152 réponses à ce sujet

[slimgrin]

skuid wrote...

loosing control of this post:crying:

Sorry.

As I said before, seeing Leliana would be great, but in what capacity? Does anyone think she'll actually be a party member? Don't know if I want that since my warden and her got along rather, um..well. 

[Lyssistr]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

In that case I can understand wanting to zoom out. Reading all the references to an isometric camera had me thinking people genuinely wanted a return to Baldur's Gate II.

Zooming out at the same extent is what I want mainly, I'm not interested in how they do their coding. If I can zoom out far enough, it makes little difference if it is fixed or not.

 It's not that I consider fixed-view games to be outdated however. BG II's isometric camera had a couple of flaws. If it is going to be a fixed view, Torchlight and Demonstone are good examples, where they made it work right, of course both games are more recent. 

 Diablo III is probably going to serve as a reference point on how to do isometric perspective right in the 3D age. BG's flaw was that it didn't adjust the angle/distance, even when this was (badly) needed, of course its too old a game, so I'm not trying to bash BG's flaws here, just pointing that fixed view doesn't automatically imply BG's problems.

[Lyssistr]

skuid wrote...

loosing control of this post:crying:

you're right, sorry for this.

[upsettingshorts]

KcK__ wrote...

No need to change every character model

Actually from what they are saying, there is a need.  Major returning characters would be made to be as close to their original appearance as possible but changes to the system means that changes to every model are indeed needed.

[Dave of Canada]

Maybe it's just me but I don't see how Leliana would find herself in the Free Marches.

[skuid]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Maybe it's just me but I don't see how Leliana would find herself in the Free Marches.

Why not? she like to travel

[ErichHartmann]

KcK__ wrote...

I think it would be great if Leliana had at least cameo in DA II, what comes to the looks of her, I'd be happy whit the Origins look really. No need to change every character model

Sure there is.  They can give characters more distinct looks with an upgraded graphics engine.  Though I hope important characters do not recieve radical changes like Isabela.   

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Why do people cling to the isometric view like it was actually good? It was a way to make sprites look 3D.
There are other ways to do a tactical camera that actually reflect the fact that you're playing a true 3D game, like the Total War camera.

Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important. You do still have the option of zooming in as far as you want personally. Why force that on everyone? Not everyone has the same tastes.

[upsettingshorts]

skuid wrote...
Why not? she like to travel

Well, lets look at her potential epilogues.  I'll change the color to red if I don't see it resulting in her being in the Free Marches, Blue if I do.  Source: Dragon Age Wiki.

• Leliana, if in love with the Warden, will offer to remain at the side of her love, supporting whatever he or she chooses to do. The single exception to this is if the Warden marries Anora or Alistair while Leliana remains "unhardened".
• Leliana will go back to Orlais to seek out Marjolaine if she is not in love with the Warden and Marjolaine is still alive. She will turn the Warden down if he/she offers to join her.
• Leliana will lead an investigation into the darkspawn, at the behest of Anora or Alistair, if she is hardened, Marjolaine is dead, and she is not in love with the Warden. If she and the Warden are in a romance and he/she offers to join her, she will gladly accept.
• Leliana will aid the Chantry in leading an expedition to the Urn of Sacred Ashes if she is not hardened, Marjolaine is dead, and she is not in love with the Warden. If she and the Warden are in a romance and he/she offers to join her, she will gladly accept.
• Leliana, if romanced, 'unhardened', and The Warden sacrifices him- or herself in the final battle, will compose what will become a famous ballad of your journey. After one performance, Leliana quietly vanishes. It is said that the maker came to her in the night, and her maid found Leliana smiling, with tears in her eyes, saying that at last she would soon be reunited with her love.
• Leliana, if romanced, 'hardened', and The Warden sacrifices him- or herself in the final battle, will compose what will become a famous ballad of your journey. After one performance, Leliana quietly vanishes. Some say that she returned to her life of adventure, others say she returned to Orlais to hunt down her enemies.
• Leliana may die at the hand of The Warden if she is present in the party after destroying the Ashes of Andraste unless 3 specific conditions are met (See Kolgrim's Offer for details). If not present, she may abandon the Warden soon after. This is dependent on choices in dialogue with Genitivi after defiling the urn (Blood Reavers) and how you respond when approached about it by Leliana back at camp. She can be persuaded/deceived away from leaving.)
• Leliana dies at Lothering if she never meets The Warden.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:07 .

[Drizzt ORierdan]

WHO NEEDS A NEW MORPH WHEN YOU ALREADY GOT THIS????? LOL

[URL=http://img529.imageshack.us/i/leliana.jpg/][/URL

BTW this is great work done by Yukidama...
I'll vote for this one any day...

Modifié par Drizzt ORierdan, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:06 .

[nightcobra]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Why do people cling to the isometric view like it was actually good? It was a way to make sprites look 3D.
There are other ways to do a tactical camera that actually reflect the fact that you're playing a true 3D game, like the Total War camera.

Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important. You do still have the option of zooming in as far as you want personally. Why force that on everyone? Not everyone has the same tastes.

as long as an isometric view is forced on as well i'm okay, as far preferances go i really don't like it but i'm all for it as an option. 

[Saibh]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

skuid wrote...
Why not? she like to travel

Well, lets look at her potential epilogues.  I'll change the color to red if I don't see it resulting in her being in the Free Marches, Blue if I do.  Source: Dragon Age Wiki.

Keep in mind, however, the game lasts over ten years. A lot can happen in ten years.

Modifié par Saibh, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:03 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Maybe it's just me but I don't see how Leliana would find herself in the Free Marches.

Just like how no one could've seen how Wynne would wind up in Amaranthine pre-Awakening? Don't worry, the writers can easily come up with a reason as to why Character X is at Location Y now.

[slimgrin]

skuid wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Maybe it's just me but I don't see how Leliana would find herself in the Free Marches.

Why not? she like to travel

True. I think she mentioned traveling with our warden in one conversation. She'd be a great candidate to make a cameo in DA2. It would be just awesome if they did this, and knowing Bioware, they'll have some surprises of this nature up their sleeve.


Edit: Wow, Yukidama's version of Leli is beautiful. Great work.

Modifié par slimgrin, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:06 .

[upsettingshorts]

Saibh wrote...

Keep in mind, however, the game lasts over ten years. A lot can happen in ten years.

True. 

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...
Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important.

So do other camera views that aren't archaic dinosaurs of the sprite era.  The Total War camera allows more or less unlimited zooming in and out and that was my stated preference.  It turns out a BG2 style fixed isometric camera wasn't actually what people were asking for, but that was the impression I was getting.  

And yeah, that means I view the Diablo III fixed camera as backwards thinking purely based in nostalgia.   There are better tactical cameras out there that give the player the freedom to put the camera wherever they please.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:07 .

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Why do people cling to the isometric view like it was actually good? It was a way to make sprites look 3D.
There are other ways to do a tactical camera that actually reflect the fact that you're playing a true 3D game, like the Total War camera.

Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important. You do still have the option of zooming in as far as you want personally. Why force that on everyone? Not everyone has the same tastes.

as long as an isometric view is forced on as well i'm okay, as far preferances go i really don't like it but i'm all for it as an option. 

I don't see why it would need to be forced, just an option, its my same viewpoint with companion clothing. Don't force a single outfit for those who value customization over a "set look" for companions. Options are good.

[Lyssistr]

 I don't know about her face but I hope Leliana gets a serious personality disorder and becomes a little like Morrigan .

 Viconia & Morrigan are made of win

[Dave of Canada]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Just like how no one could've seen how Wynne would wind up in Amaranthine pre-Awakening? Don't worry, the writers can easily come up with a reason as to why Character X is at Location Y now.

True, though at least that was still in Ferelden.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Saibh wrote...

Keep in mind, however, the game lasts over ten years. A lot can happen in ten years.

True. 

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...
Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important.

So do other camera views that aren't archaic dinosaurs of the sprite era.  The Total War camera allows more or less unlimited zooming in and out and that was my stated preference.  It turns out a BG2 style fixed isometric camera wasn't actually what people were asking for, but that was the impression I was getting.  

And yeah, that means I view the Diablo III fixed camera as backwards thinking purely based in nostalgia.   There are better tactical cameras out there that give the player the freedom to put the camera wherever they please.

Yeah I'm pretty sure people weren't asking for it to be fixed isometric, I can understand that not everyone wants that. Just keep it as similar to Origins where the player can decide for themselves where they want the camera. Win/win for everyone.

[nightcobra]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

nightcobra8928 wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Why do people cling to the isometric view like it was actually good? It was a way to make sprites look 3D.
There are other ways to do a tactical camera that actually reflect the fact that you're playing a true 3D game, like the Total War camera.

Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important. You do still have the option of zooming in as far as you want personally. Why force that on everyone? Not everyone has the same tastes.

as long as an isometric view is forced on as well i'm okay, as far preferances go i really don't like it but i'm all for it as an option. 

I don't see why it would need to be forced, just an option, its my same viewpoint with companion clothing. Don't force a single outfit for those who value customization over a "set look" for companions. Options are good.

as long as an isometric view is *not* forced on as well i'm okay with it, as far preferances go i really don't like it but i'm all for it as an option. 

this is what i meant.

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 31 octobre 2010 - 08:11 .

[Lyssistr]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Saibh wrote...

Keep in mind, however, the game lasts over ten years. A lot can happen in ten years.

True. 

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...
Simply because when it comes to tactics, it gives you a complete view of the battle field. The game being 3D or not doesn't even factor in as its not important.

So do other camera views that aren't archaic dinosaurs of the sprite era.  The Total War camera allows more or less unlimited zooming in and out and that was my stated preference.  It turns out a BG2 style fixed isometric camera wasn't actually what people were asking for, but that was the impression I was getting.  

Last comment on the iso-vew as it's quite off-topic, I'm happy to continue this via PMs. Iso view does not necessarily carry over BG's camera flaws. Keep in mind that BG was iso-view in the pre-3D era. If you look at Torchlight, I think it's a good example of how iso-view can be done properly today. Diablo III will likely do it even better.

All the above, irrespective of DA2, where what I'm talking about only including DA:O's top down view, on top of other camera modes.

[Blastback]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

KcK__ wrote...

No need to change every character model

Actually from what they are saying, there is a need.  Major returning characters would be made to be as close to their original appearance as possible but changes to the system means that changes to every model are indeed needed.

More like no need to drasticly change every character model beyond what has to be done to make them work in the new art direction.

[Saibh]

Blastback wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

KcK__ wrote...

No need to change every character model

Actually from what they are saying, there is a need.  Major returning characters would be made to be as close to their original appearance as possible but changes to the system means that changes to every model are indeed needed.

More like no need to drasticly change every character model beyond what has to be done to make them work in the new art direction.

And I don't see why they would. Isabela was an unimportant side NPC with a generic model. Our companions will probably be only significant as cameos and possibly a sidequest and will most likely only be relevant as cameos.

[tmp7704]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

So do other camera views that aren't archaic dinosaurs of the sprite era. (..)

And yeah, that means I view the Diablo III fixed camera as backwards thinking purely based in nostalgia.   There are better tactical cameras out there that give the player the freedom to put the camera wherever they please.

Something to consider -- a fixed isometric camera has two potential advantages. One, by being fixed it frees the player from actual hassle of fussing with the camera angles and positions, it becomes very much something that "isn't there" to worry about. Yes, the freedom to "put camera wherever one pleases" is nice, but camera management is common source of complaints when it comes to games. Two, the isometric view means there is no perspective distortion in the picture and the view is always aligned in the same way, which makes it easier to tell at a glance whether targets are perfectly lined up for attacks, what piece of cover can actually provide cover etc. again without need to fuss with the camera angles to get good view of the situation.

Sure, this is old technique but it doesn't mean it's obsolete just because it's old.

[Wulfram]

Saibh wrote...

And I don't see why they would. Isabela was an unimportant side NPC with a generic model. Our companions will probably be only significant as cameos and possibly a sidequest and will most likely only be relevant as cameos.

They gave the Darkspawn a radical overhaul, and they were pretty important to Origins