Seagloom wrote...
Further proof BioWare's marketing team still managed to make the "hot rod" catch phrase stick, if perhaps not in the way they might have intended.
Saibh wrote...
Mr. Man wrote...
Dave of Canada wrote...
skuid wrote...
Yes, but the story of DA2 starts in Lothering were Leliana used to live before join the warden so is very possible that we can see her there.
The destruction of Lothering, where Leliana would probably be off with the Warden (if not left behind to die).
I sense reactivity... maybe a second chance to recruit her if you didn't in DAO
I ...really doubt that. I mean, how many people do you think honestly left Leliana behind?
I should not have either, and I apologize to the OP. This will be the last I write on the matter to avoid a lock. I just tire of the cycle. The BDF phrase began because a small band of forumites felt their opinions were unfairly dismissed, and truth be told, I agree there were occasions where that was case. Now those who are teased as being part of the BDF are lashing back. I am not saying you or another has no right to feel annoyed by it, but that striking back is simply going to perpetuate this cycle. One side is going to have to be mature enough to bury the hatchet. That is all I am saying. There are a lot of intelligent people here who all share a love of games. I just wish we all could meet somewhere in the middle without this sort of thing. Okay, I am done. Again, apologies to the OP.Dave of Canada wrote...
I don't really wish to turn this thread off-topic but... it's devolved into a derogatory term rather than one where anybody feels threatened, instead of arguing or talking about something they'll go into a thread and mockingly say "OH LOOK THE BDF LOL". It's essentially calling anybody who defends anything a blind fanboy, even if the "defending" is misinformation.
When I even suggest I have a dislike for something, they'll immediately jump on my back and mock me for it.
The term means nothing, it just gets annoying how much it's thrown around falsely.
Dave of Canada wrote...
Mr. Man wrote...
I sense reactivity... maybe a second chance to recruit her if you didn't in DAO
Doubt it, they'd need to write Leliana's character for the adventure in DA2 / they'd have to write dialogue for her and they'd have to bring back the voice actress for only a small portion of people.
Seagloom wrote...
Bann Duncan wrote...
The nerdraging fanboys consider it a sin to be BioWare fans, so they have dubbed all that are the "BioWare defense force" because we are stupid enough to think BioWare will make a good game.
To be fair, I think is an unfair claim. I know at least one person that has used this phrase, and it is not because they feel it is a sin to be BioWare fans. It is because they feel their criticisms, formed by personal taste and experiences with older BioWare games, are dimissed out of hand simply for expressing reservations with the direction of Dragon Age 2. I have only seen one person argue a bit too passionately throw around the BDF tagline.
The fact is, we are *all* BioWare fans to an extent. If a person is not a BioWare fan, they would not be here nor would they care enough to debate a point, regardless of which side of the fence upon which they sit. Only a person with absolutely no life at all, and possibly possessed of questionable sanity is going to mindlessly rage against a company or its fanbase just for kicks.
Throwing out retaliatory statements such as this is as bad as the behavior from others you find offensive. Rather than dividing this community, we should all be trying to understand one another. If we cannot, then we just move on and ignore. Honestly, it is no so hard to debate without taking swipes at each other. Sorry I took your post as a reason to climb on my soapbox, Duncan, but as a regular lurker I am very tired of this whole us versus them mentality flourishing here.
Modifié par Bann Duncan, 31 octobre 2010 - 06:15 .
Brockololly wrote...
But the devs did mentione a while
back that the Sacred Ashes' fate was one such choice that will be
imported.
Seagloom wrote...
Now those who are teased as being part of the BDF are lashing back.
I'll shut up about it too.
Modifié par Dave of Canada, 31 octobre 2010 - 06:12 .
skuid wrote...
I have a friend who didn't recruit neither Leliana nor Sten. He just passthrough Lothering and start the red cliff mission.
Anyway, even if we don't meet Leliana in Lothering in DA2 there are a lot of places where we can meet her because she said that she would like to travel around the world
Modifié par Saibh, 31 octobre 2010 - 06:19 .
Bann Duncan wrote...
Seagloom wrote...
Bann Duncan wrote...
The nerdraging fanboys consider it a sin to be BioWare fans, so they have dubbed all that are the "BioWare defense force" because we are stupid enough to think BioWare will make a good game.
To be fair, I think is an unfair claim. I know at least one person that has used this phrase, and it is not because they feel it is a sin to be BioWare fans. It is because they feel their criticisms, formed by personal taste and experiences with older BioWare games, are dimissed out of hand simply for expressing reservations with the direction of Dragon Age 2. I have only seen one person argue a bit too passionately throw around the BDF tagline.
The fact is, we are *all* BioWare fans to an extent. If a person is not a BioWare fan, they would not be here nor would they care enough to debate a point, regardless of which side of the fence upon which they sit. Only a person with absolutely no life at all, and possibly possessed of questionable sanity is going to mindlessly rage against a company or its fanbase just for kicks.
Throwing out retaliatory statements such as this is as bad as the behavior from others you find offensive. Rather than dividing this community, we should all be trying to understand one another. If we cannot, then we just move on and ignore. Honestly, it is no so hard to debate without taking swipes at each other. Sorry I took your post as a reason to climb on my soapbox, Duncan, but as a regular lurker I am very tired of this whole us versus them mentality flourishing here.
The BDF-criers and self-appointed defenders of RPGs flame me whenever I say that Dragon Age 2 will probably end up being a good game because of BioWare's track record or that Mass Effect 2 was one of the best games I ever played. I'm not 'threatened' - just irritated. It's like a person cannot like anything from ME2 without the fanboys calling BDF on him.
Heck that's why I don't even post in groups I used to post and lurk in, because they've devolved into people who hate ME2 and what they've seen of DA2 and just pat each other on the back about it. I don't mind that in and of itself, but they are very hostile to any who hold a contrary opinion (or even suggestions).
Generally speaking, those who enjoyed ME2 enjoyed ME1 and are open to praise of it - ditto for Dragon Age 2 (though in that case it's confidence rather than experience) and Origins. As such the people confident in BioWare's ability do not generally flame the fans of the older games, because we are also fans of those games. The reactionaries, however enjoy randomly going into any discussion (for example the congratulations thread after the Golden Joysticks) and yelling "Yo BDF lolcats".
Saibh wrote...
skuid wrote...
I have a friend who didn't recruit neither Leliana nor Sten. He just passthrough Lothering and start the red cliff mission.
Anyway, even if we don't meet Leliana in Lothering in DA2 there are a lot of places where we can meet her because she said that she would like to travel around the world
Okay, so that's one person. I'm just saying, taking out the people who will both import the game and not recruit Leliana leaves a very, very tiny player base. And, for what? An old character who's personal issues have mostly been resolved. I'd prefer new characters.
Besides that, people have played the entire opening segment, and Leliana was not to be seen. Lothering was destroyed, and her with it.
skuid wrote...
Saibh wrote...
skuid wrote...
I have a friend who didn't recruit neither Leliana nor Sten. He just passthrough Lothering and start the red cliff mission.
Anyway, even if we don't meet Leliana in Lothering in DA2 there are a lot of places where we can meet her because she said that she would like to travel around the world
Okay, so that's one person. I'm just saying, taking out the people who will both import the game and not recruit Leliana leaves a very, very tiny player base. And, for what? An old character who's personal issues have mostly been resolved. I'd prefer new characters.
Besides that, people have played the entire opening segment, and Leliana was not to be seen. Lothering was destroyed, and her with it.
Yes, but she could do a cameo (which will be nice) or at least a codex entry
I'm all for it.
Modifié par skuid, 31 octobre 2010 - 06:35 .
Lyssistr wrote...
Now, DA2 may well be a good game on its own right but it may not resemble "getting back to the roots".
Lyssistr wrote...
Bann Duncan wrote...
Seagloom wrote...
Bann Duncan wrote...
The nerdraging fanboys consider it a sin to be BioWare fans, so they have dubbed all that are the "BioWare defense force" because we are stupid enough to think BioWare will make a good game.
To be fair, I think is an unfair claim. I know at least one person that has used this phrase, and it is not because they feel it is a sin to be BioWare fans. It is because they feel their criticisms, formed by personal taste and experiences with older BioWare games, are dimissed out of hand simply for expressing reservations with the direction of Dragon Age 2. I have only seen one person argue a bit too passionately throw around the BDF tagline.
The fact is, we are *all* BioWare fans to an extent. If a person is not a BioWare fan, they would not be here nor would they care enough to debate a point, regardless of which side of the fence upon which they sit. Only a person with absolutely no life at all, and possibly possessed of questionable sanity is going to mindlessly rage against a company or its fanbase just for kicks.
Throwing out retaliatory statements such as this is as bad as the behavior from others you find offensive. Rather than dividing this community, we should all be trying to understand one another. If we cannot, then we just move on and ignore. Honestly, it is no so hard to debate without taking swipes at each other. Sorry I took your post as a reason to climb on my soapbox, Duncan, but as a regular lurker I am very tired of this whole us versus them mentality flourishing here.
The BDF-criers and self-appointed defenders of RPGs flame me whenever I say that Dragon Age 2 will probably end up being a good game because of BioWare's track record or that Mass Effect 2 was one of the best games I ever played. I'm not 'threatened' - just irritated. It's like a person cannot like anything from ME2 without the fanboys calling BDF on him.
Heck that's why I don't even post in groups I used to post and lurk in, because they've devolved into people who hate ME2 and what they've seen of DA2 and just pat each other on the back about it. I don't mind that in and of itself, but they are very hostile to any who hold a contrary opinion (or even suggestions).
Generally speaking, those who enjoyed ME2 enjoyed ME1 and are open to praise of it - ditto for Dragon Age 2 (though in that case it's confidence rather than experience) and Origins. As such the people confident in BioWare's ability do not generally flame the fans of the older games, because we are also fans of those games. The reactionaries, however enjoy randomly going into any discussion (for example the congratulations thread after the Golden Joysticks) and yelling "Yo BDF lolcats".
I think the issue with DA2 shifts is not about if this is going to be a good game.
Rather that the whole franchise was about reviving cRPGS/getting back to the roots/spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate etc.
Now, DA2 may well be a good game on its own right but it may not resemble "getting back to the roots".
Dave of Canada wrote...
Where did they mention this? I remember they mentioned how the average gamer would forget what the ashes were (though I doubt it).
Dave of Canada wrote...
Also your avatar confused me for a second, Brock.
Mike Laidlaw wrote...
Think about any other media. How often do you see a trailer that says: "This summer... ONE MAN.... WILL DO... THE SAME STUFF HE DID LAST SUMMER."
There was a post from dev who seems to be in charge of this sort of things in another thread. He said for important characters from DAO if they'd to make another appearance, they'd generally try to preserve the features as close as possible and as the revamped character creator models/textures would allow. So would guess Leliana would retain her in-game looks.skuid wrote...
I don't know if this has been already discuss but if we are going to see Leliana in DA2 I wonder if the new art style face morph is going to be more look alike to the CG or to the DAO in-game face. I really like both but I prefer the CG.
What do you think?
Modifié par tmp7704, 31 octobre 2010 - 06:39 .
Mike Laidlaw wrote...
Lyssistr wrote...
Now, DA2 may well be a good game on its own right but it may not resemble "getting back to the roots".
This has been a constant fear since the game was announced. I certainly understand why, since certain changes represent a move in a direction that has...repeatedly...resulted in comparisons to Mass Effect, which took a very bold stance in the way it approached its RPG mechanics, by making them more progressive than interactive. For instance, you would gain a 10% boost in shield, rather than equipping a new shield generator. Was it wrong? Personal preference, and not for discussion on this forum.
Does it mean that DA2 has made the same decisions? Nope. But until we get more information out there, I empathize with the concerns.
For DA2, I think some folks thought we would be getting even further
back into the days of yore. Turn based combat only, sprite enemies,
that kind of thing. It was never really the intent, but as someone who
logged a hell of a lot of hours on Fallout, Wasteland, Bard's Tale I
& II, Wizardry and so on, I can understand
the appeal. I also understand the appeal of sticking perfectly true to the modernized BGII
formula, but it doing so would have meant stagnation, and while DA:O was a great
start, but I believe there were a lot of rough edges that needed to be
addressed.
Of course, this all begs the question "Why haven't you gone into detail about the RPG systems?" Well, a couple of reasons. First, many of them are very similar to DA:O, so they're not excatly what you want to "get out in front of people."
Think about any other media. How often do you see a trailer that says: "This summer... ONE MAN.... WILL DO... THE SAME STUFF HE DID LAST SUMMER." In some cases, that might actually be true, but it's hardly what you want to hear. Even if Die Hard 2 is, essentially, the same movie as Die Hard, it still had merits of its own, and unique elements (planes!), so that is what the trailers focused on. In our case, it's art, action and the decade-long story.
After you hit people with the points of difference, that is when you dive a little deeper into the mechanics. After all, there's a good 5 months before the game is out, and more than 2 months before the signiture edition lockdown date, so there's a bit of time to get you guys info.
CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...
The outrage and bitterness comes from that idea of a BG throwback seems to have lasted all of one game. And that even though Origins was a critical success and sold fairly well (almost the same numbers that ME2 did) Its somehow percieved by Bioware as a failure due to how long it was in development and how much they spent on it. So they felt the need to retcon many visual aspects, adapted many ME2 features like a dialog wheel and a voiced protagonist, and hot rod ninja'ed the game to be alot like ME2 with faster gameplay, because for whatever reason they seem to believe they'll sell 5 million copies that way rather than 3 million.
Dave of Canada wrote...
Mike Laidlaw wrote...
Think about any other media. How often do you see a trailer that says: "This summer... ONE MAN.... WILL DO... THE SAME STUFF HE DID LAST SUMMER."
God dammit, Mike. I can't stop laughing.
tmp7704 wrote...
There was a post from dev who seems to be in charge of this sort of things in another thread. He said for important characters from DAO if they'd to make another appearance, they'd generally try to preserve the features as close as possible and as the revamped character creator models/textures would allow. So would guess Leliana would retain her in-game looks.skuid wrote...
I don't know if this has been already discuss but if we are going to see Leliana in DA2 I wonder if the new art style face morph is going to be more look alike to the CG or to the DAO in-game face. I really like both but I prefer the CG.
What do you think?
Although i don't think i'd personally miss if they failed to keep her jaundice
edit: gah, ninja'ed
Mike Laidlaw wrote...
Lyssistr wrote...
Now, DA2 may well be a good game on its own right but it may not resemble "getting back to the roots".
This has been a constant fear since the game was announced. I certainly understand why, since certain changes represent a move in a direction that has...repeatedly...resulted in comparisons to Mass Effect, which took a very bold stance in the way it approached its RPG mechanics, by making them more progressive than interactive. For instance, you would gain a 10% boost in shield, rather than equipping a new shield generator. Was it wrong? Personal preference, and not for discussion on this forum.
Does it mean that DA2 has made the same decisions? Nope. But until we get more information out there, I empathize with the concerns.
For DA2, I think some folks thought we would be getting even further
back into the days of yore. Turn based combat only, sprite enemies,
that kind of thing. It was never really the intent, but as someone who
logged a hell of a lot of hours on Fallout, Wasteland, Bard's Tale I
& II, Wizardry and so on, I can understand
the appeal. I also understand the appeal of sticking perfectly true to the modernized BGII
formula, but it doing so would have meant stagnation, and while DA:O was a great
start, but I believe there were a lot of rough edges that needed to be
addressed.
Of course, this all begs the question "Why haven't you gone into detail about the RPG systems?" Well, a couple of reasons. First, many of them are very similar to DA:O, so they're not excatly what you want to "get out in front of people."
Think about any other media. How often do you see a trailer that says: "This summer... ONE MAN.... WILL DO... THE SAME STUFF HE DID LAST SUMMER." In some cases, that might actually be true, but it's hardly what you want to hear. Even if Die Hard 2 is, essentially, the same movie as Die Hard, it still had merits of its own, and unique elements (planes!), so that is what the trailers focused on. In our case, it's art, action and the decade-long story.
After you hit people with the points of difference, that is when you dive a little deeper into the mechanics. After all, there's a good 5 months before the game is out, and more than 2 months before the signiture edition lockdown date, so there's a bit of time to get you guys info.
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