861 réponses à ce sujet

[the_one_54321]

He's making non sequitor based on the relation of cloths and dialog to the character personality. If the cloths makes then interesting then the dialog need not do the same. I don't think he's right either, but he does acknowledge that it's only a suspicion on his part.

[soteria]

I don't see how it cuts dialogue.

Well, one thing we haven't heard yet is whether they're doing Awakening-style follower conversations. They did say it was a bit of an experiment to see if they could give follower backstory more efficiently than just following a bunch of dialogue trees that never really reflected the way normal people converse.

For those that haven't played, Awakening introduced a dialogue system in which most companion conversations were triggered by bringing said companion along with you and interacting with objects in the environment. For example, one companion might see a statue and note that the statue of his grandfather had been replaced and that would lead into companion backstory.

[Apollo Starflare]

soteria wrote...

I don't see how it cuts dialogue.

Well, one thing we haven't heard yet is whether they're doing Awakening-style follower conversations. They did say it was a bit of an experiment to see if they could give follower backstory more efficiently than just following a bunch of dialogue trees that never really reflected the way normal people converse.
For those that haven't played, Awakening introduced a dialogue system in which most companion conversations were triggered by bringing said companion along with you and interacting with objects in the environment. For example, one companion might see a statue and note that the statue of his grandfather had been replaced and that would lead into companion backstory.

DG posted aaaaages ago saying that the conversations wouldn't be like the Awakening conversations, although I think he did say it would work a little differently to Origins. I'm taking that from memory and don't have the link unfortunately, but am 100% that it won't be Awakening convo's.

[upsettingshorts]

soteria wrote...
They did say it was a bit of an experiment to see if they could give follower backstory more efficiently than just following a bunch of dialogue trees that never really reflected the way normal people converse.

1. Oh shut up you insufferable git.
2. I liked the Awakenings' style of conversation.
3. Didn't they say something about integrating Hawke into the banter?
4. Would that necessarily lead to less dialog, or just change how it is delivered?
5. That is interesting, where did you read that about Awakenings?

Hmm... decisions... decisions...  I don't know about you but I'm gonna be thinking about this one for a while.  You mind just standing still there and waiting for me to respond?  

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 08 novembre 2010 - 06:24 .

[tmp7704]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Hmm... decisions... decisions...  I don't know about you but I'm gonna be thinking about this one for a while.  You mind just standing still there and waiting for me to respond?  

Sorry but that looks like banter conversation. You'll probably have to settle for your forum persona to deliver their own automated reply, based on the tone of your posts to date.

Modifié par tmp7704, 08 novembre 2010 - 06:26 .

[upsettingshorts]

tmp7704 wrote...
Sorry but that looks like banter conversation. You'll probably have to settle for your forum persona to deliver their own automated reply, based on the tone of your posts to date.

So pedantic and tedious?

[soteria]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

soteria wrote...
They did say it was a bit of an experiment to see if they could give follower backstory more efficiently than just following a bunch of dialogue trees that never really reflected the way normal people converse.

1. Oh shut up you insufferable git.
2. I liked the Awakenings' style of conversation.
3. Didn't they say something about integrating Hawke into the banter?
4. Would that necessarily lead to less dialog, or just change how it is delivered?
5. That is interesting, where did you read that about Awakenings?

Hmm... decisions... decisions...  I don't know about you but I'm gonna be thinking about this one for a while.  You mind just standing still there and waiting for me to respond?  

5. From the very mouth of the Enemy.

[Nozybidaj]

In Exile wrote...
Yeah, why type up more when you can bask in your own superiority? As one of the unwashed masses at your feet, could you share some of your wisdom with me?

No.

How could I be slightly less inferior when compared to garbage? How can I be more like you?

You can't.  Sorry.

[soteria]

You can't. Sorry.

I guess that means he'll have something to be thankful for this Thanksgiving.

[Nozybidaj]

soteria wrote...

You can't. Sorry.

I guess that means he'll have something to be thankful for this Thanksgiving.

See, there's a silver lining to everything.

[Addai]

the_one_54321 wrote...

But that's all we can't control. Visuals. And that's small potatoes in light of the fact that we still control equipment stats. And it's an improvement (a vast improvement) when considering that the cookie-cutter body models will be out as well. Those were awful. One of the things on my short list of genuine dislikes in DA:O.

Says you.  I know this will mark me as irredeemably female, but the aesthetic element is as or more important to me as the stats.  I like to fiddle.  And if you can change the armor, then the fact that the body underneath is the same as every other body of that race and gender doesn't matter much.

Modifié par Addai67, 08 novembre 2010 - 06:52 .

[tmp7704]

Addai67 wrote...

Says you.  I know this will mark me as irredeemably female, but the aesthetic element is as or more important to me as the stats.  I like to fiddle.  And if you can change the armor, then the fact that the body underneath is the same as every other body of that race and gender doesn't matter much.

I suppose i'll put my masculinity into question if i fess up to having very much the same view on it.

Then again heck, i'm posting on intraweb forums for a computer game about fairies. What's there left to put into question.

[Wozearly]

I'm a bit torn on whether the change is good or not.



Generally, the starting look of character armour/robes in Origins, including Morrigan's unique look, were good. Most end-stage armours also looked good, provided they were worn passably within a set of other pieces of the same set to avoid the multi-coloured clown effect.



But there are some armours that I just NEVER equip - either because the visuals are so dire, or because the stats are pointless. As an example of the first, the DLC green robe looks shockingly awful on everyone bar Wynne (personal opinion) - despite being one of the best mage robes in the game, I'd have to claw my eyes out before I equipped it on Morrigan, Anders or Velanna where each had a unique 'look' that fitted the character.



From the second, I could pick whole sets of armour (and, indeed, weapons) that never see the light of day, because they're just not as good as others you get at the same/similar/earlier time. Equally, DLC tends to be epic (High Regard of House Dace, anyone?), which further boots previous in-game equipment off the list.



So unique armours that look great - doesn't bother me, although I would personally prefer the ability to select a small number of different options visually (e.g. shunting Isabella up to medium armour).



But I like the fact that we can play around with stats in a more meaningful way - I'm hoping its not a case of "its Isabella, therefore +cun and +wil only", and that will hopefully lead to fewer areas where the devs spend time creating and introducing items that players like me will go "Oh, that'd be great for a L6 character. Shame I'm L16. Straight to the vendor, then".



Personally, I like the fact that as the game progresses you slowly deck out your companions in better, more well-suited gear, which you can then tweak in a number of cases, and have to make trade-offs as you go.



So this system sounds like it could do that pretty well - I just hope they don't pick any stupid-looking defaults and then stick us with them...

[AlanC9]

Jorina Leto wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Which supposed tank, Jorina?

Carver, Aveline. They're warriors.

Right, but our screenshots of them are from the demo, where they're not supposed to have good equipment yet given the situation. Since it's already confirmed that characters will change looks as the game progresses, they seems like prime candidates for it.

[In Exile]

tmp7704 wrote...
As i understand it, since complaint/counterpoint was made that there wasn't much variety to outfits which you could put on companions, "doing it better" would involve making more varied armour models rather than as it was the case, just reskins of the same base models.

That's a resource problem, though. Bioware does not have infinite resources. So my follow-up to that, as always, would be: what gets cut to accomodate more unique models?

soteria wrote...
Well, one thing we haven't heard yet is
whether they're doing Awakening-style follower conversations. They did
say it was a bit of an experiment to see if they could give follower
backstory more efficiently than just following a bunch of dialogue trees
that never really reflected the way normal people converse.

There is some hybrid dialogue system. The goal as I understand it is that conversations are designed to be paced. They do not want you to exhaust all NPCs within seconds. This is what the goal of the Awakening dialogue was, essentially for you to discover the characters personalities as you travelled, and so they would hitch your progress through dialogue to your game completion % but in a less aggravating way than ME1/2.

We will also be told, I believe, when a companion has something new to say, though how this works in practice was unclear to me at the time.

Nozybidaj wrote...

In Exile wrote...
Yeah, why
type up more when you can bask in your own superiority? As one of the
unwashed masses at your feet, could you share some of your wisdom with
me?

No.

....

How could I
be slightly less inferior when compared to garbage? How can I be more
like you?

You can't.  Sorry.

......

[Jorina Leto]

AlanC9 wrote...

Jorina Leto wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Which supposed tank, Jorina?

Carver, Aveline. They're warriors.

Right, but our screenshots of them are from the demo, where they're not supposed to have good equipment yet given the situation. Since it's already confirmed that characters will change looks as the game progresses, they seems like prime candidates for it.

Yeah, just like ME2. Just a new texture for the same model. That's what we should expect until Bioware publishes a screenshot of Carver wearing full plate.

[tmp7704]

In Exile wrote...

tmp7704 wrote...
As i understand it, since complaint/counterpoint was made that there wasn't much variety to outfits which you could put on companions, "doing it better" would involve making more varied armour models rather than as it was the case, just reskins of the same base models.

That's a resource problem, though. Bioware does not have infinite resources. So my follow-up to that, as always, would be: what gets cut to accomodate more unique models?

Yes, that much is granted. However that brings us back to different way this situation can be looked at -- the designers already spent resources on making unique companion meshes and meshes for generic NPC, and one would hope that these "generic NPC meshes" are somewhat varied, more than in DAO given the feedback from the first game. Allowing then the companions to equip these generic NPC meshes allows to achieve some degree of that coveted ability to customize appearance of the companions, without significant additional investment of resources beyond what was already spent.

Modifié par tmp7704, 08 novembre 2010 - 07:56 .

[AlanC9]

Jorina Leto wrote...

Yeah, just like ME2. Just a new texture for the same model. That's what we should expect until Bioware publishes a screenshot of Carver wearing full plate.

If it makes you happy to believe that's what's going to happen, go ahead.

[tmp7704]

AlanC9 wrote...

If it makes you happy to believe that's what's going to happen, go ahead.

To play devil's advocate, why would they want to give Carver different attire from what he's already sporting? It is certainly unique and iconic, and so it achieves the very purpose of these outfits.

[Mehow_pwn]

I want unique companions.. not some garge same looking thing..



Have they removed the old inventory? OMFG Here we go agian MASS EFFECT 2 YAY ****ing great

[Addai]

Wozearly wrote...

So this system sounds like it could do that pretty well - I just hope they don't pick any stupid-looking defaults and then stick us with them...

Too late...

I'm sure some people like Isabela's get-up, but then that's the problem.  If you don't, you're stuck looking at her or not recruiting her.

[In Exile]

tmp7704 wrote...
Yes, that much is granted. However that brings us back to different way this situation can be looked at -- the designers already spent resources on making unique companion meshes and meshes for generic NPC, and one would hope that these "generic NPC meshes" are somewhat varied, more than in DAO given the feedback from the first game. Allowing then the companions to equip these generic NPC meshes allows to achieve some degree of that coveted ability to customize appearance of the companions, without significant additional investment of resources beyond what was already spent.

It isn't that simple. You may be fine with aesthetically poor graphical mishmash, but the critical reception would be unforgiving. Bioware can't afford a AAA release with stopgaps. If NPCs can equip other armour, they need to make sure that armour is high quality. That's part of the cost, IMO.

I agree in principle it can be done your way if you're willing to make such a large concession, but the problem is that in practice the cost is too high to simply do it that way.

[Dave of Canada]

tmp7704 wrote...

To play devil's advocate, why would they want to give Carver different attire from what he's already sporting? It is certainly unique and iconic, and so it achieves the very purpose of these outfits.

Looks more like a refugee / farmer uniform rather than a fighter, though.

[Eleinehmm]

Addai67 wrote...

Wozearly wrote...

So this system sounds like it could do that pretty well - I just hope they don't pick any stupid-looking defaults and then stick us with them...

Too late...

I'm sure some people like Isabela's get-up, but then that's the problem.  If you don't, you're stuck looking at her or not recruiting her.

I agree -  Unfortunatly we already have a stupied looking Isabela get-up 

Heh – It seems that Hawke IS the CHOSEN ONE – He/She is the only person who can change outfits more than once or twice per decade 

Modifié par Eleinehmm, 08 novembre 2010 - 08:16 .

[haberman13]

Same story as ME2, people want less thinking and more action.



Personally, customization is one of my key judging factors in a game, Bioware seems intent on losing me as a customer! (which is fine, if there is more money in casual friendly games have at it)