, 16 octobre 2010 - 12:11 .
#91
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:08
Barquiel
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Shandepared wrote...
If you play renegade you don't benefit as much from the import process. This undermines the Mass Effect series' main selling point.
What do you expect?
They could create more placeholders, but who should replace the rachni-asari? or Rana?
If Rana Thanoptis or the rachni are vital in a battle against the reaper fleet, I would agree. Renegades are punished.
#92
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:08
Count Viceroy
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AntiChri5 wrote...
Hey, Viceroy, Elnora says hi.
She's a merc who pulls a gun on you, you defend yourself like any military trained person would and you happen to kill a murderer by chance. I'm not seeing is a real comparison, but fair enough. Thats one for paragon how many renegade now?
#93
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:12
Xilizhra
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Viceroy, I ask again: why do you want Paragons to be punished?
Also, Paragons defend themselves against Elnora too; Renegades throw out a cliche one-liner that makes Elnora freak out and shoot you, ironically obviating the point of shooting first. As a nice bonus, it does nothing at all.
Also, Paragons defend themselves against Elnora too; Renegades throw out a cliche one-liner that makes Elnora freak out and shoot you, ironically obviating the point of shooting first. As a nice bonus, it does nothing at all.
#94
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Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:12
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Barquiel wrote...
What do you expect?
I expect to benefit as much from an import as a paragon does in the form of cameos, consequences, and other references to what I did in the first game. Obviously a character who died in ME1 can't appear in ME2 but there are usually alternatives available as long as you did the associated quest.
#95
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:13
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Shand, you make decisions based on unlocking content later on?
#96
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:14
Count Viceroy
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Xilizhra wrote...
Viceroy, I ask again: why do you want Paragons to be punished?
What I want, is for both alignment to be treated equally.
#97
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:15
Barquiel
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Shandepared wrote...
Barquiel wrote...
What do you expect?
I expect to benefit as much from an import as a paragon does in the form of cameos, consequences, and other references to what I did in the first game. Obviously a character who died in ME1 can't appear in ME2 but there are usually alternatives available as long as you did the associated quest.
Yes, I saw your post...answered.
The new council is definitely sloppy writing.
Modifié par Barquiel, 16 octobre 2010 - 12:17 .
#98
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:15
mosor
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Barquiel wrote...
Shandepared wrote...
If you play renegade you don't benefit as much from the import process. This undermines the Mass Effect series' main selling point.
What do you expect?
They could create more placeholders, but who should replace the rachni-asari? or Rana?
If Rana Thanoptis or the rachni are vital in a battle against the reaper fleet, I would agree. Renegades are punished.
Personally I'm not nostalgic for past characters. Well maybe Shiala! One of the benefits of a renegade playthough is that you get to save the galaxy in less time. By the time you finish talking to every person from your past, you'll probably be incorperated into some reaper shell!
#99
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:16
hamtyl07
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Shandepared wrote...
Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...
Anderson easily, he's not making decisions based on political climates and instead prefers doing the right thing... that's the type of leader that's ideal.
That's why George W. Bush was America's greatest president!
one question how doe we go from the ME universe to a former US president
#100
Posté 16 octobre 2010 - 12:19
Therion942
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hamtyl07 wrote...
Shandepared wrote...
Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...
Anderson easily, he's not making decisions based on political climates and instead prefers doing the right thing... that's the type of leader that's ideal.
That's why George W. Bush was America's greatest president!
one question how doe we go from the ME universe to a former US president
We're only 3 steps away from Godwining the entire thread, let's go for glory team!
