240 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

imported_beer wrote...
*Sigh* I think we are talking circles around each other.

So one of your characters was a hornball, and she was a hornball in return.

Another character is not one, and she doesn't attempt to molest your character, spread her legs for you at the pearl begging you to smecks her or anything. In fact, no indication is given at all that Isabela is into that kind of thing.

And where did I claim this?
My first post here was telling the OP that he didnt' need to use such terms.

imported_beer wrote...
You are yourself using the experience of your hornball character to dictate her over all morality.
That is like saying just because Wynne can be made into a bloodmage, she is evil.

No, makign wynne a blood mage is a game mechanic, and I agree that it should not have been allowed to happen.
Isabela agreeing means she doesn't really mind the idea, which one can find unappealing.

imported_beer wrote...
 What else do you have, instead of the entire argument of Isabela had a threesome with one of my PC's ergo, she is a universal SKANK.

Again, I never referred to her as such. And that's why I hate coming to this section of the forum, because that's what happens. I state an opinion and everyone thinks I said exactly what the OP said, which he apologized for btw.

I simply stated my preference, without name calling or labels. In other words, I would prefer if the other female interest is different, which is what the OP was concerned about. 

[KnightofPhoenix]

Lord_Valandil wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

One of my characters did approach Isabela and enjoyed it as hell. I, as a gamer, found out that Isabela doesn't mind foursomes, and as such, I would not want her for a partner. And that's what the OP is saying, that he, as a gamer, doesn't want someone like her as a love interest.

He could have said that, without referring to the girls as "skanks", saying that he had a lot of "class" and that most of us surely live in "*****"-up places. Don't you agree? Yes?

And I agree, and he agrees and apologized for it. So let's drop it.

[upsettingshorts]

Dudalizer wrote...
I apologized for that, but really how do you expect me to respond when people are attacking me?  Please stop trying to start a fight.

Your post's original language might as well have rung the bell. 

"The avalanche has already started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote." 

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
And I agree, and he agrees and apologized for it. So let's drop it.

It's a nice thought, but I expect this thread will be locked before it becomes truly civil.  Still, I've been wrong before.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 octobre 2010 - 04:40 .

[Lord_Valandil]

Dudalizer wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

One of my characters did approach Isabela and enjoyed it as hell. I, as a gamer, found out that Isabela doesn't mind foursomes, and as such, I would not want her for a partner. And that's what the OP is saying, that he, as a gamer, doesn't want someone like her as a love interest.

He could have said that, without referring to the girls as "skanks", saying that he had a lot of "class" and that most of us surely live in "*****"-up places. Don't you agree? Yes?

I apologized for that, but really how do you expect me to respond when people are attacking me?  Please stop trying to start a fight.

I'm not trying to start a fight. If you think that, you're missing the point.

[aaniadyen]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

SirOccam wrote...
The solution to this, in your eyes, would be what? Remove the option of sleeping with an NPC altogether? That's pretty much all that's left, because simply allowing for the possibility is enough, apparently, for you to name them skanks.

The examples you're looking for are Samara (turns you down), Morinth (kills you), and Renegade Jack (loses respect for you).

Or they could just be like Jaheira from BG1. Not a ****, but not a total prude either.

[Ryzaki]

Merced256 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

...How is a foursome with people you know, possibly love and trust skankish? Granted that's not what happened but still...

Unconvential sex =/= skank

Not at all. I don't see where people are getting that.

Even Cosmo thinks 4way is skany, need i any other evidence?

Right because a magazine is the standard for moralitiy. Frankly I find no sexual act between consensual adults to be skanky. Perverted and weird? Certainly. Skankish? That's reserved in my miind for cheaters.

[iny0fac3]

Merced256 wrote...

Really? I'd love to see you debate this because i've already got it all lined up.

Well I don't really want to DEBATE debate this...
but what makes you think she's a puritan?
I was speaking about the 16th century protestants and how they banned all theatres and all that.
if that clears anything up...

[Riona45]

Merced256 wrote...

Even Cosmo thinks 4way is skany, need i any other evidence?

Wow, you're more well-read than I thought you were.

[SirOccam]

Addai67 wrote...

SirOccam wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

??  This doesn't make a lot of sense.  So yes, she's not tackling people on the street and ripping their clothes off.  But still, she'll sleep with a bunch of people she just met and does so with a "the more the merrier" attitude.  That means it's part of her character regardless of whether the Warden even approaches her.

As imported_beer says, this is metagaming.

Using this logic you could argue that anything that is possible with an NPC defines them as a person. I suppose Dr. Chakwas is a raging alcoholic now because you can join her for a bit of brandy.

Are other NPCs not skanks because they are unwilling to do the same things, or just because they haven't been programmed to? So the option is open with Isabela; so what? As others have said, YOU have to be the one to pursue that path. All she will suggest is a simple card game to test your dexterity. Whose mind is really in the gutter?

Eurrgghh.  We're talking about how the character is written.  She's written that way no matter how the Wardens you played interacted with her.  Now, it very well could be that in DA2 we find out she was just curious about the Warden and was acting out of character for a purpose, or she chewed some Antivan herbs that morning and just had to get busy, or whatever, that she's really a one-woman kind of guy.  And Zevran was able to seduce her so easily because... because he's got magical elf powers.   But from what we know of her, that's just the way she rolls.  So, it is metagaming, but so what because that's the point.  We're talking about player preferences.

I get that, but when you really make judgements about people, you can't metagame. We have the unique opportunity to look inside what makes her tick and see every possible action she can take...and then the problem happens when we take one such possibility and blow it out of proportion. "It is possible to talk her into a threesome" becomes "she is a skank."

As I said before, it is probably not impossible for most of us to be talked into a threesome under some particular set of circumstances...does that make each person for whom that is true a skank?

Now if someone decides that they don't like any character who would willingly participate in a threesome, or who is at all casual about sex, as Isabela seems to be, then fine. Everyone is free to make up their own minds. Where I object is when moral judgements get thrown around. Everyone wants to believe theirs is the "right" way to think, and anyone on one side is a cheap floozy and anyone on the other side is a prude.

Modifié par SirOccam, 27 octobre 2010 - 04:43 .

[aaniadyen]

Ryzaki wrote...

Merced256 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

...How is a foursome with people you know, possibly love and trust skankish? Granted that's not what happened but still...

Unconvential sex =/= skank

Not at all. I don't see where people are getting that.

Even Cosmo thinks 4way is skany, need i any other evidence?

Right because a magazine is the standard for moralitiy. Frankly I find no sexual act between consensual adults to be skanky. Perverted and weird? Certainly. Skankish? That's reserved in my miind for cheaters.

But by that definition someone who sleeps with 10 people a night isn't a skank at all as long as it's consentual...

[Merced256]

iny0fac3 wrote...

Merced256 wrote...

Really? I'd love to see you debate this because i've already got it all lined up.

Well I don't really want to DEBATE debate this...
but what makes you think she's a puritan?
I was speaking about the 16th century protestants and how they banned all theatres and all that.
if that clears anything up...

Oh so the jedi code doesn't essentially prohibit attachment, love, sex(by extrapolation), blah blah blah? And all of that isn't made perfectly clear to you during your courting of bastila? Hmmmmm

Modifié par Merced256, 27 octobre 2010 - 04:44 .

[Ryzaki]

aaniadyen wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Merced256 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

...How is a foursome with people you know, possibly love and trust skankish? Granted that's not what happened but still...

Unconvential sex =/= skank

Not at all. I don't see where people are getting that.

Even Cosmo thinks 4way is skany, need i any other evidence?

Right because a magazine is the standard for moralitiy. Frankly I find no sexual act between consensual adults to be skanky. Perverted and weird? Certainly. Skankish? That's reserved in my miind for cheaters.

But by that definition someone who sleeps with 10 people a night isn't a skank at all as long as it's consentual...

I wouldn't find them to be. Nope. As long as all partners were single (or their partners knew what they were doing) no I wouldn't consider that person a skank. Very...loose and far more fluid in their sexuality than I'd ever be but not a skank. Weird I know.

Meanwhile someone could sleep with one person but if they know that person is in a closed relationship and their partner is unaware I'd call them a skank.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 octobre 2010 - 04:50 .

[Enshaid]

imported_beer wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I simply stated my preference, without name calling or labels. In other words, I would prefer if the other female interest is different, which is what the OP was concerned about. 

THAT I can totally respect.

Totally.

Totally.

[ShrinkingFish]

To address the whole argument wafting off this thread...



The OP can't blame the aggression of the people responding to his original post. The very title of the thread is antagonistic... so he was kinda asking for a fight.



I mean... I had a lot of trouble posting this instead of a three paragraph rant.



And as such, anyone who defends his position is also going to be attacked. I mean the subject is clearly sexist and offensive and so this thread was never really given the chance to be a civil discussion in the first place...

[Lord_Valandil]

ShrinkingFish wrote...

To address the whole argument wafting off this thread...

The OP can't blame the aggression of the people responding to his original post. The very title of the thread is antagonistic... so he was kinda asking for a fight.

I mean... I had a lot of trouble posting this instead of a three paragraph rant.

And as such, anyone who defends his position is also going to be attacked. I mean the subject is clearly sexist and offensive and so this thread was never really given the chance to be a civil discussion in the first place...

Pretty much this.

[AlanC9]

Zjarcal wrote...

One thing that has to be mentioned. Leliana's past as a bard does means that she slept around with both men and women. However she doesn't do that anymore and in fact she is the hardest companion to bed in the whole game.

Considering that, while she may have been a "skank" in the past, she certainly wasn't by the time the warden showed up. So qualifying her as a "skanky" LI is incorrect.

Well, if you do her personal quest you can't avoid getting on the romance track. But that seems to be a bug in the scripting. Design intent's a little hard to judge there, though; sometimes I think it may be a last-minute hack because QA kept reporting she was unromanceable. It's easy for a male character to miss the on-ramp for her romance track, and Leliana won't take the initiative with a male the way she will with a female.

Also, I'm a bit humored by how the OP keeps saying Isabella got double penetrated. Not in my game. Unless my F!Warden and Leliana were wearing "extra equipment". 

That's an image I'll be stuck with for a bit.

[KnightofPhoenix]

EDIT: nevermind. I think we've reached some mutual ground here and there is no point in going in circles.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 27 octobre 2010 - 04:52 .

[Dudalizer]

Lord_Valandil wrote...

Dudalizer wrote...

Lord_Valandil wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

One of my characters did approach Isabela and enjoyed it as hell. I, as a gamer, found out that Isabela doesn't mind foursomes, and as such, I would not want her for a partner. And that's what the OP is saying, that he, as a gamer, doesn't want someone like her as a love interest.

He could have said that, without referring to the girls as "skanks", saying that he had a lot of "class" and that most of us surely live in "*****"-up places. Don't you agree? Yes?

I apologized for that, but really how do you expect me to respond when people are attacking me?  Please stop trying to start a fight.

I'm not trying to start a fight. If you think that, you're missing the point.

You are prolonging the argument by bringing up statements I apologized for.  Anyway you don't need to respond to this post.  I would prefer it if I was not seen as a douche and prolonging this argument further would be counterproductive. 

[ShrinkingFish]

aaniadyen wrote...


But by that definition someone who sleeps with 10 people a night isn't a skank at all as long as it's consentual...

I think you didn't mean "someone"... I think you meant "woman".

When a woman has sex with ten people a night she is considered a skank.

When a man has sex with ten people a night he is considered a god.

This is a classic societal double standard. And I really need to get off of this soap box because I am terrified of heights...

[Bruddajakka]

To be fair though. Isabela doesn't even bring up the idea of having sex. The Warden is the one who suggests it.

[Ryzaki]

Personally what kind of female LIs would people prefer? I'd prefer someone experienced no carth syndrome but no virigin either.



...and personally I'd prefer if they didn't have any abused child/woman backstory. That's just personal preference.

[Inquisitor Recon]

ShrinkingFish wrote...
I think you didn't mean "someone"... I think you meant "woman".

When a woman has sex with ten people a night she is considered a skank.

When a man has sex with ten people a night he is considered a god.

This is a classic societal double standard. And I really need to get off of this soap box because I am terrified of heights...

Has somebody done a male Hawke "Deal with it!" poster yet?

[Riona45]

Bruddajakka wrote...

To be fair though. Isabela doesn't even bring up the idea of having sex. The Warden is the one who suggests it.

But...but that's not how people remember it!  The Warden is always a precious sacred lily who is led astray by NPCs.