103 réponses à ce sujet

[TheBlackBaron]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Poor people! They just unintentionally made life easier for themselves! What a tough break!

Good thing they could always just reload the level, if they so much love the "pew-pew".

For the record: I love the "pew-pew" too, but the ME2's "pew-pew" in particuar is not appealing to my taste, in which, to my knowledge, I am not alone.

If all people cared about was making the game easier for themselves, nobody would use any of the difficulties above Easy.

I suppose it's a tough break for you, though - to my knowledge, the only way to skip a game's gameplay is to not play it.

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 29 octobre 2010 - 10:32 .

[Zulu_DFA]

TheBlackBaron wrote...
the only way to skip a game's gameplay is to not play it.

Many renegade interrupts allow for easier fights already. Why not take it one step forward? To provide players with "Wow, I skipped an entire boss fight! I'm badass!!!" moments?

It's a "different avenue", a part of gameplay. As long as it remains a Role-Playing Game, even in a small part.

[La Coka Slaughterhouse]

Having just played LotSB I agree with this topic. The Renegade dialogue making fun of Asaris are kind of cool during the hostage scene but being outright able to kill the hostage and take Vasir down a peg or two.(Possibly shooting her multiple times so that her armor goes away in the fight) Yes it makes the fight a tad easier but that's the benefit of being ruthless.



I also dislike that there is no renegade decision to make during the mission. Killing Feron, giving the Shadow Broker base to TIM and then killing Liara Kai Leng style.

[Jebel Krong]

well you get to shoot the hostage (which i expected the renegade persuasion option to be, but that was weaker), i do think that could have been an interrupt though. i was surprised there weren't any but not many situations seemed that suitable the way it was written and the emphasis on liara, tbh, but then i play sensible, badass renegades, not stupid/racist/jerk ones... i half expected to be able to sympathise more with vasir as a renegade, which would have been interesting: "yeah we do blow up buildings full of people if it's necessary."

Modifié par Jebel Krong, 30 octobre 2010 - 08:18 .

[Bourne Endeavor]

I tend to agree. A prime example and complete contrast to LotSB would be Thane's loyalty mission. His son has a hostage and shouts he shall kill him if Shepard interferes. The response available for a Renegade Shepard? Shoot the hostage dead and replay, "A hostage is only good when the person cares if he lives."

So because this particular hostage was a woman and/or claimed to have a son. We have to be all nonlethal? Bioware, this is just not us cruel people.

Edit : Bah, did not realize this was a necro thread. Curse Zulu and his linking.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 27 novembre 2010 - 10:56 .

[khevan]

I...actually kind of agree. Except on one point. I think LoTSB should have had a few renegade interrupts, including one where Shep shoots (and kills) the hostage. I disagree that this should "levelskip" the boss fight, but instead of the multi-stage fight as is, it should have dropped at least one of the Vasir "See ya in a bit!" moments, and made the fight shorter (and therefore easier).

But as it is, LoTSB definately feels geared more towards Paragons than Renegades. Since I play primarily Paragade (mostly paragon, but with certain renegade options) this doesn't bother me too much, since I probably wouldn't have killed the hostage anyways. But I can definately see how it could have been done better for the more ruthless renegades out there.


Edit:  WHOOPS!  didn't realize this was a necro'd thread.  My apologies!

Modifié par khevan, 27 novembre 2010 - 06:00 .

[Lleuen]

I play a more renegade-inclined, albeit high paragon points shep (Paragade I guess) - renegade bar is full, paragon bar is high up there. I agree: an interrupt here, some extra dialogue there would be nice, ESPECIALLY Vasir, her rant was nothing short of self-righteous and annoying, but hey, I was satisfied with LotSB. What's really troubling with this thread is the archetypes people are throwing around for Paragon and Renegade, which both stereotypes in their extreme are pretty over the top IMO, and both, no matter in what extreme or mixture thereof, are at the mercy of the writers and what input they want to consider from all of us. So with that said, each to his/her own.

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Also, I can sense Cerberus hatred here.

You see, loyalty to Cerberus is not about being somebody's b*tch. It's about efficiency. One of the principles of efficiency is the division of labor. Everybody have to do what they do best. Shepard is best at killing things and getting the job done. TIM is best at thinking, manipulating and determining what job needs doing. Sounds like a perfect partnership to me.

Division of labor? hahaha more like subdivision of labor. Not many people question TIM's motives or in general, his position as the leader because he's the one handing out the paychecks, and he's always been the man behind the curtain for the organization - most operatives don't even know what he looks like. The only ones that seem to get a sense that he has second intentions, are the people who exhibit some measure of independant thinking, like Jacob. He likes their direction, but he's wary. Cerberus operations typically end with the outcome TIM wants anyway, save for Pragia I s'pose. That "Cerberus is Humanity" line says a lot about that guy. But I digress, my renegade hates Cerberus, and loves other species, so play how you want, but also, speak for yourself, the "Ruthless Shepard" archetype is up for broad interpretation. 

Modifié par Lleuen, 27 novembre 2010 - 06:51 .

[Terraneaux]

Shandepared wrote...

I'd rather turn over the Collector ship to Cerberus. Liara is nice and all, but she's not human and I can't allow some alien to have access to all this critical intel.

You'd trust TIM before Liara?  Liara has Shep's interests in mind much more than TIM does.

[SmokePants]

Vasir was just trying to get away. Killing a hostage to prevent that is less ruthless and more evil. Now, you did have that choice in Bring Down the Sky, but the guy was a terrorist that would have gone on to threaten innocent populations. Vasir was just trying to do the Shadow Broker a solid. Big difference.

And the most likely explanation that there weren't many choices overall, was because these events have to be set in stone for ME3. It is "bridging" content, after all. You can't give away or destroy the broker ship, because Liara might be the TIM of ME3. You can't kill/sacrifice Feron, because he might be a squad member.

Modifié par SmokePants, 27 novembre 2010 - 08:33 .

[Zulu_DFA]

I don't insist that the "Kill the hostage" interrupt was absolutely necessary in the LotSB, but the fact remains that there was no way to play a Ruthless Shepard. Even wounding the hostage is not a quite a ruthless act, because Shepard talks too much about it before doing it, forgetting that

"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk."



BTW, Shepard's constant urge to give speeches without good reason is quite irritating in general. Who is he? Udina?

[ReiSilver]

oh boy, most other threads renegade players are complaining they miss out on extra dialogue (can't talk to the rachni; dead, can't talk to Shiala; dead and there's no equivalent conversations with some other person in their place) and now Renegade players are complaining that they CAN'T skip out on dialogue and content. *facepalm*

[Zulu_DFA]

Renegades only complain that the obvious bonuses paragons get for making their paragon choices are not balanced out by some punishment for making real stupid paragon choices.



In the LotSB the "renegade path" is practically nonexistent at all.

[HolyJellyfish]

I'm a Renegade a good chunk of the time. The only time I ever make paragon-like choices is because I'm aware there will be more renegade dialogue by doing so (Letting certain characters live, etc.)



I didn't have an issue with LotSB. Personally, I wasn't interested in a strong Renegade or Paragon path, in so much as the game play itself. The boss fight was pretty awesome, the miniboss fight was definitely one of my favorites in both ME1 & 2 (Asari? Vanguard? Spectre? Hell yes).



Were there really all that many important paragon choices in Shadow Broker? It felt pretty neutral to me.

[Dean_the_Young]

Well, you're shoehorned into being Liara's bestest buddy, no matter how suspicious/untrusting/assholish you could be in ME1.There is no 'grudging' willingness to act against the SB with her, or 'I don't even give a **** about you.' It's 'hey, we're great friends, right?' whether your character was ever friends or not.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 29 novembre 2010 - 01:02 .

[Xilizhra]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Renegades only complain that the obvious bonuses paragons get for making their paragon choices are not balanced out by some punishment for making real stupid paragon choices.

In the LotSB the "renegade path" is practically nonexistent at all.

How strange, I thought you people were being reasonable and only wanted extra content for Renegade decisions.

[mineralica]

My most renegadish renegade wished to have an opportunity to shoot Liara and make Miranda SB. It's completely out of character that "specist" and best friend of Cerberus will trust to asari.

But again, since ME2 laслы ща choice if work with Cerberus or not, I don't complain much

[Giggles_Manically]

Compared to BDTS the end of LOTSB really lacked for badass moments.

Answering Balak with a gunshot was awesome.
I really did love how Shepard says "gladly" right before executing that bastard.

See the ending of this for example. I wish we could do this to Vasir after fighting her.

Modifié par Giggles_Manically, 30 novembre 2010 - 03:41 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Shandepared wrote...

I'd rather turn over the Collector ship to Cerberus. Liara is nice and all, but she's not human and I can't allow some alien to have access to all this critical intel.

Yes, yes, we know, you don't like aliens...

[Killjoy Cutter]

SmokePants wrote...

Vasir was just trying to get away. Killing a hostage to prevent that is less ruthless and more evil. Now, you did have that choice in Bring Down the Sky, but the guy was a terrorist that would have gone on to threaten innocent populations. Vasir was just trying to do the Shadow Broker a solid. Big difference.

And the most likely explanation that there weren't many choices overall, was because these events have to be set in stone for ME3. It is "bridging" content, after all. You can't give away or destroy the broker ship, because Liara might be the TIM of ME3. You can't kill/sacrifice Feron, because he might be a squad member.

And never mind that Vasir had just taken part in bombing a building full of civilians, and had the data that Liara needed to stop Shadow Broker, and had tried to kill Liara twice, and so on. 

[-Skorpious-]

Agreed. My renegade Shepard's heart grew three times in size during the events of LotSB.

[Sajuro]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

I would not have minded an interrupt in Vasir's rant.

I would have found it funny if you could interrupt her dying rant with a kiss, even though it would probably result in critical mission failure.

[Epic777]

-Skorpious- wrote...

Agreed. My renegade Shepard's heart grew three times in size during the events of LotSB.

Hang on I thought renegade was supposed to be badass not the grinch

[-Skorpious-]

Epic777 wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Agreed. My renegade Shepard's heart grew three times in size during the events of LotSB.

Hang on I thought renegade was supposed to be badass not the grinch

My human supremacist Shepard isn't exactly the nicest of people when dealing with aliens; especially with Liara.