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[tmp7704]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Well, then according to your argument there's no real benefit in allowing the player that option either. Since it's all just a matter of taste.

Ehh no, to the contrary? If you allow the player to adjust things so they meet their taste, then they get to play a game that better meets their taste, which should result in more enjoyable experience than being stuck with game than in some ways feels off to them. How is that not a benefit?

[Beerfish]

dan107 wrote...

yukidama wrote...
No? You don't see how calling women ugly wh*res is problematic in the least? And that you feel perfectly fine saying/agreeing with such things?

Well if a woman is an ugly wh*re, what should we call her? I'm not saying that about women in general, just this character specifically.

I'm wondering where the word wh*re came from regarding this person from DA1.  I just played through that part again last night and she said one slightly saucey line.  Does that brand her in your books?

Also your definiton of ugly is just really out to lunch, like way way out to lunch.  If the person in that trialer is 'ugly' then 95% of the people in the world are ugly.  The amount that people use total extremes on these forums is pretty absurd and just kills any credability a poster might want to portray in their beef.

[the_one_54321]

tmp7704 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Well, then according to your argument there's no real benefit in allowing the player that option either. Since it's all just a matter of taste.

Ehh no, to the contrary? If you allow the player to adjust things so they meet their taste, then they get to play a game that better meets their taste, which should result in more enjoyable experience than being stuck with game than in some ways feels off to them. How is that not a benefit?

But that's assuming that you're even given any options that suit your taste. Which for many people in DA:O you simply were not. I had to download armor from builders just so that my party's appearance didn't constantly bore me to tears.

the_one_54321 wrote...

tmp7704 wrote...
My point is, there's no real benefit in denying the player option to customize appearance of their companions. Since what is "unique", "interesting" or "fitting" ultimately boils down to individual tastes and there's no way for game to come up with designs that are able to meet all these tastes at once. This very thread is evidence of this, after all.

Well, then according to your argument there's no real benefit in allowing the player that option either. Since it's all just a matter of taste.

I should also say that my main problem with it was the copy-paste aspect. If they could let you customize all the armor but still have them individually tailored to each character that would be ideal. In fact that would be freaking awesome.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 26 octobre 2010 - 08:54 .

[hannels]

yukidama wrote...

Lol, it's fascinating how so many men cannot see that they are not who gets to determine a woman's attractiveness or what she chooses to do with her body. If she were a man I am sure there would be no such ****-shaming or judging her solely based on her looks and tossing around of transphobic slurs. Whatever. I am out of here.

This.

Is calling someone an ugly **** really ever appropriate, guys? There are certainly nicer things one could say.

[dan107]

JohnEpler wrote...

Please restrict this topic to talking about Isabela as she relates to the Dragon Age franchise, and let's get off the increasingly offensive discussion about subjective opinions on what's acceptable re: sexual promiscuity and the like.

Well if her demonstrated sexual promiscuity in DAO is something that makes her unattractive to us a a romanceable character in DA2, are we supposed to just ignore that?

[Rogue Unit]

Beerfish wrote...

dan107 wrote...

yukidama wrote...
No? You don't see how calling women ugly wh*res is problematic in the least? And that you feel perfectly fine saying/agreeing with such things?

Well if a woman is an ugly wh*re, what should we call her? I'm not saying that about women in general, just this character specifically.

I'm wondering where the word wh*re came from regarding this person from DA1.  I just played through that part again last night and she said one slightly saucey line.  Does that brand her in your books?

They call her a **** because she is willing to sleep with The Warden, Zevran, and Leliana all at the same time after speaking to them for about 3 minutes.

[Dave of Canada]

Rogue Unit wrote...

They call her a **** because she is willing to sleep with The Warden, Zevran, and Leliana all at the same time after speaking to them for about 3 minutes.

While I don't agree with the **** statement, don't forget Alistair too.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 26 octobre 2010 - 08:51 .

[Addai]

TonyTheBossDanza123 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

TonyTheBossDanza123 wrote...

This just in: Men judge first and foremost by sexual attraction. It's biological, no amount of feminist whining will change that. If you feel alienated in the gaming community it's your own fault.

And we get to mock you for being shallow horndogs with a one track mind.  It's a fair trade.  

Sounds fine to me, as long as you can deal with the facts of life.

You're a real charmer, eh?  LOL

Regardless, like the man said, if you don't like the "skank" model, you needn't even pick her up as a companion let alone romance her, just as you didn't have to pick up Leliana or Zevran in Origins.  I'm sure there will be another LI for the men.

[Beerfish]

tmp7704 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

Well, then according to your argument there's no real benefit in allowing the player that option either. Since it's all just a matter of taste.

Ehh no, to the contrary? If you allow the player to adjust things so they meet their taste, then they get to play a game that better meets their taste, which should result in more enjoyable experience than being stuck with game than in some ways feels off to them. How is that not a benefit?

As long as people taking this tact never ever ever complain about any kind of realism then that's okay.  The question is how far do you go.  Do you want to tailor make chracters attitudes as well to better mesh with the player, if not why not?

[Rogue Unit]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Rogue Unit wrote...

They call her a **** because she is willing to sleep with The Warden, Zevran, and Leliana all at the same time after speaking to them for about 3 minutes.

While I don't agree with the **** statement, don't forget Alistair too.

Huh, I didn't know Alistair would join in. Probably because I never use him.

[John Epler]

dan107 wrote...

JohnEpler wrote...

Please restrict this topic to talking about Isabela as she relates to the Dragon Age franchise, and let's get off the increasingly offensive discussion about subjective opinions on what's acceptable re: sexual promiscuity and the like.

Well if her demonstrated sexual promiscuity in DAO is something that makes her unattractive to us a a romanceable character in DA2, are we supposed to just ignore that?

Saying you dislike a character because of her promiscuity is one thing.

Repeatedly throwing out insults (whether it is towards a fictional character or not) is another. I'm fairly certain everyone here can figure out where the line is. We try to foster a positive atmosphere here.

[tmp7704]

Beerfish wrote...

Also your definiton of ugly is just really out to lunch, like way way out to lunch.  If the person in that trialer is 'ugly' then 95% of the people in the world are ugly.

To be fair, the "ugly" comments can be sparked by the fact some of the features of the character in the trailer are "anatomically uncommon", i.e. something that proverbial 95% of the people in the world don't have.

[dan107]

Beerfish wrote...
I'm wondering where the word wh*re came from regarding this person from DA1.  I just played through that part again last night and she said one slightly saucey line.  Does that brand her in your books?

It's the fact that you could tag-team her with Zevran (and some other people IIRC) after speaking to her for 5 minutes.

Also your definiton of ugly is just really out to lunch, like way way out to lunch.  If the person in that trialer is 'ugly' then 95% of the people in the world are ugly.  The amount that people use total extremes on these forums is pretty absurd and just kills any credability a poster might want to portray in their beef.

As far as ugly -- comparatively speaking, yes there are many, many far, far uglier women out there. So maybe ugly is too harsh a word, but still. I happen to be of the opinion that a fantasy video game romance character should be gorgeous. No conceivable reason not to make her such.

[John Epler]

I should also mention that insulting other posters or their beliefs is completely unacceptable, and will only net you a vacation from the forums. I shouldn't have to tell anyone that, but it seems it must be reiterated.

[Beerfish]

dan107 wrote...

JohnEpler wrote...

Please restrict this topic to talking about Isabela as she relates to the Dragon Age franchise, and let's get off the increasingly offensive discussion about subjective opinions on what's acceptable re: sexual promiscuity and the like.

Well if her demonstrated sexual promiscuity in DAO is something that makes her unattractive to us a a romanceable character in DA2, are we supposed to just ignore that?

Nope, you rag on the character at every opportunity and don't romance that character.  Problem solved!

[Rogue Unit]

I'm wondering...



If sleeping with mutiple partner makes Isabella a ****, what does that make the Warden, Leliana and everyone else willing to join in on the fun?



Would they be no different?

[Bruddajakka]

She does have a fairly prominent chin from the images we've seen for her, and the facial stud draws even further attention to it. Which make her look unconventional compared to what you expect from a female character especially from a LI though Morrigan had a very sharp chin as well. Her facial features are definately on the different side of things.

Modifié par Bruddajakka, 26 octobre 2010 - 08:57 .

[AtreiyaN7]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Calla S wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

tmp7704 wrote...
I'll just drop the screenshot of original DAO Isabela here from the Toolset



so the whole comparison/change/"was the lighting in Pearl really so bad" angle of discussion has something to go by.

This is awesome. Why couldn't they have just done something more like this? They didn't need to give her an inflated double chin.

Seriously what the current model looks like to me is a double chin.

I don't normally toss out these things on the forums, but...

lol.

Are you serious? You REALLY think she's prettier there? Oy vey.

Yes, I really do. Her lips don't look shrunken and her neck doesn't look like it was inflated with a bike pump.

As someone who's studied art in the past (as in actual life drawing/life painting classes), I'm going with no, the previous Isabela model from DA:O was not particularly attractive in my eyes - not from the angle in this screenshot of her from the toolkit anyway. The nose seems too long and too broad (for my tastes anyway). Her lips are too large, and the cheeks look somewhat sunken in (cheekbones too pronounced) with kind of a meh jawline & chin.

I'm not saying the new version of Isabela is a supermodel or that she has perfectly balanced features, but I think she's an improvement over the original and at least has some character and uniqueness to her face. On the subject of ideals of beauty, you might want to look at this (you'll have to copy & paste it):

http://www.intmath.c...athOfBeauty.php

You can read up on the Divine Proportion and how it shows up in faces that are (generally) universally judged to be beautiful/attractive. You can even see the mask overlays. You can also Google Dr. Stephen Marquardt btw, as he is the one who first researched the subject of the Divine Proportion as applied to facial features and came up with the beauty mask overlay (applies to anyone, regardless of race, since it's the proportion/ratio that matter).

A fun experiment would be for someone to actually take the images of old Isabela and new Isabela to do a comparison using the beauty mask overlay. As for what people are calling Isabela's melon head, I'm assuming that part of the issue is the kerchief covering her hair, which may be making her head look bigger than it is. However, unless she ever takes it off, I guess it would be difficult to tell one way or the other.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 26 octobre 2010 - 09:05 .

[dan107]

Beerfish wrote...
Nope, you rag on the character at every opportunity and don't romance that character.  Problem solved!

Sure. But I'd much rather have an attractive character that can be a potential romance than an objectionable one to rag on. That's all.

[tmp7704]

the_one_54321 wrote...

But that's assuming that you're even given any options that suit your taste. Which for many people in DA:O you simply were not. I had to download armor from builders just so that my party's appearance didn't constantly bore me to tears.

That's true. But wouldn't you agree that the odds of being able to suit the person's tastes improve with the increased amount of options? So having any number of options greater than just one is a step up from being stuck with just single non-choice.

[Beerfish]

dan107 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...
I'm wondering where the word wh*re came from regarding this person from DA1.  I just played through that part again last night and she said one slightly saucey line.  Does that brand her in your books?

It's the fact that you could tag-team her with Zevran (and some other people IIRC) after speaking to her for 5 minutes.

Also your definiton of ugly is just really out to lunch, like way way out to lunch.  If the person in that trialer is 'ugly' then 95% of the people in the world are ugly.  The amount that people use total extremes on these forums is pretty absurd and just kills any credability a poster might want to portray in their beef.

As far as ugly -- comparatively speaking, yes there are many, many far, far uglier women out there. So maybe ugly is too harsh a word, but still. I happen to be of the opinion that a fantasy video game romance character should be gorgeous. No conceivable reason not to make her such.

List 5 gorgeous female fantasy video game characters and I'll wager that you will get a wide wide variety of opinions as to whether they are gorgeous or not.  Was there a gorgeous female love interest in DA1?  Nope.  Morrigan and Leliana were reasonably good looking, gorgeous?  Not in my books.

Back to pirate girl to keep things on topic.  There will be a huge difference of opinion on any and all of the love interests in this game and any other.  The wild flailing complaints about some is the reason they have more than one possible love interest in a game.

[Rogue Unit]

Acharnae wrote...

Rogue Unit wrote...

Beerfish wrote...

dan107 wrote...

yukidama wrote...
No? You don't see how calling women ugly wh*res is problematic in the least? And that you feel perfectly fine saying/agreeing with such things?

Well if a woman is an ugly wh*re, what should we call her? I'm not saying that about women in general, just this character specifically.

I'm wondering where the word wh*re came from regarding this person from DA1.  I just played through that part again last night and she said one slightly saucey line.  Does that brand her in your books?

They call her a **** because she is willing to sleep with The Warden, Zevran, and Leliana all at the same time after speaking to them for about 3 minutes.

And we called her ugly because, well to some of us, she's ugly! Especially compared to the real Goddess which is Morrigan.
See you can state your preferences for love interests, we can state ours. And we are the crushing majority.
Also bare in mind that we were insulted, on a personal level, first, in this thread.

Dont get me wrong, I think she's ugly, I'm just not as vocal as some of you are about it. Besides, she can't be any worse than Cassandra.

[Beerfish]

dan107 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...
Nope, you rag on the character at every opportunity and don't romance that character.  Problem solved!

Sure. But I'd much rather have an attractive character that can be a potential romance than an objectionable one to rag on. That's all.

You'll have to wait to see what other possiblities there are I guess.  Or be celibate.