146 réponses à ce sujet

[HHS_spartan]

I wanna start out by saying I love Mass Effect 2 and think that bioware did a great job on it. That being said I have to say I'm not a huge fan of the new loading screens in place of the elevator rides and such. I mean given a choice between staring at a loading screen of an elevator moving from one floor to the next and actually being in the elevator id go with the latter. I just remember how immersive it was in Mass effect one to ride the elevators and not have to deal with a loading screen. Plus it was a good chance to hear news or conversations between your squad. I also miss the airlock sequence when visiting a hub planet I mean its just a little thing like that really adds to the immersion.

So my question is does anyone else think they should brink that back for ME3?

[SimonTheFrog]

Yes to elevators and airlocks.

[Caihn]

The only things I miss about the elevators are squadmates conversations.



I prefer ME2 loading screens.

[HHS_spartan]

Yannkee wrote...

The only things I miss about the elevators are squadmates conversations.

I prefer ME2 loading screens.

Really why do you like them better? For me the load screens kinda take me out of the game. It just seems that much more immersive to go from place to place and not hit a load screen but instead hit an elevator and talk with your team or hear some news.

[Pepper4]

I hate the elevators, but without them we have very small squad interaction.

[suprhomre]

Yannkee wrote...

The only things I miss about the elevators are squadmates conversations.

I prefer ME2 loading screens.

Yes me too. One of the reason I love Wrex so much is all the sarcastic and funny conversations he have with the rest of the squad mates. 

[Pacifien]

No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

I like the squad banter. I like the news broadcasts. I like the immersion of seeing my character transport from one area to another. Do I want the elevator/airlock load screens back? No. There are other ways to implement squad banter. News broadcasts could still be heard playing in the background while wandering Omega. If they're going to show transport, I'd rather it be much better implemented than the relatively static elevator/airlock load screens. I want more cleverly disguised load times.

Modifié par Pacifien, 25 octobre 2010 - 07:44 .

[Iz Stoik zI]

Squad interaction seems to have taken a decent beating between ME1 and ME2. No conversations in elevators and you can't talk to squadmates while on a mission to get a short opinion from them. Kind of disappointing,



I do miss elevators. If I'm going to be loading a new area for thirty seconds I'd rather do it with a news report playing.

[N0touchi]

Garrus misses the elevators.....Tali doesn't.

[ODST 3]

I don't like the elevators but I miss the interaction between squad mates. Bring that back but make it significant enough that they get cutscenes!

[kalle90]

Pacifien wrote...
No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

Couldn't it just be different people with different opinions?
Or possibly that the original system wasn't perfect, but some people think it was better than the "improvement" ME2 had?

As much as I like ME1 I admit the inventory was nowhere near perfect, but ME2 doesn't even have an inventory. That's not a real improvement IMO. The same thing with Mako, it wasn't perfect (missions included) but still miles better than not having a vehicle at all (Hammerhead is DLC and still worse IMO)

On-topic: Yes. They were more immersive and contributed something. I only hated it when I had to enter an elevator multiple times in a row (though the same issue exists with loading screens), plus a bit more news/conversation and louder music wouldn't have hurt either.

[graouly]

I miss the elevators too, the interactions between squadmates (like in ME1 and KOTOR) and the mako 

[Pacifien]

kalle90 wrote...
Couldn't it just be different people with different opinions?
Or possibly that the original system wasn't perfect, but some people think it was better than the "improvement" ME2 had?

If the original system wasn't perfect and the attempt to address it wasn't any better, that doesn't mean to then revert to the original system. It would be better if the development team continued to find a better way.

So my answer is still no. No, I don't miss the elevators. I want them to find a better way.

Modifié par Pacifien, 25 octobre 2010 - 08:31 .

[hamtyl07]

i really enjoyed the airlocks and elevators i cant stand load screens at least with the elevators you got hear the news reports and the back and forth with the squad was pretty good im sick of looking at load screens with useless tips and what not i'd rather rdie an elevator or stand in an airlock compared to looking at the same load screens over and over

[Mondo47]

I do miss the sense of immersion the elevators and airlocks offered, and the chance they gave to soak up peripheral information about the world at large and your squadmates. I don't miss the elevators themselves though - they took far too long to go from A to B and usually while offering nothing visually but four walls and two people that just stand there... if your comrades had milled about, leaned against the walls, fiddled with their gear, had more conversations, or if the elevators (and I know this is impossible in some situations, but bear with me) had glass fronts that looked out into the Citadel environment - maybe passed other floors where things were taking place so you could catch a glimpse of for instance some C-Sec officers arresting someone, or some kind of shifty deal taking place, or Keepers about their maintenance work, or simply show a vista along a ward arm: towers, aircars, that kind of thing.

[kalle90]

Pacifien wrote...

kalle90 wrote...
Couldn't it just be different people with different opinions?
Or possibly that the original system wasn't perfect, but some people think it was better than the "improvement" ME2 had?

If the original system wasn't perfect and the attempt to address it wasn't any better, that doesn't mean to then revert to the original system. It would be better if the development team continued to find a better way.

The original system is the better base? That's what I see atleast in the Mako thread.

If I say "Do something else", I have no idea what I will get so it's better to say which it should be closer to. People asked for ME1 inventory to get improved and what we got? The most barebone inventory there can be. Some are happy with it but I can understand why people don't trust Bioware with more vague "Improve this" wishes

Plus most people don't have that much creativity to come up with brand new and usable ideas, and even then it's very unlikely Bioware will use them in any way.

[Mr. MannlyMan]

Pacifien wrote...

kalle90 wrote...
Couldn't it just be different people with different opinions?
Or possibly that the original system wasn't perfect, but some people think it was better than the "improvement" ME2 had?

If the original system wasn't perfect and the attempt to address it wasn't any better, that doesn't mean to then revert to the original system. It would be better if the development team continued to find a better way.

So my answer is still no. No, I don't miss the elevators. I want them to find a better way.

Suggestions, Mr. Moderator?

Personally, I think that an elevator sequence that takes about the same amount of time as an obtrusive loading screen is far better. It's also pretty much the only alternative option, other than including both options in the game (giving the player the option to walk into an elevator or use an instant-transport system like the cab terminals in ME1/ME2).

Seriously. What other "better way" could there be? They either use load screens or more immersive, seamless transitions like the elevators/airlocks. Improving load times is a given, but seriously-what better way is there?


Personally, I never understood why people didn't like the elevators. The cab terminals were littered throughout the Citadel in ME1; did people not understand what they were for? Elevators or loading screens; we were given both options in ME1. ME2 had only one option, so therefore, IMHO, it was an inferior solution.

[Pacifien]

Well, if you say you don't like something and the developers try to give you something different, and you don't like that either, it's probably a good time to start zeroing in on what you don't like about it. ME1: I don't like its inventory. --> ME2: I don't like how you got rid of the inventory. --> Well.... now what? Do you then say go back to ME1, but, you know, make it better? Make what better?

So back to the original point, what exactly is better about the elevators/airlocks of ME1 than what we got in ME2? Do you want that exactly? Or do you want that but tweaked? You can't just say the new loading screens sucked, go back to the elevators... Well, you could, but it doesn't get you anywhere. You kind of have to know why the elevators were maligned in the first place and why the new loading systems wasn't better.

Was it the squad banter? They can manage squad banter without resorting to elevators, just witness the Garrus/Tali conversation while walking down the corridors. Was it the news broadcasts? Again, you could hear news broadcasts playing in the background wherever you went on Omega, you didn't need elevators. Was it the sense of transport? Why would I want to stare at three people shuffling feet when I could be controlling the taxi myself or watching a beautiful vista pass me by?

Whatever was accomplished by the elevator/airlock sequence can be so much better done in other ways. The only thing left is load times. There are better ways to disguise load times which the developers actually did during other portions of the game. I want more of that.

Modifié par Pacifien, 25 octobre 2010 - 09:14 .

[Pacifien]

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...
Seriously. What other "better way" could there be? They either use load screens or more immersive, seamless transitions like the elevators/airlocks. Improving load times is a given, but seriously-what better way is there?

There's a segment during the final mission that is a load screen that you probably never noticed was a load screen until I told you right now. The developers can disguise load screens in much better ways than a load screen or elevator rides.

[Destroy Raiden_]

Definitely no loading screens in the blatant sense you're now loading sense. I know they must exist but make them hidden 1's use of elevators for the most part hid the fact the game was loading lets see can you do the elevators but in a shorter time frame? We all liked the conversations while you where waiting maybe sometimes shep can talk too or we can respond to curtain conversations?



I'm trying to think of other creative load screens but I really can't mostly they do a black screen, a timer, or both which is annoying and for a moment or two you think has the game froze?



We're looking for when the game loads to be doing something while its loading so its not so obvious....



The only other idea I'm coming up with beyond no elevators or physical load screens would be the load screen becomes the omni tool screen and a brief mini game plays and the player gets to try to get a high score with in the time frame if they do well then they get added bonus points if not then they don't. The import Evangelion did this type of thing with school every day you went to school you'd have to fast type a sequence or a hit the button at the correct times to get a passing grade and get points if not your character did poorly and became depressed.

[kraidy1117]

Depends. The elevators where fine on the Citadel. Everywhere else was torture because there was no music, banter or new reports.



Plus there was a lot of loading screens in ME too :/

[belwin]

Sure, some were okay,
however i like how much faster ME2 loads for me than the slllooooow elevators rides.

also, i approve of all the elevator jokes in ME2.
Garrus agrees with me:

[Quething]

I think one of the big problems with the elevators was that they actually moved. Admittedly, they wouldn't have been all that immersive if they didn't - half the point is that you can look out the glass door and see the Citadel flying past - but the problem is, that gives them a fixed duration. You still have to actually get from the top to the bottom even if your machine finished loading the next area before the squad banter even fired.



To put that in more specific terms, the machine I first played ME1 on had half a gig of memory and a seven-year-old CPU. So when I left the Citadel for the Normandy, I had two long waits; the elevator took a minute or two, then the airlock took a minute or two. I finally upgraded about a month after I bought ME2, to a much beefier machine. The airlock sequence now takes about four seconds - the little blue scanning animation doesn't even have time to run from one side to the other before the door opens - but the elevator still takes two minutes. That's a bad way to hide a loading screen.



Now the airlock I definitely want back, it's really obnoxious and disorienting to pop into orbit next to the galaxy map any time you want to duck back onto the Normandy to change your pants or get a new conversation between two missions on the same damn planet. The airlock was also superior to the elevators in that you didn't lose control of your character; it wasn't just that you could pull up the menu and check quests or switch weapons (which you could also do in elevators, and which was a very good thing and better than loading screens), but also that you could run in little circles or draw and put away your weapons or crouch or toggle run/walk. Not that you'd have any reason to want to, but the fact that you could made it seem that much more like you were still in the game world.



You would appear to lose the squad banter and news announcements this way, since if there's no fixed duration for the load, you can't easily slot in a conversation, but nothing says you have to set it up that way. Just use the Dragon Age system instead, and make "get into the transport shuttle" or whatever into a trigger action, so the banter starts up during the load and then, if the load finishes before the conversation/announcement does, it just continues while your squad gets off and walks through the next area.

[kraidy1117]

NewMessageN00b wrote...

It's quite weird with those loading screens... they sometimes just take forever. The elevators are better than this and they aid immersion.

But... really... why is this game loading for so long... of course, I can start finding my own answers on this, but none of them explains why can't they still optimize it.

P.S.
Played FO: NV recently. Now THAT is nice load times. They're so short, any animation would make them longer.

The loading itmes in NV are long as hell O.o