51 réponses à ce sujet

[Varenus Luckmann]

specter7237 wrote...
Great speculation, if little more until we could get harder evidence on the matter.  If this was true though, you could potentially have Alistair siring a child on his own sister.  Thats just wrong...

No. That is awesome.

[Curlain]

Tamyn wrote...

Akrim_Drak wrote...

I'd imagine half the children in the Denerim alienage are probably Maric's...

So that's why the orphans' ghosts in the alienage orphanage have round ears?!

Yup, in fact every other kid you see in Denerium as a whole (and Redcliffe) is Maric's child.  I don't know why Eamon was so worried about the survival of Thierin blood resting on Alistair's shoulders, sounds like there's plenty more where that came from, at least Maric had the survival of his blood close to his heart (amongst other things, like hot blond elven ladies )

[Ulicus]

specter7237 wrote...

Sometimes its hard to believe Alistair carries Therin blood.  Towards the end he does finally start to fill those shoes.

Reading TST, I came to realise that Alistair is absolutely his father's son. Sure, he doesn't live up to the legend of Maric... but neither does Maric. One of my favourite things about the book was seeing just how much Alistair has in common with his father.

LdyShayna wrote...
Well, at the end of The Calling, Fiona explicitly REQUESTS her son be lied to.  Thus, it can go either way, I think.

Yeah, though the lying doesn't explain why Alistair wouldn't perk up one day and go, "Hey, why am I at least three years younger than I possibly can be?"

I thought at first that the kid was just going to be Alistair and this was going to be a niggly continuity thing... but I've started to come around to the view I've seen others express: that this kid exists for the purpose of making sure - no matter what happens in the game - the Theirin line continues. Especially since Alistair/FPC are unlikely to have kids, and then there's all those rumours about Anora being barren, too. Just makes sense.

Servant of Nature

Then again.. ugh, makes me angry that Maric was willing to cheat on
Rowan so horribly. At least him sleeping with Fiona was five years
after Rowan's death

Two years -- but, yeah, I know what you mean.

Modifié par Ulicus, 16 décembre 2009 - 09:58 .

[nos_astra]

Ulicus wrote...
I thought at first that the kid was just going to be Alistair and this
was going to be a niggly continuity thing... but I've started to come
around to the view I've seen others express: that this kid exists for
the purpose of making sure - no matter what happens in the game - the
Theirin line continues. Especially since Alistair/FPC are unlikely to
have kids, and then there's all those rumours about Anora being barren,
too. Just makes sense.

Yeah, makes sense and is yet very unelegant. It's an easy way out. Every time there is trouble to the bloodline now we pull the Marics-endless-supply-of-secret-bastards-card and off we go. This is fun once in DAO when Alistair's background is revealed. It is bearable twice, maybe. But then it starts getting ridiculous.

When I first read that there might be more behind the story, more secrets to discover, that made me really happy. More flesh to the world of DAO. And although it's unlikely to be true (timeline issues) I still want to believe. :-)

Modifié par klarabella, 16 décembre 2009 - 10:12 .

[LdyShayna]

Servant of Nature wrote...

That's the only real hook for me. I don't think Maric would hurt Rowan like that, not for a fling with a servant girl... he cared for Rowan, love or no.

I actually think the age thing is a merely a continuity issue, which is why I don't find it definitive.  Despite everyone having such a very low opinion of Maric, I just disagree that the actions ascribed to him by Goldanna were at ALL in character for him.  Nor does it sound in character for him to cheat on Rowan.  I just don't buy it.

I think it's reasonable to think Goldanna was paid off not because her mother was actually Alistair's mother, but because she had witnessed too much.  She added things up and made poor assumptions which have grown in importance in her mind as she became more bitter over the years.

And before anyone whips out Occam's Razon AGAIN, I don't think any of this is MORE unlikely or more complicated than there being yet another, separate conspiracy and ANOTHER heir somehow hidden to be whipped out.

Most endings point to the ending of the Theirin line, so I think that's where they headed.  *shrugs*

[Ulicus]

klarabella wrote...

Yeah, makes sense and is yet very unelegant. It's an easy way out. Every time there is trouble to the bloodline now we pull the Marics-endless-supply-of-secret-bastards-card and off we go. This is fun once in DAO when Alistair's background is revealed. It is bearable twice, maybe. But then it starts getting ridiculous.

When I first read that there might be more behind the story, more secrets to discover, that made me really happy. More flesh to the world of DAO. And although it's unlikely to be true (timeline issues) I still want to believe. :-)

I know what you mean... and, honestly, the way that last scene is written has ALISTAIR all over it... but, at this point, I'm just going to wait and see.

[Servant of Nature]

LdyShayna wrote...
I actually think the age thing is a merely a continuity issue, which is why I don't find it definitive.  Despite everyone having such a very low opinion of Maric, I just disagree that the actions ascribed to him by Goldanna were at ALL in character for him.  Nor does it sound in character for him to cheat on Rowan.  I just don't buy it.

I think it's reasonable to think Goldanna was paid off not because her mother was actually Alistair's mother, but because she had witnessed too much.  She added things up and made poor assumptions which have grown in importance in her mind as she became more bitter over the years.

And before anyone whips out Occam's Razon AGAIN, I don't think any of this is MORE unlikely or more complicated than there being yet another, separate conspiracy and ANOTHER heir somehow hidden to be whipped out.

Most endings point to the ending of the Theirin line, so I think that's where they headed.  *shrugs*

I don't have a 'low' opinion of Maric, I just got tired of him boinking Katriel with Rowan around.  He was a young guy, Rowan still treated him like a boy, Katriel made him feel all manly.  It wasn't surprising, it was just poor form and selfish.

That being said, I highly doubt he raped anyone, Goldanna is, as you say, bitter.  I have issues with the ending of such an important bloodline, though.  It's continued for 400 years, and is the very foundation of Ferelden.  I'd hate to have that be, just... gone.

Alistair could be Fiona's kid, honestly it seems like Maric's(or maybe it's just all the Theirin men?) genes override everything, so it's hard to tell anyway.   I'm sure we'll find out sometime.

[Akrim_Drak]

LdyShayna wrote...

Servant of Nature wrote...

That's the only real hook for me. I don't think Maric would hurt Rowan like that, not for a fling with a servant girl... he cared for Rowan, love or no.

I actually think the age thing is a merely a continuity issue, which is why I don't find it definitive.  Despite everyone having such a very low opinion of Maric, I just disagree that the actions ascribed to him by Goldanna were at ALL in character for him.  Nor does it sound in character for him to cheat on Rowan.  I just don't buy it.

I think it's reasonable to think Goldanna was paid off not because her mother was actually Alistair's mother, but because she had witnessed too much.  She added things up and made poor assumptions which have grown in importance in her mind as she became more bitter over the years.

And before anyone whips out Occam's Razon AGAIN, I don't think any of this is MORE unlikely or more complicated than there being yet another, separate conspiracy and ANOTHER heir somehow hidden to be whipped out.

Most endings point to the ending of the Theirin line, so I think that's where they headed.  *shrugs*

I agree with the end of the Theirin line. Maric's mother sounded like an amazing woman and a great queen. Maric was an okay king(thanks to Loghain, otherwise he'd be hopeless) Cailin was a bit of a flake and Alistair wants nothing to do with it. They definitely aren't the same as they used to be during Calenhad's run...

My PC certainly didn't care. Told Alistair to do whatever the hell he wanted. I sacrificed myself and said "screw it, let someone ELSE deal with this mess."

Modifié par Akrim_Drak, 16 décembre 2009 - 10:39 .

[Felene]

David Gaider wrote...

Felene wrote...

Also, King Maric has more than two children, right?

I guess anything is possible, sure.

From Dragon Age: The Calling Discussion thread - (*SPOILERS*)

Modifié par Felene, 16 décembre 2009 - 10:38 .

[bobsmyuncle]

LdyShayna wrote...

Servant of Nature wrote...

That's the only real hook for me. I don't think Maric would hurt Rowan like that, not for a fling with a servant girl... he cared for Rowan, love or no.

I actually think the age thing is a merely a continuity issue, which is why I don't find it definitive.  Despite everyone having such a very low opinion of Maric, I just disagree that the actions ascribed to him by Goldanna were at ALL in character for him.  Nor does it sound in character for him to cheat on Rowan.  I just don't buy it.

I think it's reasonable to think Goldanna was paid off not because her mother was actually Alistair's mother, but because she had witnessed too much.  She added things up and made poor assumptions which have grown in importance in her mind as she became more bitter over the years.

And before anyone whips out Occam's Razon AGAIN, I don't think any of this is MORE unlikely or more complicated than there being yet another, separate conspiracy and ANOTHER heir somehow hidden to be whipped out.

Most endings point to the ending of the Theirin line, so I think that's where they headed.  *shrugs*

I actually think Goldanna was paid off not because she witnessed anything (she wasn't living with her mother anymore at the time, IIRC), but because she came back and started asking questions. I agree that it's out of character, in my judgment, for Maric to cheat on Rowan. By the end of TST they had settled into a kind of comfortable partnership and I think it would be very strange for him to hurt her like that. From what I gather of him from both books, he also doesn't seem to be the type for a fling. With both Katriel and Fiona they spent a while together as friends before sleeping together, so I don't see him going "Hey, is your father a baker? Cause you've got a sodding nice set of buns!" and falling into bed with a stranger.

I agree that the Theirin line is probably ending. Alistair is a Warden, and while we know nothing about Cailan or Anora's fertility situation, five years without even a girl would have been enough for historical courts to start grumbling about heirs. If Alistair marries Anora, she's going to be pressured to produce an heir PDQ considering she didn't conceive in the last five years. Same for Cousland, except with unhappier results since she will likely be unable.

It doesn't hurt that the end of the royal bloodline will make for a useful plot point sometime in the future (that's just my writer's senses tingling). Besides, the Theirin dynasty lasted for ~400 years and both lost and regained the country from foreign occupiers. Plenty of real world royal houses aren't that interesting.

[FlintlockJazz]

Shady314 wrote...

So Alistair=Arthur because they both start with A?

They both start with A, end with r, are both kings of a feudal society despite being raised as more normal people (Arthur as a Squire, Alistair as a Templar), and both have a generally decent demeanour.

Modifié par FlintlockJazz, 17 décembre 2009 - 12:31 .

[Inakhia]

Not having read the books, I'm basing this of Alistair and what i've read here so far, but Maric was raised as a noble, unlike Alistair who, at this point at least, isn't one for one night stands. But considering what the rest of the nobility are up too on a daily basis, I don't think fidelity is a major strong point of Ferelden nobility. Point of fact, it might be considered an unspoken rule to have a few halfbloods around to keep the full bloods on their toes and make sure should anything happen, theres always a fall back position. Bastard children have a useful place in society. If you look after them you have a useful resource, with a certain amount of familial loyalty. Sons can be raised to useful positions around the court and daughters can be married off to *very* minor nobility or merchants you want to keep in good with ect...

[Saurel]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

You know, that's the first thing that crossed my mind too, and considering the similarities in not only the inbreeding but in their actual names too (Morrigan = Morgana/Morgaine and Alistair = Arthur) and Calenhad being portrayed as a very Arthurian character (uniting the nobles together and all that) it does lead on to some disturbing thoughts...

If it clarfies anything, Gaider apparently got the name from a Female friend of his who used the name for a character she RP'd as. And he happened to like it.

http://social.biowar...x/380325#380667

Doesn't rule out possibilites

Modifié par Saurel, 17 décembre 2009 - 06:48 .

[Ariella]

Shady314 wrote...

So Alistair=Arthur because they both start with A?

If you're going to play that game, I think it's more likely that Alistair=Xander because Alistair is a celtic derivation of the name Alexander.

As for all the age thing: this isn't the modern age where everyting is documented in triplicate and kept on file somewhere. It wouldn't be to hard to lie about Alistair's age, and it wouldn't be too hard to lie about who his birth mother was. Remember, he found Goldanna on his own, when he was inducted into the Wardens, he was never told he had a sibling besides Calian.

It wouldn't be the first fantasy series where a main character's heritage is based on a lie. Melanine Rawn's Dragon Prince and Dragon Star series are good examples, especially since they had to conncoct a fake pregnacy among other things...

[Aedan_Cousland]

At one time people thought it was out of character for Tiger Woods to cheat on his wife as well.

[Ariella]

Aedan_Cousland wrote...

At one time people thought it was out of character for Tiger Woods to cheat on his wife as well.

Oy vey... But Tiger Woods isn't a character in a book where we have godlike access to his thoughts and feelings. Maric is.

[Lotion Soronarr]

specter7237 wrote...
Lets hope the child doesnt suffer the same effects of Westeros inbreeding, or he may become a twisted sociopath

Morrigan is raising it. Methinks it might become a sociopath without any genetic tag-a-longs.

[bobsmyuncle]

Ariella wrote...

If you're going to play that game, I think it's more likely that Alistair=Xander because Alistair is a celtic derivation of the name Alexander.

As for all the age thing: this isn't the modern age where everyting is documented in triplicate and kept on file somewhere. It wouldn't be to hard to lie about Alistair's age, and it wouldn't be too hard to lie about who his birth mother was. Remember, he found Goldanna on his own, when he was inducted into the Wardens, he was never told he had a sibling besides Calian.

It wouldn't be the first fantasy series where a main character's heritage is based on a lie. Melanine Rawn's Dragon Prince and Dragon Star series are good examples, especially since they had to conncoct a fake pregnacy among other things...

Did you just reference Dragon Prince? I love you

[Original182]

The Theirin bloodline is important. You must ensure it continues. It was the Theirin bloodline that united Ferelden, and the Theirin bloodline that fought back the Orlesians and regained Ferelden's independence. It symbolizes more about Ferelden than anything else.

[Faerell Gustani]

specter7237 wrote...

Great speculation, if little more until we could get harder evidence on the matter.  If this was true though, you could potentially have Alistair siring a child on his own sister.  Thats just wrong...

that's a very...Aurthurian thing...
Huh...Alistair -> Arthur
Morrigan -> Morganna

If the child's name starts with an M, I'm going to be disappointed in the writing.

[Mondo_]

FlintlockJazz wrote...

specter7237 wrote...

Great speculation, if little more until we could get harder evidence on the matter.  If this was true though, you could potentially have Alistair siring a child on his own sister.  Thats just wrong...

And so very DA:O.

So very King Arthur and Morgana!

[Mondo_]

High five Faerell!

[Alarna]

Regarding the timeline in TST and The Calling



0. Maric in Flemeth hut

1. Maric and Rowan married

2. Cailans birth (if we believe Rowan was pregnant in the first year)

11. Maric met Fiona

12. Alistairs birth (if we believe that he is the child)



So Morrigan would be 12 years older than Alistair and with a look in the game I don't believe it, witch or not.

[Maria Caliban]

Servant of Nature wrote...

Maric probably has several bastards around. I don't trust him at all.

Seriously. There's nothing about Maric to suggest he picked up some sense when it comes to letting his little Maker out.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 17 décembre 2009 - 11:35 .

[Darth_Trethon]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Servant of Nature wrote...

Maric probably has several bastards around. I don't trust him at all.

Seriously. There's nothing about Maric to suggest he picked up some sense when it comes to letting his little Maker out.

He was written as too much of a saint though the truth is he fell rather fast for Fiona and Katriel before her. It's all too easy to see Maric having more unknown children though I am inclined to think Alistair is in fact Fiona's child....time will tell I suppose....or not....depending where BioWare takes this.

He was too weak in that area though.....seeing a set of boobs was enough to get him drooling all over hiself.

Modifié par Darth_Trethon, 17 décembre 2009 - 11:40 .