315 réponses à ce sujet

[Meltemph]

The concept of "stats" or "attributes" exists entirely outside of a games "immersion."

So someone can't get immersed in the statistics portion of a game? It personally adds a lot of immersion to me, for a game, if I can number crunch, I definitely can get lost in stuff like that for quite awhile. I know a lot of people who get absorbed by stuff like that.

[Kileyan]

ChickenDownUnder wrote...

I've got a different question, but it does relate to armor.

Can we wear pants?

I know where this is going, no there won't be a hide pants option:)

[JamieCOTC]

Head gear in DA doesn't bother me. Mass Effect on the other hand ...

[ydaraishy]

Kileyan wrote...

ydaraishy wrote...

If you don't want the awesome stats a dead peacock gives you, then breaking immersion and making your dead peacock be invisible but getting the stats still is a better option? Huh?

This is where everyone argues about what is a rp game and what breaks immersion.

Perhaps immersion was a bad word. Consistency is better. Letting people gain the stats from wearing an item, but having that item not visible, implies that there are invisible garments in the world. This doesn't make any sense here.

These arguments in DAO boiled down to people complaining that players wanted something for nothing. That isn't the case. They don't want free helms with awesome stats handed out for doing nothing to earn them. What they want is the option to see their characters faces, and yes, sometimes the options to hide very fugly hats. Were the itemization power of hats really based upon ugly being part of the trade off?

I can't see Bioware thinking to themselves, this hat is really powerful, I think to balance it out, it should be ugly so that a)people won't use it or those that do use it will have to pay for its power by looking at a bird on their head for 30 hours.

I'd rather be able to hide helms, but the lack of the option won't affect my like of the game at all. Gaider gets in a tizzy anytime a toggle is mentioned. I don't blame him, we'd have a toggle list so long, they'd have to have a full time team just designing toggled versions of every part of the game.

Making things ugly in order to balance things out is a weak way of imparting balance, sure, but allowing them to be invisible is decidely not the way to fix the problem.

Modifié par ydaraishy, 18 octobre 2010 - 12:53 .

[Maverick827]

Meltemph wrote...

The concept of "stats" or "attributes" exists entirely outside of a games "immersion."

So someone can't get immersed in the statistics portion of a game? It personally adds a lot of immersion to me, for a game, if I can number crunch, I definitely can get lost in stuff like that for quite awhile. I know a lot of people who get absorbed by stuff like that.

That's not what "immersion" means, at least not in this context.

Modifié par Maverick827, 18 octobre 2010 - 12:52 .

[Koralis]

Si-Shen wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

And next would be the toggle for armor, right? You want the bonus for wearing it (if there is one), but you don't want to have to look at it?

That'll be up to the Dev team, but I hope that if you choose to wear a piece of head gear, you wear a piece of head gear. If you don't want to, then you assume the risks for doing so.

Personally, I agree with this 100%, if you don't want to look at it, don't wear it.  Why should you get the benifit of something you dont want to actually wear for any other reason then to get a bit more armor.

Because "in real life" you'd always wear a helmet.  However, wearing a helmet basically means that your face that you spent 2 hours customizing is never seen.  It's annoying as hell, especially if they don't remove it for cut scenes, etc.

What was that about gameplay trumping reality?  I seem to recall some game company claiming that at some point...  surely being able to see your character rather than bioware's static artwork should be seen as somewhat important to people and not "pooh pooh"''d

Modifié par Koralis, 18 octobre 2010 - 12:56 .

[dopefourtwo]

Meltemph wrote...

And magically losing your headgear during speech and cutscenes isnt breaking immersion?

Not just pointed at you, but... The definition immersion is very different then how you are using it. If you are no longer engrossed with a game, because someone takes a hat of when a conversation starts, either you don't like the game as much as you think you do or you get distracted really easy.

I never said I didnt like the game, dont know where you got that from...all I said was that the ugly hats had an effect on the game for me, its not a huge effect and asking for a toggle on the hats isnt asking all that much, especially when the devs should have seen this topic coming. I am currently putting time into another of my several dragon age characters. Again, I never said I was no longer "engrossed" with the game. Just to make that clear. And I could care less about my use of the definition of immersion, were not here to discuss grammar were hear to discuss the toggling of headgear, I could easily say you spelled "off" wrong but were not hear for that.

Modifié par dopefourtwo, 18 octobre 2010 - 12:57 .

[Zanaide]

Meltemph wrote...

you get distracted really easy.

Me.

But then again, I don't get immersed in a game so much as engrossed in that I tend to lose track of time when playing something I really like, as I did with DA:O. The hat thing didn't bother me that much. More of a pet-peeve with the inconsistency of the graphics.

SQUIRREL!

*Runs off*

[Ortaya Alevli]

I say do away with hats altogether.

[ChickenDownUnder]

Kileyan wrote...

ChickenDownUnder wrote...

I've got a different question, but it does relate to armor.

Can we wear pants?

I know where this is going, no there won't be a hide pants option:)

Well there should be. I mean, how will the sex scenes play out when there isn't an instant pants removal button. But besides that, the removal and wearing of pants in DA2 is a very important question, especially if Hawke is going to be doing those high jumping attacks while wearing certain skirt-like light armor.

Think of the children.

Modifié par ChickenDownUnder, 18 octobre 2010 - 12:59 .

[Bullets McDeath]

The much better solution would be to have headgear that is not arsefugly to the max. And please stick with removing them for talky-scenes. I spent hours customizing that face and hair! Lemme seeeeeee it!

I'm definitely throwing in my bid for the pants toggle, though. I can't believe not a single Bioware game has had this as an option. Seriously glaring error, Bioware.

Modifié par outlaworacle, 18 octobre 2010 - 01:02 .

[Meltemph]

That's not what "immersion" means, at least not in this context.

Sounds more like people in this topic are meaning believability... I mean, I can still be engrossed with a game, even if I find something recurring in it that I find stupid/nonsensical.

I never said I didnt like the game, dont know where you got that from...all I said was that the ugly hats had an effect on the game for me, its not a huge effect and asking for a toggle on the hats isnt asking all that much, especially when the devs should have seen this topic coming. I am currently putting time into another of my several dragon age characters. Again, I never said I was no longer "engrossed" with the game. Just to make that clear. And I could care less about my use of the definition of immersion, were not here to discuss grammar were hear to discuss the toggling of headgear, I could easiyl say you spelled "off" wrong but were not hear for that.

Misunderstood you then. I thought you were saying you became disinterested(breaking immersion) because of the hats, sorry.

[thegoldfinch]

outlaworacle wrote...

The much better solution would be to have headgear that is not arsefugly to the max.

Agreed. I would have happiy stuck a leather helmet on my rogue, if the helmet in question didn't look like a crusty cereal bowl pried from the gnarled fingers of a world weary hobo.

Modifié par pixieface, 18 octobre 2010 - 01:03 .

[Saibh]

Actually, this is a toggle that I definitely support. You know how long I spend crafting my characters? I want to see their damn heads. And if it means sacrificing armor bonuses to do it...well...unfortunately I'm a shallow, shallow person.



At least DAO didn't take the ME route and never, ever remove your helmet. I have tons of awesome armors and helmets that I never use because I'm not allowed to see Shepard's face when I do. It irritates me to no end.

[Meltemph]

I want to see their damn heads. And if it means sacrificing armor bonuses to do it...well...unfortunately I'm a shallow, shallow person.

Ha! Love the honesty! Ya, I am much the same way. Even though I know the helmet looks like ass, I still wear it because it increases my swing/spell by .20%. A toggle would be a nice remedy, but then, I would probably not use it because I would think it would be weird having a hat on, but not being able to see it, ugly or no.

Modifié par Meltemph, 18 octobre 2010 - 01:10 .

[Novasurge]

I think the problem would be more easily fixed if they just made the hats look nicer.

[dopefourtwo]

Novasurge wrote...

I think the problem would be more easily fixed if they just made the hats look nicer.

honestly with bioware that might be asking too much....but id rather they go that route.

[Siven80]

As long as headwear is removed in speeches and cutscenes i'll be happy.

[Faz432]

Toggling headgear visibility is one solution.





A better solution would be to design attractive headgear in the first place, surely?

[Lilitv]

Am I the only one who liked the Libertarian Cowl?

[Kileyan]

I'm not a realism nut. I don't really care if swords are a little big or armor has big shoulder pads.

But when I realized my threshold of immersion/realism was broken, was when I finally played a mage. I never noticed it too bad while in combat, but when I was in camp, strutting around in one of those silly mage hats, I was doing the chat up Leliana and romance thing. I looked at my character, looked at his horrible robe and bird hat, and thought to myself *really* this hot chick of the world is looking at this character, and not bursting out laughing?

I suppose that is the reason my only mage to make it past the first several levels, became an arcane warrior. I never really designed him to be a tank or min max, but I subconciously got out of those mage armors as quickly as possible.

I know, I know, in this world those hats can be imagined as great items representing a mages power and station. I just couldn't imagine it.

But yeh, I hope as people have said, hide helm won't be required, I'd much rather just have better hats, cowls or circlets, whatever.

[Zenjamin]

Chris Priestly wrote...

And next would be the toggle for armor, right? You want the bonus for wearing it (if there is one), but you don't want to have to look at it?

That'll be up to the Dev team, but I hope that if you choose to wear a piece of head gear, you wear a piece of head gear. If you don't want to, then you assume the risks for doing so.

Many people carry this line. but it doesnt make too much sense.
You think knights and other types of warriors in the midevil era always had their armor and headgear on? 

Before a battle, yes. But they are not going to go trecking for miles with 10 pounds of hot metal encasing your head.

The toggle option should not work for combat. When in combat, all your armor should show. 
but if you have the healm toggled off, it wont show unless you are in combat.


PS:
If you are ambushed by a rogue or something, then the armor you had toggled off would not trigger and you would not benifit form those stats.

[ErichHartmann]

Chris Priestly wrote...

And next would be the toggle for armor, right? You want the bonus for wearing it (if there is one), but you don't want to have to look at it?

That'll be up to the Dev team, but I hope that if you choose to wear a piece of head gear, you wear a piece of head gear. If you don't want to, then you assume the risks for doing so.

Wearing headgear in DAO doesn't increase your survival odds.   Besides my (character's) face is too pretty for hiding behind a helmet.  For the record a toggle would be very simple to implement.      

[Lumikki]

Other solution is not to connect any stats to head gear at all. Meaning there would not be any benefit to wear head gear or not. That ways hole idea is just cosmetic, the look of character, not stats.

Modifié par Lumikki, 18 octobre 2010 - 01:55 .

[Basiritz2]

Indeed, less silly hats would be good. And maybe some mage outfits that include a pair of pants. I'm sick of having to be a transvestite whenever I play a mage in every single fantasy game. Nothing wrong with once in a while, it's important to air the boy's out now and then, but all the time? My Hawke might get a cold.