146 réponses à ce sujet

[Xallah]

TMA LIVE wrote...

I only like the elevators because they were a way to get banter between characters. However, they can replace that with DA banter, and then everything's fine.

Agree! More banter...

Though elevators had something special about them, long rides in a small box... Can't describe really, but they were awesome )

[Nightwriter]

I don't miss the wait, but I miss the dialogue.

In ME1 I also started to resent news announcements. They robbed me of an opportunity to hear squad banter. And it always seemed like the same announcement too.

I'd be all, "Oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter, oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter..."

*gets in the elevator*

Wait for it...
Wait for it...
WAIT FOR IT...

"A salarian excavation team has run into an unexpected problem at a Prothean dig site..."

GAH! DAMN IT! Prothean dig site announcement, you are my nemesis! Thy evil must be vanquished! Another elevator ride, WASTED!

[Christmas Ape]

Nightwriter wrote...

I don't miss the wait, but I miss the dialogue.

In ME1 I also started to resent news announcements. They robbed me of an opportunity to hear squad banter. And it always seemed like the same announcement too.

I'd be all, "Oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter, oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter..."

*gets in the elevator*

Wait for it...
Wait for it...
WAIT FOR IT...

"A salarian excavation team has run into an unexpected problem at a Prothean dig site..."

GAH! DAMN IT! Prothean dig site announcement, you are my nemesis! Thy evil must be vanquished! Another elevator ride, WASTED!

Stop the presses and start shipping parkas to hell, I am in full agreement with you.

[Icinix]

Yes I do, didn't have the load issues. Was only ever in them for a few moments at a time, and used rapid transport when I wanted to move things along a bit quicker.



I like the feel they gave the citadel, it just felt HUGE. Where as in ME2, everything feels compartmentalized, it didn't do as well throwing up the invisible boundaries that ME did...



..in fact, one of the only reasons I begun posting on these forums and stuck around was because they took out those things of ME1 because of complaints. So I jumped on here to say I wanted them back. Prior to that I was never a forum dweller...now I can't get off the damn thing.

[kalle90]

Pacifien wrote...
So back to the original point, what exactly is better about the elevators/airlocks of ME1 than what we got in ME2? Do you want that exactly? Or do you want that but tweaked? You can't just say the new loading screens sucked, go back to the elevators... Well, you could, but it doesn't get you anywhere. You kind of have to know why the elevators were maligned in the first place and why the new loading systems wasn't better..

+More seamless
+News and conversations

I wouldn't exactly complain if the elevators came back exactly like they were (They're still an improvement over what ME2 has) but I wouldn't object shorter rides and smoother implementation (Team won't stand in the same formation, no one uses elevators but my squad, there isn't always just 1 bit of news or dialogue...)

If Bioware can hide the loading screens in other ways (or practically remove loading like Halo and many other games do) then good for us, but as it is: ME1 way > ME2 way

[Tranceptor]

HHS_spartan wrote...

So my question is does anyone else think they should brink that back for ME3?

YES!

the lack of squad banter in ME2 made the game feel pretty quiet and a bit empty. Same with news reports. I hated having to click and listen to them in ME2 because it meant standing around doing nothing until they were finished. At least with the elevator you were standing around for a reason.

Airlocks I can live without.

Modifié par Tranceptor, 26 octobre 2010 - 06:16 .

[vehzeel]

To Gehennungagap with elevators and air locks.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

those elevators were slow as frack.

[tallon1982]

I wasn't a fan of either the mako or the elevators. I guess they were just necessary for ME1 since it was just something new to try out. The loading times were so long and it seemed like once you got the one small conversation or news announcement it was just a long period of silence. No, thanks. What I do miss is being able to talk to the squadmates at random while just walking around. The talking points that are in different areas are fine but I just liked the other banter you could get in ME1 too.

[Kurt Cobain]

They should return, though not as a full game thing, just a couple of small 'ME1 returns' in the story, or sidequests.

[vehzeel]

Ofc the loading screens are there. They just don't bother me much - especially since they're a lot faster than the elevators.

[Quething]

kalle90 wrote...

Pacifien wrote...
So back to the original point, what exactly is better about the elevators/airlocks of ME1 than what we got in ME2? Do you want that exactly? Or do you want that but tweaked? You can't just say the new loading screens sucked, go back to the elevators... Well, you could, but it doesn't get you anywhere. You kind of have to know why the elevators were maligned in the first place and why the new loading systems wasn't better..

+More seamless
+News and conversations

I wouldn't exactly complain if the elevators came back exactly like they were (They're still an improvement over what ME2 has) but I wouldn't object shorter rides and smoother implementation (Team won't stand in the same formation, no one uses elevators but my squad, there isn't always just 1 bit of news or dialogue...)

Yeah, if the question is "exactly what is the issue," I think it's pretty simple. Players don't like being taken out of the game. The more seamless and coherent you make the game world, the better. The more time you make them sit around doing nothing, the more annoyed you're making them.

So, a lot of people don't like the elevators, because they're almost always much slower than they need to be, so you're spending more time not playing the game then you have to. And a lot of people don't like the loading screens, because they remove you from the world and remind you that you're sitting in front of a monitor and not exploring a vast alien city. It's the same problem in both cases - your ability to play the game is being interrupted more than it needs to be.

So, the solution is... make your immersive option quicker and less mandatory (among other things, there should have been a cab stand on the C-Sec dock, and fast transit on Noveria). And make your non-immersive option more immersive. I actually didn't mind the actual elevators in ME2, for the most part; the Normandy elevator in particular with its specific graphic for each floor really did give a strong sense of where I was going and its relation to where I just was, and helped the ship feel like a coherent whole. And the generic elevator loadscreen you get on Illium was similarly helpful in saying "look, you're going up in an elevator." More of that and less of the artsy spinning ".... oh, it's an... airlock? maybe?" crap would be a huge step in the right direction (you don't hear people complaining about the relay or FTL Normandy loadscreens from ME1, after all).

(Also, get rid of the Goddamn mission complete screens, which are exactly the same problem. The musical sting is especially brutal, particularly coming off a mission like Overlord or Samara's loyalty.)

[Nightwriter]

Christmas Ape wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

I don't miss the wait, but I miss the dialogue.

In ME1 I also started to resent news announcements. They robbed me of an opportunity to hear squad banter. And it always seemed like the same announcement too.

I'd be all, "Oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter, oh please let me get some Garrus/Wrex banter..."

*gets in the elevator*

Wait for it...
Wait for it...
WAIT FOR IT...

"A salarian excavation team has run into an unexpected problem at a Prothean dig site..."

GAH! DAMN IT! Prothean dig site announcement, you are my nemesis! Thy evil must be vanquished! Another elevator ride, WASTED!

Stop the presses and start shipping parkas to hell, I am in full agreement with you.

What, are we, like, nemeses? Nobody tells me anything.

I don't even know him and he's my nemesis. How does this happen. It's because I'm a Libra, isn't it. I see how it is.

Oh and if they bring back party banter... BioWare, I'd like some unique DA:O-style banter. Even in ME1 most of the lines were recycled. 5 different people asking Tali about her suit, and her giving the same response to each.

[Quething]

Nightwriter wrote...

Oh and if they bring back party banter... BioWare, I'd like some unique DA:O-style banter. Even in ME1 most of the lines were recycled. 5 different people asking Tali about her suit, and her giving the same response to each.

Man I sat through so many recycled news reports waiting to hear what Ashley would say to Wrex about getting in a fight with Shepard, only to discover it was the exact same damn line as Kaidan. So crushed! (Weird, too, because pretty much every other line they share in either game is more in-character for Ashley than for Kaidan, but that one's a total Kaidan response).

[Tup3x]

Pacifien wrote...

No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

I like the squad banter. I like the news broadcasts. I like the immersion of seeing my character transport from one area to another. Do I want the elevator/airlock load screens back? No. There are other ways to implement squad banter. News broadcasts could still be heard playing in the background while wandering Omega. If they're going to show transport, I'd rather it be much better implemented than the relatively static elevator/airlock load screens. I want more cleverly disguised load times.

It's kinda funny that in reality all these loading time would be about 2 secs or instant on PC but for some reason they force us to watch the whole loading video.

[Nightwriter]

Quething wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

Oh and if they bring back party banter... BioWare, I'd like some unique DA:O-style banter. Even in ME1 most of the lines were recycled. 5 different people asking Tali about her suit, and her giving the same response to each.

Man I sat through so many recycled news reports waiting to hear what Ashley would say to Wrex about getting in a fight with Shepard, only to discover it was the exact same damn line as Kaidan. So crushed! (Weird, too, because pretty much every other line they share in either game is more in-character for Ashley than for Kaidan, but that one's a total Kaidan response).

Let it be known that I shall never say ME1 did squad banter perfectly. 

[HHS_spartan]

So from reading all of this I think its easy to see what the perfect solution would be.

Bring back the elevators like in mass effect 2 but improve them.

Add more squad banter and a greater variety of news reports and even throw some adds in there.

Allow your squad to move a little bit in the elevator so there not standing like statues.

When riding the elevators give us a view so we see where were going. Like someone said before maybe see different floors go by and the actions on those floors. Or give us an epic view.

At the same time put an instant travel hub on in every area you have an elevator. That way people that dont want to deal with the slow elevators and have fast loading times can use that and get a quick loading screen instead.

Bring back the airlock and make the time spent in it equal to the amount of time it takes to load the outside area.

Also as a side note dont just limit squad banter to the elevators. Let us talk to our squad anytime we want to on the ship or not.

I think all these things would be fairly easy to implement and it gives everyone what they want. The people that want the loading screens get loading screens and the people that want elevators gets elevators. If Bioware does this then they make pretty much everyone happy. Seems to me like the perfect solution i hope thats what they go with.

Modifié par HHS_spartan, 26 octobre 2010 - 09:13 .

[Christmas Ape]

Nightwriter wrote...
What, are we, like, nemeses? Nobody tells me anything.

I don't even know him and he's my nemesis. How does this happen. It's because I'm a Libra, isn't it. I see how it is.

Oh and if they bring back party banter... BioWare, I'd like some unique DA:O-style banter. Even in ME1 most of the lines were recycled. 5 different people asking Tali about her suit, and her giving the same response to each.

Nah, I know my nemesis. Good guy. I'm gonna play some VtES with him later today. I've just noticed we've crossed paths on several threads in the past week and basically always coming at it from opposite directions. Guess I was the only one that cared.

Though your Libra theory may be plausible. There can be only one!


Now then, why I came here in the first place: to vent a little spleen without cluttering your other thread with too much elevator talk.
The airlock can stay the f--k dead. If there is a sense of justice in the universe that repetitive, useless waste of time will remain discarded. "Oh, but I feel like I'm really leaving the ship!" Yawwwn; if anyone ever spoke, or the door jammed even once, or maybe Joker does his best "Normandy VI" voice and tries to prank you...god, ANYTHING AT ALL...it miught have been okay. Its only redeeming feature was it was a convenient place to level squadmates so you could put heavier armor on them to clear out inventory space.

And as for a more cohesive world, I can only assume no-one was paying that much attention to the most bewildering collection of elevators anywhere - C-Sec. Why does the ONLY elevator to the docking bay lead directly to the Normandy? Why is it thirty feet from an elevator that opens into some ridiculously nowhere part of the Presidium? Why does it take radically different amounts of travel to get to the Wards if you go straight from the Presidium or through C-Sec - and yet the two actual access points are almost within sight of each other? Why does constantly moving downward - first the stairs, then two elevators - take me back to the same level I started on?

[kalle90]

^^

One option is to change the loading screens too. Instead of being so vague and artistic they could actually stay in the game. A surveillance camera view from elevator, a cutscene showing people going through the airlock etc. Not a red/orange screen screaming "I'm Loading, please wait!"



It feels like I'm in the game, but it's a prerendered video. They could even have those squad discussions (yet more lively) or news/ads

[FuturePasTimeCE]

tallon1982 wrote...

I wasn't a fan of either the mako or the elevators. I guess they were just necessary for ME1 since it was just something new to try out. The loading times were so long and it seemed like once you got the one small conversation or news announcement it was just a long period of silence. No, thanks. What I do miss is being able to talk to the squadmates at random while just walking around. The talking points that are in different areas are fine but I just liked the other banter you could get in ME1 too.

that's the only thing we need for a random conversation... "press a to talk to squad member"...not the long boring elevator rides... i agree with you.

versus wait until you're at this random secret spot to interact with squad member, and then they're interrupted by the in-game environment

Modifié par FuturePasTimeCE, 26 octobre 2010 - 09:33 .

[HHS_spartan]

Christmas Ape wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...
What, are we, like, nemeses? Nobody tells me anything.

I don't even know him and he's my nemesis. How does this happen. It's because I'm a Libra, isn't it. I see how it is.

Oh and if they bring back party banter... BioWare, I'd like some unique DA:O-style banter. Even in ME1 most of the lines were recycled. 5 different people asking Tali about her suit, and her giving the same response to each.

Nah, I know my nemesis. Good guy. I'm gonna play some VtES with him later today. I've just noticed we've crossed paths on several threads in the past week and basically always coming at it from opposite directions. Guess I was the only one that cared.

Though your Libra theory may be plausible. There can be only one!


Now then, why I came here in the first place: to vent a little spleen without cluttering your other thread with too much elevator talk.
The airlock can stay the f--k dead. If there is a sense of justice in the universe that repetitive, useless waste of time will remain discarded. "Oh, but I feel like I'm really leaving the ship!" Yawwwn; if anyone ever spoke, or the door jammed even once, or maybe Joker does his best "Normandy VI" voice and tries to prank you...god, ANYTHING AT ALL...it miught have been okay. Its only redeeming feature was it was a convenient place to level squadmates so you could put heavier armor on them to clear out inventory space.

And as for a more cohesive world, I can only assume no-one was paying that much attention to the most bewildering collection of elevators anywhere - C-Sec. Why does the ONLY elevator to the docking bay lead directly to the Normandy? Why is it thirty feet from an elevator that opens into some ridiculously nowhere part of the Presidium? Why does it take radically different amounts of travel to get to the Wards if you go straight from the Presidium or through C-Sec - and yet the two actual access points are almost within sight of each other? Why does constantly moving downward - first the stairs, then two elevators - take me back to the same level I started on?

I agree they could do a little more to improve the air lock. But I still think its better then watching the same loading screen over and over.

As for the rest of it thats why I think they should put both an instant travel option so the people like you that didnt like elevators dont have to deal with it, and have the elevators for the people that want them. Everyone wins 

[Cyberfrog81]

My latest ME1 playthrough I hardly got a SINGLE piece of squad banter. And not because I was avoiding the elevators. It was all news reports. Good for flavour and the occasional side quest reminder, but not what I wanted. Still, I have to admit that some of the "magic", if you will, were lost in ME2. And I'm saying that as someone who likes ME2 a LOT more than ME1.

I'm used to loading screens and they rarely bother me (and I appreciate the different animations they put in there). Some of the ME1 elevator rides, however, did bother me.

Airlocks were OK though. And the "mission complete" screens simply need to go, at least in their current form. They are near-useless and just plain... wrong.

I like how ME2 succeeds at being more cinematic and "alive" (at least in dialogues). They should try to maintain a cinematic feel but if possible also allow the player to be more immersed in the various environments when you aren't watching a neat cutscene. Whatever they do, the solution better not be to go back to "maybe you'll get something semi-interesting, maybe you'll be bored silly" elevator rides.

[Christmas Ape]

HHS_Spartan wrote...

I agree they could do a little more to improve the air lock. But I still think its better then watching the same loading screen over and over.

That is exactly what the airlock was. The same load screen, over and over again. There was more variation in the ME2 load screens than in the airlock.