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[whykikyouwhy]

Quething wrote...

I think she did sleep with Anders. She says of the electricity thing, "that was nice," which sounds like firsthand experience to me.

Maybe she was just a spectator. Or maybe she just got a residual charge.

[hoorayforicecream]

Quething wrote...
See, and I had one of those and Izzy loved her. 

I think she did sleep with Anders. She says of the electricity thing, "that was nice," which sounds like firsthand experience to me. Despite her instant, down-to-the-dialog recollection of Anders and Leliana, I don't know if she finds all her partners that memorable (the Warden's presence counts as extenuating circumstances), so it works for me. But you could also figure they were both involved in the same small orgy, or some similar event where she wouldn't be expected to know everyone involved.

AoE spell effect?

Regarding past lovers, I'm looking at the down-to-the-dialog recollections, but also things like:

* Isabela: You look like a man I once dueled.
* Isabela: He was a little intimated by my reputation as a vicious pirate, but rose to the challenge.
* Carver: He looked like me, you say?
* Isabela: It went on all night, under the stars, the waves lapping at our ankles.
* Carver: On the beach? In the surf? How did you get proper footing?
* Isabela: We didn't. There was quite a bit of tumbling around, and we were soaked and sore by the time the sun came up.
* Carver: Did you... win?
* Isabela: I managed to get on top in the end, but I considered it a tie.

Also this:

* Bethany: I guess you've been with a lot of men.
* Isabela: Men. Women. Elves. A dwarf in drag once, but I don't recommend that.

She doesn't seem to ever have trouble remembering past lovers; she's pretty specific whenever they come up.

Modifié par hoorayforicecream, 23 novembre 2011 - 02:33 .

[Abispa]

Actually, I wonder sometimes how much of it is exaggeration on her part. I don't doubt that she has had many lovers, but I sometimes think she makes up stuff just to fluster whoever she's talking to.

"You've had many lovers, haven't you?"
"Not as many as some think."

In a way she could just be a party girl or a female Ric Flair. Not above having a one night stand, but more than willing to go hope alone after partying all night.

[hoorayforicecream]

I do agree with the party girl idea as well. On another note, I just had a thought regarding Anders, and the Pearl. He mentioned that people at the Blooming Rose often tried to hire him. Perhaps that's what he was doing at the Pearl?

[Master Shiori]

Anders hiding in the Pearl as an apostitute? I find the thought to be incredibly amusing for some reason.

He certainly was a light hearted, fun loving person back then, but I'm not sure if he'd really agree to such line of work.

Maybe he was just there to get laid after escaping his solitary confinement in the Circle Tower?

[whykikyouwhy]

So you think he was in the middle of a job interview when he was flinging sparks and bolts around? That's certainly a possibility. A brothel would be a great place to hide, and stay abreast of all the town gossip - such as "hey, some templars and Wardens are looking for a runaway mage. Oh, and they want a three-way."

And magic should always be an element of sexytimes. Even the kind you pay for.

[hoorayforicecream]

He wouldn't necessarily have to be an apostitute though. More like the house physician/magician, I'd think. Various additional services available for customers at an additional cost, and to keep the workers healthy.

[whykikyouwhy]

I suppose he could be the doc-on-call, applying his balms and tinctures as needed.

But, I could see DA:A Anders as having had some regular clientele (maybe it's the earring - it sort of denotes fun), and thus being on staff. He already had some kind of reputation, right?


EDIT: Removed an incorrect reference.

Modifié par whykikyouwhy, 24 novembre 2011 - 01:28 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Out of curiosity how many times did you notice mentions of the Isabella romance in the dialogue of the game? She was the first out of the four that I perused and I counted a few of them. Although, I kind of was expecting more.

Leandra says "I've heard that pirate girl of yours talk"

Aveline once mentions "You and Isabella" if you ask her about her relationship with Donnic when you first find out she is pursuing him.

Merrill and Isabella have a couple banters in total I think. One where Merrill says that "I think Hawke likes you" And one where Isabella mentions "that she's just happy."

Gamlen has that one line (I managed him to ask me about two women but I honestly can't seem to recreate it anymore when I try to find it again).

And I don't think there is anything else other than 1 slightly modified line about her persuading the right person to come away with her from Kirkwall in another banter with Merrill and that Zevran/Isabella threesome option.

Other than the DLCs did any of you guys run into other ones?

[hoorayforicecream]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

Out of curiosity how many times did you notice mentions of the Isabella romance in the dialogue of the game? She was the first out of the four that I perused and I counted a few of them. Although, I kind of was expecting more.

Leandra says "I've heard that pirate girl of yours talk"

Aveline once mentions "You and Isabella" if you ask her about her relationship with Donnic when you first find out she is pursuing him.

Merrill and Isabella have a couple banters in total I think. One where Merrill says that "I think Hawke likes you" And one where Isabella mentions "that she's just happy."

Gamlen has that one line (I managed him to ask me about two women but I honestly can't seem to recreate it anymore when I try to find it again).

And I don't think there is anything else other than 1 slightly modified line about her persuading the right person to come away with her from Kirkwall in another banter with Merrill and that Zevran/Isabella threesome option.

Other than the DLCs did any of you guys run into other ones?

The grand list:

Any Love interest:
- Aveline will bring up Hawke's love interest during the Long Road
- Leandra will bring up the love interest in a bark after talking about her getting remarried
- Gamlen will bring up the love interest in a bark if you click on him in his home. He will further ask about what it's like with two women, if Hawke is female.
- Varric will bring up the love interest in a scripted conversation at the Hanged Man during act 2. This was previously bugged not to occur, but was fixed in 1.03.
- The Love Interest will be kidnapped during "Best Served Cold" if Hawke's sibling died in the Deep Roads, and there will be some conversation options.
- The Love Interest will visit and comfort Hawke after Leandra's death in All That Remains

Isabela-specific talk:
- Sebastian will ask why Isabela is sticking around. If Isabela's romanced, she'll say it's because of sex with Hawke. If not, she'll say it's because of the Blooming Rose.
- Merrill will ask why Isabela is smiling. She's "just happy"
- Merrill will ask if Isabela will ever leave Kirkwall. If romanced, Isabela will say she will if she can convince a certain someone to come away with her, otherwise as soon as she can.
- Merrill will say "I think Hawke likes you". Depending on whether the 100% Questioning Beliefs has been completed, Isabela will say "I'll have to think about that" (not 100%), or "I certainly hope so" (100%).
- The Zevran encounter

[Quething]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Did you yell at her for selling you out for a boat?

That Hawke didn't take her into the Fade. "I never give in to temptation" was really more warning than she needed. She did yell at her after the Tome thing but it was basically a drop in the bucket at that point.

I certainly got the impression that Anders was working the floor. "The runaway mage who did that electricity thing" definitely sounds like Sanga's marketing pitch, and he knows Izzy liked "that girl with the dragon tattoos" (only time in the game an LI is shown to be s/s regardless of Hawke's gender?), so clearly he was around and familiar with the other employees. And his worry about someone at the Rose trying to hire him seems a little random otherwise. (Also, the hypocrisy fits him. ... man I'm on an Anders tear lately. I don't actually hate him, I promise.) Plus it amuses me beyond reason to picture her hiring him.

(I'm in the camp that that whole thing with the duel is just her messing with Carver. It doesn't seem to suggest she found her partner particularly memorable, at the very least, just the sex.)

[Wulfram]

Quething wrote...
(only time in the game an LI is shown to be s/s regardless of Hawke's gender?),

• Bethany: So you've... been with women. In bed?
• Isabela: I know. Shocking, isn't it?

Also there's potentially references to Leliana and the Warden.

[Quething]

I don't think Leliana's painfully vague DLC-only bugged-as-crap comment that is entirely dependent on player action (there's no way to get a femWarden/Leli romance without importing) really counts. XD

You're right about the Beth comment, but I guess it doesn't have the same impact to me because that whole banter is very much in the "look at Isabela, look how sexually adventurous she is, isn't she attractive" vein. Not saying that's inherently a bad thing, but when that's the only perspective you get on a queer female's queerness, it comes across as very barsexual and insulting, like it's all about the hot girl-on-girl for whatever dude is watching and not any kind of real feeling on the part of the involved women. I just really like that there's this one line in the game that marks her liaisons with women as unequivocally about her and something she genuinely gets pleasure from, that every player can hear, regardless of their Hawke's gender or relationship status.

(And while we're on the topic, that Beth conversation is really hilarious with a queer Lady Hawke. Because if Beth isn't unfamiliar with f/f relationships in general, she must be curious about Isabela in particular. Sussing her out for big sis? Interested herself? If so, I can't fault her taste, but we may have to have words later about who saw her first.)

Modifié par Quething, 25 novembre 2011 - 04:59 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

I remember the first while I played I took Bethany and Isabella around a lot wondering if Isabella would flirt with Bethany in banters or anything of a similar nature would occur, but after playing through the game a few times I don't see their relationship like that at all. Isabella seems to care for Bethany a lot and is protective of her. Seemingly more than any time I saw her flirting with anyone. I actually found it to be one of the sweetest relationships in the game, especially in game where she romanced Hawke. It seemed very natural to me in those versions because they are essentially the equivalent of sisters in law. As such while initially disappointed, I found the platonic banters to be very satisfying in retrospect.

At one point I played the Legacy and Mark of the Assassin content with a Grey Warden Bethany and a romanced Isabella in Act 3 and even though I don't think they have any dialogue about the Isabella romance, given their respective relationships to Hawke I really felt like it conveyed the impression that the two of them were family now.

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 25 novembre 2011 - 07:56 .

[hoorayforicecream]

Quething wrote...

You're right about the Beth comment, but I guess it doesn't have the same impact to me because that whole banter is very much in the "look at Isabela, look how sexually adventurous she is, isn't she attractive" vein. Not saying that's inherently a bad thing, but when that's the only perspective you get on a queer female's queerness, it comes across as very barsexual and insulting, like it's all about the hot girl-on-girl for whatever dude is watching and not any kind of real feeling on the part of the involved women. I just really like that there's this one line in the game that marks her liaisons with women as unequivocally about her and something she genuinely gets pleasure from, that every player can hear, regardless of their Hawke's gender or relationship status.

I dunno, if you look at the entirety of the Beth banter, it sure seems like it's about her and some genuine pleasure - at least to me.

The rest of the banter goes:

# Isabela: You see, sweetness, men are only good for one thing. Women are good for six.
# Bethany: Six? Which six?
# Hawke: Isabela!
# Isabela: (Laughs)

[whykikyouwhy]

Quething wrote...

You're right about the Beth comment, but I guess it doesn't have the same impact to me because that whole banter is very much in the "look at Isabela, look how sexually adventurous she is, isn't she attractive" vein. Not saying that's inherently a bad thing, but when that's the only perspective you get on a queer female's queerness, it comes across as very barsexual and insulting, like it's all about the hot girl-on-girl for whatever dude is watching and not any kind of real feeling on the part of the involved women. I just really like that there's this one line in the game that marks her liaisons with women as unequivocally about her and something she genuinely gets pleasure from, that every player can hear, regardless of their Hawke's gender or relationship status.

I could see where the line might come off in a negative light, simply by not having anything else in the game to support it. But I think that actually gives it more impact (especially when you get the whole picture, as hoorayforicecream quoted). It conveys the impression that sexual relations with women just may, for Isabela, trump those with men (or at least could certainly be more pleasurable). It lets the player know that yeah, this character is open, and isn't going to let social conventions or fear or anything else prevent her from finding, partaking of and acknowledging what brings her joy. It's that element that pulls the banter, however brief, out of the just-for-titillation-sake realm.

Couple that with the fact that the dialogue is with Bethany (and thus is, despite whoever is in the party, an almost intimate conversation between two sisterly women), and the tone is layered with pure curiosity and affection.

[Abispa]

One of the reason I like the "all bi" option is that it allows s/s players to choose a LI for their personality and not just their availability. If you like a sweet and innocent (though incredibly dangerous) young lady you got Merrill, but you still have the wild party girl in Isabela. Bioware writers no longer have to worry about whether a character is "gay/straight enough" or "too gay/straight" and can instead focus on creating a variety of personalities for LIs.

[jlb524]

Quething wrote...
(And while we're on the topic, that Beth conversation is really hilarious with a queer Lady Hawke. Because if Beth isn't unfamiliar with f/f relationships in general, she must be curious about Isabela in particular. Sussing her out for big sis? Interested herself? If so, I can't fault her taste, but we may have to have words later about who saw her first.)

I was never sure what to make of that question coming from Beth since my rogue Lady Hawke was very much into the ladies back in Lothering and never hid anything.

I like your interpretation.

Abispa wrote...
One of the reason I like the "all bi" option is that it allows s/s players to choose a LI for their personality and not just their availability. If you like a sweet and innocent (though incredibly dangerous) young lady you got Merrill, but you still have the wild party girl in Isabela. Bioware writers no longer have to worry about whether a character is "gay/straight enough" or "too gay/straight" and can instead focus on creating a variety of personalities for LIs.

That's basically the reason I like it.  I hate all the 'too gay, not gay enough' talk.  Or the, 'X makes sense as bisexual so should be an option but Y doesn't so should be straight'. talk.

It's also personal for me because I only like to play f/f romances so it sucks when I can't pair up my PC with the option that best suits her or I can't romance my fave female character in general.

Modifié par jlb524, 25 novembre 2011 - 04:58 .

[Master Shiori]

Not to mention bisexual romances take up less resources than creating separate characters for each sexuality. So you do get more bang for your buck (no pun intended).

I'm hoping this is something Bioware will carry into future Dragon Age games.

[Wulfram]

jlb524 wrote...

I was never sure what to make of that question coming from Beth since my rogue Lady Hawke was very much into the ladies back in Lothering and never hid anything.

She might be more comfortable talking about it with someone who isn't her sister.

[jlb524]

Wulfram wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

I was never sure what to make of that question coming from Beth since my rogue Lady Hawke was very much into the ladies back in Lothering and never hid anything.

She might be more comfortable talking about it with someone who isn't her sister.

It's just that Bethany always sounded as if she were surprised that Isabela would bed other women.  Like it was a foreign concept to her.  It shouldn't have been in the Hawke household.  My Hawke bedded more women than Carver.

[Chun Hei]

We do not know how much Bethany knew about her siblings' sex lives. Did she know that Carver had girls going down on him behind the shed? Did she know if Hawke had sex with everyone?

As Quething pointed out it was likely that Bethany was discouraged from having relations with boys or girls because she had to keep her apostate status a secret from any potential suitors coming to her window and catching her practice her spells. She would probably have been even more sheltered once they got to Kirkwall. I find that a very likely scenario and it would have been cruel for her siblings to flaunt their sexual conquests in front of her.

[whykikyouwhy]

Chun Hei wrote...

We do not know how much Bethany knew about her siblings' sex lives. Did she know that Carver had girls going down on him behind the shed? Did she know if Hawke had sex with everyone?

As Quething pointed out it was likely that Bethany was discouraged from having relations with boys or girls because she had to keep her apostate status a secret from any potential suitors coming to her window and catching her practice her spells. She would probably have been even more sheltered once they got to Kirkwall. I find that a very likely scenario and it would have been cruel for her siblings to flaunt their sexual conquests in front of her.

I don't know that anyone would have been flaunting any conquests, but family tends to know what family is up to - so no matter how much discretion would have been implemented, someone curious (like Bethany, perhaps) might have an inkling as to what was going on behind closed doors, or sheds.

I just got the impression that Bethany was always shy in some regards, and probably did not pursue any would-be romances for a myriad of reasons, some of which could include the fact that she was a mage. Hence, she might not be as worldly in the ways of sex. Well, save from anything she might have read.

[Abispa]

Bethany is also barely 18 at the start of the game. In addition to being protected as a mage, it's likely she was still considered a child and was sheltered from sex in a manner not unlike people do IRL. DA has shown that the people of Thedas aren't totally liberated from "traditional values." Even if Hawke is a mage, s/he is 24 at the start and was an adult, maybe even living outside the house, so s/he probably had at least four of five years to run wild, it that's how you role play him/her.

[jlb524]

Chun Hei wrote...
I find that a very likely scenario and it would have been cruel for her siblings to flaunt their sexual conquests in front of her.

It wouldn't be flaunting.  I'd imagine Bethany would be somewhat curious about her sibling's love lives....perhaps wonder why her big sister hasn't gotten married to a man yet.  I could see that kind of stuff coming up in a conversation.

Or, lets say, if Bethany wanted to 'talk about boys' with her big sister.  My Hawke would probably reply with an 'ugh' and make a face.  

Furthermore, she could have heard about her big sister's sexploits via town gossip.  There's many possibilities.

Modifié par jlb524, 26 novembre 2011 - 06:38 .