115 réponses à ce sujet

[tonnactus]

jlb524 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...


Oh, I'm sure she's killed some bad people too,

Nef as a victim never make any sense.
Did she has the same chat with her like with shepardt,that she like power and danger.I doubt it.
Persons like Donovan Hock are far more likely to end as victims.

Modifié par tonnactus, 09 novembre 2010 - 01:22 .

[Nightwriter]

She has a diverse palate. She hungers for people with that "spark". The spark can manifest itself in many ways.

[Stazro]

tonnactus wrote...

Nef as a victim never make any sense.
Did she has the same chat with her like with shepardt,that she like power and danger.I doubt it.
Persons like Donovan Hock are far more likely to end as victims.

Nightwriter wrote...

She has a diverse palate. She hungers for people with that "spark". The spark can manifest itself in many ways.

Nef was a sculptor. Being an artist is what made her a target for Morinth.

[Louis_Cypher]

Dean_the_Young wrote...
]It's in the codex of Justicars. 'A justicar would fight to the death to defend a village from bandits, but would then kill them all if she found they were all part of a smuggling cartel.'

Not seeing it.  Maybe I'm blind, but I've looked over the codex multiple times, and I don't see anything like that.  I do see: "Their methods range from subtle where possible, to brutal where necessary", which even implies that not everyone she punishes gets executed.

Smuggling is not a crime deserving execution anymore than adultry or sodomy.

Smuggling is a crime; execution is too extreme a punishment for it, but some level of punishment is just. Adultery and sodomy are not crimes in a free society.

Corruption is broad. If they didn't want to cite a broad category, they shouldn't have. Samara doesn't say she killed corrupt officials because they led to someone's death: she simply leaves it on the basis that they were corrupt.

It's a brief remark.  You can't expect her to give every detail.

Asari law does have due process. The Justicars aren't a part of the justice system: they are an extrajudicial organization Asari are awed by.

As I said before, extrajudicial is not the same as extralegal.  Liara specifically says Samara's not a criminal.  Dara says justicars "embody our highest laws".  She's outside the regular judicial process, clearly.  But there's no indication that she's acting outside the law.

I don't think what Garrus was doing on Omega was right or for the best either, so it's a pointless comparison.

I did say it wasn't an ideal situation.  But is your ideal response to Garrus to kill him and recruit Sidonis?  Or maybe Garm?

Are you sure that having a force on Omega that's actively working for justice, even a harsh sort, is worse than the purely mercenary ambitions of current powers?

It's not like she rejects the idea she could or would, either. She didn't think about going to Tuchanka or Omega until she saw them herself, and there certainly are injustices in the Citadel (up to the top, I'd say), and certainly in the slums of earth.

Except that she DOES see the Citadel, including Captain "I have an agreement" Bailey, and doesn't comment like she does on Omega.  A law enforcement officer admits to taking bribes, right in front of her, and she doesn't so much as comment.  Does that sound like she's eager to go vigilante on the Citadel? 

Samara doesn't have a warrant for applying Asari law anywhere or on anyone that doesn't accept the roles of the Justicars. The closest thing the Justicars have to a justification for their actions is that the Asari accept them. No one else has to, or must.

If you travel to another country, you have to respect and obey its laws.  In asari space, that means the risk of facing a justicar if you break asari law.  Note that, despite everyone's fears, she hasn't gone around killing people for dealing red sand or other things that are legal on Illium but illegal in asari space proper.

If worse comes to worse, she's already done more damage than Morinth.

As far as I can tell, she hasn't operated outside asari space before she came to Illium.  So all of her policing has been legal, and widely accepted by the populace.  It may not have the protections of "human" rights that I would like, but neither do the Spectres.  And I see rather more evidence of abuse of power among the Spectres than the justicars.  

No. Not every killing is a murder. She specifically points out that Nihlus killed an INNOCENT.

She doesn't know that. She just knew it was an unarmed civilian, and went from there. Nihlus's reasons or justifications were never known or mattered.

Again, we don't have all the details, but as far as I can tell Nihlus never attempted to offer any justifications or reasons.  It's understandable that Samara would jump to a conclusion.  And we don't have any evidence that the civilian wasn't innocent; Spectres are certainly allowed, and often willing, to kill innocents in the process of pursuing their goals.

[Dean_the_Young]

[quote]Louis_Cypher wrote...

[quote]Dean_the_Young wrote...
]It's in the codex of Justicars. 'A justicar would fight to the death to defend a village from bandits, but would then kill them all if she found they were all part of a smuggling cartel.'[/quote]
Not seeing it.  Maybe I'm blind, but I've looked over the codex multiple times, and I don't see anything like that.  I do see: "Their methods range from subtle where possible, to brutal where necessary", which even implies that not everyone she punishes gets executed.
[/quote]...this is perplexing and confusing, because I swear I read the line just a day ago, and it's in the Mass Effect wiki on Justicars, but not the codex. I'm going to need to playthrough the recruitment mission again: it may have been one of the asari police officers.


[quote]

[quote]Smuggling is not a crime deserving execution anymore than adultry or sodomy.[/quote]
Smuggling is a crime; execution is too extreme a punishment for it, but some level of punishment is just. Adultery and sodomy are not crimes in a free society.[/quote]Even in societies in which it is a crime, it doesn't deserve execution.

[quote]It's a brief remark.  You can't expect her to give every detail.[/quote]How is every detail needed, as opposed to a simple qualifier?

[quote]
I did say it wasn't an ideal situation.  But is your ideal response to Garrus to kill him and recruit Sidonis?  Or maybe Garm?[/quote]Sidonis isn't near to as good as Garrus. If Garm came with the Blood Pack to be used, it certainly wouldn't be a clear-cut call.

And, of course, Garrus isn't saying he'll kill me if I do things he doesn't like.
[quote]
Are you sure that having a force on Omega that's actively working for justice, even a harsh sort, is worse than the purely mercenary ambitions of current powers?[/quote]It isn't significantly better, it isn't an acceptable long-term justice, and when the side effects can be far worse (like, say, the next time Shepard goes to Omega, or trying to take down Aria), yes. It would be worse.

And it isn't that she's only going to be on Omega.

[quote]Except that she DOES see the Citadel, including Captain "I have an agreement" Bailey, and doesn't comment like she does on Omega.  A law enforcement officer admits to taking bribes, right in front of her, and she doesn't so much as comment.  Does that sound like she's eager to go vigilante on the Citadel? [/quote]It sounds a lot like a vigalente who's sworn an oath to go along with anything Shepard does for the duration of the oath.

[quote]If you travel to another country, you have to respect and obey its laws.  In asari space, that means the risk of facing a justicar if you break asari law.  Note that, despite everyone's fears, she hasn't gone around killing people for dealing red sand or other things that are legal on Illium but illegal in asari space proper.[/quote]Did you just forget we aren't talking about in Asari space? That we're talking about places outside of Asari space?


Bad laws should always be challenged and confronted as possible, regardless where they are.
[quote]As far as I can tell, she hasn't operated outside asari space before she came to Illium.  So all of her policing has been legal, and widely accepted by the populace.  It may not have the protections of "human" rights that I would like, but neither do the Spectres.  And I see rather more evidence of abuse of power among the Spectres than the justicars.  [/quote]She's outside Asari space now. She's shown repeated interest in staying outside of Asari space. What she is likely and capable of doing in the future is the cause of concern for her future actions.

I agree the Spectres should be brought to heel. Udina and the Human Council for reforms for the win.

[quote]Again, we don't have all the details, but as far as I can tell Nihlus never attempted to offer any justifications or reasons.  It's understandable that Samara would jump to a conclusion.  And we don't have any evidence that the civilian wasn't innocent; Spectres are certainly allowed, and often willing, to kill innocents in the process of pursuing their goals.
[/quote]Why should Nighlus have to justify himself to Samara, who's supposed to be respectful of Asari law, which recognizes the rights of Spectres?

We never have any indication Nihlus attempted to offer justification... nor does Samara once say she south any. If Samara's inclination after jumping to a conclusion is murder, that's a Bad Thing.

[Sajuro]

Stazro wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

Nef as a victim never make any sense.
Did she has the same chat with her like with shepardt,that she like power and danger.I doubt it.
Persons like Donovan Hock are far more likely to end as victims.

Nightwriter wrote...

She has a diverse palate. She hungers for people with that "spark". The spark can manifest itself in many ways.

Nef was a sculptor. Being an artist is what made her a target for Morinth.

and Shepard's medium just happens to be bullets

[Dean_the_Young]

And biotics, and bloodstains, and whatever geth fluid is called.

[forestsavage]

Am I actually the only one who is sympathetic and who always chooses Morinth over Samara?
Samara is a naive and deeply disturbed woman whose only goal in life is to end the lives of her children because of the flaw in her self and sees the world in black and white, this makes her useless as a tool against the Collectors and ultimately the Reapers. At least Morinth sees the world for what it is and only follows her biology when killing people, it's the way she was born; as a balance to the otherwise naive and static Asari. Morinth is flexible and able to do whatever is needed and is an ultimate survivor like my commander Shepard, she's also considerably more powerful than her mother at half the age so the potential is greater there as well.

Modifié par forestsavage, 09 novembre 2010 - 11:28 .

[tonnactus]

Nightwriter wrote...

She has a diverse palate. She hungers for people with that "spark". The spark can manifest itself in many ways.

That spark starts her interest.But that alone isnt enough regarding the game.The whole senseless thing with nef was only included to make the decision easy. I found that just stupid.

[TuringPoint]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Do I ever do acts that would obligate Samara to come after me once the code has expired, as she promised?

If the answer is yes, the possible threat is preferred to the promised one.

When Samara says, "If you make me do anything too dishonourable," she makes it quite clear that it's pretty much common sense.  If she is given reason to resent what you make her do.

You do have an interesting way of looking at it, I just see it differently.

Modifié par Alocormin, 10 novembre 2010 - 07:32 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Alocormin wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Do I ever do acts that would obligate Samara to come after me once the code has expired, as she promised?

If the answer is yes, the possible threat is preferred to the promised one.

When Samara says, "If you make me do anything too dishonourable," she makes it quite clear that it's pretty much common sense.  If she is given reason to resent what you make her do.

You do have an interesting way of looking at it, I just see it differently.

Samara considers corruption a crime worthy of extra-judicial execution. That is not common sense. Neither is the code of the Justicars about reasonableness, compromise, or extenuating circumstances.

[Stazro]

I'd like to drop a little something for this discussion. Let's first remember, this is not about what kind of a person Samara is, but about chosing Morinth over her or not.

The reasons for which Samara kills, are not considered as just unanimously. There is a controversy about wether the punishments provided by the code are reasonable in relation to the respective crimes. If someone can point me to a source where a certain degree of penalty is actually mentioned, I'd be thankful.
The reasons for which Morinth kills, are not considered as just by anyone. In fact, killing for your own pleasure is certainly one of the lowest conceivable motives to do so, in most societies that value life at all.

I don't know about you, but I don't think it would be defensible if someone, who is opposed to capital punishment would go shooting law enforcement officers, say from various US states, because the law they follow considers the death penalty as an adequate punishment.

It can happen that someone falls victim to Samara who hasn't done anything to deserve his death, although it is known that she has abandoned a mission before, in order to avoid it.
However, if that death serves a greater good, Samara accepts it. Renegade Shepard has no qualms with it, either.
It can happen that someone falls victim to Morinth who has deserved his death or at least leaves the world a better place without him.
However, Morinth couldn't care less. When Morinth takes lives, it serves no purpose, but her own satisfaction. Not even the most renegade Shepard does this. Why? Because he's not evil and Morinth is.

Now for some certain incidents with Samara's involvement that have been discussed:

The "defenseless-eclipse-merc-incident":
There has been complaint about Samara killing that Eclipse-merc in the first encounter with Shepard and that is one of the first dialogue options to express concern paragonstyle. A renegade Shepard would have no right to object in the first place, since he would have shot several defenseless people himself by that time (off the top of my head Fist, Shiala and probably more), just so they wouldn't get away.
It is also not far-fetched to assume that said eclipse-officer has committed a number of deeds considered a crime both on Illium and in Asari space, which like instigation to murder or perhaps murder itself are maybe (I'm not that intimate with Asari penal code...) punishable by death. Since justicars act not only as both prosecutor and judge, but also executor, what Shepard witnesses there is probably not an act of senseless violence, but simply administring sentence, sparing the convict an agonizing waiting time on death row.

The "village-incident":
Earlier it has been pointed out that Samara was willing to wipe out an entire village, while good Morinth only makes it offer her sacrifice. The concerning dialogue says quite clear that Morinth send the (mindcontrolled) villagers against her. I suppose no one suggests there had been enough time for some measurement of de-programming. Samara was attacked and she defended herself, in the process killing all attackers. She has pulled the trigger (or whatever way she did it), but responsible for the deaths of every single one of the villagers is Morinth. Morinth was the one who made them attack Samara, thus effectively killing them.
By the way, renegade Shepard has left refinery workers to burn, because saving them would prevent him from catching up to a criminal.

The "Nihlus-incident":
Let's think about the meaning of the often-cited statement concerning spectres being above the law. Spectres act on behalf of the council and for this, they are granted extensive privileges. But what a Spectre is allowed to do is logically limited by the limit of what the council would be allowed to do. Is the council allowed to decide someone's death just because they want to? Hardly. No civilized gouvernent can allow itself or be allowed to take lives without justification and the council is not even a sovereign ruler of the galaxy. So, following this reasoning, when a Spectre is encountered by an empowered representative of justice of a member race (which a justicar is at least by legal custom of the Asari) on said race's territory apparently committing an act that is considered a crime in said territory, it is imperative that said representative of justice has the authority to inquire and determine if said Spectre acted justified. In case of non-compliance it is consequential that said representative of justice initiates pursuit.[/legalese]
By the way, Renegade Shepard has once killed a Spectre on duty, when he wasn't one himself anymore, when he had no jurisdiction whatsoever.

Finally, the infamous "police station-incident":
First of all, it hasn't happened. Samara threatens to force her will by lethal force on someone who may have the right to impede her. Just as Shepard did on Noveria and Purgatory. Point made.
Nah, of course, I won't make it that easy for myself.
What is the reason for the detention? Anaya tells Shepard: "My bosses want to detain her. They're worried she'll cause some kind of cross species incident." Officer Dara has earlier said something similar, she asks Shepard if the alliance would understand Samara killing a human, since we humans can't even figure out our own religions.
So, basically Anaya's bosses don't want to prevent Samara from doing something illegal, but to prevent her from doing her job and the job the local police is too afraid to do, because of "diplomatic reasons". When someone on Illium says "diplomatic" she actually means: business. Anaya's bosses want to prevent Samara from serving justice, in order to protect business interests.
And she is not just some vigilante. She's a Justicar. Officer Dara tells Shepard some things about Justicars: "Justicars embody our highest laws. If you follow the laws you have nothing to fear and a Justicar would die without hesitation to protect the innocent. No law-abiding Asari would question a Justicar's orders."
It basically means, by ordering a Justicar's detention, Anaya's bosses set themselves in conflict with their own highest laws.
There's another interesting thing Officer Dara says: "But their code orders them to stop lawbreakers, with lethal force in most cases, and everyone skirts the law somehow on Illium." Makes you think they have their own skin in mind, when  they don't want a Justicar to roam freely in their city, but I'm not going that far to assume something.
Anyway, the detention is not lawfull and she has every right to resist.

A word on jurisdiction: It has been pointed out that Illium isn't in Asari space and thus doesn't fall under the authority of the Asari Republics, but I don't think it matters here. The authority of the Justicar order is not derived from a gouvernment. The submission under the Justicars' authority is a part religious, part cultural thing, shared by all Asari. I believe it is tied to individuals rather than territory.

Conclusion:

A Paragon Shepard doesn't really have a choice here. He can't possibly prefer to protect a wanted murderer over a seeker of justice. He doesn't even have to fear anything from Samara after the mission ends, because he has a pure conscience.

Renegade Shepard may consider choosing Morinth over Samara for one of the following reasons:

1. He thinks Morinth's powers are more useful than Samara's.
2. He wets his pants because he fears Samara will punish him for the "extremely dishonourable" things he made her do, while she was bound by oath.

Additionally, he should not forget who he is inviting on the ship. Morinth is addicted to taking people's lives. The Asari know her conditions for millenia, but there still is no cure to Morinth's condition. They know one remedy: A life of self-restriction, the life that Morinth's sisters have chosen and that they will live out in peace. Only Morinth made the selfish choice to knowingly unleash herself on the galaxy.

Morinth doesn't care about the mission, about the collectors, about the reapers. She has agreed to follow Shepard for two reasons:
1. If she hadn't she'd be dead.
2. She wants to feed on Shepard.
Sure, she is marked as "loyal", but that's only for gameplay purposes. The story gives no explanation why Morinth should ever be loyal to anyone and I think it would be logical if she tried to leave the ship as soon as she realizes, she won't succeed in seducing Shepard (or if she succeeds, but that's game over anyway). Since no one aboard beside Shepard knows her true identity that shouldn't be too hard to do.

When refering to Renegade Shepard, I'm not saying your Shepard has, but the "model" of a renegade Shepard that the game implies, has.

I should go.

Modifié par Stazro, 10 novembre 2010 - 06:43 .

[Xilizhra]

People like Jacob more than they like Morinth, which says a lot.

It is a bit odd, when one considers that Jack and Morinth are nigh-identical, with the main differences being that Jack is angrier and won't kill you if you **** her.

[AntiChri5]

There is a world of differebce between Jack an Morinth.

[Ashira Shepard]

As is probably obvious, I always choose Samara, but my thoughts on why have changed since my first playthrough. At first it felt like it was the right thing to do anyway to kill Morinth, I usually play paragade, so I saw no real threat to my Shepard and felt no need to figuratively shoot Samara in the back.



Now though, my thoughts are a little different. Killing Morinth now feels like mercy killing to me, based around how things must have been. If Morinth ran at 40, that's around equal to a 13 year old Human child running away from home. Now in a big scary galaxy, what horrors would've taken place to a child who just wanted to get away? I'm not trying to say she's completely blameless for her crimes, not at all, her actions were taken while she was fully aware of what she was doing.



But I'm pointing out that its not like she was born a psychopathic murderer from the start, things happen to break someone that badly. Is she a terrible person? yes. A straight forward murdering sociopath? I'm not so sure.

[Moiaussi]

[quote]Dean_the_Young wrote...

this is perplexing and confusing, because I swear I read the line just a day ago, and it's in the Mass Effect wiki on Justicars, but not the codex. I'm going to need to playthrough the recruitment mission again: it may have been one of the asari police officers.[/quote]

The wiki is player driven. It isn't official. As such it is subject to change and needs to be taken with a grain of salt regardless.

[quote]Even in societies in which it is a crime, it doesn't deserve execution.[/quote]

Wouldn't that depend on what was being smuggled? If someone was smuggling nukes, bio weapons or other WMD's would your opinion still apply? Note I live in a country with no capital punishment, so no crimes here are deemed to deserve execution. That said, if there is captial punishment, all smuggling isn't equal and some likely would be worthy of the death penalty.

Now, can you prove that the code treats all smuggling as worthy of execution? I am still waiting for you to present the full copy of the code you act like you have....

[quote]How is every detail needed, as opposed to a simple qualifier?[/quote]

How is even a simple qualifier 'needed?' If you misunderstand her, is the game ruined somehow?

[quote]Sidonis isn't near to as good as Garrus. If Garm came with the Blood Pack to be used, it certainly wouldn't be a clear-cut call.[/quote]

So pure skill is the only criteria for recruitment? Trustworthiness is assumed? Metagame much?

[quote]And, of course, Garrus isn't saying he'll kill me if I do things he doesn't like.[/quote]

Are you doing things he doesn't like though? You are saying that no matter what Shepard does, every member of his squad will support him like mindless idiots? If he randomly shot half the crew of the Normandy, for example? This isn't a matter of you deeming Samara 'bad' or 'wrong,' but one of you wanting to do things you feel she would object to, and being willing to kill her over that (which is neccessary if you choose Morinth).

[quote]It isn't significantly better, it isn't an acceptable long-term justice, and when the side effects can be far worse (like, say, the next time Shepard goes to Omega, or trying to take down Aria), yes. It would be worse.

And it isn't that she's only going to be on Omega.[/quote]

If she was to do that in the middle of the mission, yes that would be bad, but she has agreeed not to by way of her oath. Regardless, what makes you think she couldn't pull it off? Garrus took down pretty much the entirety of the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th major factions on Omega, mostly alone, albiet with Shepard's help at the end, including taking down there leadership. Strangely, you (as Shepard) not only didn't object to that, you helped him. And yet, when Samara talks about finishing the job, you balk. Why? Why aren't you wanting to shoot Garrus too?

It could also be wishful thinking on her part, or her just seeing how Shepard would react to get to know her commander better. You do not know her motives for any given thing she says.

[quote]It sounds a lot like a vigalente who's sworn an oath to go along with anything Shepard does for the duration of the oath.[/quote]

Someone who is actually considered a legitimate law enforcement officer working within their law is not known as a vigilante. You are the one who keeps insisting otherwise despite all evidence to the contrary. As for jurisdiction, the Citadel is Council space and the Asari are a Council race. Justicars might have status there. Regardless, she doesn't even comment on it.

[quote]Did you just forget we aren't talking about in Asari space? That we're talking about places outside of Asari space?

Bad laws should always be challenged and confronted as possible, regardless where they are.[/quote]

1) Did you forget that Illium seems to recognize Justicar authority (as proven by no objection to her having taken down those mercs and her word rendering evidence admissable).

2) You feel that bad laws should always be challenged and confronted, yet condemn Samara for threatening to resist being detained indefinately? Hypocracy?

[quote]She's outside Asari space now. She's shown repeated interest in staying outside of Asari space. What she is likely and capable of doing in the future is the cause of concern for her future actions.[/quote]

Illuim may be outside Asari space, but all the evidence suggests they have an Asari legal system, including respect for Justicars.

[quote]I agree the Spectres should be brought to heel. Udina and the Human Council for reforms for the win.[/quote]

And yet, you would rather Samara die than have her police you, even if a more diligent Council would condemn you for exactly the same actions.

[quote]Why should Nighlus have to justify himself to Samara, who's supposed to be respectful of Asari law, which recognizes the rights of Spectres?

We never have any indication Nihlus attempted to offer justification... nor does Samara once say she south any. If Samara's inclination after jumping to a conclusion is murder, that's a Bad Thing.
[/quote]

Didn't you just say "Bad laws should always be challenged and confronted as possible, regardless where they are"? We don't even know if whatever Nihilus was doing was neccessary or would have been "council approved" or even approved by you. When a spectre objects to your actions in LotSB, do you simply agree and/or surrender to her? Regardless of playing paragon or renegade?

[Moiaussi]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Samara considers corruption a crime worthy of extra-judicial execution. That is not common sense. Neither is the code of the Justicars about reasonableness, compromise, or extenuating circumstances.

The implication is that you consider corruption, regardless of how deep or the nature of such corruption, a wonderful thing that should at worst get a slap on the wrist.

You also seem overly concerned with jurisdiction as opposed to actual justice.

[Dean_the_Young]

Moiaussi wrote...

You know what? Same reasons I left the last thread are why I'm not going to bother continuing this argument with you.

Congratulations, Moiaussi. You won. Your clearly convincing arguments, hyperbole, strawmen, reducto ad absurdum fallacies, never supplied mitigating factors, and most importantly your endurance have won the argument.

Yay.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 10 novembre 2010 - 05:35 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Xilizhra wrote...

People like Jacob more than they like Morinth, which says a lot.

It is a bit odd, when one considers that Jack and Morinth are nigh-identical, with the main differences being that Jack is angrier and won't kill you if you **** her.

And that Jacob is pretty much an honest, moderate Paragon, and so most people's dislike is very shallow.

[Xilizhra]

I think the dislike comes from the fact that Jacob has very little personality; in the words of someone else, "a life-support system for his abs."

[Dean_the_Young]

Xilizhra wrote...

I think the dislike comes from the fact that Jacob has very little personality; in the words of someone else, "a life-support system for his abs."

'He's not interesting enough' is a very shallow basis for dislike.

[SimonTheFrog]

Stazro, nice post! And very true.

[Killjoy Cutter]

forestsavage wrote...

Am I actually the only one who is sympathetic and who always chooses Morinth over Samara?
Samara is a naive and deeply disturbed woman whose only goal in life is to end the lives of her children because of the flaw in her self and sees the world in black and white, this makes her useless as a tool against the Collectors and ultimately the Reapers. At least Morinth sees the world for what it is and only follows her biology when killing people, it's the way she was born; as a balance to the otherwise naive and static Asari. Morinth is flexible and able to do whatever is needed and is an ultimate survivor like my commander Shepard, she's also considerably more powerful than her mother at half the age so the potential is greater there as well.

You undermine your statement with multiple factual errors:

1)  Samara is only hunting Morinth, not all three of her children.  The other two daughters did not choose a life of sadistic psychosexual murder-for-thrills.

2)  Morinth does not need to kill.  She is not forced to choose between killing others and her own death.  Other Ardat-Yakski are able to live an entire Asari lifetime without murdering anyone. 

3)  Nothing we see between Morinth and Samara indicates that Morinth is more powerful. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Moiaussi wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Samara considers corruption a crime worthy of extra-judicial execution. That is not common sense. Neither is the code of the Justicars about reasonableness, compromise, or extenuating circumstances.

The implication is that you consider corruption, regardless of how deep or the nature of such corruption, a wonderful thing that should at worst get a slap on the wrist. 

Please don't appeal to false dichotomies.