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What do you do with Maelon?


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#126
Phaedon

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GodWood wrote...
Hmm... I don't know. I understand what you mean, but what STG did wasn't exactly good as well.

The STG chose the best possible solution.


It was also immoral. At least to Maelon. He scr**** the krogan and now he wants to fix that. I can't help but think that he is a good guy, or at least someone who doesn't deserve to get shot.

The experiments were indeed horrible. He should pay for his crimes in a way, perhaps by redeeming himself. I think that he thought that if he cured the genophage, more lives would be saved, and that he was doing the right thing.

Modifié par Phaedon, 17 octobre 2010 - 08:52 .


#127
Arijharn

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 I shoot him, if only for justice for the guy who was left to rot on the staircase.

#128
Big I

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I always let him live because:

a) I undersood and supported his wishing to stop the genophage, if not the methods he went about it

B) It's unclear how culpable he is fo the experiments (the Weyrlocs also have to take some responsibility). Mordin even says the krogan female was a volunteer, and the scout seemed williing to be a part of the experiment.

c) I've already beaten him.

d) Most importantly it's bad for Mordin to let him kill Maelon. Mordin even thanks you afterwards.

#129
DPSSOC

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I actually just thought this decision would be good for a second (renegade) interrupt.

Shepard: Mordin you don't have to do this. You're not a murderer.
Mordin: No, not a murderer. Thank you Shepard [Interrupt]
Shepard: shoots Maelon But I am.

Thus achieving both goals, Mordin has a clear conscience and Maelon is no longer a threat to anyone, ever.

Modifié par DPSSOC, 17 octobre 2010 - 01:08 .


#130
Count Viceroy

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DPSSOC wrote...

I actually just thought this decision would be good for a second (renegade) interrupt.

Shepard: Mordin you don't have to do this. You're not a murderer.
Mordin: No, not a murderer. Thank you Shepard [Interrupt]
Shepard: shoots Maelon But I am.

Thus achieving both goals, Mordin has a clear conscience and Maelon is no longer a threat to anyone, ever.


Already had this exact scene in Me1 though, with Toombs and the cerberus scientist.

#131
AntiChri5

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I like DP's idea. As it is the only way to make Maelon answer for his actions is to let Mordin kill him.

#132
Count Viceroy

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Yeah don't get me wrong, I'd shoot the guy in a heartbeat but i'd like the scene to play out differently than the toombs one.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 octobre 2010 - 02:00 .


#133
mosor

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I'd let Maelon live, if he ended up as the Salarian in Urdnot Torsk's video.

#134
Xilizhra

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I spare him. With Clan Weyrloc annihilated, he doesn't have anywhere else to go for his experiments, and I don't really think he deserved to die.

#135
mosor

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Xilizhra wrote...

I spare him. With Clan Weyrloc annihilated, he doesn't have anywhere else to go for his experiments, and I don't really think he deserved to die.


Krogan clans like Weyrloc are a dime a dozen on Tuchanka.

#136
Xilizhra

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This is clearly why everyone says that Maelon would be killed if he tried to go anywhere else. I also don't think that any other clans run a galaxy-spanning mercenary band to rake in cash.

#137
AntiChri5

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That isn't what our Krogan expert said.

#138
Epic777

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Count Viceroy wrote...

Christmas Ape wrote...

If you're still trying to be a Spectre, he needs to die.
What's your job description? Preserve galactic stability. Under no circumstances does "krogan released from the genophage" qualify as preserving galactic stability. Maelon is a textbook example of the reasons Spectres are above the law in the execution of their duties; it might not be right to let Mordin shoot him, but it is necessary.
Besides, they were going to be making trouble for Urdnot, and King Bro needs all the help he can get right now.


Well said. :wizard:

You think the krogan will play nice if they ever get cured of the 'phage? It's going to be even more ugly than the rebellions that forced the 'phage in the first place. Wrex is cool and all, and what he's doing is cool, but he's rather insignificant in the grand scheme of the krogan race.


This is something I never understood. Just the KILL krogan already, why create a new a modified genophage everytime the krogan population spikes? If it is the firm belief that NOTHING will change the brutal krogan culture, then go full out genocide. 

#139
Count Viceroy

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Mordin feels the salarians are at fault for rising the krogan to spaceflight too quickly in the first place as they were needed to fight the racnhi, He believes this is one of the reasons why the krogan never had time to work past their natural aggression. Genocide isnt their intent, they are just trying to fix a leak they started.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 octobre 2010 - 08:47 .


#140
Epic777

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Count Viceroy wrote...

Mordin feels the salarians are at fault for rising the krogan to spaceflight too quickly in the first place as they were needed to fight the racnhi, He believes this is one of the reasons why the krogan never had time to work past their natural aggression. Genocide isnt their intent, they are just trying to fix a leak they started.

 
The salarian genophage fix is like constantly repairing an old car, at some point no amount of fixing can help. With the genophage especially the modified genophage I think salarians have passed that point. The krogan are already angry justified or not about the genophage and will probably be more so if they ever find out about the 2nd genophage. I say kill them all don't wait for the krogan to adapt or cure the genophage, again nothing will ever change the krogan.

#141
Nightwriter

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Count Viceroy wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

This makes you a nice person but a terribad spectre.


Not really. He's not a threat anymore. I think they make that pretty clear.

And it's not like I encourage Mordin to cure the genophage or something.


How is he not a threat? He has explicit knowledge in the works and possible cure of the genophage and has shown that he's fully capable of setting aside any moral qualms in order to cure it. So what if mordin bans his access to the data stg had, he probably has everything he needs already. If anyone else would get ahold of maelon they could easily continue his work.

Bioware haven written themselves into a corner here. On one hand, krogan everwhere are obssessed with the 'phage and how it affects and debilitates their society and their struggle to overcome it but if you go the paragon route they then claim that clan Werlock is unique, calling it an anomaly that they would be the only clan willing to find a way to cure it. BS, goes against everything we know about the krogan, it's like it was written to pat a paragon on the back, not to make sense.


Yeah. It happens. I love it.

Anyway:

"What if he talks to more krogan? Tells the public about the modified genophage project?"
"Special Tasks Group good at covering tracks. No proof. Weyrloc willingness to work with salarians unusual. Other krogan will kill him."

"Aren't you worried he'll start his research again?"
"No. Locking this unit. Special Tasks group can cut access to old data. Could start from scratch. Decades of work though. Didn't teach you everything I knew."

He's really no threat. They make it blatantly clear. You may not think it's logically sound, but that's the way they wrote it.

Modifié par Nightwriter, 17 octobre 2010 - 09:59 .


#142
fongiel24

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Does anybody else kind of wish there had been an option to draft Maelon onto your crew, as Mordin suggests later on the Normandy? I just think the idea of having two salarian scientists yammering away in the biolab would have been awesome.

#143
Eber

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Epic777 wrote...

This is something I never understood. Just the KILL krogan already, why create a new a modified genophage everytime the krogan population spikes? If it is the firm belief that NOTHING will change the brutal krogan culture, then go full out genocide. 


I think the salarians are somewhat full of themselves and assume they will always be able to control the lesser krogans (and make good use out of them from time to time). Then there are hippies like Mordin who think biodiversity has intrinsic value. A view shared by many asari...

#144
DPSSOC

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Epic777 wrote...
This is something I never understood. Just the KILL krogan already, why create a new a modified genophage everytime the krogan population spikes? If it is the firm belief that NOTHING will change the brutal krogan culture, then go full out genocide.


The Genophage is not a punishment, it is merely meant to counterbalance the Krogans removal from their natural environment.  The Krogan leaped centuries, possibly millenia, forward when the Salarians found them, this gave them an advantage over their environment they'd never had before.  It has been shown that as technological level and standard of living improve population growth drops.  To illustrate this point at the turn of the 20th century many more people lived in rurals areas than do now.  At the time it was also common for families to have 5+ children.  Fastforward to the turn of the 21st century and we have most of our population living in cities and the avearage family only has 1-2 children.

Had the Krogan reached the technological level to find the Mass Relays themselves their birth rate would have dropped considerably and the Krogan wouldn't be nearly the threat they were for the Rebellions.  The Salarian accelleration of the Krogan didn't allow them to develope that lower birthrate naturally so in order to compensate the Salarians chopped it down.  They didn't want to kill the Krogan just correct the mistake they had made in advancing them too far too fast.

#145
Giggles_Manically

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Mordin also says that all life is precious, and the universe demands/needs diversity.



As we saw not all Krogan are bad.(Urdnot scout/ Poet Krogan) I do think that the Krogan are going to change under Wrex though. He wont change them but his ideas seem to be pushing them in the right direction.

#146
Cyberstrike nTo

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mosor wrote...

I'd let Maelon live, if he ended up as the Salarian in Urdnot Torsk's video.


I think it's safe bet to believe that was Maelon.

#147
philiposophy

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I let him live because it fits nicely with Mordin's "not a murderer!" arc. Metagaming? Yup.

#148
Epic777

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DPSSOC wrote...

Epic777 wrote...
This is something I never understood. Just the KILL krogan already, why create a new a modified genophage everytime the krogan population spikes? If it is the firm belief that NOTHING will change the brutal krogan culture, then go full out genocide.


The Genophage is not a punishment, it is merely meant to counterbalance the Krogans removal from their natural environment.  The Krogan leaped centuries, possibly millenia, forward when the Salarians found them, this gave them an advantage over their environment they'd never had before.  It has been shown that as technological level and standard of living improve population growth drops.  To illustrate this point at the turn of the 20th century many more people lived in rurals areas than do now.  At the time it was also common for families to have 5+ children.  Fastforward to the turn of the 21st century and we have most of our population living in cities and the avearage family only has 1-2 children.

Had the Krogan reached the technological level to find the Mass Relays themselves their birth rate would have dropped considerably and the Krogan wouldn't be nearly the threat they were for the Rebellions.  The Salarian accelleration of the Krogan didn't allow them to develope that lower birthrate naturally so in order to compensate the Salarians chopped it down.  They didn't want to kill the Krogan just correct the mistake they had made in advancing them too far too fast.


Still its an artificial limitation, not a social or environmental change. I have heard this argument before about families. Understand, why don't most Western families have large families? A women can as many children back then as now. Partly because more children are living to maturity and are not dying plus many other reasons. Social reasons not just technological. Understand a women can have as many children now as back then, however for social reasons we do not, it is not simply because of technology. 

Again its an artificial limit, only a few fertile females meaning the majority are infertile.  If the genophage was not a punishment then why modify it? Let the krogan adapt to their growing population, will they go to war?I do not know. No one knows, as know one knows the future. For me, the salarians have opened pandoras box but cannot fully close it. If the krogan got their act together and had a stable government and a stable population they will still resent the council/ salarians. 

If what I said above sounds like nonsense, then I stand by what I said before still stands, kill 'em all.

On a side note: I wonder if people are more angry that maelon experimented on humans more than anything else?

Modifié par Epic777, 18 octobre 2010 - 01:09 .


#149
Praetor Knight

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Epic777 wrote...

DPSSOC wrote...

Epic777 wrote...
This is something I never understood. Just the KILL krogan already, why create a new a modified genophage everytime the krogan population spikes? If it is the firm belief that NOTHING will change the brutal krogan culture, then go full out genocide.


The Genophage is not a punishment, it is merely meant to counterbalance the Krogans removal from their natural environment.  The Krogan leaped centuries, possibly millenia, forward when the Salarians found them, this gave them an advantage over their environment they'd never had before.  It has been shown that as technological level and standard of living improve population growth drops.  To illustrate this point at the turn of the 20th century many more people lived in rurals areas than do now.  At the time it was also common for families to have 5+ children.  Fastforward to the turn of the 21st century and we have most of our population living in cities and the avearage family only has 1-2 children.

Had the Krogan reached the technological level to find the Mass Relays themselves their birth rate would have dropped considerably and the Krogan wouldn't be nearly the threat they were for the Rebellions.  The Salarian accelleration of the Krogan didn't allow them to develope that lower birthrate naturally so in order to compensate the Salarians chopped it down.  They didn't want to kill the Krogan just correct the mistake they had made in advancing them too far too fast.


Still its an artificial limitation, not a social or environmental change. I have heard this argument before about families. Understand, why don't most Western families have large families? A women can as many children back then as now. Partly because more children are living to maturity and are not dying plus many other reasons. Social reasons not just technological. Understand a women can have as many children now as back then, however for social reasons we do not, it is not simply because of technology. 

Again its an artificial limit, only a few fertile females meaning the majority are infertile.  If the genophage was not a punishment then why modify it? Let the krogan adapt to their growing population, will they go to war?I do not know. No one knows, as know one knows the future. For me, the salarians have opened pandoras box but cannot fully close it. If the krogan got their act together and had a stable government and a stable population they will still resent the council/ salarians. 

If what I said above sounds like nonsense, then I stand by what I said before still stands, kill 'em all.

On a side note: I wonder if people are more angry that maelon experimented on humans more than anything else?


I'd like to agree with you, especially since I like the krogans as a species, and I hope Wrex can be that catalyst for the krogan, darn blood rage!

Maybe the reapers are just what they need to unite? A foreign enemy can do wonders for internal strife and maybe Wrex can also use Shep to take out other troublesome krogan warlords to not seriously upset the balance on Tuchanka, ninja assassin style :ph34r:, like how Shep helps the Patriarch if he takes out the mercs for him as his krantt.

#150
Dean_the_Young

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Killed him,destroyed the data.



I don't think anything could undermine Wrex's reforms faster than the cure, and Wrex's reforms and unification policy are the best means to get a solid Krogan force behind us. Curing the genophage gives superferlous numbers, but numbers of ground troops aren't what are needed to fight the Reapers.