393 réponses à ce sujet

[Brockololly]

The problem I have with this whole "Oh, its just like comics changing artists!" argument is that comics like Batman often crap all over any sense of continuity when they change artists and that often times the change to a different artist is tied to either a standalone graphic novel or some other sort of retcon in the lore to reset things story wise. Such that the new art style reflects the themes in the redesigned world.



So unless the continuity of the world is being tossed in the trash can for DA2, the shift in visual style isn't like a comic getting a new artist, it would be like reading one graphic novel and turning the page to the next chapter only to have a new artist doing all the art, with things and characters you grew to recognize completely changed.



And that lack of visual consistency is annoying as hell.

[mellifera]

Honest question- What's the problem with the game looking different in terms of just pure aesthetics (no animations or whatever)? Why is that such a bad thing?

[Maverick827]

Chris Priestly wrote...

Which image is "right"?

Trick question: they're aligned vertically.

[Lord_Valandil]

Brockololly wrote...

The problem I have with this whole "Oh, its just like comics changing artists!" argument is that comics like Batman often crap all over any sense of continuity when they change artists and that often times the change to a different artist is tied to either a standalone graphic novel or some other sort of retcon in the lore to reset things story wise. Such that the new art style reflects the themes in the redesigned world.

So unless the continuity of the world is being tossed in the trash can for DA2, the shift in visual style isn't like a comic getting a new artist, it would be like reading one graphic novel and turning the page to the next chapter only to have a new artist doing all the art, with things and characters you grew to recognize completely changed.

And that lack of visual consistency is annoying as hell.

This.

[Saibh]

Chris Priestly wrote...

This is a Batman image drawn by artist Jim Lee.
[snip]
This is a Batman image drawn by Sam Kieth.
[snip]

Which image is "right"?

Honestly, I don't like the comparison. Comic book artists are individual people whose individual flair is a part of what draws people to comics. What looks okay for the style of, say, New Mutants might not have looked alright for The Sandman.

It'd be difficult for them to be consistent, anyway--a comic book colored by different people but penciled and inked by the same guy can look pretty different in style and mood.

Besides that, both of those Batmans share pretty common attributes. It's not the same as a visual overhaul. If people were complaining that updating the character morph system so that past characters didn't share the same exact art style, then I could see where you're coming from. But Batman (usually) stays pretty consistent with appearance and style.

Modifié par Saibh, 04 novembre 2010 - 11:49 .

[Kaiser Shepard]

Maverick827 wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Which image is "right"?

Trick question: they're aligned vertically.

Well played.

[Ympulse]

yukidama wrote...

Honest question- What's the problem with the game looking different in terms of just pure aesthetics (no animations or whatever)? Why is that such a bad thing?

Some of us (myself included) prefer the grittier low-fantasy that DA:O presented. Where Flemeth was a bat**** insane old woman that was scary as hell because you just don't Know what she was capable of.

If I wanted Flemeth the Demigod to turn into a mid-30s cougar dragonthing with WoW-prostitute armor...

Modifié par Ympulse, 04 novembre 2010 - 11:51 .

[KhorinShizucor]

What I do agree with some posters here is that there IS a lack of continuity. However, I think the artists and developers are still trying to shape the franchise's own image. To me, the DA franchise is like a teenager trying to find out what it's true identity is. By DAIII, I hope they've developed the final visual style.



Instead of citing comic examples, how about cite examples of actual RPG games that have been given visual changes?

[Anarya]

Brockololly wrote...

The problem I have with this whole "Oh, its just like comics changing artists!" argument is that comics like Batman often crap all over any sense of continuity when they change artists and that often times the change to a different artist is tied to either a standalone graphic novel or some other sort of retcon in the lore to reset things story wise. Such that the new art style reflects the themes in the redesigned world.

So unless the continuity of the world is being tossed in the trash can for DA2, the shift in visual style isn't like a comic getting a new artist, it would be like reading one graphic novel and turning the page to the next chapter only to have a new artist doing all the art, with things and characters you grew to recognize completely changed.

And that lack of visual consistency is annoying as hell.

I really don't think that's the point of that particular analogy. Superhero comics are a whole other can of worms and the way they treat lore continuity is both unique to the superhero comic genre and not necessarily tied to artist changes. There's plenty of comics that switch artists without also changing all the lore around when they do so, but they tend to be the ones that started in the 80s and onward.

Also you might find the lack of consistency annoying but I and many others like seeing how different people interpret and reimagine things that I'm familiar with.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Maverick827 wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Which image is "right"?

Trick question: they're aligned vertically.

Well played.

Not really, last I checked Dragon Age wasn't a comic book, isn't getting a lore/continuity reset aside from visually and I'd imagine most of the art team is pretty much the same.

Its comparing apples to oranges and totally fail.

They've essenitally changed the art style for the sake of changing the art style to look more "WoW/Cartoon/Actiony" thinking somehow it'll sell more copies. .

[Lord_Valandil]

Saibh wrote...
Besides that, both of those Batmans share pretty common attributes. It's not the same as a visual overhaul. If people were complaining that updating the character morph system so that past characters didn't share the same exact art style, then I could see where you're coming from. But Batman (usually) stays pretty consistent with appearance and style.

Exactly, Saibh. Batman still wears a black mask and cloak.
It's not like he suddenly became pink, or grew horns or something like that. The style is different, but the character remains mostly the same.

[mellifera]

Ympulse wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Honest question- What's the problem with the game looking different in terms of just pure aesthetics (no animations or whatever)? Why is that such a bad thing?

Some of us (myself included) prefer the grittier low-fantasy that DA:O presented. Where Flemeth was a bat**** insane old woman that was scary as hell because you just don't Know what she was capable of.

If I wanted Flemeth the Demigod to turn into a mid-30s cougar dragonthing with WoW-prostitute armor...

So the reason is because you liked the old style? A matter of preference, then. I don't see how it affects continuity aside from how we as the player see the environments and characters (visually, not how we percieve them to be). It doesn't really affect the actual story which is about a (mostly) completely different set of people and events.

Modifié par yukidama, 04 novembre 2010 - 11:56 .

[Fishy]

Let's say the old art direction was the new art direction and the new art direction was the old art direction.Would it be a regression or a progression?

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

The new art direction is what has kept my interest in the series. I don't know if I'd be here eagerly anticipating the sequel if it was the same style, excellent story or no.



Maybe the details went over my head because I played it on the console but I see a lot of dragons, and I see a LOT of ugly faced grunt guys in scrappy armor, and I see a lot of European fantasy type stuff, but in this new style it all stands out and I don't have to squint at it to see that it's unique.

[Dave of Canada]

I'd much prefer visual retcons that give a unique spin on the world than having everybody look a human. Hell, the Qunari explanation isn't that half bad considering we've seen like... 5 in all the game.

[Fortlowe]

Pseudocognition wrote...

The new art direction is what has kept my interest in the series. I don't know if I'd be here eagerly anticipating the sequel if it was the same style, excellent story or no.

Maybe the details went over my head because I played it on the console but I see a lot of dragons, and I see a LOT of ugly faced grunt guys in scrappy armor, and I see a lot of European fantasy type stuff, but in this new style it all stands out and I don't have to squint at it to see that it's unique.

^Definitely This.

[mellifera]

Suprez30 wrote...

Let's say the old art direction was the new art direction and the new art direction was the old art direction.Would it be a regression or a progression?

Regression.

[Dave of Canada]

Suprez30 wrote...

Let's say the old art direction was the new art direction and the new art direction was the old art direction.Would it be a regression or a progression?

Regression.

"omfg why the hell do darkspawn look like zombies?"
"why do ogres have horns when qunari don't?"
"why does everybody look like a human?!"

[the_one_54321]

Fortlowe wrote...

Pseudocognition wrote...
The new art direction is what has kept my interest in the series. I don't know if I'd be here eagerly anticipating the sequel if it was the same style, excellent story or no.

Maybe the details went over my head because I played it on the console but I see a lot of dragons, and I see a LOT of ugly faced grunt guys in scrappy armor, and I see a lot of European fantasy type stuff, but in this new style it all stands out and I don't have to squint at it to see that it's unique.

^Definitely This.

That is the strangest motivation to play a video game I have ever heard of. Even stranger than Sylvius' RP desires.

You're entitled to it, of course. But it still makes me go

[Raycer X]

I don't mind the art style change. But the change in the Darkspawns' character art... Blasphemy!

[Lord_Valandil]

I'm not against change. In fact, I really love the new designs of the Darkspawn. And Flemeth.
Even Isabela, I really like her new look.

Though I won't deny that possible -big- changes made to the other Origins characters may annoy me.

Modifié par Lord_Valandil, 04 novembre 2010 - 11:59 .

[Nerevar-as]

Ympulse wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Honest question- What's the problem with the game looking different in terms of just pure aesthetics (no animations or whatever)? Why is that such a bad thing?

Some of us (myself included) prefer the grittier low-fantasy that DA:O presented. Where Flemeth was a bat**** insane old woman that was scary as hell because you just don't Know what she was capable of.

If I wanted Flemeth the Demigod to turn into a mid-30s cougar dragonthing with WoW-prostitute armor...

If she wants to cause a strong first impression to Hawke, old looks wouldn´t really work. I´m concerned in how visuals will affect game atmosphere. What little dark fantasy there was in Origins atmosphere may be gone with the new style, but backgrounds still look bleak where appropiate. Also depends on music, hope they won´t go heavy mithril with the soundtrack.

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

the_one_54321 wrote...
That is the strangest motivation to play a video game I have ever heard of. Even stranger than Sylvius' RP desires.

You're entitled to it, of course. But it still makes me go

Uh, artist here, lol. I play games to have fun and also to get inspired 8D

Modifié par Pseudocognition, 05 novembre 2010 - 12:56 .

[Anarya]

Honestly the first time I fired up Origins with absolutely zero knowledge of the game beforehand, my first thought was "this looks really generic". I'm honestly not too sure what kept me playing long enough for the story to hook me. I mean, I'm glad I stuck with it but from where I'm standing the new art direction is a big improvement.

[Dave of Canada]

I thought Qunari was a term for just another people (instead of species) when Sten was talking about them.