346 réponses à ce sujet

[Sir JK]

Vankraft wrote...
I don't know if it was just the person playing the actual video game but I didn't see much with regards to tactics, it all looked very "hack'n'slash".

Exactly! And he lost 2/3 of his party because of it. In the equalient of Ostagar. In a demo (easiest or normal difficulty)!

[aaniadyen]

Sir JK wrote...

-Semper- wrote...

[

yes, but not as easily as in da2 - so it seems.

You clealry did not see me first time I met the ogre in the tower in Ishal:

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

I'm pretty much convinced that's the only way to do it on nightmare without resorting to cheating/bugs/spamming items.

[Khayness]

Sir JK wrote...

You clealry did not see me first time I met the ogre in the tower in Ishal:

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

Haha, that fight was funny at first attempt. The mage NPC overaggroed, my PC, Alistair as S&B warriors and Dog were running after it slashing its heels while I kited with the random mage NPC.

[-Semper-]

Sir JK wrote...

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

that works because there were comrades around yourself. your pc took the aggro and others shoot him to death. now only one char is needed to kite. wow, what a tactic

[Enshaid]

Sir JK wrote...

-Semper- wrote...

[

yes, but not as easily as in da2 - so it seems.

You clealry did not see me first time I met the ogre in the tower in Ishal:

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

This was my experience aswell. Except for me everyone but generic mage ended up dead and welll.... let's just say I have a pretty good idea of what was going through whoever was playing Bethany's head in that video.

Modifié par Freek on a Leesh, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:14 .

[tmp7704]

DId anyone else get a laugh out of what seems to be mama Hawke standing patiently in the middle of all the kiting, completely ignored by the darkspawn and apparently waiting for them to die so she can get on with her grand acting scene

[upsettingshorts]

-Semper- wrote...
that works because there were comrades around yourself. your pc took the aggro and others shoot him to death. now only one char is needed to kite. wow, what a tactic

...the comrades in the DA:2 video died...

Sir JK wrote...

Vankraft wrote...
I don't know
if it was just the person playing the actual video game but I didn't see
much with regards to tactics, it all looked very
"hack'n'slash".

Exactly! And he lost 2/3 of his party because of it. In the equalient of Ostagar. In a demo (easiest or normal difficulty)!

The thread title should literally be changed to "GUY TRIES TO PLAY DA:2 AS A HACK AND SLASH GAME, GETS MOST OF PARTY KILLED"

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:16 .

[-Semper-]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Strikes me as a situation that calls for tactics.

no. strikes for better programmed a.i.

[-Semper-]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

...the comrades in the DA:2 video died...

and that's the point! in da:o your mage alone was not able to run away and spam enemies to death because walking and hitting were seperated more drastically.

Modifié par -Semper-, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:17 .

[upsettingshorts]

-Semper- wrote...
no. strikes for better programmed a.i.

Could say the same about DA:O, or any other game, if you believe your companions should auto-win while you run off in circles. 

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:18 .

[aaniadyen]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

-Semper- wrote...
no. strikes for better programmed a.i.

Could say the same about DA:O, or any other game, if you believe your companions should auto-win while you run off in circles. 

Not to mention if you reload every time anyone dies it won't matter anyway...

[Sir JK]

-Semper- wrote...
that works because there were comrades around yourself. your pc took the aggro and others shoot him to death. now only one char is needed to kite. wow, what a tactic

You know... I once did it with a single archer in DAO just to prove I could (okay... not true. I managed to accidentally lose 3/4 of the team a couple of seconds in... still not sure what happened).... it took a while...

So kiting is he same here as it is in DAO. It's in fact a tactic I use fairly often to save my mages (run in circles until the tank piks up the aggro... keep running.... keep... running... Oh finally... no wait... sorry, he was just shuffling... keep running)

[Vankraft]

Sir JK wrote...

Vankraft wrote...
I don't know if it was just the person playing the actual video game but I didn't see much with regards to tactics, it all looked very "hack'n'slash".

Exactly! And he lost 2/3 of his party because of it. In the equalient of Ostagar. In a demo (easiest or normal difficulty)!

Yep, but you have to give he/she credit for their top notch dark spawn kiting skills, looks like they were probably used to using that as a viable tactic

[Xeper84]

I'am shocked it looks even worse than i thought it could be! As a huge fan of DA:O i can't see a lot of good stuff in this video.

1.Hack and slash the mage is just missing a dodge (like side roll) to make that Troll miss on his sprint attack^^ (gothic 4 anyone?)

2.saw like 3 spells and they fought against a troll so they shouldn't be @ lvl 1

3.Combat indicates that you have to press x for every attack

4.Graphics look like DA:O (i only know the pc version) except the enviroment looked like it's not yet there ^^

5.UI looks ... bad

[Brockololly]

tmp7704 wrote...

Don't know if i'd call them puppy eyes but yes, thet do appear to be damaging her image...

My lord- seriously, does any human being on earth have eyes that strangely shaped? I mean come on, is Cassandra going to cry or something? Cassandra along with the Ogre have sad faces.

tmp7704 wrote...

DId anyone else get a laugh out of what  seems to be mama Hawke standing patiently in the middle of all the  kiting, completely ignored by the darkspawn and apparently waiting for  them to die so she can get on with her grand acting scene ../../../images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png

Yeah, plot armor indeed.

Modifié par Brockololly, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:22 .

[Sir JK]

Vankraft wrote...
Yep, but you have to give he/she credit for their top notch dark spawn kiting skills, looks like they were probably used to using that as a viable tactic

Absolutely, a little more use of AoE spells as traps and we'd have beheld a master at work

[aaniadyen]

Brockololly wrote...

My lord- seriously, does any human being on earth have eyes that strangely shaped? I mean come on...

I do. I think you should apologize.

[Saibh]

Brockololly wrote...

Well yeah, when they're all bunched up, they're all holding their swords with one hand over their head wiggling it and lumbering over in lock step, sort of floating over the ground as they slide forth. The animation wouldn't be so bad if they all didn't share it or had some variety.

I honestly didn't notice and wasn't bothered by it. Mostly I just saw "ack INCOMING HORDE GRAB PILLS STICK TOGETHER FU AI DIRECTOR FIRE IN TH--" wait, wrong game. I liked what seeing them bunched together charging invoked. Something scary, not some shuffly little gnome army.

I'm sure newer animations wouldn't hurt, but since darkspawn don't play a big role, maybe they think it's not worth the trouble?

Yeah, in this video they only seemingly used their basic mage attack. But even here, because they were firing that off so frequently, it looked very spammish and the animation got repetitive. ITs a nitpick , but even in the other "real" video from a couple days ago when the players were using abilities, their stamina/mana was almost always fully charged.

No, it looked really abrupt and reptitive to me. I don't mind the speed, but all of those weird twists she keeps doing look plain tiring.

I honestly can't remember that older video.

Ok, but what I'm saying is I have no clue what he could say and thats a bad thing if I'm supposed to be playing as Hawke. Is he going to say something a bit insensitive and dickish  yet funny, since Carver just died and is laying there dead on the ground? Thats my issue it seems with the emotion icon is that there are varying levels of sarcasm or agressiveness, but its impossible to tell how far Hawke will go with any given response. I guess I'll just have to see it in action more...

It's the neutral option--he's going to be sarcastic, but he's not going to be too diplomatically apologetic or aggressively caustic. It shouldn't be one too much in the way of the other. You're choosing to say something sarcastic about it, but not necessarily emotional, is my opinion. If your mother gets upset that you're joking about it--well, you knew you were going to joke about it.

But, yeah, I have a feeling I'll have to play the game a bit to get a sense of what the sarcastic option generally means.

Yes, the BioWare face- they do everything but move their face, hence they look like a robots stuck in the Uncanny Valley. But to me, the new faces look far worse at emoting realistically than even Origins due in part to their unrealistic facail features.

DAO had that problem to me too--it looked like their facial muscles were pulled by strings. Usually because the eyebrows were very dramatic.

I wouldn't say it looks worse (except perhaps more obvious because of the more detailed face morphs), but I would say it looks about the same level of Uncanny Valley.

Modifié par Saibh, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:23 .

[ashwind]

My thoughts:
I like the fast pace combat with warriors and rogues but to see a mage run around like that while swinging her staff like some (failed) shaolin chicken monk is ... very disturbing.

I am under the impression the mage was using regular attack until the very end when she stun, arcane prison, fireball the ogre. If I am right, her regular attacks looks like a mad person swing a stick madly to produce arcane bolt... while DAO's "pew pew" is uncool, what I have just seen is... .. . indescribably retarded.

Rogues and Warriors are fine in fast pace combat but maybe Bioware should consider making the mage different, slower maybe? Able to stagger enemies so they dont need to run like a mad damsel in distress. Not only will the mage look less like a lunatic, it will also provide players with a new playstyle.

Please do not compare this to ME2... the Adept is way much cooler. To draw parallel between Adept to the mad person in the vid is the ultimate insult to ME2!

Modifié par ashwind, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:24 .

[StingingVelvet]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

StingingVelvet wrote...

Because it's not needed.  I'm not a gamer who uses tactics for the hell of it, if a game is simple and easy to play and doesn't need them then why would I sit back and make a grand strategy?  That makes no sense.

So from the video you're assuming that gameplay is easy?  That's different.  I thought you simply were saying that because the unpaused speed is faster, pausing makes no sense, and that's what I didn't understand.

I don't think you can assume difficulty at all from this video, especially since it's an early level, and the guy - who didn't seem to be trying too hard - got his team killed.  Maybe you WILL need to pause?  Who is to say?

StingingVelvet wrote...

There is a mainstream gaming idea that everything should be simple to do.  I don't agree with that, I think complexity adds to a game, it doesn't detract from it.  If there were more tactics involved in ME2 which required pausing and planning that would be awesome, but there are not.  A pause button does not change that.

I agree, but I can't see how the video proves that the game will lack the depth and/or difficulty of DA:O you desire.  It's just got different animations.

-Semper- wrote...

there was no room for dodging (just walking away) because the damage of an enemy was calculated although your pc already was 10 feet away, so you have to plan before going into fights. now it seems that you can dodge enemy's blows.

You could kite in DA:O...

I was talking about Mass Effect 2.  You asked me why I did not use pause in ME2 and those were my answers, you then applied those answers to a completely different game.

Modifié par StingingVelvet, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:25 .

[Reaverwind]

Sir JK wrote...

-Semper- wrote...

[

yes, but not as easily as in da2 - so it seems.

You clealry did not see me first time I met the ogre in the tower in Ishal:

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

Yea, kiting definitely topped my Top Ten Cheesy Exploits in DA:O. I'd actually run my mage through hordes of darkspawn to get them to bunch up - without the mage taking a single hit. I did have to watch the AOE's, though.

[Saibh]

Reaverwind wrote...

Sir JK wrote...

-Semper- wrote...

[

yes, but not as easily as in da2 - so it seems.

You clealry did not see me first time I met the ogre in the tower in Ishal:

"Argh! The ogre killed my tank and is going after me!" *Runs in circles while the mage and archers peppers the ogre till death*

Yea, kiting definitely topped my Top Ten Cheesy Exploits in DA:O. I'd actually run my mage through hordes of darkspawn to get them to bunch up - without the mage taking a single hit. I did have to watch the AOE's, though.

Well, you could complete entire levels without ever fighting a single enemy if you turned Morrigan into a Stinging Swarm and put Haste on her.

Modifié par Saibh, 07 novembre 2010 - 04:26 .

[-Semper-]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Could say the same about DA:O, or any other game, if you believe your companions should auto-win while you run off in circles.

ahhh... you driving me nuts oO
in da:o you simply can't run away with a single mage alive and spam a whole horde to death! if you try you will end up like this: you run away and left click to attack. now it takes time till your missile is ready and hits. while your mage prepares to fire a bolt the enemies are already in close range and they will hit you hard. there is no way you can avoid those attacks and you will only win if those enemies are weaker then yourself. there was no big a.i. needed because the enemies were able to reach you.

now look at the action gameplay of da2: the whole horde isn't even able to come in close range, let alone hitting you with a single blow. it's hilarious!

[tmp7704]

Brockololly wrote...

My lord- seriously, does any human being on earth have eyes that strangely shaped? I mean come on, is Cassandra going to cry or something? Cassandra along with the Ogre have sad faces.

Think she's supposed to be sad there actually, yes. But it's kinda unrelated to iris size so she winds up looking weird, you'd need to try really hard to open eyes wide enough to have this much of whites showing, sad or not.

[TheConfidenceMan]

Not really digging the way the Mage played. Run, run, run, turn around and rapid-fire spells until enemies get close, turn around and run, run, run, etc until you win.



And while this was console gameplay I can't see how a different interface for PC is going to make it any less like an action game.