294 réponses à ce sujet

[CroGamer002]

Call of Duty Black Ops already did it so no.

Not it is a bad thing but still.

[Gyroscopic_Trout]

My only problem with this idea is that it could easily become an excuse to reboot Commander Shepard again.  Take away the ship, the crew, all the fancy toys and make Shepard start all over again in what is supposed to be the series' climax.  I really don't want to go on another recruiting drive.

I can see there being a trial in absentia though, playing out kind of like the intro to ME1, where Anderson, Udina and Hacket are going over Shepard's personnel file.  Except in this, they are going over Shepard's actions in the first two games and foreshadowing the Commander's interactions with the Alliance or Citadel Council throughout the game.

To look at it another way, Shepard's death and resurrection were all over the promotional material of ME2.  It was a powerful scene (that admittedly I sometimes wished I could skip after making a Shepard that didn't look quite right for the thrid time in a row and wanting to go back in time 30 minutes to make him/her over again).  However, it wasn't a surprise, because we all knew it was coming.  Wouldn't it be better if the Alliance coming to grab Shepard happened maybe a couple hours into the game and came as a surprise to the player? 

To have Shepard get caught and imprisoned by his 'allies' in the first five minutes of the game would, to me, not be as interesting as if they came after him later on and interrupted whatever the heck he's doing to save the galaxy (kind of like Knights of the Old Republic).  It would also add to the tension, since every minute Shepard spends locked up, the reapers are that much closer to achieving their goals.

[Count Viceroy]

Mesina2 wrote...

Call of Duty Black Ops already did it so no.
Not it is a bad thing but still.

If I had a cookie for every time a game or any other form of media had something some other media had already used then I'd have lots of cookies. I'd have to rent the biggest store room ever to store all of my cookies.

I'd probably have to hollow out the moon to fit them all.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 17 novembre 2010 - 09:15 .

[CroGamer002]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Call of Duty Black Ops already did it so no.
Not it is a bad thing but still.

If I had a cookie for every time a game or any other form of media had something some other media had already used then I'd have lots of cookies. I'd have to rent the biggest store room ever to store all of my cookies.

I'd probably have to hollow out the moon to fit them all.

Only this would be very big similarity.

[Dean_the_Young]

Mesina2 wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Call of Duty Black Ops already did it so no.
Not it is a bad thing but still.

If I had a cookie for every time a game or any other form of media had something some other media had already used then I'd have lots of cookies. I'd have to rent the biggest store room ever to store all of my cookies.

I'd probably have to hollow out the moon to fit them all.

Only this would be very big similarity.

Again. Moon.

[Galenwolf]

No thanks, already the pointless intro rubbish. I want to stop the reapers not repeat myself again with a load time wasted.

Also as for the squadmates, I just spent an entire new game recruiting them im not sodding recruiting a load more of misfits. I want the bloody people I just recruited and earned the loyalty of. The only change I could see is Thane dying depending on the gap and that being filled by the ashley/kaiden.

If ME3 even has a slight smell of this happening or me going on another load of bloody recruitment cycles in any way then bioware can shove ME3.

Modifié par Galenwolf, 18 novembre 2010 - 02:35 .

[vinak]

After thinking about it for a while...We probably have to find ourselves in some kind of scenario that lets us reconstruct our face and possibly reselect our starting class again...along with explaining why we have to start at level 1 again. Plus the Normandy is probably going to have to be replaced/upgraded as well. Having Shepard "die" again(or some other dramatic event) and the Normandy blowing up again are just not going to happen.

I don't see an interrogation plot happening. I don't think Bioware will want to go in that direction. We've already had a traumatic dramatic start to ME2. It just wouldn't work in ME3. It is the conclusion to a trilogy. It needs to tie everything together and reach a climax.

Shepard in ME3 will most likely have a more empowered beginning. Shepard coming into his/her own. You've established your allies/contacts. You know the reapers are coming. Now you have to figure out how to stop them.

So my guess would be for Shepard to have some complications with his/her Lazarus implants (or whatever they did to him/her) which lands him/her in a hospital (or other facility) for a few days. During this period, Shepard provides a debrief/explanation to relevant parties. While the Normandy is going to be in dry dock for refit. Depending on player choices, the Normandy is also going to have to have its registration/insignia changed, entangled communication rerouted, and TIMs monitoring devices stripped.

Something arises: plot ensues.

Modifié par vinak, 18 novembre 2010 - 09:46 .

[Dean_the_Young]

'Shepard catches face flu' is considered a more realistic,start and better tie in than 'Shepard is held accountable for choices he/she has made over the course of the last two games, culminating in simmering tensions and distrust with the Council and Alliance'?

[vinak]

uhh no...strawman is appreciated though.

I am basically trying to say the beginning of ME3 is probably not going to be so confrontational as the first 2 games...while trying to think of ways to enable basic gameplay elements as facial reconstruction options without needing to kill off Shepard again or otherwise cause great bodily harm..as it became redundant.

Shepard's accountability for his/her action will play out during the game, not right at the beginning...as that is the whole point of ME3, and Mass Effect as a whole.

Modifié par vinak, 18 novembre 2010 - 10:28 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Shepard being captured and interrogated doesn't need to provide great harm, nor is it any less redundant than 'game starts off in a hospital so that Shepard can change her face'.



The boons and costs of Shepard's actions will play out throughout the game, but an accounting can certainly be a way to start off the game. We certainly got a brief one at the beginning of ME2: What shepard did with the Council, and soon after a sequence about pre-service history, Virmire death, and the Ambassadorship.

[Dark Glasses]

I support this 100%. It would be great beginning.

[Destroy Raiden_]

Gyroscopic_Trout wrote...

My only problem with this idea is that it could easily become an excuse to reboot Commander Shepard again.  Take away the ship, the crew, all the fancy toys and make Shepard start all over again in what is supposed to be the series' climax.  I really don't want to go on another recruiting drive.

I can see there being a trial in absentia though, playing out kind of like the intro to ME1, where Anderson, Udina and Hacket are going over Shepard's personnel file.  Except in this, they are going over Shepard's actions in the first two games and foreshadowing the Commander's interactions with the Alliance or Citadel Council throughout the game.

To look at it another way, Shepard's death and resurrection were all over the promotional material of ME2.  It was a powerful scene (that admittedly I sometimes wished I could skip after making a Shepard that didn't look quite right for the thrid time in a row and wanting to go back in time 30 minutes to make him/her over again).  However, it wasn't a surprise, because we all knew it was coming.  Wouldn't it be better if the Alliance coming to grab Shepard happened maybe a couple hours into the game and came as a surprise to the player? 

To have Shepard get caught and imprisoned by his 'allies' in the first five minutes of the game would, to me, not be as interesting as if they came after him later on and interrupted whatever the heck he's doing to save the galaxy (kind of like Knights of the Old Republic).  It would also add to the tension, since every minute Shepard spends locked up, the reapers are that much closer to achieving their goals.

I can relate to the whole but why do we have to reboot shep again?! I at least am operating on the assumption they're going to boot us back to 1 and reboot status for instance after 1 I though ok we're going to pick up right where we left off...on the ship well we kinda did except the ship blew up so that sucked and here we are at level 1 w/ no one but Miranda....so I can only assume if they did this to us in 2 they'll repeat the process for all the newbies they hope will come in for 3. I'd rather they left off really this time on the ship w/ no epic explosion but I have no evidence at this time to belive that this scenario will come about.

I do love your idea though about really blindsiding the player w/ the trial later in the game ideally this was what I wanted to happen as well but like I said before sense we have no evidence to support a start from where you left of opening will occur we must assume they will take away squad and reboot you like 2 which then unfortunately has to move the trial scenerio up in the queue.

I also like your idea of absence trial too just try shep on real and or fake charges get him arrested then consequences for our main story decisions from 1 till now would be dealt later in the games main story plot!

[Zulu_DFA]

Lol, look what I found!



http://social.biowar...5/index/1357935



Anyone up for a hardcore necro?

[Fixers0]

 Again No, just no, this is just going to be another cliche just to open the story

It won't work, sheppard's a hero and imprisoning a protagonist (or killing and resurrecting him) isn't what the big part of the Players want since Shepard's is supposed to be a hero.

Forcing  the protagonist (Shepard) to comit crimes during act 1 and 2 and then having him on trial in act 3, doesn't make any sense and again a big part of the Players won't accept this right away... Unless it's a conspiracy plot.... Yay more conspiracy plots.

Do you understand the concept of a protagonist, he is the main focus in the game/series/movie most of the time he is someone who we can relate to, if you get one protagonist into so much unbelievable situations will disconect the players from the story and remove all the excitement because we need to live into the scene and the protagonist.

Modifié par Fixers0, 25 novembre 2010 - 01:39 .

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Fixers0 wrote...

 Again No, just no, this is just going to be another cliche just to open the story

It won't work, sheppard's a hero and imprisoning a protagonist (or killing and resurrecting him) isn't what the big part of the Players want since Shepard's is supposed to be a hero.

Forcing  the protagonist (Shepard) to comit crimes during act 1 and 2 and then having him on trial in act 3, doesn't make any sense and again a big part of the Players won't accept this right away... Unless it's a conspiracy plot.... Yay more conspiracy plots.

Do you understand the concept of a protagonist, he is the main focus in the game/series/movie most of the time he is someone who we can relate to, if you get one protagonist into so much unbelievable situations will disconect the players from the story and remove all the excitement because we need to live into the scene and the protagonist.

Shepard's a hero doesn't equal Shepard can't be put on trial for stuff the Alliance/Council thinks he did.

Shepard the big damn hero whose claims have been dismissed by the original council or who the human council fears has put humanity up against the other alien species.

Shepard the big damn hero who some of the Alliance Officers believes should have been arrested pre-ME2 events

Shepard the big damn hero who is using a ship and fundings of an 'alleged' terrorist group who 'the original council' considers a nemesis and whom are reluctant to let Shepard leave the Citadel but will do so as long as Shepard stays in the Terminus Systems (in other words, out of sight, out of mind).

Do I need to go on or do you understand that it doesn't matter if Shepard is the Hero or not, other people aren't always going to see Shepard as such. If you really think the Council is suddenly going to start believing Shepard after the events of ME2 then you are seriously fooling yourself and in my opinion them arresting Shepard makes far more sense for a story opening to ME3 than anything else I can think of.

Also to use my Username as a prime example, the protagonist CAN at some point find themselves in jail/prison/in stocks/deemed a criminal. In fact, my Username is a very good example because that was right near the end of the story when that happened. If you find it far fetched and taking you out of the story then you clearly have been playing the games with blinkers on and wearing earplugs.

Edit: Actually I would go as far to state that if anything was to throw the majority of intelligent players out of the game it would be the Council/Alliance welcoming Shepard back with open arms and agreeing with all that Shep said at the start of ME3. Which from the way you've written your thoughts on the matter, is what your expecting *shakes head in disbelief*

Modifié par Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien, 25 novembre 2010 - 02:41 .

[Fiery Phoenix]

Thank you for explaining it on my behalf, Lichenstien.

[Zulu_DFA]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...
Thank you for explaining it on my behalf, Lichenstien.

Almost looks like we're taking turns on this Captain Obvious' watch.

[Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien]

Imperium Alpha wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Call of Duty Black Ops already did it so no.
Not it is a bad thing but still.

If I had a cookie for every time a game or any other form of media had something some other media had already used then I'd have lots of cookies. I'd have to rent the biggest store room ever to store all of my cookies.

I'd probably have to hollow out the moon to fit them all.

Alpha Protocol
Can i have a cookie now ! ?! :innocent:

Yeah always find it funny when people mention something that is used it as if it is the first time it has used it when it isn't. Like people claiming WoW invented the Trinity system.

Speaking of games where a 'protagonist' is being interrogated...

Varric in DA2 is in a similar situation. Ook he's a 'follower' of the protagonist, but still

I want my cookie!

Anyone expecting there to be Sunshine, Lollipops and Rainbows for there Protagonist in ME3 I think is in for some disappointment. Ok so you MIGHT get it at the end, but I think your in for a rough ride beforehand.

[Fixers0]

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

 Again No, just no, this is just going to be another cliche just to open the story

It won't work, sheppard's a hero and imprisoning a protagonist (or killing and resurrecting him) isn't what the big part of the Players want since Shepard's is supposed to be a hero.

Forcing  the protagonist (Shepard) to comit crimes during act 1 and 2 and then having him on trial in act 3, doesn't make any sense and again a big part of the Players won't accept this right away... Unless it's a conspiracy plot.... Yay more conspiracy plots.

Do you understand the concept of a protagonist, he is the main focus in the game/series/movie most of the time he is someone who we can relate to, if you get one protagonist into so much unbelievable situations will disconect the players from the story and remove all the excitement because we need to live into the scene and the protagonist.

Shepard's a hero doesn't equal Shepard can't be put on trial for stuff the Alliance/Council thinks he did.

Shepard the big damn hero whose claims have been dismissed by the original council or who the human council fears has put humanity up against the other alien species.



Shepard the big damn hero who some of the Alliance Officers believes should have been arrested pre-ME2 events

Shepard the big damn hero who is using a ship and fundings of an 'alleged' terrorist group who 'the original council' considers a nemesis and whom are reluctant to let Shepard leave the Citadel but will do so as long as Shepard stays in the Terminus Systems (in other words, out of sight, out of mind).

Do I need to go on or do you understand that it doesn't matter if Shepard is the Hero or not, other people aren't always going to see Shepard as such. If you really think the Council is suddenly going to start believing Shepard after the events of ME2 then you are seriously fooling yourself and in my opinion them arresting Shepard makes far more sense for a story opening to ME3 than anything else I can think of.

Also to use my Username as a prime example, the protagonist CAN at some point find themselves in jail/prison/in stocks/deemed a criminal. In fact, my Username is a very good example because that was right near the end of the story when that happened. If you find it far fetched and taking you out of the story then you clearly have been playing the games with blinkers on and wearing earplugs.

Edit: Actually I would go as far to state that if anything was to throw the majority of intelligent players out of the game it would be the Council/Alliance welcoming Shepard back with open arms and agreeing with all that Shep said at the start of ME3. Which from the way you've written your thoughts on the matter, is what your expecting *shakes head in disbelief*

Haven't you even read the second and third part of my post where i said that Forcing the protagonist into making crimes and then rewarding him with a trial which most likley is going to bad for shepard will not be accepted by a big part of the players and is in fact is just another damn cliche.

Now i'm just getting started, Shepard might have commited some crimes but the fact that we are forced to make them, never tolled why we are making them and never really explained that we even are making crimes, don't you understand and this is the wrong way of thinking.The game makes you think that you are doing the right thing and even pushes you in that way, but when you are putting him on trial in the next game for crimes, then the players will feel confused and will not accept it.

The creators of the theory, appeartly thought that by making there theory as complicated as possible so that most gamers won't understand and just go along with the given explanation ( even though there is not one).

The whole theory is just and entire contradiction, the game let's us be hero and let us save the galaxy twice and then we get arrested, like we had it coming. the implausibility of this whole theory i just so big that i will probably laugh if this is really going to happen in mass effect 3, it comes of like some 8 year old kid wrote and thought it would be an interesting twist in the mass effect universe. but it isn't

What's up with your username anyway. 

Modifié par Fixers0, 25 novembre 2010 - 03:47 .

[Zulu_DFA]

It doesn't necessarily have to be the Council or the Alliance. The Batarians may want to capture and torture Shepard. And ME3 is bound to have some Batarian content, due to their connection to Sovereign, Leviathan of Dis and their knowledge of the Reapers in general (see Mad Prophet).

[Fixers0]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

It doesn't necessarily have to be the Council or the Alliance. The Batarians may want to capture and torture Shepard. And ME3 is bound to have some Batarian content, due to their connection to Sovereign, Leviathan of Dis and their knowledge of the Reapers in general (see Mad Prophet).

To be honest that might work, as it's a nice simple and working plot that  isn't as offensive to the players as being arrested and put into jail by the side that he worked for.

The whole thing about Shepard being betrayed by the side he stood for just feels wrong, it might work in series but certainly not in games.

Modifié par Fixers0, 25 novembre 2010 - 03:54 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Shepard's already been spurned by the side he stood for. Their names are the Council and the Virmire Survivor. Following through on that distrust and distancing before Shepard reconciles/saves the day regardless would be a logical story progression.

[Fixers0]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Shepard's already been spurned by the side he stood for. Their names are the Council and the Virmire Survivor. Following through on that distrust and distancing before Shepard reconciles/saves the day regardless would be a logical story progression.

Now that might be true, but bad guys should clearly bad and we don't like them and the good guys should clearly be the good ones that we can support, it's an old formula but it's still suprisingly powerfull.

[Soahfreako]

I approve of this idea.