294 réponses à ce sujet

[AlexMBrennan]

Good idea as long as you keep it short - don't let it take up the entire game; this is one of the things that made AP somewhat confusing and silly - Mike ended up changing his haircut/beard/glasses numerous times during the interrogation.

[LorDC]

CARL_DF90 wrote...

Interesting idea, although I'm sure Admiral Hackett and a few others within the Alliance would do everything within their power to keep it from happening, just like when Hackett shot down an Alliance major's request to "bring Shepard in".

Actually it could Hackett himself who will put Shepard into custody. Just to make sure that nothing will happen to him until Reapers arrive.

[Zulu_DFA]

Interesting idea, although I'm sure Admiral Hackett and a few others within the Alliance would do everything within their power to keep it from happening, just like when Hackett shot down an Alliance major's request to "bring Shepard in".

That's the catch. Once Hackett and other wannabe benefactors change their mind, Shepard is fair game. Drama. Emotional engagement.



Also it'd definitely make up a pattern:



ME1 = Shepard works for the Galactic government...

ME2 = Shepard works for a shadowy extremist group...

ME3 = Shepard is on his own.

[Dean_the_Young]

Hacket shooting down one major doesn't translate to unlimited, unconditional support. Even Anderson keeps distance from Shepard. It isn't as if the VIP's of the Alliance are in Shepard's corner under all conditions.

[Fixers0]

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.



We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

[M8DMAN]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

spacehamsterZH wrote...

M8DMAN wrote...

Like or not bioware isn't going to use a fanmade storyline for ME3.

True. I have to say I'd appreciate some repercussions to Shepard working with what is widely considered a terrorist organization, though. Everyone associated with the Alliance is shocked to find out about it in ME2, but nobody does anything about it. So yeah, BW isn't going to base the game off of fanfic, but there being legal repercussions to Shepard's actions in ME2 leading to Shepard having to go rogue to save the galaxy makes sense and would be pretty cool.

If you got your Shephard reinstated... would the Alliance try to arrest a Spectre?  At that point, Shep has tacit approval from the Council to continue looking into the colony raids while using Cerberus as a resource.  As a Spectre, with that approval, Shephard isn't doing anything illegal -- that's a big part of being a Spectre!  During LotSB, Vasir orders the Illium cops out of Liara's apartment, and they obey, for cripe's sake.

a) If you played LotSB, that means you've killed a spectre. You're rogue. You're Saren-Shepard. In addition to the tax evasion, that is.

This is not a fan-made storyline or my fanfic. It's an analysis.

c) Prison break = ideal for tutorial level. Trial/interrogation will allow BioWare (aside form anything else) an easy way to account for the "Big Choices".

d) This idea seems immensely popular, so you can't really handwave it like "It's just Zulu".

A)  Another Spectre who had attacked Shepherd and started blowing up random Council-member-race civilians.  The Council must have allowances for that sort of thing, or they're even dumber than they look. 

  If it looks like fanfic, and walks like fanfic, and bleats like fanfic, then it's fanfic. 

C)  Prison Break  = pathetic, rote cliche.

D)  Dancing With the Stars is very popular too...

I agree with the above points.

Plus how does killing a renegade spectre make him "rogue''? Tela Vasir was a murdering psychopath that tried to kill both Liara and Shepard.

You also fought Tela in the public plaza of the Azure Hotel which I am pretty sure is filled with surveillance cameras. 
Which probably caught both her admittance of working with the shadow broker and her Hostage taking. 

This is the 22 century we're talking about here.

Modifié par M8DMAN, 12 novembre 2010 - 03:33 .

[Dean_the_Young]

While I disagree with Zulu's habitual hyperbolism, there is a good kernal of truth to his point.



Any Shepard killing Vasir is troubling. She wasn't rogue, and it can just as much be your word on the situation versus whatever the Council hears. And, since your role is in question and your loyalties are already doubted, your word isn't worth much. Psychopath or not (not), she's a spectre, and even Shepard during the first day of the job had the right to kill every civilian in Chora's Den if he/she wanted.



Shepard fighting Vasir on a plaza is never in doubt. The exact context, is. There are plenty of bad reasons Shepard kills Vasir.



(No, the 22nd century apparently lacks hidden microphones everywhere. Again.)

[Cerberus Operative Ashley Williams]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Any Shepard killing Vasir is troubling. She wasn't rogue, and it can just as much be your word on the situation versus whatever the Council hears. And, since your role is in question and your loyalties are already doubted, your word isn't worth much. Psychopath or not (not), she's a spectre, and even Shepard during the first day of the job had the right to kill every civilian in Chora's Den if he/she wanted.

Hell, Shepard was only a prospective spectre when he laid waste to Chora's Den. I agree, killing Vasir is probably a decision the council will not take kindly too.

[Dean_the_Young]

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

[Destroy Raiden_]

Killing Spector girl wasn't OK'd by the council like it was Saren so regardless of why you killed her or what she did/didn't do to deserve herself getting killed the council will still take issue.

[Fixers0]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

That's true though i depends on how you look at it , the first time i played mass effect 2 i thought wow that's epic, when the normandy is destroyed, but now i see it as a mere plot device that is only there to shock the player, and to give us a reason to work with Cerberus, having shepard dragged away, locked up in prison, and then escaping is just to cliche and unorignal.

[Dean_the_Young]

Fixers0 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

That's true though i depends on how you look at it , the first time i played mass effect 2 i thought wow that's epic, when the normandy is destroyed, but now i see it as a mere plot device that is only there to shock the player, and to give us a reason to work with Cerberus, having shepard dragged away, locked up in prison, and then escaping is just to cliche and unorignal.

Congratulations: all events that move the story are plot devices. And all literary devices have already long since become timeless. No matter how they open ME3, it's going to be something that's already been done since antiquity.

[Stazro]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

That's true though i depends on how you look at it , the first time i played mass effect 2 i thought wow that's epic, when the normandy is destroyed, but now i see it as a mere plot device that is only there to shock the player, and to give us a reason to work with Cerberus, having shepard dragged away, locked up in prison, and then escaping is just to cliche and unorignal.

Congratulations: all events that move the story are plot devices. And all literary devices have already long since become timeless. No matter how they open ME3, it's going to be something that's already been done since antiquity.

I concur. Although I'm shocked you could forget Bastila Shan's name

[Fiery Phoenix]

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc. so that the game feels new and welcoming to everyone regardless of whether or not they've played the previous title(s). Of course, import bonuses are always there.

[Dean_the_Young]

Stazro wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

That's true though i depends on how you look at it , the first time i played mass effect 2 i thought wow that's epic, when the normandy is destroyed, but now i see it as a mere plot device that is only there to shock the player, and to give us a reason to work with Cerberus, having shepard dragged away, locked up in prison, and then escaping is just to cliche and unorignal.

Congratulations: all events that move the story are plot devices. And all literary devices have already long since become timeless. No matter how they open ME3, it's going to be something that's already been done since antiquity.

I concur. Although I'm shocked you could forget Bastila Shan's name

Not ever having played the game might have had something to do with it.

[Dean_the_Young]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc. so that the game feels new and welcoming to everyone regardless of whether or not they've played the previous title(s). Of course, import bonuses are always there.

I don't see why it can't do all that AND look cool.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc. so that the game feels new and welcoming to everyone regardless of whether or not they've played the previous title(s). Of course, import bonuses are always there.

I don't see why it can't do all that AND look cool.

Oh yeah, I was just saying. I'm sure it would be awesomeness. All of it.

[Lumikki]

Wizz wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

No thanks for Interrogation. No need for it, I know my choises what I have done in past. As for new player, they choises has no meaning, because they don't know what those choises would be. This Interrogation would only serve purpose to someone who want to try different choises and knows what those choises are. That's powerplaying. I allways thinked this is roleplaying game and you live with your choises what you have made in past. What's the point of asking more meaning to choises what you do inside the game, if you can just cancel them at every games begin.

You take it too literally, of course questions like "Did you saved cure from genophage?" will be senseless for new players ('Genophage'? What is it?) and boring for old players. I see interrogation like good way to show Shepard's ideology and increase Shepard's character.

Yeah, but the system also creates loop hole for old players who try to find perfect situations as metagaming or powerplaying. Oh , damm I did wrong choise in my last gameplay, there and there, no problem I fix it with the Interrogation system in beging of ME3. What good of making choises is, if we can change them to be anything. We player ask all the time from developers, give our choises more meaning, this interrogation system just takes hole meaning of choises away, because you can change your choises to anything. You can create perfect gameplay. Hole system lowers meaning of choises done in past and doesn't allow us to make mistakes what we can't fix easyly.

[Killjoy Cutter]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc.

Thank you for (unintentionally) pointing out another excellent reason to NOT have this nonsense in ME3. 

[Fixers0]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The problem with this idea is that it will be almost the Same as ME2 just slightly different.

We get an dramatic intro (ME2: Shepard's dead, ME3 Shepard's capture.) then we need to escape(ME2 from Lazarus station,ME3 from Alliance prison), then we learn about our mission(ME2 TIM, ME3 the person who helped you get out.)

You just summarized the desired beginning of virtually every 'epic' game ever: intro to build suspense, dramatic setting of initial level(s), normalization as main course begins.

In ME1, it was 'Who is Shepard'/spectre candidacy/first video of Sovereign, Eden Prime, and then proving Saren's guilt and starting the main game.

In KOTOR it was escaping ship, rescuing what's-her-name, retracing Revan's steps.

In Dragon Age, it was Origin, Ostagar, Treaty Quests.

That's true though i depends on how you look at it , the first time i played mass effect 2 i thought wow that's epic, when the normandy is destroyed, but now i see it as a mere plot device that is only there to shock the player, and to give us a reason to work with Cerberus, having shepard dragged away, locked up in prison, and then escaping is just to cliche and unorignal.

Congratulations: all events that move the story are plot devices. And all literary devices have already long since become timeless. No matter how they open ME3, it's going to be something that's already been done since antiquity.

Maby so but, the problem  Shepard's Death and resurection is that it had zero importance to the rest of story and only seems to exit within the first ten minuts of the game, after we gain control of the Normandy SR2 it's seems like nothing happend at all, and that we just start working for cerberus,

If you make a dramatic opening to game or a movie then make it important to the main plot (not that mass effect 2 has one) , letting Shepard die and then ressurect him five minutes later is a bad idea, especialy if it doesn't have any importance to the main storylne.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc.

Thank you for (unintentionally) pointing out another excellent reason to NOT have this nonsense in ME3. 

If you say so...

[M8DMAN]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc.

Thank you for (unintentionally) pointing out another excellent reason to NOT have this nonsense in ME3. 

If you say so...

I don't think Bioware will have shep put in Jail just to bust him down to Level 1.  The whole prison thing just sounds like a bad plot device that isn't needed in anyway.

There's no way a few space cops could arrest Shepard. 

Plus his ties with TIM and the new shadow broker make's him virtually Untouchable.

Modifié par M8DMAN, 12 novembre 2010 - 03:44 .

[Fiery Phoenix]

M8DMAN wrote...

I don't think Bioware will have shep put in Jail just to bust him down to Level 1.  The whole prison thing just sounds like a bad plot device that isn't needed in anyway.

I would be lying to you if I told you anyone expected Shepard to be killed at some point and thought it would be necessary prior to ME2.

There's no way a few space cops could arrest Shepard.

If Shepard is meant to go to jail, she will, regardless of the how of it.

Plus his ties with TIM and the new shadow broker make's him virtually Untouchable.

Same as above.

[Zulu_DFA]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...

The ultimate reason for this is not to look cool, but rather to bust Shepard down to Level 1 and devoid her of all squadmates, equipment, etc.

Thank you for (unintentionally) pointing out another excellent reason to NOT have this nonsense in ME3. 

Am I starting to smell the odor of cold "Bring Squadmates Back" sweat here?

I think this thread's lacked it up till now, but it was inevitable in the end...