146 réponses à ce sujet

[Teh_handoGod]

The airlock was extremely important as it made it feel like you were just going back onto the ship while it sat in port instead of randomly leaving, plus the airlock loading was marginally faster than the stupid leaving and landing crap you deal with in its absence. I don't understand where the complaints come from because the airlock was quick and painless. Elevators were nice but not needed, also my game craps out when I take the elevator to the visit the council in ME1 (so I use the rapid transit). The place where the lack of an elevator really plagues ME2 in on the Normandy if we just had an elevator on the ship it would actually fell like a ship as compared to a bunch of disjointed rooms that are supposed to be a ship, I honestly never bought that the ME2 Normandy was a ship and I eventually figured out that the loading screens ruined it.    
                plus honestly the elevators are like 5 seconds tops seriously anyone who hates them is rather impatient XD  

[sinosleep]

Elevators are junk and add nothing to the game as LotSB is clear proof you don't need a garbage time wasting mechanic in order to have good party banter.



And well, those of us on PC know that the loading screens aren't long because they're actually loading anything, they are long because they play 15 second movies regardless of how long it actually takes to load the area. If you remove the movies you'll see loading takes no time flat.

[RideUrLightning]

Pacifien wrote...

No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

I like the squad banter. I like the news broadcasts. I like the immersion of seeing my character transport from one area to another. Do I want the elevator/airlock load screens back? No. There are other ways to implement squad banter. News broadcasts could still be heard playing in the background while wandering Omega. If they're going to show transport, I'd rather it be much better implemented than the relatively static elevator/airlock load screens. I want more cleverly disguised load times.

Mass Effect is all about being immersed in the world, so I prefer elevators. I never complained about them in the first place, OR the Mako. That was the idiotic reviewers.

[HHS_spartan]

I don't get the people that want to get rid of elevators all together. Why not have an option that leaves it in for the people that want but have a fast travel system for the people that dont. Any other option doesn't really solve the problem.

[shnizzler93]

I miss the option of twiddling my thumbs for 20 seconds...oh wait, I can still do that...

[Pacifien]

HHS_spartan wrote...
I don't get the people that want to get rid of elevators all together. Why not have an option that leaves it in for the people that want but have a fast travel system for the people that dont. Any other option doesn't really solve the problem.

There really are other ways to portray traveling other than elevators, you know. There's even other ways to maintain immersion in the game. It's all in how the developers lay out the environment. Do I want them to lay out the environment specifically so I can get an elevator back? No. If an elevator fits into the design, then I probably won't complain.

[HHS_spartan]

Pacifien wrote...

HHS_spartan wrote...
I don't get the people that want to get rid of elevators all together. Why not have an option that leaves it in for the people that want but have a fast travel system for the people that dont. Any other option doesn't really solve the problem.

There really are other ways to portray traveling other than elevators, you know. There's even other ways to maintain immersion in the game. It's all in how the developers lay out the environment. Do I want them to lay out the environment specifically so I can get an elevator back? No. If an elevator fits into the design, then I probably won't complain.

Thats true but I cant really think of many ways to do it. It could be things other then an elevator such as a speeder or shuttle. Main thing is I just dont want to be taken out of the game for loading screens even if they have cool info or whatever it still ruins the flow.

[Angel-Shinkiro]

In Mass Effect 1 people hated elevators because they were long and because there was nothing to do after the news report played or teammates finished their banter.



In Mass Effect 2 people hated loading screens because their was no squad banter, they broke "immersion" and they repeated the same thing over and over only at different times.



So here is what I propose:

In the elevator and airlocks there could be a screen that played videos of stuff going on in the MEverse, you could see people reporting on stuff that happen on missions or assignments, commercials or short clips of videos (everyone wants to see Blasto or Elcor Hamlet) or maybe just watch yourself watching yourself if nothing new plays. Your squadmates coud also be able to comment on the scene just like how they can comment on Edi's intel on Mission worlds. This TV can also be turned off, which will lead to squadmates bantering with each other instead and making the scene load faster.



What do you think?

[Quething]

HHS_spartan wrote...

Thats true but I cant really think of many ways to do it. It could be things other then an elevator such as a speeder or shuttle. Main thing is I just dont want to be taken out of the game for loading screens even if they have cool info or whatever it still ruins the flow.

Well, in ME2, the Citadel had stairs. (Those are loading zones; try using a speed cheat and racing from one floor to the next, if you do it fast enough the game will stall out while it prepares the next area). If there had been a way other than shuttle to reach Anderson/Udina's office, the warehouse, or the ward Thane takes you to, it would have been nearly perfect - you can take the long way and see how everything is connected, or you can take the short way and save yourself some time while staring at a loading screen. There were even news kiosks so you had something to listen to as you traveled (though the audible radius is too small, having to stand in place to hear the whole thing defeats the whole purpose).

You could also do shuttle rides, like the Noveria tram. Even if they didn't actually move in the game; I think another reason that the actual elevator-elevators in ME2 work are that you get into an elevator prior to the loading screen, and you can turn around and look at the elevator you just got out of once it's over, instead of opening a door or tapping a bare console that magically dumps you into a corridor miles away with no real transition. We saw a bit of that in LotSB, with actually getting out of Vasir's shuttle and into the taxi on either end of the trade center, and with the tram and Hammerhead loading screens in Overlord, so maybe that's progress in the right direction - those DLCs do feel more like coherent worlds than most of ME2.

[Trix-Rabbit]

Pacifien wrote...

Quething wrote...
I think one of the big problems with the elevators was that they actually moved. Admittedly, they wouldn't have been all that immersive if they didn't - half the point is that you can look out the glass door and see the Citadel flying past - but the problem is, that gives them a fixed duration. You still have to actually get from the top to the bottom even if your machine finished loading the next area before the squad banter even fired.

Seriously, I could walk the entire length of the Normandy in the time it takes the elevator to get down to the cargo hold.

what kind of pc do you have that it takes that long? 5-10 sec elevator to cargohold max~! At least on my crappy self built machine

3.2ghz phenom II 965
4Gig OCZ black Edition
Asus Board, dont remember which, not made anymore and was one of the only nforce sli boards made.
gtx 275

All together a lil less than 1000 bucks everything else is a holdover from my original system built in 03' or earlier. HDD is a 133mb ide drive first to be made 300gb hdd......

[Pacifien]

Trix-Rabbit wrote...

Pacifien wrote...
Seriously, I could walk the entire length of the Normandy in the time it takes the elevator to get down to the cargo hold. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

what kind of pc do you have that it takes that long?*snip*

Oh, the kind of PC that's an XBox 360.

Maybe one day I'll get the game for the PC, but lengthy elevator times is my punishment for wanting to get Mass Effect 1 the day it came out, I suppose.

Modifié par Pacifien, 30 octobre 2010 - 07:04 .

[HHS_spartan]

Pacifien wrote...

Trix-Rabbit wrote...

Pacifien wrote...
Seriously, I could walk the entire length of the Normandy in the time it takes the elevator to get down to the cargo hold. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

what kind of pc do you have that it takes that long?*snip*

Oh, the kind of PC that's an XBox 360.

Maybe one day I'll get the game for the PC, but lengthy elevator times is my punishment for wanting to get Mass Effect 1 the day it came out, I suppose.

Same here but I dont have anything that could run it well enough to do it justice. Thats the one thing I love about consoles compared to a computer. When I buy a video game I dont have to worry about if i can run it or not.

[Chuvvy]

The current loading screens are boring. I don't understand why they didn't just put up concept art of what ever area you were in. That would have been much better. But yes I like elevators.

[Lumikki]

I would allways choose impression, before the praticality. That's what elevators was, impression detail, giving player better feel that world is alive.

Modifié par Lumikki, 30 octobre 2010 - 11:20 .

[Jabarai]

The 3D model of the SR-2 with the elevator isn't particularly clumsy or boring as a substitute, but on planets and such the original elevators provided perfect idle time for any news casts and brief conversations between squad mates. I'm a bit saddened by Bioware's lack of self-confidence in this matter...

[kalle90]

Slidell505 wrote...
The current loading screens are boring. I don't understand why they didn't just put up concept art of what ever area you were in. That would have been much better. But yes I like elevators.

Concept art wouldn't be any better IMO. Instead the possible loading screens should be made to look like the game. So if I can't be in the airlock or elevator in-game then make it a cutscene that looks like in-game.

[schneeland]

Well, having played Mass Effect 2 right after the first part, I have to say that I really did miss something, but not necessarily the elevators. As others already commented, some of the news and banter were nice to hear, but what I miss most is the feeling of contingency and openness, I had on the Citadel station in ME 1. While a crowded look makes perfect sense for a station on the outskirts of civilization like Omega, I just felt that the old citadel with its statues and marble paved pavements was just much more fitting for something that is supposed to be in the centre of the universe.



Also, boarding the Normandy via the air lock made perfect sense for me and definitely increased my feeling of immersion.



On the other hand, I can agree that some of the elevator moments were, well, not the most interesting part of the game . It's only that the loading screens were even worse ... so if I had to choose between elevators and loading screens, I would choose the former, and if there had to be loading screens, I would also go for concept art and codex entries instead of these strange 3D-model animations.



On a side note:

I really do not understand, why space travel on the Normandy is not used to create more chances for team character interaction. Guessing from the comments regarding the travel time estimate to the Omega 4 portal at the end of ME 2, space travel still takes reasonable time, even in the far and tech abundant future. It seems quite natural to me that I (=Shepard) would spend this "idle time" in some officer socializing zone or just in my room, reading intel reports or the latest Elcor poetry, and other characters could also approach me or just spend some time throwing in puns or comments.

[slimgrin]

Pacifien wrote...

No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

I like the squad banter. I like the news broadcasts. I like the immersion of seeing my character transport from one area to another. Do I want the elevator/airlock load screens back? No. There are other ways to implement squad banter. News broadcasts could still be heard playing in the background while wandering Omega. If they're going to show transport, I'd rather it be much better implemented than the relatively static elevator/airlock load screens. I want more cleverly disguised load times.

I suppose I agree with this. Squad banter while on the move makes sense to me. No loading times is best and I wait to see if TW2 can really pull this off. ( actually just 4 loading times in TW2 )

[swirlwind]

No to loading screens, yes to anything that keeps you in character throughout the game, be it elevators, the airlock or something we haven't seen yet. ME2 was very chopped up by the loading screens and the "mission accomplished" Illusive Man screens. I sincerely hope those won't be in ME3.

[Inquisitor Recon]

I don't really care about the elevators. I liked the banter on the Citadel ones, but after a few times it was the same thing. And don't get me started about the elevator on the Normandy. A state of the art frigate that took billions to build and it has an elevator that takes 30 seconds to go down one floor.

What I do want to see is a scene like this in ME3.

*Shepard and his team are going up on an elevator. Suddenly Harbinger appears on the news screen.*
"ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL, THIS HURTS YOU!"
*The elevator starts moving really, really slow.*
*Shepard goes insane and starts breaking everything and cursing at the top of his lungs.*

[PD ORTA]

Pacifien wrote...

No. Just because it was a good opportunity to hear news broadcasts and squad banter does not give it a free pass into the game design. People complained about the elevator and airlock sequences not really taking into account that they were to disguise load times. The result was removing them altogether and replacing them with a different loading screen... that also has a lengthy load time. Now people want the elevators back, but the back and forth doesn't address the issue: lengthy load times.

Same issue with the Mako. People complained considerably about the Mako, so the designers removed it altogether. Now people complain about the lack of the Mako. Did they or did they not like the Mako? Or perhaps what they really didn't like was the repetitive level designs that they were forced to endure in the Mako.

I like the squad banter. I like the news broadcasts. I like the immersion of seeing my character transport from one area to another. Do I want the elevator/airlock load screens back? No. There are other ways to implement squad banter. News broadcasts could still be heard playing in the background while wandering Omega. If they're going to show transport, I'd rather it be much better implemented than the relatively static elevator/airlock load screens. I want more cleverly disguised load times.

I agree with this 100%. The only thing I miss from elevators and airlocks is the squad banter. ME2 still has news clips.

[Jabarai]

Bennyjammin79 wrote...
..... And ditch that weird TIM screen: " Mission Complete" .....

Yes, the 'mission complete' screen was a complete failure. The player always should feel somehow elevated and rewarded each time a mission is completed, but the view of TIM and tabs full of generic, inessential debriefing is a let down.

[Jonesey2k]

I just wish that the Citadel and other hub worlds & stations were a lot bigger. I miss Mass Effect 1's sense of massive space.

[Gibb_Shepard]

To those complaining about the elevator length times, do you yet understand that they were loading screens? When an elevator was moving, everything you were about to enter was being loaded. All ME2 did was take out the immersive elevators, and replace it with the immersion breaking loading screens, still taking the same amount of time to load. If i had a choice between a long elevator ride and a long loading screen, i'll choose the elevator ride any day.