I've made several attempts to defeat Arval and his henchies and I must say I'm finding this battle impossible. I've tried various tactics - using spells from companions to buff up my squad, using the mirrored shield I picked up earlier in the crypt but that still doesn't stop my squad getting blinded and cursed in seconds and killed shortly afterwards.
Does anybody have any tips on how to get past this battle. My character is a level 11 Air Genasi fighter travelling with Neeshka, Sand, Casavir and Shandra.
Thanks:crying:
Bryce Crypt - Battle With Arval Impossible
Débuté par
Leematon
, oct. 27 2010 03:27
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#2
Posté 27 octobre 2010 - 07:45
I_Raps
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The big answer is to wait on this subquest. It will become MUCH easier shortly.*
But that's not the answer you want.
You should bring Elanee instead of three and a half meleeists. Sand should have Stone Body on and Remove Curses ready. And two casters dropping AOE spells will silence these cultists a lot faster - not to mention Elanee can do some healing, which seems to be completely lacking from your group.
I would dump Casavir. He's not helping you. Or Neeshka. Even Grobnar would be more help here than those two.
And maybe you should buy some Remove Blindness potions until you have a caster who can do it. You're going to see a lot of blindness from here on (or is that "not see?").
But that's not the answer you want.
You should bring Elanee instead of three and a half meleeists. Sand should have Stone Body on and Remove Curses ready. And two casters dropping AOE spells will silence these cultists a lot faster - not to mention Elanee can do some healing, which seems to be completely lacking from your group.
I would dump Casavir. He's not helping you. Or Neeshka. Even Grobnar would be more help here than those two.
And maybe you should buy some Remove Blindness potions until you have a caster who can do it. You're going to see a lot of blindness from here on (or is that "not see?").
Modifié par I_Raps, 27 octobre 2010 - 09:02 .
#3
Posté 27 octobre 2010 - 08:40
Vaalyah
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My character is a cleric and I've found extremely useful those few cleric's spells that do holy damages. I can't tell you the names, since I use the game in Italian, but I am referring to those that make a holy light falling from the ceiling over the head of enemies.
Enchant your weapons with divine damages, protect your party from evil and cast holy damages with spells. That should work (and my character was at a lower level than yours)
Enchant your weapons with divine damages, protect your party from evil and cast holy damages with spells. That should work (and my character was at a lower level than yours)
#4
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 09:55
Leematon
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Thanks for the tips, guys. I_Raps I assume by AOE spells you mean spells that provide protection against evil. Incidentally I'm intrigued to find out where in the game the trigger is that makes this battle much easier.
#5
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 09:58
Mr Ordinary
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Please let us know where your latest save is - i.e. just outside the room where you meet Arval?
Also, some details as to what feats/spells Sand and Casavir have/know would help as this battle does depend very much on the initial tactics of your party - much more so than many other battles in the OC. I'm sure you can win the battle with your current party, if you are able to make a good tactical strike as your initial action.
Also, some details as to what feats/spells Sand and Casavir have/know would help as this battle does depend very much on the initial tactics of your party - much more so than many other battles in the OC. I'm sure you can win the battle with your current party, if you are able to make a good tactical strike as your initial action.
Modifié par Mr Ordinary, 28 octobre 2010 - 10:07 .
#6
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 10:37
I_Raps
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Leematon wrote...
Thanks for the tips, guys. I_Raps I assume by AOE spells you mean spells that provide protection against evil. Incidentally I'm intrigued to find out where in the game the trigger is that makes this battle much easier.
AOE is an old wargaming term for Area Of Effect. It means spells like Fireball or Isaac's Missiles (in Sand's case) or Call Lightning, Sunbeam etc. for Elanee.
As for the "trigger" - you're very soon going to receive a super-duper Grade A crypt cleaner.
Modifié par I_Raps, 28 octobre 2010 - 10:38 .
#7
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 02:59
Seagloom
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I agree with bringing Elanee along. Have her cast flame weapon on your melee characters and spell resistance on anyone that keeps getting pummeled by magic. Make sure Sand prepares a few heroism spells. If he has it, you might even want to consider greater heroism instead. Another invaluable spell is haste, preferably extended to make sure it keeps for the entire battle. Casavir's turn undead may stymie a few of those shadows. He can also benefit from casting aura of glory then following that with divine favor before wading into melee. Neeshka will be pretty useless here. If possible, sub her out for Elanee. Shandra, Casavir, and Elanee are more than enough melee power. Alternatively you can drop Casavir instead.
Grobnar is also handy to bring along, as someone has already mentioned. His inspirations make a big difference. Have him use inspire courage, or if you're very worried about blindness, inspire toughness.
Grobnar is also handy to bring along, as someone has already mentioned. His inspirations make a big difference. Have him use inspire courage, or if you're very worried about blindness, inspire toughness.
Modifié par Seagloom, 28 octobre 2010 - 03:00 .
#8
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 04:04
Leematon
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Mr Ordinary wrote...
Please let us know where your latest save is ...
Also, some details as to what feats/spells Sand and Casavir have/know...
My latest save is in the room I killed Raven (two rooms before the Arval Room).
As for spells Sand has the following spells in his arsenal (a * indicates memorised spells):
Level 6 - Disintegrate *x1, Greater Stoneskin *x2, Stone Body, Tenser's Transformation, Cloudkill (extended), Mind Fog (extended);
Level 5 - Cone of Cold *x3, Cloudkill *x1, Dismissal *x1, Mind Fog, Polymorph Self (extended), Stoneskin (extended);
Level 4 - Isaac's Lesser Missile Storm *x2, Bestow Curse *x1, Polymorph Self *x1, Stoneskin *x1, Greater Magic Weapon (extended), Haste (extended), Slow (extended), Spiderskin (extended);
Level 3 - Greater Magic Weapon *x2, Haste *x2, Slow *x1, Spiderskin *x1, Bear's Endurance (extended), Eagle's Splendour (extended), Fox's Cunning (extended);
Level 2 - Balagorn's Iron Horn *x2, Fox's Cunning *x2, Bear's Endurance *x1, Eagle's Splendour *x1. Enlarge Person (extended), Expeditious Retreat (extended), Low Light Vision (extended), Magic Weapon (extended), Shield (extended);
Level 1 - Burning Hands *x2, Enlarge Person *x1, Expeditious Retreat *x1, Identify *x1, Low Light Vision *x1, Magic Missile *x1, Magic Weapon, Shield, Daze (extended), Flare (extended), Light (extended), Resistance (extended);
Cantrips - Acid Splash *x1, Daze *x1, Flare *x1, Light *x1, Ray of Frost, Resistance, Touch of Fatigue.
Additionally Casavir has the following spells in memory - Level 3, Remove Curse; Level 2, Aura of Glory and Bull's Strength; Level 1, Divine Favour and Bless Weapon.
Hope this helps. I_Raps, can't wait to get my hands on the 'crypt-cleaner'.
#9
Posté 28 octobre 2010 - 10:56
I_Raps
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I don't want to reveal too much since you seem to be on your first time through, but I'll say this: don't assume you're out of the woods after this battle.
While it's possible to win with the folks you have, it's doing it the hard way. You have to choose between refighting this many times and moving on. You can always keep a save and come back to it as a "what if" once you've learned more about the game.
But if you insist... Sand needs to ditch Tenser's and Polymorphs. They're toys. They will do more harm to him than to the enemy. Mind Fog also isn't going to do you a bit of good. You lower people's Will Saves... for what? Bestow Curse?
It seems like you haven't let him learn any new spells, either. Almost everything there is what he started with. Chain Lightnings or Isaac's Greater Missile Storms would come in real handy here. Also, Firebrand beats those Cones of Cold hands down. If you don't have those spells - also the old standbys like Fireball, Lightning Bolt, etc. - then you really do need Elanee.
Another slight spoiler here - one of the frustrations in this game is that the NPCs will often charge stupidly to their deaths. The average IQ of your group is about to go way down. Elanee can help keep folks alive.
Besides, she looks better in a bikini than Casavir.
[edit] If you keep Casavir, Remove Blindness is far more important than Remove Curse. Oh, and when you get out of this, tell Sand to hit the books!
While it's possible to win with the folks you have, it's doing it the hard way. You have to choose between refighting this many times and moving on. You can always keep a save and come back to it as a "what if" once you've learned more about the game.
But if you insist... Sand needs to ditch Tenser's and Polymorphs. They're toys. They will do more harm to him than to the enemy. Mind Fog also isn't going to do you a bit of good. You lower people's Will Saves... for what? Bestow Curse?
It seems like you haven't let him learn any new spells, either. Almost everything there is what he started with. Chain Lightnings or Isaac's Greater Missile Storms would come in real handy here. Also, Firebrand beats those Cones of Cold hands down. If you don't have those spells - also the old standbys like Fireball, Lightning Bolt, etc. - then you really do need Elanee.
Another slight spoiler here - one of the frustrations in this game is that the NPCs will often charge stupidly to their deaths. The average IQ of your group is about to go way down. Elanee can help keep folks alive.
Besides, she looks better in a bikini than Casavir.
[edit] If you keep Casavir, Remove Blindness is far more important than Remove Curse. Oh, and when you get out of this, tell Sand to hit the books!
Modifié par I_Raps, 28 octobre 2010 - 11:15 .
#10
Posté 29 octobre 2010 - 09:21
Mr Ordinary
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Thanks for the reply, Leematon.
As well as reiterating what I_Raps and others have said regarding the spells Sand would find useful, I would not keep multiple versions of the same sort of spell in his spellbook - especially of spells which have a long duration, like Stoneskin. If this is your first playthrough and you are unfamiliar with the mechanics of resting in the OC this is a spoiler, but you can refresh your spellbook pretty much as and when you like so long as you find somewhere a little distance away from enemies. Also, an NPC has to actually be an enemy (i.e. highlight red) to prevent you resting and many encounters do not become enemies until after a conversation.
As for Casavir - he is a 12th level Paladin at this point, is he not? He will have useful buffs in his spell repertoire which will help you resist the debilitating spells being cast at you (saving throw buffs, etc) by Arval's group.
As for spells against Arval's group, they are all divine spell-casters (and a monk or two) and the casters have better Fort and Will saves than Reflex, so spells which require reflex saves will be more difficult for them to resist. However, as has been noted, you haven't had Sand learn any new spells other than those he had when joining your group.
I would, from your latest save, reset Sand's memorised spells to:
L6: Disintegrate (x2), Greater Stoneskin
L5: As is
L4: ILMS (x4), Bestow Curse
L3: GMW, Haste, Slow, Spiderskin (x2)
L2: BIH (x2), Fox's Cunning, Bear's Endurance, Eagle's Splendour, Shield (extended)
L1: Magic Missile (x7)
L0: Ray of Frost (x3), Resistance
For Casavir, the following:
L3: Magic Circle Against Alignment (or Prayer, if MCAA not available)
L2: Owl's Wisdom, Shield Other
L1: Bless (not Bless Weapon), Divine Favour
It is meta-gaming a bit - but you could already guess from the previous encounters that this room will be a battle, so buff up before going in. Cast the long duration spells (like Magic Circle Against Alignment) first, before the encounter, and leave the very short duration spells (like Haste) for the actual battle.
Have Casavir cast Shield Other and Owl's Wisdom on Sand. Anticipate the conversation with Arval ending and *pause* immediately. Sand should target Arval straight away with Disintegrate. It is a Fort save spell, but is from the Transmutation school - Sand's speciality - so he will have the best chance of overcoming Arval's saves. If the first Disintegrate doesn't work, use the second.
Take down Arval and the others are considerably easier.
Casavir's MCAA and Bless should give you the best chance of saving against the spells this group will throw at you. Casting Owl's Wisdom on Sand before the battle will boost his Will saves vs the Blindness and Curses.
It's not a guarantee you will beat Arval's group, but it will give you a much better chance.
As well as reiterating what I_Raps and others have said regarding the spells Sand would find useful, I would not keep multiple versions of the same sort of spell in his spellbook - especially of spells which have a long duration, like Stoneskin. If this is your first playthrough and you are unfamiliar with the mechanics of resting in the OC this is a spoiler, but you can refresh your spellbook pretty much as and when you like so long as you find somewhere a little distance away from enemies. Also, an NPC has to actually be an enemy (i.e. highlight red) to prevent you resting and many encounters do not become enemies until after a conversation.
As for Casavir - he is a 12th level Paladin at this point, is he not? He will have useful buffs in his spell repertoire which will help you resist the debilitating spells being cast at you (saving throw buffs, etc) by Arval's group.
As for spells against Arval's group, they are all divine spell-casters (and a monk or two) and the casters have better Fort and Will saves than Reflex, so spells which require reflex saves will be more difficult for them to resist. However, as has been noted, you haven't had Sand learn any new spells other than those he had when joining your group.
I would, from your latest save, reset Sand's memorised spells to:
L6: Disintegrate (x2), Greater Stoneskin
L5: As is
L4: ILMS (x4), Bestow Curse
L3: GMW, Haste, Slow, Spiderskin (x2)
L2: BIH (x2), Fox's Cunning, Bear's Endurance, Eagle's Splendour, Shield (extended)
L1: Magic Missile (x7)
L0: Ray of Frost (x3), Resistance
For Casavir, the following:
L3: Magic Circle Against Alignment (or Prayer, if MCAA not available)
L2: Owl's Wisdom, Shield Other
L1: Bless (not Bless Weapon), Divine Favour
It is meta-gaming a bit - but you could already guess from the previous encounters that this room will be a battle, so buff up before going in. Cast the long duration spells (like Magic Circle Against Alignment) first, before the encounter, and leave the very short duration spells (like Haste) for the actual battle.
Have Casavir cast Shield Other and Owl's Wisdom on Sand. Anticipate the conversation with Arval ending and *pause* immediately. Sand should target Arval straight away with Disintegrate. It is a Fort save spell, but is from the Transmutation school - Sand's speciality - so he will have the best chance of overcoming Arval's saves. If the first Disintegrate doesn't work, use the second.
Take down Arval and the others are considerably easier.
Casavir's MCAA and Bless should give you the best chance of saving against the spells this group will throw at you. Casting Owl's Wisdom on Sand before the battle will boost his Will saves vs the Blindness and Curses.
It's not a guarantee you will beat Arval's group, but it will give you a much better chance.
#11
Posté 29 octobre 2010 - 12:55
Mr Ordinary
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Just a quick addition to the above, I forgot to mention that you should put Neeshka into stealth mode before entering the room, and disable her from using ranged weapons.
As far as I am aware, the conversation you have with Arval does not destealth her and she will not be targetted with Blindness or Curse (or other spells) if she remains undetected. Have her sneak up to Arval and hit him hard, if your Disintegrates haven't already polished him off.
As far as I am aware, the conversation you have with Arval does not destealth her and she will not be targetted with Blindness or Curse (or other spells) if she remains undetected. Have her sneak up to Arval and hit him hard, if your Disintegrates haven't already polished him off.
Modifié par Mr Ordinary, 29 octobre 2010 - 12:56 .
#12
Posté 29 octobre 2010 - 01:58
Shallina
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4 characters
1 tank, 1 rogue, 1 healer, 1 caster.
You got 3 fighter + 1 caster without spell. You got a really bad party set up.
1 tank, 1 rogue, 1 healer, 1 caster.
You got 3 fighter + 1 caster without spell. You got a really bad party set up.
#13
Posté 29 octobre 2010 - 06:06
BelgarathMTH
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There are several spells that I find indispensible for this battle:
1) Protection from Evil - every member of the party needs it to avoid being stunned.
2) Death Ward - greatly reduces damage, since a lot of it is coming from negative energy. Elanee should be able to cast it on you and herself, at least.
3) Energy Immunity - fire and/or lightning on as many people as possible. Sand should take this spell as soon as you find a scroll or he gets a high enough level advance for him to get it as a bonus spell.
4) Haste - really helps with those pesky monks. Slow on them is a good addition. More spells that Sand should know, and/or you if you're playing an arcane caster.
Elanee and Sand should be blasting everything in the room with Call Lightning and Isaac's Missile Storms or Chain Lightning. Everybody should be stoneskinned. It really hurts at this point if Sand's spellbook hasn't been managed well, as someone else pointed out.
Melee doesn't do a bit of good other than to give the spellcasters a few extra precious seconds to cast.
This is one battle where magic is going to win the day over brawn.
I understand it may be too late this time around to take some of this advice, especially in Sand's case, but live and learn, I suppose.
One last piece of advice - don't neglect your spellcasters as they level up. There is at least one more battle coming up that is even harder and more magic-dependent than this one.
1) Protection from Evil - every member of the party needs it to avoid being stunned.
2) Death Ward - greatly reduces damage, since a lot of it is coming from negative energy. Elanee should be able to cast it on you and herself, at least.
3) Energy Immunity - fire and/or lightning on as many people as possible. Sand should take this spell as soon as you find a scroll or he gets a high enough level advance for him to get it as a bonus spell.
4) Haste - really helps with those pesky monks. Slow on them is a good addition. More spells that Sand should know, and/or you if you're playing an arcane caster.
Elanee and Sand should be blasting everything in the room with Call Lightning and Isaac's Missile Storms or Chain Lightning. Everybody should be stoneskinned. It really hurts at this point if Sand's spellbook hasn't been managed well, as someone else pointed out.
Melee doesn't do a bit of good other than to give the spellcasters a few extra precious seconds to cast.
This is one battle where magic is going to win the day over brawn.
I understand it may be too late this time around to take some of this advice, especially in Sand's case, but live and learn, I suppose.
One last piece of advice - don't neglect your spellcasters as they level up. There is at least one more battle coming up that is even harder and more magic-dependent than this one.
#14
Posté 01 novembre 2010 - 07:06
Star Dragon
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Or...
You can say stuff the 4 party limit and go 10 (max).
If I am the leader, I decide who/how many I bring with me...
This is the only time I encourage console usage.
hit ~ key to bring up console
type:
debugmode 1
rs ga_party_limit(10)
debugmode 0
~ (closes the console)
You now can have up to 10 party members in the group if you met them all yet.
At least you get to hear all possible comments and interactions in a scene!
It also means you can't keep everyone happy, you'll most likely gain and lose influence EVERY SCENE! He he...
You can say stuff the 4 party limit and go 10 (max).
If I am the leader, I decide who/how many I bring with me...
This is the only time I encourage console usage.
hit ~ key to bring up console
type:
debugmode 1
rs ga_party_limit(10)
debugmode 0
~ (closes the console)
You now can have up to 10 party members in the group if you met them all yet.
At least you get to hear all possible comments and interactions in a scene!
It also means you can't keep everyone happy, you'll most likely gain and lose influence EVERY SCENE!
He he...
Modifié par Star Dragon, 01 novembre 2010 - 07:06 .
#15
Posté 02 novembre 2010 - 05:59
Leematon
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Well, I've finally made it! I modified Sand's spellbook as per Mr Ordinary's advice and substituted Neeshka for Elanee like some of you others have suggested and it worked - just! It took me about a dozen attempts but I finally made it with about 1 HP left on my last man standing!
The remaining battles in the crypt I found much easier by comparison. All that remained was to call at the Church of Lathander to get my Ability damage healed.
Once again a big thank you to all who have input to this thread.
The remaining battles in the crypt I found much easier by comparison. All that remained was to call at the Church of Lathander to get my Ability damage healed.
Once again a big thank you to all who have input to this thread.
#16
Posté 02 novembre 2010 - 10:53
I_Raps
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Leematon wrote...
All that remained was to call at the Church of Lathander to get my Ability damage healed.
That skinny girl with the pointed ears would be happy to do that for you. You should explore the possibilities of the various characters; you're fighting now with one hand tied behind your back.
#17
Posté 03 novembre 2010 - 09:26
Leematon
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I_Raps wrote...
You should explore the possibilities of the various characters; you're fighting now with one hand tied behind your back.
Oh, I'm doing that alright. The Church of Lathander just seemed the obvious place to go. It was just a pain that my character was walking back through the crypt with the speed of an 80-year old and I had to change control to an unhindered companion to expedite the journey.
Modifié par Leematon, 03 novembre 2010 - 03:50 .
#18
Posté 03 novembre 2010 - 01:09
Mr Ordinary
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Glad you made it through! As you learn more about the character's strengths and weaknesses, and especially more about the magic system in NWN2, you'll find your party will become a lot more capable and you'll have increased party flexibility going forward.
Good luck on the journey!
Good luck on the journey!
Modifié par Mr Ordinary, 03 novembre 2010 - 01:09 .
