1080 réponses à ce sujet

[Onyx Jaguar]

I find it strange that my thoughts in the old thread might actually be what is happening in a way, except a little bit nerfed a bit

Onyx Jaguar wrote...



I'd prefer a combination of the two. The first ME did this somewhat with regards to Garrus, Tali and Wrex. I personally like the outfits in ME 2 better but I wish there was more variety and a chance to put them in armor. Pretty much only Jack and Miranda have outfits that looked different (all including theirs pretty much palette swaps). In that regard Garrus and Legion were especially disappointing.



I personally wish that they would allow the DL outfits avaiable for other crewmembers.

But I will say that in DA it would have been neat if all of the characters had a default outfit like Morrigan, but the options were better in DA than ME 2. With regards to the overall character model quality? ME 2 destroys DA.



One thing that DA did a little bit of (that ME did slightly) was have different looking armor depending on who was wearing it (Male v Female, another example would be Heavy Chainmail and how it looks on a Human V Elf, same with robes). An extension to that could be character specific, or have other character traits show in their clothing that would differ from the default.

Somewhere in there I also mention the individuality of the models being important and kind of a comparison of how many different model types for each system. Basically 8 X 1 + 2 X 2 in Vanilla ME 2, and the whole tiers in DA. Male Female, and races so on that a bass 2 X 3 per model in a way (however with slight differentials).



I would almost be completely ok with it if the number of models were the same or increased relevant to the number in DA, but had more individuality because the player models themselves were different. But in DA:O you still had the whole 2 by 3 thing to deal with so that is a hard thing to reconcile.

[Bann Duncan]

Rawgrim wrote...

I wonder what happened to "the spiritual successor to Baldur`s Gate"...

I don't understand what this complaint is. In Baldur's Gate, no matter what you had equipped, you looked like a half-naked stick figure with a shiny stick in hand.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Yeah but you could imagine looking like a badass

[tmp7704]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Er.. you said chessmaster. That's rating class for chess. You're unlikely to meet one outside of a tournament and unless you're paying them for a tutorial, they're not going to sit around while you figure out how to move your pawns.

Since the discussion already devolved into petty argument over semantics, i feel at ease to point out "chess master" can also mean someone who simply plays chess with consummate skill. That it also happens to be used in organized chess plays doesn't necessarily mean the OP had to have that particular interpretation on mind.

Replace "chess master" with "person who is really good at playing chess" and see if you can argue his actual point instead?

[Aermas]

I don't see what is so different between wearing a good set of armor to adventure in five years down the road. This doesn't mean you wore it every day, it's just the best armor the character has & so is still using it

[Onyx Jaguar]

What if I don't play chess as it lacks sonic stimulation

[upsettingshorts]

tmp7704 wrote...

Replace "chess master" with "person who is really good at playing chess" and see if you can argue his actual point instead?

His actual point was in rebuttal to my point which was to refute a random comment.  And none of it was on topic.  So yeah, we should probably just let it go.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 06 novembre 2010 - 05:56 .

[Saibh]

tmp7704 wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Er.. you said chessmaster. That's rating class for chess. You're unlikely to meet one outside of a tournament and unless you're paying them for a tutorial, they're not going to sit around while you figure out how to move your pawns.

Since the discussion already devolved into petty argument over semantics, i feel at ease to point out "chess master" can also mean someone who simply plays chess with consummate skill. That it also happens to be used in organized chess plays doesn't necessarily mean the OP had to have that particular interpretation on mind.

Replace "chess master" with "person who is really good at playing chess" and see if you can argue his actual point instead?

But I can see where Maria would think he's talking about tournaments, if that's how she uses and hears that term exclusively. I don't think either is wrong.

[Aermas]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

What if I don't play chess as it lacks sonic stimulation

Add sound effects yourself or have a friend narrate in the voice of Morgen Freeman

[tmp7704]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I do wonder precisely what is meant by the hints of additional outfits.  Do they work like loyalty sets?  Are they different?  What's the deal?

From Mr.Laidlaw's clarification early in this thread:

Some may [change visually] but that is more the exception rather than the rule. Their equipment, however, will evolve over time from a statistical point of view, as will your access to upgrades. Apologies for the confusion.

http://social.biowar...92&lf=8#5179306

edit: so it seems you're getting for the most part the same item but at different "material tier" so with slightly better stats, additional rune slots etc.

Modifié par tmp7704, 06 novembre 2010 - 05:59 .

[errant_knight]

Bann Duncan wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

I wonder what happened to "the spiritual successor to Baldur`s Gate"...

I don't understand what this complaint is. In Baldur's Gate, no matter what you had equipped, you looked like a half-naked stick figure with a shiny stick in hand.

Hell, at this point, I'd be happy if it was a spiritual successor to Dragon Age: Origins. I simply don't understand why they're throwing away so much of a VERY sucessful game.

[upsettingshorts]

filaminstrel wrote...

Well Mr. Laidlaw said having their equipment visually change would be "more the exception rather than the rule." It would be kind of strange if only a few of them got loyalty outfits, so I'm not sure what that would mean, really. Stealth mission, maybe?

It could just be "Carver gets proper armor if he makes it to Kirkwall"

Mike Laidlaw said...

Some may [change visually] but that is more the exception rather than the rule. Their equipment, however, will evolve over time from a statistical point of view, as will your access to upgrades. Apologies for the confusion.

I remember that, but I'm fishing for an example.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 06 novembre 2010 - 06:00 .

[Maria Caliban]

MerinTB wrote...

And had I made a comparison to playing basketball with a pro-athlete, you'd have wanted there to be a time clock or some kind of payment to get a professional player to play with a novice, right?

If you had said "there's no time limit in football," I'd have said "professional football has time limits." It's true that while you're with your buddies playing in the backyard, you can ignore that time limit, but in a casual setting, you can ignore *any* rule of football.

Likewise, you could play a casual game of baseball where you ignore strikes completely and people get to swing until they manage to hit. I would object to you saying "strikes don't matter in baseball."

You do realize that you aren't addressing the argument, you are trying to pick apart words I used instead of dealing with the overall concepts?

I'm not addressing your argument because I have no idea what it is what you're arguing, haven't read your posts, and am not interested in the conversation you're having with UpsetPants.

...it would appear to me that I have a stance you disagree with...

You might. I wouldn't know. I was scrolling and notice you said that if you played against a chessmaster you wouldn't have a time limit. It occurred to me that you didn't know about the time limit in professional chess.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 06 novembre 2010 - 06:01 .

[Meltemph]

 The whole point of party based CRPG's is to represent that "tabletop" experience in a single player setting.

Pen & Paper table top RPGs =! Computer RPG's.

[Onyx Jaguar]

tmp7704 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I do wonder precisely what is meant by the hints of additional outfits.  Do they work like loyalty sets?  Are they different?  What's the deal?

From Mr.Laidlaw's clarification early in this thread:

Some may [change visually] but that is more the exception rather than the rule. Their equipment, however, will evolve over time from a statistical point of view, as will your access to upgrades. Apologies for the confusion.

http://social.biowar...92&lf=8#5179306

wtf Bioware games are turning into Suikoden

[pizoxuat]

Well, this is the first news about DA2 that kind of bums me out. It's not a deal breaker, but I did hate ME2 not letting me change the way my companions look except for loyalty armors. If there are about 5-6 distinct different looks per companion, that would be enough to satiate my desire to play dress up.

Modifié par pizoxuat, 06 novembre 2010 - 06:01 .

[tmp7704]

pizoxuat wrote...

 If there are about 5-6 distinct different looks per companion

Given there was 6-8 distinct armour meshes (with few reskins each) per entire DAO... well.

[AlanC9]

MerinTB wrote...

David Gaider wrote...
It's not as bad as some make it out to be, but with any change you're going to encounter the most opposition (or, at least, trepidation) amongst those who are most invested in having everything remain exactly the same.

It comes across as very dismissive when it seems like you are trying to backhandidly downplay complaints as coming only from people who wanted everything to remain the same.

But the specific complaints we're getting in this thread are about people wanting things to stay the same. Should DG have been responding to other complaints from some other thread?

[Maria Caliban]

tmp7704 wrote...

...see if you can argue his actual point instead?

I have no interest in arguing with him. I just wanted him to know that, yes, there's a time limit in chess.

Seriously, this is the conversation from my perspective.

UpsetPants: Blah, blah, blah, blah, Sean Connery was the sexiest Bond.
Other Dude: Daniel Craig is sexier. blah, blah, blah.
Maria: *scrolls*
UP: Argument about movies
Other Dude: Argument about movies
Maria: *scrolls* *next page*
UP: Gophers are awesome! Blah, blah, blah
Other Dude: Blah, blah, blah. Chipmunks ate my cat!
Maria: *scrolls*
OD: Blah, blah, blah. Alligators live in New York sewers. blah, blah
Maria: No, there are no alligators in the NYC sewers.
OD: Strawman! Did I say NYC? No. I meant New York, Florida.
Maria: The hell?
OD: If you're going to argue that Martians haven't invaded Washington, I demand you do so and stop talking about alligators.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 06 novembre 2010 - 06:21 .

[MerinTB]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
Flight sim players are still here. The games are dead, they don't get made anymore. They're stuck playing modded versions of decade-old games.  If you can't see the parallels I'm drawing, you've got blinders on.

http://www.microsoft.../games/flight/ - "Microsoft Flight" is a new PC game from Microsoft Game Studios.

http://www.combatsim.com/ - Apache: Air Assault is a new combat flight simulation game based on the Apache AH-64D Longbow attack helicopter.

Yeah, no game franchise is truly as dead as everyone likes to make them out to be.
Just because Wii's motion sensor games outsell FPS games like 5 to 1 sometimes doesn't make FPS games dead.
Because another game genre sells more doesn't make one that sells less dead.

People said adventure games were dead nearly 20 years ago... and yet we still get stuff like Still Life 2.  Go figure.

As for "party based" RPGs, ignoring BioWare:

you dismiss, out of hand, all JRPGs I assume?
or do you mean "design your whole party yourself" RPGs?
NWN2 isn't that old yet.
Avernum 6 came out last year.
Silent Storm series had it's last game in 2005 so it's a bit older.
There are more...

You want a "dead" sub-genre?  How about Bard's Tale style?  No one would make, let alone sell, a game like that anymore!
http://www.devilwhiskey.com/


So, perhaps tone down "dead" and say instead "niche" or "not as popular as the best selling genres" or some such.

Text adventures aren't even dead.

Edit: I don't see how the overall conclusion is even controversial, I'm reframing the same "DA:2 was supposed to be like DA:O which was supposed to be like Baldur's Gate, but they're not so I'm screwed" arguments I read all the time.  Are you guys saying those arguments aren't accurate representations of how you feel?  If not, I'll gladly re-examine my position.

Which guys?  Some might want something closer to BG2.  I don't.

I could list what I really want, but neither BG2 nor DA:O (nor any BioWare RPG, for that matter) comes close.
We all compromise our ideals for what we can get.
Just for some DA2 seems to be asking for too many "let go of this" to gain too many "this is awesome" that they don't actually find awesome at all.

---

And this isn't directed at you, Upsettingshorts, so don't take offense - I'm posting too many responses and just wanted to slip this in -

not ever cRPG fan thinks PST was the greatest game ever (or Deus Ex for that matter) - some of us (myself in particular) couldn't even get that far into PST on multiple tries.

[pizoxuat]

tmp7704 wrote...

pizoxuat wrote...

 If there are about 5-6 distinct different looks per companion

Given there was 6-8 distinct armour meshes (with few reskins each) per entire DAO... well.

Yeah, the lack of variety for my rogue was one of my complaints in DAO.  I didn't care enough to pump up her strength to get access to better looking stuff, though.

[Onyx Jaguar]

Technically Wizardry-esque games and Roguelikes are still being made and do fine in Japan

[tmp7704]

AlanC9 wrote...

But the specific complaints we're getting in this thread are about people wanting things to stay the same. Should DG have been responding to other complaints from some other thread?

But people voicing their complaints in this thread do that regarding a single matter they'd prefer to stay unchanged -- companion equipment. It was somewhat disingenous to try and present it as if the complaints were coming from people pushing for everything in the game remain unchanged.

[pizoxuat]

MerinTB wrote...

You want a "dead" sub-genre?  How about Bard's Tale style?  No one would make, let alone sell, a game like that anymore!
http://www.devilwhiskey.com/

Oh my god, how can you mention this genre and not mention Etrian Odyssey?  I can understand having missed The Dark Tower, but the EO series is pretty well established, considering the niche nature of the genre.