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[crimzontearz]

the_one_54321 wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
I think the implication is that you can skip all the extra stuff and be playing a fight within 15 seconds. Not that you absolutely will be playing the game in 15 seconds. Still the implication that this removes all the stat micromanagement is a bad thing no matter how you try to spin it as streamlining. Micromanagement and character building is part of what made DA:O different and great. End of story.

that argument NEVER flies with the devs unless neigh EVERYOE starts companing about it (including the media) like it happened in ME2

Well how about this argument: DA:O sold better than ME2, and what were the major differences between them?

oh yes I know


but the same argument was made with ME2 being streamlined from ME1...the result was that initially the devs said it was for the best and after monyhs of companing and even the media saying it was a bad turn finally they announced ME3 would be more of an RPG again

which is what I think might happen to DA2 and 3

[UpDownLeftRight]

the_one_54321 wrote...

You know, Mike has heretofor been the one that has sworn up and down that combat on the PC will not change other than being more responsive. For him to turn around and make a comment like this.
Good lord I hate marketing. Sometimes it feels like they want us to be upset at them.

I am sorry, but are you having a laugh and this is your attempt at jocularity or are you truly solemn?

This interview concerns the PS3 version. Not the PC or the Xbox 360 version.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

please do not ask.....people almost never hear the whole reason behind the cross platform evolution in the DA franchise.....they only hear "ZOMG consoles suck so we had to dumb the game down"

Lol, I'm not asking about battle animations or fighting. I'm asking about the look. It seems people are acting like the graphics in DAO looked better on PC because consoles can't handle the graphics (which at times are pretty awful even on PC) instead of a crappy port.

that's what I mean Yuki. 

Dao's visuals were ceonceived for a PC game, they were built to use the strengths of that platform, and since it was a port and it was not built from the ground up for consoles the reuslt on consoles was even more out-dated-looking than on PC.

so when it came time to make DA2 the art team decided to creat a visual style that would be optimal for all three platforms  (it was admitted by a dev before more than once) but that does not mean that the consoles could not handle good graphics just that the visuals of DAO were unsuitable for effective cross platform developement

yet still to this day all that people hear from this is "consoles suck"

Compared to a high end pc? Yes consoles do suck. Thats realitiy, and I own a PS3 and like it for what it is, but a high end PC will outperform a console with usually outdated tech any day of the week.

[crimzontearz]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

yukidama wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Exaggerating or not, its not very difficult to see the target audience they're catering to Dave, I don't even think you're nieve enough to not realize it.

Sorry, but I don't see the game focused on the "Mountain Dew swilling, Chee-Zee-Poof gobbling, New Sh*t-loving demographic". Call me naive or not, but I heavily doubt adding faster animations and making an attack button (FOR CONSOLES ONLY) suddenly turns the game into an action rpg.

Well, lets take all the previews comparing the game to ME2, take all the dev comments talking about how Origins combat was "too slow" and take all the leaked footage that was ok to be considered representative of the game at all these cons, but now is considered taboo. The art changes to "help the console versions out" among other factors. What do you get when you add all those factors together? What kind of picture does it paint?

How are the art changes to help the consoles out? PS3/360s can handle graphics extremely well.

please do not ask.....people almost never hear the whole reason behind the cross platform evolution in the DA franchise.....they only hear "ZOMG consoles suck so we had to dumb the game down"

Lol, I'm not asking about battle animations or fighting. I'm asking about the look. It seems people are acting like the graphics in DAO looked better on PC because consoles can't handle the graphics (which at times are pretty awful even on PC) instead of a crappy port.

that's what I mean Yuki. 

Dao's visuals were ceonceived for a PC game, they were built to use the strengths of that platform, and since it was a port and it was not built from the ground up for consoles the reuslt on consoles was even more out-dated-looking than on PC.

so when it came time to make DA2 the art team decided to creat a visual style that would be optimal for all three platforms  (it was admitted by a dev before more than once) but that does not mean that the consoles could not handle good graphics just that the visuals of DAO were unsuitable for effective cross platform developement

yet still to this day all that people hear from this is "consoles suck"

Compared to a high end pc? Yes consoles do suck. Thats realitiy, and I own a PS3 and like it for what it is, but a high end PC will outperform a console with usually outdated tech any day of the week.

I am not saying a high end PC does not outperform a console but consoles are capable of remarkable feats through sheer optimization and clever programming which is what will happen in DA2...they just need have games built for them from the groung up which was obviously not possible for DAO because we all know it was built originally for PC only

[JrayM16]

So, what does it matter that a high end pc will outperform consoles?

[crimzontearz]

JrayM16 wrote...

So, what does it matter that a high end pc will outperform consoles?

PC gamers are the master Race, Consoles are holding Videogaming performance back, Console players are moronic at best and every change made to the game is a dumbing-down manouver to allow consoles to run it


that is pretty much what the line of thought of a lot of people around here boils down to

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

JrayM16 wrote...

So, what does it matter that a high end pc will outperform consoles?

In DA2's case? Prolly nothing because its more than likely the 2 console skus will hold back the PC version visuals wise. I doubt they spend the resources to allow the PC version to use Directx11 when the 360 for example is limited to Directx 9, because the payout wouldn't be worth the development money. Especially considering PC is no longer the lead sku as its easier to port up than down.  

[crimzontearz]

thank you for proving my point Sarah

[Lyssistr]

crimzontearz wrote...
I am not saying a high end PC does not outperform a console but consoles are capable of remarkable feats through sheer optimization and clever programming which is what will happen in DA2...they just need have games built for them from the groung up which was obviously not possible for DAO because we all know it was built originally for PC only

 The problem is that when a game is built from ground up with consoles in mind, it usually plays like **** on PCs. Dreamfall Chapters comes to mind as the worst implementation I have come across. That's why Blizzard sticks to PCs, its not that consoles wont run Diablo III, it's that they don't want to blow the game.

 I miss the times when we bought consoles for consoles games and PCs for PC games. SNES for JRPGs and PCs for Quest for Glory.

[mellifera]

Yes, but at the end of the day not everyone has a high end PC. I can play DAO on the highest settings and it looks good, but it definitely could look better.Having a more cohesive style that looks good on all platforms is better than having a game that only looks good on very high settings on a PC while leaving everyone else thinking it looks really bad.


And it's been said multiple times that the three are being developed simultaneously...

Modifié par yukidama, 02 novembre 2010 - 01:06 .

[Lyssistr]

yukidama wrote...

Yes, but at the end of the day not everyone has a high end PC. I can play DAO on the highest settings and it looks good, but it definitely could look better.Having a more cohesive style that looks good on all platforms is better than having a game that only looks good on very high settings on a PC while leaving everyone else thinking it looks really bad.

 Imho the greatest issue with console games ported as PC games is gameplay & UI. Graphics too but compared to how unnatural some of these ports feel, this is really a minor issue.

[slimgrin]

JrayM16 wrote...

So, what does it matter that a high end pc will outperform consoles?

It can get frustrating when you spend $1300 on a gaming machine when so many multi-platform titles never take advantage of that type of hardware, let alone the advanced control scheme and flexibility the platform offers. If I want a game to behave as if it were on a console, then I'd buy a console. This is the source of much pc nerd rage.

/ rant off 

[Ryzaki]

Also the only thing I've gotten is that DA2 looks *different* not better but different.

[mellifera]

Lyssistr wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Yes, but at the end of the day not everyone has a high end PC. I can play DAO on the highest settings and it looks good, but it definitely could look better.Having a more cohesive style that looks good on all platforms is better than having a game that only looks good on very high settings on a PC while leaving everyone else thinking it looks really bad.

 Imho the greatest issue with console games ported as PC games is gameplay & UI. Graphics too but compared to how unnatural some of these ports feel, this is really a minor issue.

But that's not what is happening here. They're not porting the console version to PC, they're working on all of them at the same time.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

crimzontearz wrote...

thank you for proving my point Sarah

What point? That I think I'm elite or better than a 360 user? Because I don't think that at all. Its reality that developers aren't going to go out of their way to support PC only features like DX11 when porting up from console builds. If that was your intended point, then yes I guess I proved it.

[mellifera]

Ryzaki wrote...

Also the only thing I've gotten is that DA2 looks *different* not better but different.

It's not a finished game and they're still working on it? Who knows how it'll look on the day it ships vs how it looks from a few short videos we've seen.

[Lyssistr]

yukidama wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Yes, but at the end of the day not everyone has a high end PC. I can play DAO on the highest settings and it looks good, but it definitely could look better.Having a more cohesive style that looks good on all platforms is better than having a game that only looks good on very high settings on a PC while leaving everyone else thinking it looks really bad.

 Imho the greatest issue with console games ported as PC games is gameplay & UI. Graphics too but compared to how unnatural some of these ports feel, this is really a minor issue.

But that's not what is happening here. They're not porting the console version to PC, they're working on all of them at the same time.

Top down view chopped, gameplay adjusted to console, it's safe say that DA2 is designed with consoles in mind. A Bio dev said this 1-2 months ago during an interview for a French magazine.

[Ryzaki]

yukidama wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Also the only thing I've gotten is that DA2 looks *different* not better but different.

It's not a finished game and they're still working on it? Who knows how it'll look on the day it ships vs how it looks from a few short videos we've seen.

Yeah well I'm not overly fond of the character designs. Their chins look off.

So who knows. But so far it just looks *different*. Maybe I think it'll be better when its done and maybe I think it'll be worse and maybe someone else will think the exact opposite. so far I'm not liking the new character designs.

[Khayness]

Finally, no annoying PR lines repeating, very good, informative.

Keep up the good work!

- a PC gamer

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

yukidama wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Yes, but at the end of the day not everyone has a high end PC. I can play DAO on the highest settings and it looks good, but it definitely could look better.Having a more cohesive style that looks good on all platforms is better than having a game that only looks good on very high settings on a PC while leaving everyone else thinking it looks really bad.

 Imho the greatest issue with console games ported as PC games is gameplay & UI. Graphics too but compared to how unnatural some of these ports feel, this is really a minor issue.

But that's not what is happening here. They're not porting the console version to PC, they're working on all of them at the same time.

When a dev can comfirm to me that the PC version still has a tactical over head camera option, I'll maybe believe its not a port. Its not hard to see that the console versions are the focus this time out since that was where the fallout was with DAO being originally meant as a PC only game at one point.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Ryzaki wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Also the only thing I've gotten is that DA2 looks *different* not better but different.

It's not a finished game and they're still working on it? Who knows how it'll look on the day it ships vs how it looks from a few short videos we've seen.

Yeah well I'm not overly fond of the character designs. Their chins look off.

So who knows. But so far it just looks *different*. Maybe I think it'll be better when its done and maybe I think it'll be worse and maybe someone else will think the exact opposite. so far I'm not liking the new character designs.

Yeah the whole bug eyes and Jay Leno Jaw's are both disturbing to say the least.

[Lyssistr]

Not to mention the lack of toolset, until Bio confirms otherwise.

[Morroian]

crimzontearz wrote...

but the same argument was made with ME2 being streamlined from ME1...the result was that initially the devs said it was for the best and after monyhs of companing and even the media saying it was a bad turn finally they announced ME3 would be more of an RPG again

which is what I think might happen to DA2 and 3

Doubt it, what is being done from DAO to DA2 is not remotely close to what was done for ME2, at least as reported so far, I'm a mite nervous about the inventory and armour for NPC issue. DA2 as reported is still more of a traditional rpg than ME1.

[Herr Uhl]

Lyssistr wrote...

Top down view chopped, gameplay adjusted to console, it's safe say that DA2 is designed with consoles in mind. A Bio dev said this 1-2 months ago during an interview for a French magazine.

Oh, that article. They're still working on the tactical camera on the PC, but then again, they're still working on the rogue animations too.

And gameplay is adjusted to console on consoles *gasps*

[Morroian]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

When a dev can comfirm to me that the PC version still has a tactical over head camera option, I'll maybe believe its not a port. Its not hard to see that the console versions are the focus this time out since that was where the fallout was with DAO being originally meant as a PC only game at one point.

The engine is the same engine that was built on the PC originally.