442 réponses à ce sujet

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

JrayM16 wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

JrayM16 wrote...

Death to meangingless buzzwords.

Tell that to BioWare's marketing department then too.

I tried, they didn't listen. 

I was hoping that forumites might be more open to cutting out buzzwords.

Eh I'm calling it how I see it, every interview/preview etc so far screams out this is Dragon Age, over the top action edition. Kinda hard to deny it when its repetedly tossed out there over and over.

That's how it's going to be!   HA-HA!  :lol:

Game's going to ****ing rock. 

[Sir JK]

Just a thought for those who are concerned about the way marketing are portraying things:

Have you considered that the main reason the marketing focuses on these changes so much might be that the game might actually not be very different from it's prequel and that marketing pushes the changes so much to make sure they don't go unnoticed?

I'm not saying it is like that, but it's not an impossibility.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

[Tsuga C]

Sir JK wrote...
I'm not saying it is like that, but it's not an impossibility.

At this point, one can only hope... 

[mellifera]

the_one_54321 wrote...

I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

I dunno, it just seems to me that there are auto-leveling or quick play options. Not that you have to employ it, but that you can if you are so inclined.

[slimgrin]

Ryzaki wrote...

Yeah which became hell if you messed up Shepard's face. Those scenes need to be skippable. At least in Origins you can check out your face pretty quickly.

I think it worked horrible but that's because I had to keep tweeking Shep's face and it took bloody forever to get to face customization. <_<

Ok you're right about this. Any intro should be skippable for replays.

Modifié par slimgrin, 02 novembre 2010 - 12:37 .

[Herr Uhl]

the_one_54321 wrote...

I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

As I've said before, the "15 second to action" is probably when Varric starts telling the story, choose your class and gender and get the default Hawke for that. For the exaggerated part there would be no assignment of skill-points. Cassandra proceeds to call BS (hopefully not a long way in) and he restarts with you going to CC-screen.

As long as that opening sequence isn't too long I'm fine with it.

[mellifera]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

[crimzontearz]

Sir JK wrote...

Just a thought for those who are concerned about the way marketing are portraying things:
Have you considered that the main reason the marketing focuses on these changes so much might be that the game might actually not be very different from it's prequel and that marketing pushes the changes so much to make sure they don't go unnoticed?
I'm not saying it is like that, but it's not an impossibility.

 the reverse could also be true...you never know, 

not until you get a decent gameplay walkthrough

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

JrayM16 wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

JrayM16 wrote...

Death to meangingless buzzwords.

Tell that to BioWare's marketing department then too.

I tried, they didn't listen. 

I was hoping that forumites might be more open to cutting out buzzwords.

Eh I'm calling it how I see it, every interview/preview etc so far screams out this is Dragon Age, over the top action edition. Kinda hard to deny it when its repetedly tossed out there over and over.

That's how it's going to be!   HA-HA!  :lol:

Game's going to ****ing rock. 

Sure for a new **** type of guy like yourself, which is how you come across in all of your post. For the older Bioware fans it very well may suck that we got a throwback to BG finally and it lasted all of 1 game.

[crimzontearz]

yukidama wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

please do not ask.....people almost never hear the whole reason behind the cross platform evolution in the DA franchise.....they only hear "ZOMG consoles suck so we had to dumb the game down"

[Dave of Canada]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo.

All leaked footage also happens to SUDDENLY cut off before the real gameplay starts, haven't you noticed? The general idea of people who've played the game is that it still feels like Origins but faster.

I can hardly take any of the previews seriously anymore because they tend to be extremely misinformed (not judging the quality of this article, just in general).

The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors.

Where was this said? All I remember reading was the art change was made because Origins was outdated (you can't tell me it wasn't with a straight face).

What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

It paints a picture of people overreacting with nothing, insulting console gamers everywhere and calling other people stupid. How does that look?

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 02 novembre 2010 - 12:42 .

[mellifera]

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

please do not ask.....people almost never hear the whole reason behind the cross platform evolution in the DA franchise.....they only hear "ZOMG consoles suck so we had to dumb the game down"

Lol, I'm not asking about battle animations or fighting. I'm asking about the look. It seems people are acting like the graphics in DAO looked better on PC because consoles can't handle the graphics (which at times are pretty awful even on PC) instead of a crappy port.

[Mike Laidlaw]

Herr Uhl wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

As I've said before, the "15 second to action" is probably when Varric starts telling the story, choose your class and gender and get the default Hawke for that. For the exaggerated part there would be no assignment of skill-points. Cassandra proceeds to call BS (hopefully not a long way in) and he restarts with you going to CC-screen.

As long as that opening sequence isn't too long I'm fine with it.

That's pretty much it, yes. We're not removing stats, we're just moving them to after you get a chance to play the game.

[the_one_54321]

crimzontearz wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

that argument NEVER flies with the devs unless neigh EVERYOE starts companing about it (including the media) like it happened in ME2

Well how about this argument: DA:O sold better than ME2, and what were the major differences between them?

[Onyx Jaguar]

Lack of Polygons can be helped with a different art style. Look at Killer7, looks fantastic compared to the more realistic contemporaries. A better engine however would negate that in DA's case, look at that Witcher 2 engine they seem to be runnin up shoes with. Rather than compete you side step it.

[Morroian]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

To me your post simply paints a picture of someone who can't see (or doesn't want to see) past the marketing and the buzzwords.

[Tsuga C]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...
That's pretty much it, yes. We're not removing stats, we're just moving them to after you get a chance to play the game.

This makes little sense to anyone who's ever played a Pen & Paper RPG or even DA:O.  When it's time to put on your shoes and socks, you don't do it in that order...  

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo.

All leaked footage also happens to SUDDENLY cut off before the real gameplay starts, haven't you noticed? The general idea of people who've played the game is that it still feels like Origins but faster.

I can hardly take any of the previews seriously anymore because they tend to be extremely misinformed (not judging the quality of this article, just in general).

The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors.

Where was this said? All I remember reading was the art change was made because Origins was outdated (you can't tell me it wasn't with a straight face).

What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

It paints a picture of people overreacting with nothing, insulting console gamers everywhere and calling other people stupid. How does that look?

One of the devs, I think it was Laidlaw but I could be wrong and I'm too tired to go searching for the post, mentioned one of the reasons the art style was changed was due to essentially console performance but not in so many words. Granted like I said, I'm tired, I could be remembering wrong, or mixing one post with another up.

Dave, every aspect of the game so far screams out what people are worried of. I just hope that doesn't end up being the case because Origins for me was prolly the best game I've played in a very long time. I'd hate to see it end up more like ME2 and less like DA;O.

[crimzontearz]

yukidama wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

please do not ask.....people almost never hear the whole reason behind the cross platform evolution in the DA franchise.....they only hear "ZOMG consoles suck so we had to dumb the game down"

Lol, I'm not asking about battle animations or fighting. I'm asking about the look. It seems people are acting like the graphics in DAO looked better on PC because consoles can't handle the graphics (which at times are pretty awful even on PC) instead of a crappy port.

that's what I mean Yuki. 

Dao's visuals were ceonceived for a PC game, they were built to use the strengths of that platform, and since it was a port and it was not built from the ground up for consoles the reuslt on consoles was even more out-dated-looking than on PC.

so when it came time to make DA2 the art team decided to creat a visual style that would be optimal for all three platforms  (it was admitted by a dev before more than once) but that does not mean that the consoles could not handle good graphics just that the visuals of DAO were unsuitable for effective cross platform developement

yet still to this day all that people hear from this is "consoles suck"

[slimgrin]

On high settings DA:O looks pretty good, considerably better than console versions, and has some nice surface detail, particularly the armor. But meh...I guess I can live with less than stellar graphics.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Morroian wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

To me your post simply paints a picture of someone who can't see (or doesn't want to see) past the marketing and the buzzwords.

If it walks like a duck, sounds like a duck, guess what? It's prolly a duck.

[Sir JK]

Tsuga C wrote...

This makes little sense to anyone who's ever played a Pen & Paper RPG or even DA:O.  When it's time to put on your shoes and socks, you don't do it in that order...  

It's a literary technique called In Medias Res, essentially starting in the middle of the action. Instead of then slowly moving the way through the initial story the reader/viewer(player is then allowed to catch up. A good way to establish a very immersive and engaging pacing if pulled off well.
I've used it in PnP RPGs a couple of times and my players generally respond very well to it. It generally allows the players to get a sense if they like their ideas before they build them and establish some initial thoughts about the character.
If anything, In Medias Res is a more advanced way of telling the story than the regular slow build up. Since it needs to have a strong enough narrative to allow the audience to catch up.

[mellifera]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

As I've said before, the "15 second to action" is probably when Varric starts telling the story, choose your class and gender and get the default Hawke for that. For the exaggerated part there would be no assignment of skill-points. Cassandra proceeds to call BS (hopefully not a long way in) and he restarts with you going to CC-screen.

As long as that opening sequence isn't too long I'm fine with it.

That's pretty much it, yes. We're not removing stats, we're just moving them to after you get a chance to play the game.

When do you get the CC screen?