128 réponses à ce sujet

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Maria Caliban wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

I would think this is a problem to be rectified.

The problem is the 'fans.' There is information out there, but it's buried under threads and threads of complaining and jumping to conclusions.

You want to know what the gameplay of DA II is?

Start up DA:O, play it. If you play in bird's eye view, zoom in a bit. Enter combat. Make the animations faster and add a bunch of new ones. These new ones will be 'awesome' and unrealistic. There will be lots of glowing things for the warrior and rogue.

Now end combat and talk to someone. A dialogue wheel pops up instead of a list. Pick an option - your PC says it aloud.

Now open your inventory screen. Try to take Alister's clothing off. You can't. Weapons, amulets, rings, and belts can be changes on a companion, but not the armor/clothing.

There, that's the gameplay. The same but with the above changes.

Basically they turned Origins into a piece of **** console action game.

[Maconbar]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

I would think this is a problem to be rectified.

The problem is the 'fans.' There is information out there, but it's buried under threads and threads of complaining and jumping to conclusions.

You want to know what the gameplay of DA II is?

Start up DA:O, play it. If you play in bird's eye view, zoom in a bit. Enter combat. Make the animations faster and add a bunch of new ones. These new ones will be 'awesome' and unrealistic. There will be lots of glowing things for the warrior and rogue.

Now end combat and talk to someone. A dialogue wheel pops up instead of a list. Pick an option - your PC says it aloud.

Now open your inventory screen. Try to take Alister's clothing off. You can't. Weapons, amulets, rings, and belts can be changes on a companion, but not the armor/clothing.

There, that's the gameplay. The same but with the above changes.

Basically they turned Origins into a piece of **** console action game.

Yippie!!

[Brockololly]

I feel like the Rent is Too Damn High guy, but I'll say it again:

The best marketing for a game is to just show off the damn gameplay, maybe with some insightful commentary or narration from the devs. Just show some damn PC gameplay walkthrough videos, that would surely be better than the dozens of bootlegs out there now. Unless BioWare really believes in the whole "any attention is good attention" mantra.

[upsettingshorts]

Brock, you should really just prepare a form post where you ask for a gameplay video. I mean, for your own sake. You can just paste it whenever it comes up in a thread. I mean, I would.

[Marionetten]

Maria Caliban wrote...



Try to take Alister's clothing off. You can't.

Deal breaker right here.

[slimgrin]

Brockololly wrote...

I feel like the Rent is Too Damn High guy, but I'll say it again:

The best marketing for a game is to just show off the damn gameplay, maybe with some insightful commentary or narration from the devs. Just show some damn PC gameplay walkthrough videos, that would surely be better than the dozens of bootlegs out there now. Unless BioWare really believes in the whole "any attention is good attention" mantra.

They aren't showing it cause its not ready to show. My theory.

[Malevolence65]

Here's what I think Bioware should do. They should do 2 walkthrough videos of the start of the game. One with a male warrior Hawke, the other with a female rogue Hawke. No commentary. We should also be able to hear the voices, sounds, and music.

[Marionetten]

Malevolence65 wrote...

Here's what I think Bioware should do. They should do 2 walkthrough videos of the start of the game. One with a male warrior Hawke, the other with a female rogue Hawke. No commentary. We should also be able to hear the voices, sounds, and music.

I miss the German walkthroughs we had for Dragon Age: Origins.

[Brockololly]

slimgrin wrote...
They aren't showing it cause its not ready to show. My theory.

That very well may be the case and thats fine. It is worrisome too, given what that one German PC magazine said after seeing the rather incomplete looking demo earlier this week- that the game as presented in London looked very very rough, even for a pre-release build, but yet there is only 4 months to go and no doubt they need to be done with the game before March. 

But it just gets back to the marketing then if thats the case- why announce a game in July,  hype up all these changes using bloated and loaded marketing buzzwords that only serve to get your "hardcore" fanbase all riled up and maintain a very vague mass market firendly message, except for the fact that the only people focusing on the game this early on are the more "hardcore" fans that want details? Is it just the whole "any attention is good attention" mantra? So even if you've proceeded to tick off a good number of people with vague changes, thats a good thing cause they're talking about the game?

Their marketing thus far has been catered for a mass market audience thats not even listening or aware of the game this early out. The only people listening are Origins fans or people that probably had an interest in Origins or BioWare. Its like politics- if you're a candidate running for the Presidency in the US, you start out trying to appeal to your core group of partisan supporters- you solidify your base. And its only after you've got a solid base and have won the primaries that you branch out and moderate your message for the general election when the more average, less partisan voters will start paying attention.And thats more or less how Origins worked- we had seen gameplay and RPG stuff before they went all mass market with the New ****/Sacred Ashes CG fluff.

Malevolence65 wrote...

Here's what I think Bioware should  do. They should do 2 walkthrough videos of the start of the game. One  with a male warrior Hawke, the other with a female rogue Hawke. No  commentary. We should also be able to hear the voices, sounds, and  music.

Thats what I've been saying like a broken record for months, buddy. Just like the ones they did for Origins back in October 2008 when Origins was slated to come out in March 2009.

Modifié par Brockololly, 07 novembre 2010 - 06:14 .

[MerinTB]

slimgrin wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

I feel like the Rent is Too Damn High guy, but I'll say it again:

The best marketing for a game is to just show off the damn gameplay, maybe with some insightful commentary or narration from the devs. Just show some damn PC gameplay walkthrough videos, that would surely be better than the dozens of bootlegs out there now. Unless BioWare really believes in the whole "any attention is good attention" mantra.

They aren't showing it cause its not ready to show. My theory.

That's what they say.  I think it's pretty universally accepted that they don't show it because it's not ready.

The question is - why isn't it ready?

They need to build up a sufficient "console version is kick-ass action awesomesauce fer realz" meme before any PC gameplay footage of different camera angles, tactical play and such might turn off console gamers?
The PC version is having problems, as in so much focus on the console versions that the PC version isn't working out?
The PC version is the port (despite what they say) and the port hasn't reached a level where showing it would be a positive for them?
Or they still haven't figured out a way to show the PC gameplay with enough spin to make it not look almost exactly like all the "actiony" console gameplay we've seen?

This question is what drives some of us bonkers, I'd wager.

[StingingVelvet]

----9----- wrote...

Part of the problem: everybody's definition of what an RPG is or is supposed to be, varies a lot.

After sifting through the various 'explanations' and attempted 'definitions' of what an RPG is supposed to be,  I'm not sure it can be pinned down easily because the RPGs keep evolving, as does the hardware. In the few games that I've played on both the PC and PS3, (DA:O is one) there's a difference in play between them, some subtle, some not.

I consider Dragon Age, Uncharted and Call of Duty, an RPG, yet they are vastly different games.

I don't have the opinion that anything with stats can be called an RPG, no.  The core gameplay of ME2 is shooting dudes and shooting dudes is based on reflexes, not dice rolls.  That's a shooter.  It has a lot of dialogue and you can choose to be an **** or not, but none of it effects the gameplay much.  I can tell the Illusive Man to screw off but next mission I'll still be doing what he tells me because the alternative is no more game, so the dialogue is not really RPG dialogue with choice ane consequence.  The world isn't really open, it's quite linear, you just get to choose which level to play when like a Megaman game.

I loved... repeat LOVED... Mass Effect 2.  It was a great, great shooter.  It was not what I would consider an RPG in any way.  I know some people disagree, that's their business.  That's why I said "not what I consider an RPG."

[My Mistake]

BW lock this thread............... lol

[StingingVelvet]

My Mistake wrote...

BW lock this thread............... lol

We are getting off-topic.

Again, the point of the thread is that supposedly the core gameplay in DA2 is the same as DA:O, yet this is not being made known or talked about in any detail.  Why is that?  Is it on purpose?  Are they scared of what the sales will be if people know the game is the same?  Why?

Etc. etc..

[My Mistake]

Because has any sequel to a game been the same as the first?

[StingingVelvet]

My Mistake wrote...

Because has any sequel to a game been the same as the first?

Debating that is even more off-topic.

Again, the question is why are they not informing people of the basic gameplay?

[My Mistake]

StingingVelvet wrote...

My Mistake wrote...

Because has any sequel to a game been the same as the first?

Debating that is even more off-topic.

Again, the question is why are they not informing people of the basic gameplay?

They are? I see Devs in the forums all the time making comments on gameplay.

[My Mistake]

As far as gameplay, they want people to get stoked and keep them stoked

[TheMufflon]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Basically they turned Origins into a piece of **** console action game.

You've never actually played a console action game, have you?

[Xeper84]

from the differences we know so far it certainly sounds to be closer to a console action game as it is to a group rpg game.

and sadly we have no information or video to think different

Modifié par Xeper84, 07 novembre 2010 - 07:03 .

[hexaligned]

In Exile wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...
My whole point was DON'T cluster people.  Don't assume the combat of DA:O was generally hated on consoles, maybe a bunch of them liked the more tactical combat DA:O brought to their Xbox or PS3.

You don't seem to get it. Tactical combat was broken on the console.

Seriously, it might not be so noticeable if you didn't play the PC version, but the game was just bad. Changing the combat has nothing to do with removing tactics; right now it's just about making it remotely playable.

[

Pretty much, having played both I have to say that in comparison the console version of DAO was just a cluncky ass mess.  I've said it before, I don't know how people managed to enjoy the game like that.  They obviously had to do SOMETHING for the console version.   I'm primarily a PC gamer, but I own a 360 and a  PS3, and do play and enjoy RPG's on them, so I don't think this is biased, but maybe it still is, but, combat in DAO on the console was about as bad as it gets for console gaming.  it felt like you were fighting the control scheme, bad UI, and cluncky responce time more than you were the enemies in the game.

How much they have changed regarding how the PC version plays we still don't know, other than the random offhanded dev responce.  Until we get some PC gameplay vids all we have to go on is this "beefed up" console version. 

To the console gamers out there who were hoping for more of the same, I think I would have been more dissapointed in Bioware as a developer if they HADN'T changed the console version.  If you want to play more slow paced tactical  RPG's buy a gaming rig, you got lucky with DAO, but that's obviously not happening again.

Modifié par relhart, 07 novembre 2010 - 07:39 .

[rexil]

Brockololly wrote...

Their marketing thus far has been catered for a mass market audience thats not even listening or aware of the game this early out. The only people listening are Origins fans or people that probably had an interest in Origins or BioWare. Its like politics- if you're a candidate running for the Presidency in the US, you start out trying to appeal to your core group of partisan supporters- you solidify your base. And its only after you've got a solid base and have won the primaries that you branch out and moderate your message for the general election when the more average, less partisan voters will start paying attention.And thats more or less how Origins worked- we had seen gameplay and RPG stuff before they went all mass market with the New ****/Sacred Ashes CG fluff.

As I see it they are not catering for a mass market at all, they are catering to they console ONLY fan base, showing that they improved what was bad in Origins on consoles. But they are completely ignoring about their PC fan base, we saw nothing, we get only some post by the Devs about how it will be the same as Origins but faster.

If the game is really just like Origins but faster, why they don't show something to us? And what happened with that tactical camera, last time I heard Mike was testing it... Did it get ditched? Have it got any improvements?
And don't tell me they recently released some screenshots from the PC GUI because it adds nothing new as it's just like the ones we already have saw on the leaked console gameplay.
It's fine for me to them show those highly needed changes for the consoles, but we PC gamers want to know the changes made on our side too. If the PC version is really being developed side by side with the consoles, there should be plenty of things to show and talk about.

[Luigitornado]

You can never please everybody. The best option Bioware has is to minimize disappointments while increasing the number of approvals.



No doubt this game will be fun, but the conservative fan-base will still look at any changes as being pointless, and therefore dismiss it.



Ironically, the conservative fan-base are the ones who will pay the most attention to any and all announcements about Dragon Age II. The question is: are they eager to learn more about the game because they are interested, or are they just scared that Bioware is making changes to a formula they are fond of?



"If it ain't broken, then don't fix it."



Sales could always be higher, so why release the same game twice?

[slimgrin]

Brockololly wrote...

Their marketing thus far has been catered for a mass market audience thats not even listening or aware of the game this early out. The only people listening are Origins fans or people that probably had an interest in Origins or BioWare. Its like politics- if you're a candidate running for the Presidency in the US, you start out trying to appeal to your core group of partisan supporters- you solidify your base. And its only after you've got a solid base and have won the primaries that you branch out and moderate your message for the general election when the more average, less partisan voters will start paying attention.And thats more or less how Origins worked- we had seen gameplay and RPG stuff before they went all mass market with the New ****/Sacred Ashes CG fluff.

It's hard to dismiss this argument, but if I had to, I'd say:

A. It really is a rush job and they are just doing a media blitz

or

B. they are marketing the game like most companies do now.


B seems more likely given Bioware's pedigree. It's not uncommon these days for theatrical vids and internet catch phrases to precede actual gameplay by months. I don't' like it either. Until I see official gameplay I'm not truly informed.

The exceptions are companies like Blizzard and CD Projekt, both of which had in-game screens and alpha vids out long before release dates were even announced. Hell, we don't even know if D3 will get here next year and there are loads of extended gamplay clips available.

Modifié par slimgrin, 07 novembre 2010 - 07:39 .

[ENolan]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

I would think this is a problem to be rectified.

The problem is the 'fans.' There is information out there, but it's buried under threads and threads of complaining and jumping to conclusions.

You want to know what the gameplay of DA II is?

Start up DA:O, play it. If you play in bird's eye view, zoom in a bit. Enter combat. Make the animations faster and add a bunch of new ones. These new ones will be 'awesome' and unrealistic. There will be lots of glowing things for the warrior and rogue.

Now end combat and talk to someone. A dialogue wheel pops up instead of a list. Pick an option - your PC says it aloud.

Now open your inventory screen. Try to take Alister's clothing off. You can't. Weapons, amulets, rings, and belts can be changes on a companion, but not the armor/clothing.

There, that's the gameplay. The same but with the above changes.

Basically they turned Origins into a piece of **** console action game.

I'm just checking with you to make sure the supposed 'anger' (I'm not sure what to call the emotion behind your occasional post) is based off of what is believed to be the departure from the gameplay style of DAO and not an opinion of action-oriented games. I can't tell to be honest.