6837 réponses à ce sujet

[Crimson Invictus]

Dave of Canada wrote...
Last I checked, characters were interesting because who they are and not because of how much you want to mold them.

I don't think there has ever been a relationship where someone hasn't been trying to mould someone.

[Taleroth]

Liana Nighthawk wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...
Last I checked, characters were interesting because who they are and not because of how much you want to mold them.

I don't think there has ever been a relationship where someone hasn't been trying to mould someone.

My two favorite things are commitment and changing myself.

[Eternal Dust]

crimzontearz wrote...

also........I demand an alternate appearance like THIS


for isabela!

Her boobs look as huge as her face...

[Razaroh]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Loads of you want to "tame" Isabela (you know who you are, if you feel targeted it's because you are). She's hedonistic and free spirited, if you want to change her... why even bother liking the character? You want to change who she is, which to me seems... odd, because you certainly don't care about the character if you want to change who she is.

They're kinda like the ones in Tali's fabase that fetishizes her virginity. But in reverse. To have a normally wanton woman fall so in awe over the PC sexual prowess, that she realizes he is all she would ever need and was foolish for thinking otherwise, is a testament to their manliness.

At least, that's how those posts came off to me.

[crimzontearz]

Dave of Canada wrote...
Loads of you want to "tame" Isabela (you know who you are, if you feel targeted it's because you are). She's hedonistic and free spirited, if you want to change her... why even bother liking the character? You want to change who she is, which to me seems... odd, because you certainly don't care about the character if you want to change who she is.

Why must she "settle" for Hawke? Why must Hawke *change* her, why can't Hawke change for her? Oh right, because you're the protagonist. She can't be allowed to be her own person if you dislike it, you'd have to change it. If you want somebody that isn't hedonistic or free spirited, don't romance Isabela.


Last I checked, characters were interesting because who they are and not because of how much you want to mold them.

1: like it was said before I've never been in a relationship in which both parties did not wanted to mold the other in some way shape or form


2: you may not like it but given what we have seen (both on the trailers and in other Bioware games like Say ME2 or even BG) it is VERY likely that is going to be the outcome so.....as much as you want us "not to romance her if we do not like her free spirited and swinging away" I guess "we" are gonna have it our way apparently uh? With that in mind why would you even care? I mean if WE are given that option to "tame" her as you put it (which is not...it's about your relationship evolving to the point hawke is more important to her than her swinging lifestyle and her choosing him over it) and you are given the option to let her not settle and ultimately we BOTH are happy with the end result then why in the name of god do you care? why do you have to villify what we find appealing?


3:A character is not enticing solely because of her basic personality but also because of her interaction with your character and how those interactions make her evolve. If the character is utterly static then it's boring. If one of the ways Isabela's character is made to evolve by our interactions then DON'T do it and choose a different path. Same with hardening or softening Lelliana or Alistair

Modifié par crimzontearz, 18 février 2011 - 06:19 .

[crimzontearz]

Razaroh wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Loads of you want to "tame" Isabela (you know who you are, if you feel targeted it's because you are). She's hedonistic and free spirited, if you want to change her... why even bother liking the character? You want to change who she is, which to me seems... odd, because you certainly don't care about the character if you want to change who she is.

They're kinda like the ones in Tali's fabase that fetishizes her virginity. But in reverse. To have a normally wanton woman fall so in awe over the PC sexual prowess, that she realizes he is all she would ever need and was foolish for thinking otherwise, is a testament to their manliness.

At least, that's how those posts came off to me.

I suppose you should go back and read some of the earlier, less testosterone induced, posts

[Maria Caliban]

octoberfire wrote...

Her boobs look as huge as her face...

I think the same is true of Isabela.

[Dave of Canada]

crimzontearz wrote...

like it was said before I've never been in a relationship in which both parties did not wanted to mold the other in some way shape or form

Molding a person does happen in relationships, though not to the extreme you guys want. You want to take away everything Isabela is and turn her into somebody she's not, which is different. It's like those relationships where people date the bad boy and want to turn him good and wonder why the hell the bad boy is still being bad.

you may not like it but given what we have seen (both on the trailers and in other Bioware games like Say ME2 or even BG) it is VERY likely that is going to be the outcome so.....

What? One line of dialogue where she questions if you're bringing feelings into sex, please. That isn't enough evidence for anything, all we've seen so far is Isabela being Isabela.

as much as you want us "not to romance her if we do not like her free spirited and swinging away" I guess "we" are gonna have it our way apparently uh?

Read what's in pink in my signature. It applies here.

With that in mind why would you even care?

Because it's about a character? Last I checked, this is a discussion thread and I find what you guys are discussing creepy and brought points to it. It's still a discussion, one which you probably feel uncomfortable because you're one of the people targeted in the post.

I mean if WE are given that option to "tame" her as you put it (which is not...it's about your relationship evolving to the point hawke is more important to her than her swinging lifestyle and her choosing him over it) and you are given the option to let her not settle and ultimately we BOTH are happy with the end result then why in the name of god do you care? why do you have to villify what we find appealing?

Because what you find appealing isn't related at all to the character in question? If you want to settle down with a one man woman, go with Merrill. She seems the type. At the moment, what you guys want is mostly to turn Isabela into Merrill.

A character is not enticing solely because of her basic personality but also because of her interaction with your character and how those interactions make her evolve.

Interactions shouldn't change what defines a character unless it's part of the character itself, for example... being nice to Oghren doesn't magically cure him of alcoholism and commitment issues.

If the character is utterly static then it's boring.

So most of the characters in ME1, ME2 and DAO were boring?

If one of the ways Isabela's character is made to evolve by our interactions then DON'T do it and choose a different path.

I won't do it, I'm just rather disturbed by how you want to change a character's fundementals because you don't like it. Why the hell should she change to suit your needs? Mm? Please explain it to me, tell me why she should change her lifestyle and behavior because you don't feel comfortable. Why can't Hawke change for her? If your Hawke truely loves Isabela, why does she have to be the one to change?

You don't like what was presented of Isabela in both DA:O and DA2, yet you want to change that because you want to sleep with her. That just shows... control issues (are those the correct words?) to me. It's like wanting to change Zevran into a gentlemen that finds murder disgusting, you can't do that because murder is pretty much part of who he is.

Same with hardening or softening Lelliana or Alistair

Both were uncertain of themselves, Isabela doesn't seem uncertain of herself because she's pretty much lived this way for a long time. You were unable to morph Oghren into an icon of public civility, Sten into loving the non-Qunari and Zevran into a non-assassin.

I suppose you should go back and read some of the earlier, less testosterone induced, posts

That'll take some digging.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 18 février 2011 - 07:59 .

[nijnij]

I was bored and did this on MSpaint.

[Taleroth]

I little cleaner and I would have mistaken it for an old graphical adventure game (I actually did for a moment). Good job.

Modifié par Taleroth, 18 février 2011 - 08:19 .

[nijnij]

Taleroth wrote...

I little cleaner and I would have mistaken it for an old graphical adventure game (I actually did for a moment). Good job.

I actually just played one, so that was the intent. Although I didn't technically try to do pixel art, I just drew normally in a small frame and with few colors.

[Crimson Invictus]

Totally off the subject I do realise, but that perfectly demonstrates the effect of unique appearances for the companions. Even presented in a very simple style it is obvious who they both are.

[nijnij]

Liana Nighthawk wrote...

Totally off the subject I do realise, but that perfectly demonstrates the effect of unique appearances for the companions. Even presented in a very simple style it is obvious who they both are.

Hehe, quite true. With my lazy skills, I would have had much more trouble representing, say, Leliana and Zevran in a somewhat recognizable fashion.

[Master Shiori]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Loads of you want to "tame" Isabela (you know who you are, if you feel targeted it's because you are). She's hedonistic and free spirited, if you want to change her... why even bother liking the character? You want to change who she is, which to me seems... odd, because you certainly don't care about the character if you want to change who she is.

I don't need her to change. As long as she truly cares about my Hawke and is commited to staying together with her that's enough for me. Besides, my Hawke will also be free spirited, fun loving person so they should get along just fine.
That said, I don't believe Isabela will be quite as free spirited in a serious relationship as she would be when she's solo. At least not before making sure her lover was alright with that, just as my Hawke would never do something that would upset Isabela. A threesome between Isabela, Hawke and a third person, like the one in DA:O, would be fine as long as we both agree to it.

Dave of Canada wrote...

Why must she "settle" for Hawke?

Depends on what you consider "Settling for Hawke" to mean.

Personally, I'd imagine Isabela would react to a relationship with Hawke in a similar manner that Zevran reacted to a relationship with the Warden; he did settle for the Warden as in, he loved him/her and was commited. That didn't mean he had to stop being an assassin or even drasticaly change his personality.

If I romance a character in Dragon Age it's because I like them for who they are, not because I want to do a 180 degrees and become a completely different person.

Modifié par Master Shiori, 18 février 2011 - 10:32 .

[crimzontearz]

[quote]Dave of Canada wrote...

[quote]crimzontearz wrote...

like it was said before I've never been in a relationship in which both parties did not wanted to mold the other in some way shape or form[/quote]

Molding a person does happen in relationships, though not to the extreme you guys want. You want to take away everything Isabela is and turn her into somebody she's not, which is different. It's like those relationships where people date the bad boy and want to turn him good and wonder why the hell the bad boy is still being bad.

[quote]you may not like it but given what we have seen (both on the trailers and in other Bioware games like Say ME2 or even BG) it is VERY likely that is going to be the outcome so.....[/quote]

What? One line of dialogue where she questions if you're bringing feelings into sex, please. That isn't enough evidence for anything, all we've seen so far is Isabela being Isabela.

[quote]as much as you want us "not to romance her if we do not like her free spirited and swinging away" I guess "we" are gonna have it our way apparently uh?[/quote]

Read what's in pink in my signature. It applies here.

[quote]With that in mind why would you even care?[/quote]

Because it's about a character? Last I checked, this is a discussion thread and I find what you guys are discussing creepy and brought points to it. It's still a discussion, one which you probably feel uncomfortable because you're one of the people targeted in the post.

[quote]I mean if WE are given that option to "tame" her as you put it (which is not...it's about your relationship evolving to the point hawke is more important to her than her swinging lifestyle and her choosing him over it) and you are given the option to let her not settle and ultimately we BOTH are happy with the end result then why in the name of god do you care? why do you have to villify what we find appealing?[/quote]

Because what you find appealing isn't related at all to the character in question? If you want to settle down with a one man woman, go with Merrill. She seems the type. At the moment, what you guys want is mostly to turn Isabela into Merrill.

[quote]A character is not enticing solely because of her basic personality but also because of her interaction with your character and how those interactions make her evolve.[/quote]

Interactions shouldn't change what defines a character unless it's part of the character itself, for example... being nice to Oghren doesn't magically cure him of alcoholism and commitment issues.

[quote]If the character is utterly static then it's boring.[/quote]

So most of the characters in ME1, ME2 and DAO were boring?

[quote]If one of the ways Isabela's character is made to evolve by our interactions then DON'T do it and choose a different path.[/quote]

I won't do it, I'm just rather disturbed by how you want to change a character's fundementals because you don't like it. Why the hell should she change to suit your needs? Mm? Please explain it to me, tell me why she should change her lifestyle and behavior because you don't feel comfortable. Why can't Hawke change for her? If your Hawke truely loves Isabela, why does she have to be the one to change?

You don't like what was presented of Isabela in both DA:O and DA2, yet you want to change that because you want to sleep with her. That just shows... control issues (are those the correct words?) to me. It's like wanting to change Zevran into a gentlemen that finds murder disgusting, you can't do that because murder is pretty much part of who he is.

[quote]Same with hardening or softening Lelliana or Alistair[/quote]

Both were uncertain of themselves, Isabela doesn't seem uncertain of herself because she's pretty much lived this way for a long time. You were unable to morph Oghren into an icon of public civility, Sten into loving the non-Qunari and Zevran into a non-assassin.

[quote]I suppose you should go back and read some of the earlier, less testosterone induced, posts[/quote]

That'll take some digging.


[/quote]

oh good god you have to be kidding me. First off I am not uncomfortable....please, do not give yourself that much credit, at best you succeeded in annoying me.

First off Dave even the devs said that her "open ways" are not what defines the character. Yes she is free spirited but that is not what makes Isabela who she is NOR prevents her from settling down eventually. regardless

Observe ME and DAO, the characters are definitely not static in those games. In ME you can steer both Kaiden and Ashley in certain directions depending on how you talk to them. In DAO you can harden and soften Lelliana and Alistair (even Zev a little), in Awakening you can steer almost all the character toward certain realizations often ultimately opposite to the alternative (and hey look at Viconia from BG2 swapping from Neutral Evil to True Neutral...just saying). In ME2 you can do so with those characters as well, yes you may say they were conflicted to begin with but again Isabela's lifestyle when it comes to relationships is not what defines her at all nor it is the immutable cornerstone of her personality and it is rather odd you believe it to be so. Not to mention no one EVER said we want her to turn into Merryl or something, the most people want really is monogamy.....I doubt they would flip if she still flirted with people as long as he was not bedding everything that caught her fancy. She can happily remain her flirty, sexy, exibitionist, sultury little self be assured. 

Now back to Isabela, why does SHE have to change for Hawke? Because she is the one who does NOT want to get attached ot bring feelings into the relationship which bring us to an impass. Either A: Hawke accepts not to bring feelings into it and therefore this is not a relationship but simply a ****buddy arrangement or B: Isabela concedes to her feelings for Hawke ...at which point either Hawke is ok with it being an open relationship or he is not. If he is OK with it then well whatever but if he is not (like mine will be) then it is up to Isabela to make a choice....what is more important, Hawke or her lifestyle? It is a choice MANY couples have to face eventually. It is not about forcing a change it's about a very normal choice. A choice that actually appeals to me, it brings forth contrast and hey if the choice ends up  being "romance isabela but Hawke is not important enough for her to be at least monogamous" and "romance Merryl who will be monogamous" I will go for Merryl, no harm no foul. But given the choice to arrive to the conclusion to have Isabela become monogamous I will pursue that path. ....your Hawke may be happy  in an open relationship, my Hawle might not. As long as we are both happy with the result then, again...why would you care? You would because then the character is ruined to YOU? Because she should remain the way you like her since you feel her being monogamous is a 180 degree turn way above the reach of character developement?......yeah whatever

 no point pursuing this any further

[HolyJellyfish]

Guys, when it reaches paragraph levels, it means PM is preferred.

Anywhoooo, I'd love to see what her alternative armor upgrades will look like. Different scarves? Pants? Short shorts? I'm intrigued.

Modifié par HolyJellyfish, 18 février 2011 - 10:50 .

[gastovski]

moilami wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

also........I demand an alternate appearance like THIS


for isabela!

This is awesome and reminds me I should buy Fallout 3.

this from Batman Arkham City. Shes Harley Quinn

Modifié par gastovski, 18 février 2011 - 11:01 .

[crimzontearz]

gastovski wrote...

moilami wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

also........I demand an alternate appearance like THIS


for isabela!

This is awesome and reminds me I should buy Fallout 3.

this from Batman Arkham City

it is

and Harley Quinn is the sexiest DC character...ever....better than powergirl too 

Modifié par crimzontearz, 18 février 2011 - 11:04 .

[Taleroth]

Quinn



Harley Quinn

[crimzontearz]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Guys, when it reaches paragraph levels, it means PM is preferred.

Anywhoooo, I'd love to see what her alternative armor upgrades will look like. Different scarves? Pants? Short shorts? I'm intrigued.

not sure she will have one......remember alternate appearances due to upgrades are the exception not the rule according to th devs

that said I'd LOVE to see some alternative appearance packs for her

[nightcobra]

in the attempt of using batman to veer the topic back onto isabela i hereby request a catwoman-y or harley quinn-ish fanart of isabela.

[crimzontearz]

Taleroth wrote...

Quinn

Harley Quinn

Typo......she is still iron-brand hot

[nijnij]

This proves there's nothing as un-universal as the notion of beauty. I'd rather romance Sandal than an Isabela who looks like this... thing up there. She almost makes the actual Isabela look classy.

[crimzontearz]

nijnij wrote...

This proves there's nothing as un-universal as the notion of beauty. I'd rather romance Sandal than an Isabela who looks like this... thing up there. She almost makes the actual Isabela look classy.

it's also the concept behind the chharacter....and the fact she is a world class gymnast...oh and her voice actress (she is soooo adorably quirky)

[upsettingshorts]

All I know is this thread used to be all right, now it's typically filled with enough do-not-want that I simply stopped checking it unless linked.