472 réponses à ce sujet

[Sir JK]

I find the claim that the idea that developers would cut out finished (or semi-finished) content to market it separately would be common sense to be slightly amusing. After all:

To cut out content you need to decide what to cut out, inform the teams involved what should be cut, delegate responsibility of doing so, put a team on doing it, spend the time taking it out piece by piece, erasing all traces you can find of it, develop tools for it to be able to reintegrate into the game it was cut from, test to make sure that the main game still functions properly without it, polish it up separately from the game, market it separately, and then sell it.

There's probably even more work involved than my breakdown implies even, it is essentially more time-consuming, expensive and problematic than developing it completely on the side. In fact... cutting out finished content is probably more expensive than developing new things by the side. Thus Occam's razor (the simplest conclusion is probably the most true one) dictates that it's probably not cut for the reason to market it separately.

Which is to say that it should be common sense that it isn't cut for that reason, especially since the developers in question have stated that they are developed separately with their own budget and their own timetable (and if you think they are in fact lying, what do you have to gain here?).

[akabane_k]

This whole thing is a simple risk-reward tradeoff

there is more risk in buying a game before it is released and reviewed, therefore bioware has to compensate people, otherwise no one would buy it beforehand.

That would cause them to lose profit, since some of the people that would have preordered will read a review and decide not to buy the game.

If you feel the risk is too great, wait until reviews come out and then make your choice, but don't expect to be rewarded for doing nothing

[AlanC9]

Snelle Jaap wrote...

Big Blue Car wrote...

http://dragonage.bioware.com/da2/info/

Pre-order the game on blind faith, before any real reviews or critical opinions are released, and you get free content. Don't and you won't.

It's the best method to trick fans into buying a product before they can make an informed choice about it I can think of.

That
a hundred times that.

Anyone else amused to see that the people who are ostensibly defending the fans' interests are the ones who think the fans are fools?

[upsettingshorts]

AlanC9 wrote...
Anyone else amused to see that the people who are ostensibly defending the fans' interests are the ones who think the fans are fools?

Constantly. 

[aaniadyen]

Snelle Jaap wrote...

Big Blue Car wrote...

http://dragonage.bioware.com/da2/info/

Pre-order the game on blind faith, before any real reviews or critical opinions are released, and you get free content. Don't and you won't.

It's the best method to trick fans into buying a product before they can make an informed choice about it I can think of.

That
a hundred times that.

To be fair, I don't think it's meant to be a means of tricking people into buying something they don't want. I think it's just there to reward the people who would be buying it anyway (which includes al ot of people here).

[ForceXev]

The way I see it, it's a gift for the fans. The only reason why it looks bad at all is because they're releasing it right away on day 1. They could have easily held on to that extra character for a month, and then charged everyone a few bucks for it, which they're probably going to do eventually anyway. Instead, you can get it right away for free on day 1 if you pre-order. Those of us who are fans of DAO and Bioware games and have enough faith in Bioware to pre-order the game get a freebie. I don't see anything wrong with that.

[Morroian]

MadLaughter wrote...

a character for preordering is different. Bioware are requiring people to make the jump and order the game before it is reviewed and before consumers can make an informed decision.

No, they really aren't.

[AtreiyaN7]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
Anyone else amused to see that the people who are ostensibly defending the fans' interests are the ones who think the fans are fools?

Constantly. 

I'll second that.

[Onyx Jaguar]

I'll freak out if it really is just a preorder thing



As for DLC with new copies I am for that as I am a business man, and it is a brilliant business move that only hurts the second hand buyers.



Video Games are like Music or Television. You can't go to a show to see the game perform and you can't watch a game on TV (well some you can but I digress) and the ratings combined with marketers fill the coffers with change (outside of the constantly going online games of course). Video Games, especially single player, are a one way street and that one way is buying a new copy out of release. Be it 50-80 dollars right away or down the line when the publisher releases it again at a lower cost.

[Riona45]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...
Anyone else amused to see that the people who are ostensibly defending the fans' interests are the ones who think the fans are fools?

Constantly. 

I'll second that.

I'll third it.

[Onyx Jaguar]

You guys are all scabs fighting against the gamer union! We need this army of Ralph Naders as sometimes they are right!



That sounded much more amusing in my head than in text, but I'll press submit anyway, just to show em. The Lord of the lands next door that is.

[DocDVD]

As for DLC with new copies I am for that as I am a business man, and it is a brilliant business move that only hurts the second hand buyers. 

Really, well the new scheme of Bio/EA lost them at least one customer (->me), I simply don't see the point why I should be thankfull that I get "extra" content (that was left out intentionally) if I
* buy the game at a certain store
* preorder the game
* etc.

I like(d) Bioware games and I gladly preorderd all their games up to ME2 - but after Dragon Age I swore never to buy another Bio/EA game again (and that had nothing to do with the core game itself).

In my opinion most of the DLC was either overpowered (Weapons) or not worth the money (Witch Hunt). Add tons of authentication problems (for free DLC - LOL) and non existing customer support from EA on top of that and I'll glady spend my money elsewhere.

I wish all best of fun with DA2 (seriously), but I'll look elsewhere for entertainment than EA/Bio in the future.

[aaniadyen]

DocDVD wrote...

As for DLC with new copies I am for that as I am a business man, and it is a brilliant business move that only hurts the second hand buyers. 

Really, well the new scheme of Bio/EA lost them at least one customer (->me), I simply don't see the point why I should be thankfull that I get "extra" content (that was left out intentionally) if I
* buy the game at a certain store
* preorder the game
* etc.

I like(d) Bioware games and I gladly preorderd all their games up to ME2 - but after Dragon Age I swore never to buy another Bio/EA game again (and that had nothing to do with the core game itself).

In my opinion most of the DLC was either overpowered (Weapons) or not worth the money (Witch Hunt). Add tons of authentication problems (for free DLC - LOL) and non existing customer support from EA on top of that and I'll glady spend my money elsewhere.

I wish all best of fun with DA2 (seriously), but I'll look elsewhere for entertainment than EA/Bio in the future.

Ok, so you aren't going to buy it...but you're on a forum for it 5 months before it even comes out? I think your bigger problem with the game is all the problems you've been having, as all the topics you've made have been ddirectly related to game bugs. It's hard to take you seriously when you made a thread a year ago that said "that's it, I'm never buying another EA game." Yet you're still here.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 28 octobre 2010 - 06:11 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Considering almost every publisher is adopting such a scheme you are going to run out of options soon.



Hell even Super Meat Boy does something similar and that is an Indie game. This preorder stuff ins't new its been around for ages now.

[Morroian]

DocDVD wrote...

Really, well the new scheme of Bio/EA lost them at least one customer (->me), I simply don't see the point why I should be thankfull that I get "extra" content (that was left out intentionally) if I

So I take it you buy no luxury or recreational goods given that it is a ploy used across the retail industry.

[MelfinaofOutlawStar]

Funny thing is you're pre-ordering content that is already on the disc.

[Riona45]

Also, if you declare that you are no longer the customer of a company, then they have no more reason to try to give you what you want.

[Onyx Jaguar]

MelfinaofOutlawStar wrote...

Funny thing is you're pre-ordering content that is already on the disc.

here is the proper issue, for instance "The Edge" seemed most certainly to be on the disc and weas just unlocked if you got the game early.

This practice is BS

[ObserverStatus]

JohnEpler wrote...

Folks, let's keep it polite and civil.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, and they're entitled to discuss it without being attacked.

I know we can't attack each other for our opinions on dlc, but can we attack each other for using the word "irregardless" ?

[Onyx Jaguar]

You know what the Lord Humongous always said, "No kill, kill is for later"



I assume thats what he meant in regards to irregardless

[ObserverStatus]

Stanley Woo wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
I don't mind when they create DLC AFTER the game is finished, but I do mind removing portions of the game created before release and selling them separately.

Shale is a perfect example of a DLC that contained content that was originally in the game. The content was removed due to not having enough time/resources to finish it, but due to the delay in DAO's release, it was decided to finish the content and release it as DLC. Based on your post, you would prefer that the excised Shale content never see the light of day ever because it was originally in the main game!
Aside from that, I think we can manage our own time and resources and develop the content we need when we need to, thank you. We can't very well have developers just sitting around twiddling their thumbs just because of a perception that we're doing something inappropriate. Developers get restless.

Interesting, I always thought that the story with Shale was the same as the Versus mode in Resident Evil 5.  Capcom put it on the disc, but required an expensive download of a few kilobites to unlock it.  I see how the game getting delayed would put such content in a state of limbo.

[Bann Duncan]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Merced256 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Gabey5 wrote...
i will buy this game regardless. Its dragon age.

I will buy the game irregardless.

is that even a word?

Something to consider.

Yay Jeeves! I've been a massive fan since my childhood.

Pick up his book The Ode Less Traveled if you get a chance. It's simply Stephen Fry musing about poetry and language with the intention of awakening such interest in the reader.

[ObserverStatus]

NKKKK wrote...

Hey at least you're not going down the line of Fallout Broken Steel...yet.

Hey, I liked broken steel.  It was worth every penny.

Modifié par bobobo878, 28 octobre 2010 - 07:01 .

[upsettingshorts]

bobobo878 wrote...
I know we can't attack each other for our opinions on dlc, but can we attack each other for using the word "irregardless" ?

I should create a second account to use solely to attack people who say "could care less" when they mean "couldn't care less."

And no-one better try and justify that one to me.  I will destroy you.  

...I could call the second account Furiouspants.

bobobo878 wrote...
Hey, I liked broken steel.  It was worth every penny.

All of the Fallout 3 DLC was pretty good.  Though I think Mothership Zeta ran out of steam about halfway through escaping the ship - it got a bit old - but redeemed itself with its fun space battle minigame at the end.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 28 octobre 2010 - 07:11 .

[Dave of Canada]

akabane_k wrote...

This whole thing is a simple risk-reward tradeoff

Hell, they can simply preorder and cancel it near release if reviews aren't favorable.

Voila: Free content if you get it, no content if you don't.