611 réponses à ce sujet

[soteria]

I've never thought of Jane Austen's works as romantic comedies but I understand why others might. I suppose it's the difference between a love story and a story with love in it? Totally personal viewpoint.

I call them that mostly because I don't consider "classic" to be a genre. I guess I could just call her books "novels" but that's pretty vague anymore. When translated to film, Emma at least seems to fit pretty squarely into "romantic comedy." What do you call them?

Would you consider something like Wilde's The Importance of Being Ernest as a romantic comedy?

Thanks for reminding me of that play; I haven't read it since high school. Not really, though. It's a hilarious satire of romance--there's really no actual romance in it, is there? Austen gets pretty snarky at times, but her books do have that "awww" factor that makes you smile without laughing.

Back on topic:

As a man, I would just say I'll be disappointed if all the women are sized "boobtastic."  I just don't find it particularly attractive, and it looks ridiculous when all the women look like that.  Other than not caring for the look, it would make me think the game is being targeted at teenagers.  A few women like that are fine.

Modifié par soteria, 06 novembre 2010 - 10:02 .

[Dundalis]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Aermas wrote...
Put on full football gear & a full school backpack, that's about what they carry

Football pads - even the helmet - are pretty light, especially when compared with military grade body armor and a helmet.

Saibh wrote...

This makes me want to pull out that comparion shot between Bethany, Ivy Valentine and Pamela Anderson that indicated that Bethany had a larger bust and a much smaller waist than Pamela, and was at least the same proportion as Ivy Valentine. If you really want me to get it, I will. The female body model is drastically disproportionate.

I maintain Bethany looks basically like she has Diora Baird's build.  (Mildly NSFW link)  That being said, the idea of every woman in a fictional universe looking similar to an outlier like Diora is pretty absurd and quite obviously fanservice.

I have to agree with this in terms of some people saying that girls simply do NOT EXIST that are seemingly that disproportionate. They are rare, but to say they do not exist is incorrect. Diora is a prime example of a woman whom naturally has ginormous mammory glands with quite a petite skeletal structure. In fact for anyone that's seen her sans clothing in a pictorial, it is quite difficult to believe they are real.

See here:



While I do find Diora's body attractive, it's more in an exotic way, I prefer a girl particularly one as well endowed as that to have larger hips and thighs. And I prefer girls more in the range of C to D, DD are ok if the female is proportionate, but anything bigger is generally not attractive to me, the same for girls in the A cup range or really skinny. Plus I hate the boobs that have an unnatural upturned look, or are gravity defying, which seems to perpetuate games more and more, particularly some of the nude mods being made. They look stupid.

So while it may be that the big breasted skinny hipped female is what is attractive to males, it doesn't apply to this male, or most other males I know. It mostly looks stupid, and don't get what the attraction is at all. The Beyonce/JLo body shape is where it's at for me. Even Kim Kardashian, although she's is probably right on the high end limit of my tastes. Should be more girls in video games that are similarly shaped. It also makes more sense to have a girls with bigger hips and thighs be a warrior or fighting character. While the picture of Chun Li posted is unrealistic, I quite dig the big toned thighs (obvously I'd be a bit scared if I saw a female with thighs that big irl), and if the boobs were smaller, I wouldn't mind it at all. And it fits with the type of character she is supposed to be.

Modifié par Dundalis, 06 novembre 2010 - 10:54 .

[upsettingshorts]

I don't think the objection boils down to "women like that don't exist" but that they shouldn't be used as the model for every woman in the game.

[Dundalis]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I don't think the objection boils down to "women like that don't exist" but that they shouldn't be used as the model for every woman in the game.

I was responding more posts that were saying it was completely unrealistic to have a body with those dimensions, one of them giving a comparison to Pamela Anderson, and basically saying it's not physiologically possible.

I agree having them as the model for everyone in the game is unrealistic, but then isn't that more a engine limitation, whatever base model is used is likely to be the same for all. Unless they want to go down the route of providing a unique body type for every single different character in the game. I'm no programmer though, so I got no idea if that's feasible.

[Maria Caliban]

I like the smaller bust. Though it makes me wonder why your sister is running around fighting darkspawn with a plunging neckline. She's wearing chain armor of some sort. Is it part of her 'character?'

I just noticed her shoulders look high. I assume this is because female warriors in heavy and massive armor need the extra space between their arm and torso.

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

I vote for Stanley Woo as the model for the next female character body mesh.


Actually I think the best generic female body mesh was in ME. FemShep didn't look like some rediculous Barbie doll or like a man. She looked like a soldier who was used to an active lifestyle and the body proportions were logical (unlike the hand/shoulder/breast proportions in DA:O).

Of course, what would solve all of this is if Bioware developed sliders for height and girth like the system Obsidian threw into NWN 2. I understand that the models used in DA's engine supposedly won't allow for size scaling for some reason...so it might take alot of work to impliment. One day I would love to see a Bioware game with an excellent character face morph system like they have in DA:O combined with a  body morph system to adjust the skeletal structure of our PCs in nearly every aspect. Some MMORPG  from the last two years (Aion?) seemed to have one along those lines. Despite my disdain for MMORPGS, the character creation looked pretty awesome.

[Ziggeh]

I think a lot of this discussion has lost sight of the context somewhat.

It's a fantasy, and as such they are trying to create heightened and exaggerated imagery. People wield weapons that their muscular structure wouldn't actually be able to support, because it enhances their image as a powerful and dangerous warrior. It provides at a glance the knowledge that this person is to be considered a bad ass, without having to prove it. Similarly, unrealistically enlarged breasts are an instant and easy way to get across that this is a sexualised character, this is someone who they would like you to consider in a sexual manner.

It has very little to do with what body type we individually find realistic or attractive, it's just a part of the visual language available to the art department. A language we've all learnt through exposure to all forms of media. They're broad strokes that cover a thousand words on the topic, and yes, it could be done more subtlety, but it couldn't be done as quickly or effectively.

Now, there is the issue that this simply helps perpetuate the unrealistic cultural female body image, but really that horse left the barn quite some time ago. I have my own theories on how you could combat the pre existing image, I won't bore you but suffice to say, denying it is the wrong way to go.

And I completely understand the idea that such exaggeration might decrease ones sense of identification and empathy with the character, but again, I'm not sure that really holds a good deal of weight in a world in which you can choose to play as a cave dwelling midget who rocks a phallic symbol that's taller than himself.

Modifié par ziggehunderslash, 06 novembre 2010 - 03:43 .

[Siegdrifa]

Yenaquai wrote...


Thoughts?

I prefer the retouched one.
They look more natural and at the same time still very sexy generous for woman standard, when i was in Art School we drew nude woman model every week, and their real anatomy is far from "game an magasin" standard .

But when i see how many guy like big breast and too small stomac / ribcage, i'm part of a minority i guess.

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

@Yenaquai: Daw~ she looks much more sister-y and healthy. Nicely retouched, as well, looks like you know your way around Photoshop.

Whether it does anything, it's good that this discussion is being had, methinks.

Modifié par Pseudocognition, 06 novembre 2010 - 04:12 .

[tmp7704]

Jayce F wrote...

True. Seige warfare was the norm for the most part.

Wouldn't that mean for the most part combat was performed on foot rather than from horse's back? There isn't much room for horse charges and skewering people with lances during that. 
 

by the fourteenth century, it was common for knights to dismount to fight[/b].[30] Horses were sent to the rear, and kept ready for pursuit.[31]

I'd disagree with this statement. Foot combat became more common due to the use of pikemen and longbows plate armour evolved in response to the rise of these weapons indeed, even a 120lb draw weight longbow couldn't penetrate plate at anything over 20 yards.

Well, that's not really disagreement, is it? You are explaining why the foot combat became more common, but that doesn't exactly counter the statement that fighting on foot did in fact become practiced.

Thats pretty poorly worded by whoever wrote that on wikipedia. by the 17th century plate mail had been rendered obsolete because of firearms and just how impractical it could be to wear.

It's probably because the article focuses specifically on use of horse during the medieval period. So it doesn't delve into other aspects beyond what seems necessary.

I'd disagree due to the points raised above. By the 17th century, cavarly rarely wore more armour than a cuirass (breast plate) and god help you if you sugested to a cavalryman that he should dismount!

Well, obviously what's happening in 17th century doesn't exactly applies to our discussion. But you didn't really raise any true objections regarding the existenec and frequency of armoured foot combat in the earlier period, i.e. the one where people would be using their plate armour. So... dunno.

anyway, the topic seems to have moved on meantime to posting interesting looking pictures, so going to let my lack of attention span take over, and drop it

[Cutlasskiwi]

@Yenaquai - great job with the retouch. It looks so much more natural than the original picture. And like Pseudo said, she looks more healthy now

[SaberBloodwork]

Yenaquai wrote...




Thoughts?

it looks MUCH better than the first picture. She seems healthier, still very attractive
and certainly more believable. I wish BW took your route instead of following
what other games are doing to the female characters’ models.

Modifié par SaberBloodwork, 06 novembre 2010 - 04:39 .

[Mike Laidlaw]

SaberBloodwork wrote...

Yenaquai wrote...




Thoughts?

it looks MUCH better than the first picture. She seems healthier, still very attractive
and certainly more believable. I wish BW took your route instead of following
what other games are doing to the female characters’ models.

Just to drop in here, I find it interesting that no one ever stops to wonder if, perhaps, Varric were prone to exaggerating more than just facts about Hawke...

I suppose time will tell, but there might be a few surprises in store for the keen of eye.

[tmp7704]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

Just to drop in here, I find it interesting that no one ever stops to wonder if, perhaps, Varric were prone to exaggerating more than just facts about Hawke...

People did wonder actually, but since developers in general choose not to provide any straightforward insight into these threads that's all we're left with -- speculations based on very limited footage.

edit: but in any case, doesn't this particular outfit show during the non-exaggerated part of Varric's narration? The exaggerated part seems to have Bethany in fancy robes which funnily enough make her bust seem slightly smaller, not bigger.

Modifié par tmp7704, 06 novembre 2010 - 05:00 .

[Clover Rider]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

SaberBloodwork wrote...

Yenaquai wrote...




Thoughts?

it looks MUCH better than the first picture. She seems healthier, still very attractive
and certainly more believable. I wish BW took your route instead of following
what other games are doing to the female characters’ models.

Just to drop in here, I find it interesting that no one ever stops to wonder if, perhaps, Varric were prone to exaggerating more than just facts about Hawke...

I suppose time will tell, but there might be a few surprises in store for the keen of eye.

Cause with a keen eye for details...One truth will prevail!  .

[Kaiser Shepard]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

Just to drop in here, I find it interesting that no one ever stops to wonder if, perhaps, Varric were prone to exaggerating more than just facts about Hawke...

I suppose time will tell, but there might be a few surprises in store for the keen of eye.

Bethany's  "size" wll change depending on the narrator?

[Pseudo the Mustachioed]

Curse you Varric!

[slimgrin]

SaberBloodwork wrote...

Yenaquai wrote...




Thoughts?

it looks MUCH better than the first picture. She seems healthier, still very attractive
and certainly more believable. I wish BW took your route instead of following
what other games are doing to the female characters’ models.

Second one looks malnourished, decadent, and boring. Not only her looks, but her character has suffered as well. I'm glad Bioware has their priorities together.

Edit: just read Laidlaw's post. Looks like the agenda for anemic figures has won. 

Beginning not to like the whole exaggeration bit.

Modifié par slimgrin, 06 novembre 2010 - 05:10 .

[soteria]

Just to drop in here, I find it interesting that no one ever stops to wonder if, perhaps, Varric were prone to exaggerating more than just facts about Hawke...

I considered it, and I've seen others suggest it, but I didn't really buy it. I'm not accusing you of lying, it just seems... well... surprising. I guess that would be a commentary on Varric, if anything.