276 réponses à ce sujet

[Ziggeh]

Just had a quick check, my first playthrough on DA was 60 hours, ME2 it was 40. Not that that's really indicative, mind. But I imagine you're right, it's likely to be shorter, and that's a concern, but for me at least it's a reasonable trade off.

Sharn01 wrote...

It would still only require two voice actors for Hawke, just a few small changes to the dialog here and there, less if they are named Hawke regardless of race.

Hmm. I suppose that's true, they don't really have racial accents as such. So I suppose it really comes down the type of story they want to tell, and while it's definitely a feature that will be missed, I think even the most cynical and reactionary of the forum populous probably trusts them on writing if nothing else.

[Ziggeh]

Lyssistr wrote...

 The thing is, some of us got an infinite amount of **** for saying DA2 is going to be h&s. I'm sure even after the gameplay video, some people will still be willing to stick to their guns.

As the devs and multiple people have said, the gameplay video was of the console oriented combat system being played by someone with no idea how to play. Stick to your misinformed guns, by all means.

[fchopin]

A definite no pre-order from me.
 
If i wanted to play a slash game there are better games out there.
 
The graphics look very bad and fake, Hawke looked stupid with those eyes, don't know what graphic artist's you are using but you should do some changes and improve things. I don't see anything wrong with the DAO graphics, but maybe i am stupid and don't understand.
 
I will wait until the game is out and then maybe will buy the game depending on how it's received.
 
Disappointed so far.

[Lyssistr]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

 The thing is, some of us got an infinite amount of **** for saying DA2 is going to be h&s. I'm sure even after the gameplay video, some people will still be willing to stick to their guns.

As the devs and multiple people have said, the gameplay video was of the console oriented combat system being played by someone with no idea how to play. Stick to your misinformed guns, by all means.

misinformed blah blah, you know, I'm gonna laugh so hard when h&s is final verdict. You don't want to trust your own eyes and see what's in the gameplay footage, I honestly can't help with that.

[Morroian]

Lyssistr wrote...

misinformed blah blah, you know, I'm gonna laugh so hard when h&s is final verdict. You don't want to trust your own eyes and see what's in the gameplay footage, I honestly can't help with that.

Since when do hack and slash games have auto attack and pause and give orders?

[Ziggeh]

Lyssistr wrote...
misinformed blah blah.

haha, "yeah, yeah, just cause what I said was false doesn't mean I'm wrong". You're making stuff up and being angry about it. More power to you. But I think it's time the forum as a whole gave up discussing things people have made up, so I'll make a start.

[AtreiyaN7]

Lyssistr wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

 The thing is, some of us got an infinite amount of **** for saying DA2 is going to be h&s. I'm sure even after the gameplay video, some people will still be willing to stick to their guns.

As the devs and multiple people have said, the gameplay video was of the console oriented combat system being played by someone with no idea how to play. Stick to your misinformed guns, by all means.

misinformed blah blah, you know, I'm gonna laugh so hard when h&s is final verdict. You don't want to trust your own eyes and see what's in the gameplay footage, I honestly can't help with that.

Ooo, ooo, and you can even say "I told you so!" later when you're undoubtedly proven right.

*sarcasm*

[Lyssistr]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...
misinformed blah blah.

haha, "yeah, yeah, just cause what I said was false doesn't mean I'm wrong". You're making stuff up and being angry about it. More power to you. But I think it's time the forum as a whole gave up discussing things people have made up, so I'll make a start.

How about actually looking into the gameplay footage, instead of using some generic arguments that could be used even for claiming that bananas taste like oranges.

[In Exile]

Revan312 wrote..
And with the removal of origin stories and no more multi race choices the replayability falls yet again. Now as I've said, whether or not this all means a worse game is yet to be seen, I'll have to play it first, but, I know for a fact I'll have less, most likely much less, than a quarter of the game time into this sequel in total than I did DA:O, if there's no toolset update released then even less time...

You are going to have to explain this to me. Why do the origins make the game replayable? They offer very little actual new content, aside from the 1hr intro and the epilogues at the end of the game.

The meat of the replay is the fact that the game is fun. My biggest problem with DA:O and the Origins is that the game is just so long and identical I can't actually bear to go through the game with every race (especially since mages are so much more fun than rogue/warriors).

Modifié par In Exile, 08 novembre 2010 - 11:10 .

[Revan312]

In defense of Lyssistr, ME2 also had a pause function that was completely unneeded, it was pretty much a relic from the first game. Not that I'm saying that DA2 won't be tactical, I have a hard time assuming it won't be at higher difficulty as 3 fully controllable companions would be a waste with anything less, but the possibility is there.



This could all be solved with a gameplay video from the PC version.. Normally there's at least a couple vids at this point when considering a AAA title. But to reiterate, no, I don't think there will be a problem with the "hack and slash" concern floating about, more than anything the animations are the things making people worried about it, which I must admit, they are waaay over the top and faaar to fast paced for my liking. Hopefully with the top down cam they won't be awfully noticeable..

[Morroian]

Lyssistr wrote...

How about actually looking into the gameplay footage, instead of using some generic arguments that could be used even for claiming that bananas taste like oranges.

How about actually listening got what the devs are saying instead of going solely by brief unrepresentative footage.

[Lyssistr]

Morroian wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

How about actually looking into the gameplay footage, instead of using some generic arguments that could be used even for claiming that bananas taste like oranges.

How about actually listening got what the devs are saying instead of going solely by brief unrepresentative footage.

Well sorry for trusting my eyes, keep your faith in whatever devs say  

[In Exile]

Revan312 wrote...

In defense of Lyssistr, ME2 also had a pause function that was completely unneeded, it was pretty much a relic from the first game. Not that I'm saying that DA2 won't be tactical, I have a hard time assuming it won't be at higher difficulty as 3 fully controllable companions would be a waste with anything less, but the possibility is there.

...ME1 had a pause function? ME2 had a pause function? Wait, what?

This could all be solved with a gameplay video from the PC version.. Normally there's at least a couple vids at this point when considering a AAA title. But to reiterate, no, I don't think there will be a problem with the "hack and slash" concern floating about, more than anything the animations are the things making people worried about it, which I must admit, they are waaay over the top and faaar to fast paced for my liking. Hopefully with the top down cam they won't be awfully noticeable..

We're not getting it any time soon because Bioware needs to make sure everyone and their mother understands that DA2 gameplay will not be broken on consoles. Seriously, I played the game on console once as a retal out of cuirosity and it was like a punishment.

[Morroian]

Lyssistr wrote...

Morroian wrote...

Lyssistr wrote...

How about actually looking into the gameplay footage, instead of using some generic arguments that could be used even for claiming that bananas taste like oranges.

How about actually listening got what the devs are saying instead of going solely by brief unrepresentative footage.

Well sorry for trusting my eyes, keep your faith in whatever devs say  

So just to be clear you're accusing them of outright lying. When they talk about the game having auto attack and pause and give orders there's no room for them to be playing semantic games.

[Revan312]

In Exile wrote...

You are going to have to explain this to me. Why do the origins make the game replayable? They offer very little actual new content, aside from the 1hr intro and the epilogues at the end of the game.

The meat of the replay is the fact that the game is fun. My biggest problem with DA:O and the Origins is that the game is just so long and identical I can't actually bear to go through the game with every race (especially since mages are so much more fun than rogue/warriors).

I replayed the game for nearly every race/combo minus dwarves as it did have some rather clever and well written dialogue depending on what you were race/origin wise. Plus it's just nice to have had the choice.

As it's quite obvious that you didn't much enjoy DA:O compared to the unreleased DA2, theres not much point arguing with the fans that liked those aspects of the original. I personally feel that a voiced protag along with the pidgeon holing of the race/background into a single being (human/hawke) will cause my replayability of the game to go way way down. After I've seen evil Hawke and good Hawke I'm assuming there won't be much left to see, just like with most of Bioware's RPGs.  DA:O was an exception for me as I did replay it a bunch just trying out different builds/races/origins/choices in the end etc.

Now DA2 might have some crazy decision impact and will actually carry itself really well regardless of the shortened length, but it's still going to fall short by quite a margin of the amount of time I have invested in DA:O, there's just no way I'll be able to have the amount of playthroughs I did because of the things I listed. You might get more because you disliked DA:O, but I can already tell I won't, game quality aside.

[DanaScu]

In Exile wrote...

Well, how can Bioware know that? They released 4 distinct games between BG and DA:O. How would they know if you are a repeat customer or not? How could they know what you did buy if you bought any previous games? Even if they knew your puchasing history (which is an impossible breach of privacy), how could they know your particular evaluation of each product?

Well, on my old forum account Bioware could very easily see my purchasing history, with absolutely no breach of privacy. They could see anyone's purchasing history. It was all noted next to your avatar, if you registered your games, which you had to do to post in the game specfic forums.

NWN 2: XP1 Game Owners
NWN2 SOZ Game Owners
Jade Empire Special Edition (PC) Game Owners
Star Wars: KotOR (PC) Game Owners
Neverwinter Nights Game Owners
NWN: SoU Game Owners
NWN: HotU Game Owners
NWN 2 Owner

As for any evaluation, they could read the forums. Most people who posted on the old forums about the old games posted about the game; issues, flaws, things that worked well, and things they wanted to see. There weren't 300 page threads about dwarf chest hair, although there was a long running Aribeth appreciation thread that went through many iterations. People were capable of coherently posting their opinions without being attacked by people who agreed or disagreed. Note that I said, attacked. That isn't to say that people didn't agree or disagree, just that they were able to post their opinions in a discussion without resorting to insults.

I'm just waiting to hear about who the voice actors are for Hawke; more from a morbid sense of curiosity than any idea of getting the game. From the information they've released so far, I'm not getting the game. Almost all of the things that are getting pointed at by devs/marketing as being "improved" and "teh awesomest ever" are the things that I enjoyed in their original form in DA:O. They are not in any way, shape, or form, "improvements" in my opinion.
I know others have the opposite view.

[Revan312]

In Exile wrote...

Revan312 wrote...

In defense of Lyssistr, ME2 also had a pause function that was completely unneeded, it was pretty much a relic from the first game. Not that I'm saying that DA2 won't be tactical, I have a hard time assuming it won't be at higher difficulty as 3 fully controllable companions would be a waste with anything less, but the possibility is there.

...ME1 had a pause function? ME2 had a pause function? Wait, what?

Surprisingly yes, they did Mostly only needed in the original as it actually had more abilities than just 3 for a companion and some of the fights were harder on insanity than the whack a mole style combat in the sequal.. 

I know, crazy huh..

Modifié par Revan312, 08 novembre 2010 - 11:27 .

[In Exile]

Revan312 wrote...
As it's quite obvious that you didn't much enjoy DA:O compared to the unreleased DA2, theres not much point arguing with the fans that liked those aspects of the original.

I don't want to argue with you; I honestly want to understand why you find those features fun. I got a lot of value out of DA:O 7-8 playthroughs. But they were all mostly with the same two characters - Human Noble & Human Mage. I did one City Elf run, and say all the origins, but that was it.

I personally feel that a voiced protag along with the pidgeon holing of the race/background into a single being (human/hawke) will cause my replayability of the game to go way way down. After I've seen evil Hawke and good Hawke I'm assuming there won't be much left to see, just like with most of Bioware's RPGs.  DA:O was an exception for me as I did replay it a bunch just trying out different builds/races/origins/choices in the end etc.

See, this is exactly what doesn't make any sense to me. The dwarf had like 4 extra flavour lines compared to the 4 extra flavour lines the Noble got. The only differences were the endgame epilogues. You didn't get locked out of romances, quests, etc. Even your origin areas treated you basically as the same person.

So I legitimately cannot see how this would reduce replayability.

I mean, I play very few games that I enjoy. Most games suck. DA:O and ME2 were the only games I purchased in 2009-2010.

Now DA2 might have some crazy decision impact and will actually carry itself really well regardless of the shortened length, but it's still going to fall short by quite a margin of the amount of time I have invested in DA:O, there's just no way I'll be able to have the amount of playthroughs I did because of the things I listed. You might get more because you disliked DA:O, but I can already tell I won't, game quality aside.

What makes you think I disliked DA:O? There were just features I didn't like, and it happens they're getting changed and some people hate that, so I have to wind up defending my preferences. If you were on the old DA:O boards, I'd be the lone nut arguing for PC VO and having a 5-way debate on why Vancian magic is poor gameplay.

[In Exile]

Revan312 wrote...
Surprisingly yes, they did Mostly only needed in the original as it actually had more abilities than just 3 for a companion and some of the fights were harder on insanity than the whack a mole style combat in the sequal.. 

I know, crazy huh..

Oh, you're counting the power wheel as pause. Right, I get it. I always used the power wheel in ME2. I don't map powers to buttons on the 360.

[Ziggeh]

DanaScu wrote...

Almost all of the things that are getting pointed at by devs/marketing as being "improved" and "teh awesomest ever" are the things that I enjoyed in their original form in DA:O. They are not in any way, shape, or form, "improvements" in my opinion.

Would you mind expanding on that? Honestly not trolling, I think discussing examples of what people actually dislike is contructive, were as "don't like what I see, not buying" is common and unhelpful to man nor beast.

[tmp7704]

In Exile wrote...

...ME1 had a pause function? ME2 had a pause function? Wait, what?

Yes. Hitting space (iirc) to invoke the command screen pauses the game but you can still rotate camera around while in this mode. Makes it even easier to take note of tactical situation or even line up your gun with intended target if you feel like it.

[In Exile]

DanaScu wrote...

Well, on my old forum account Bioware could very easily see my purchasing history, with absolutely no breach of privacy. They could see anyone's purchasing history. It was all noted next to your avatar, if you registered your games, which you had to do to post in the game specfic forums.

Ah, I forgot about that feature. Now that's a fair point, and I certainly retract that criticism.

As for any evaluation, they could read the forums. Most people who posted on the old forums about the old games posted about the game; issues, flaws, things that worked well, and things they wanted to see. There weren't 300 page threads about dwarf chest hair, although there was a long running Aribeth appreciation thread that went through many iterations. People were capable of coherently posting their opinions without being attacked by people who agreed or disagreed. Note that I said, attacked. That isn't to say that people didn't agree or disagree, just that they were able to post their opinions in a discussion without resorting to insults.

But the forum is not representative of the entire purchasing community. Even if it was, it's an absolutely biased sample because loudmouth extroverts (like me) might just drown out other posters. A forum most certainly cannot give Bioware accurate market data, so the problem stands as I described it.

I'm just waiting to hear about who the voice actors are for Hawke; more from a morbid sense of curiosity than any idea of getting the game. From the information they've released so far, I'm not getting the game. Almost all of the things that are getting pointed at by devs/marketing as being "improved" and "teh awesomest ever" are the things that I enjoyed in their original form in DA:O. They are not in any way, shape, or form, "improvements" in my opinion.
I know others have the opposite view.

And that's most certainly justified. People should avoid the game if it lacks the features they like. It just bothers me when people want to insist they know what Bioware really makes, and who the true fans are. 

[addiction21]

Revan312 wrote...

Surprisingly yes, they did Mostly only needed in the original as it actually had more abilities than just 3 for a companion and some of the fights were harder on insanity than the whack a mole style combat in the sequal.. 

I know, crazy huh..

Whats wrong with Whack-A-Mole? Its deep and complex. So many holes they could possibly pop out of and only two hands.

I think I have reached my bad joke qouta for the day. Let me check the spread sheet.

[Ziggeh]

In Exile wrote...

So I legitimately cannot see how this would reduce replayability.

Characters, I would say. I'm more interested in the story and decisions myself, and so have a hard time replaying any of this type of game if I'm being honest. But I played through all the origins, and was tempted each time to take this interesting character and place it in the same situations to see how I felt about them, whether they would act differently etc.

I guess that's still feasible, but in a less direct manner, you are not crafting a whole new person.

[AtreiyaN7]

*hands the chicken a waffle for the bad joke*

This place needs more humor, not less anyway.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 08 novembre 2010 - 11:37 .