13812 réponses à ce sujet

[Nerevar-as]

TobiTobsen wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Yaevinn's by far the most unlikable character in the series bar none. I couldn't wait to kill the bastard with my boy Siegfried during my first run of TW1.

I also found White Rayla to be pretty disgusting. That women had way to much fun fighting the elves... and what she did to Toruviel...

I was smirking when she got hit by the arrow. The icing on the cake was the fact that I could kill her again, this time myself, in the Salamandra hideout.

Those two are among the worst (in the evil sense) characters in the books. You get a good sense of Rayla in the games, but Yaevinn would feel at home with the Wild Hunt. Killing riders  for fun because they are human, he would even have killed Ciri when she was about 11 if not for Toruviel. He also attacks a hospital tent during Brenna (seeing they tended wounded from his side shcoked him a bit and Toruviel stopped him yet again).

[KnightofPhoenix]

Skelter192 wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...


It's really Bioware's recent trackrecord that pisses me off: and ToR. BS writing. 
  

Heh you have a TOR account?
 

No. Read and watched part of it.

Costin_Razvan wrote...

No, I
think he let her go to provoke Roche to do something stupid. Ves lied
to Roche not to blind him by rage over the rape I guess. Or something
similar.

The problem with that is that Ves mentions
she could still smell that swine on her ( her direct words ). So I
think she told Roche.

I think it's a lapsus and does not necessarily mean she had sex with him.

I think it's pretty obvious. She said Henselt just let her go. Geralt surmized that Henselt demanded sex in exchange for sparing the blue stripes, which of course he didn't do. We have a similar black and white flashback in Lilies and Vipers where geralt imagines what would happen if he says something.

As for why Henselt did it. Because he can. That's how it was, I'm sad to say. It was pretty much the norm, and when Henselt said that any wench would dream of being screwed by a king, well that was how they thought.  And that was in his character all the time (he can say that he is going to take Saskia's virginity). He was always a dick, a surprinsigly likeable one.

As for why the writers did it. It may be shock value to taunt you to kill him, which I'll be blunt think is a stupid decision for Geralt to do. And that's fine, because Henselt already had solid characterization and was multi-faceted enough that even his dick move didn't stop me from liking him. If it wasn't for that, let's face it Geralt would not have enough reason to kill Henselt, because yea killing the blue stripes makes sense, while what he did with Ves was just a bastardly move.

So I see no problem with what Henselt did at all, from a metagaming perspective. I still like him as a character a lot.

The problem is the lack of closure for Ves, but that's a seperate issue.

[KnightofPhoenix]

lol

[Costin_Razvan]

Of course it was the norm, but to me it just seems like being cruel just for the sake of being cruel which seemed out of place for Henselt, yes yes he is a dick but he never came off like that. Yes I like Henselt a lot myself but others don't and some of them would have killed him regardless of Ves or not.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 04:16 .

[Babli]

The thing with Ves is...

Henselt lost all his sons and because of his age, he was impotent. I cant say I remeber it correctly, but didnt Sheala, at one point in Act 1 or 2 say, that she was there also to try to "cure" Henselt, so he can have another son?

If so, it may be possible that Ves got pregnant and is having royal bastard. So even if someone kills Henselt in W2 and civil war ensues, this kid could unite them in same way as Anais.

[hangmans tree]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

lol

GOD LOL DAMN!  

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Of course it was the norm, but to me it just seems like being cruel just for the sake of being cruel. Yes I like Henselt a lot myself but others don't and some of them would have killed him regardless of Ves or not.

Yea it was cruel for the sake of it. So what? Nothing points to Henselt not being like that, when he threatens Saskia that he's going to take her virginity. Geralt said it best. People who think they are above the law because of divine right will tend to think they can do stuff like that and get away with it. That's the theme behind the whole Henselt ordeal. That's how Geralt ultimately justifies the choice of killing him. That people who think they are above the law should be punished to make them realize that they need to be held accountable.

Him killing the Blue Stripes was very much lawful and cannot really be criticized.

[Costin_Razvan]

Actually Phillipa mentions that Sile is going to use the Kayran parts for that if I recall correctly? So dunno, but really...

Well I guess it would touch on an interesting subject if Ves did give birth to Henselt's bastard child.

 So what? Nothing points to Henselt not being like that, when he threatens Saskia that he's going to take her virginity. 

Which only happens if you as the player decided to do that, yes this is me saying that without metagaming I wouldn't have known that because I always duel Saskia. This is why it seemed out of place to me, and even with Saskia he is trying to capture her since he knows that without her the rebel army is nothing, so even that has a bigger reason then just cruelty for the sake of cruelty.

 
That's how Geralt ultimately justifies the choice of killing him. That people who think they are above the law should be punished to make them realize that they need to be held accountable.  

Eh...right. Though I'd argue killing him doesn't acomplish that, and does Geralt actually say this if he lets Roche kill him?

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 04:21 .

[Nordicus]

Babli wrote...

If so, it may be possible that Ves got pregnant and is having royal bastard. So even if someone kills Henselt in W2 and civil war ensues, this kid could unite them in same way as Anais.

*slaps himself in the forehead*

OF COURSE! Damn, why didn't I think of that... well actually, lack of imagination I assume

Costin_Razvan wrote...

and does Geralt actually say this if he lets Roche kill him?

Yes, in Chapter 3 cartoon cinematic Geralt says this when you go rescue Anais

Modifié par Nordicus, 23 avril 2012 - 04:25 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

 So what? Nothing points to Henselt not being like that, when he threatens Saskia that he's going to take her virginity. 

Which only happens if you as the player decided to do that, yes this is me saying that without metagaming I wouldn't have known that because I always duel Saskia. This is why it seemed out of place to me, and even with Saskia he is trying to capture her since he knows that without her the rebel army is nothing, so even that has a bigger reason then just cruelty for the sake of cruelty.

He also says it on Iorveth's path IIRC. And he wanted to do more than capture her, he wanted to take her vriginity.

But even without that, I didn't see anything that really points to Henselt not being that kind of person. I think Foltest and Radovid are clearly not that kind of person, but honestly Henselt gave off that vibe to me from the beginning.
I really was not surprised when I learned of this.

The thing however is that Henselt is multi-faceted, which is why he is a great character.

 
That's how Geralt ultimately justifies the choice of killing him. That people who think they are above the law should be punished to make them realize that they need to be held accountable.  

Eh...right. Though I'd argue killing him doesn't acomplish that, and does Geralt actually say this if he lets Roche kill him?

Of course it doesn't, I think it's stupid to kill him even if I do agree with the premise, which I do. But yes that's what Geralt says in the flashback.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 23 avril 2012 - 04:28 .

[Costin_Razvan]

but honestly Henselt gave off that vibe to me from the beginning.
I really was not surprised when I learned of this.

Fair enough. To me though he just seemed like a bastard who would enjoy all the spoils of war, but not someone who would just enjoy inflicting suffering just for the hell of. Hell he doesn't seem to be the biggest fan of Dethmold, who unlike Henselt only does what is necesary to get his job done.

Of course it doesn't, I think it's stupid to kill him even if I do agree with the premise, which I do. But yes that's what Geralt says in the flashback.

Speaking about the premise...well prisons are full of people who don't regret anything they've done, so I don't think it's something that works really well. Though there are a few cases of people here and there who do repent.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 04:36 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Costin_Razvan wrote...
Fair enough. To me though he just seemed like a bastard who would enjoy all the spoils of war, but eh. I never really cared that much about him in the beginning and I found Dethmold a vastly more interesting character.

I didn't like Henselt that much either until my 2nd Roche playthrough. That's when I realized that he's a great character.

EDIT: it's not just suffering for the hell of it. He's ploughing a woman he finds attractive. He's getting physical pleasure out of it. 

Speaking about the premise...well prisons are full of people who don't regret anything they've done, so I don't think it's something that works really well. Though there are a few cases of people here and there who do repent.

From my perspective, whether the criminals repent or not while desirable is ultimately irrelevent to the premise itself. The punishment might not be perfect, but I dread to think what would happen without punishment that can keep people in line. I am the kind of person who believes that with the collapse of norms, conventions and / or law, almost everyone becomes a criminal. Reminds me of what Adam Jensen says in the Illuminati ending

Which is not to say that the whole penal system shouldn't be reformed.

And I personally am in favor of the death penalty, for the simple and some would say very cold, reason that some people are just a waste of money.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 23 avril 2012 - 04:40 .

[Costin_Razvan]

The punishment might not be perfect, but I dread to think what would happen without punishment that can keep people in line.

Certainly that is the goal of the prison system at the moment, but while it removes criminals from society so they don't cause harm it needs to be improved.

And I personally am in favor of the death penalty, for the simple and some would say very cold, reason that some people are just a waste of money.

Call me a naive christian fool but I strongly disagree with killing another human being. I understand the cold pragmatism of it very well but doesn't mean I have to like it. Hell it's the main reason I generally try and not kill people in video games.

So yes. I disagree with the Death Penalty just to free up resources. I can use the example of my own country here: We have a very low rate of murders and we don't have the death sentence.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 04:48 .

[Sebby]

Some art of the best character that don't appear in TW1

[KnightofPhoenix]

Obviously the death penalty is not the solution. The penal system in general is not. The solution lies in addressing the root causes. My support of capital punishment is only to spare resources when they are clearly wasted in order to deal with the root causes.

[Costin_Razvan]

It does actually, provided you make certain choices Seb.

 
Obviously the death penalty is not the solution. The penal system in general is not. The solution lies in addressing the root causes. My support of capital punishment is only to spare resources when they are clearly wasted in order to deal with the root causes.  

Fair enough. Though perhaps those resources could instead be taken from all that money spent in making sure prisoners have good conditions. ( I am looking at you Norway ).

Speaking about Norway however, I think the worst they could do with that anti-radical Islamist is to kill him. 

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 05:07 .

[Sebby]

Really? I can't recall seeing them. I presume the top one is for refusing to have him join you to fight the cockatrice but I only remember seeing a shot where he's swinging his torch at some bats.

[Khayness]

Seboist wrote...

Really? I can't recall seeing them. I presume the top one is for refusing to have him join you to fight the cockatrice but I only remember seeing a shot where he's swinging his torch at some bats.

Yep, but you have to visit him on guard duty he got as punishment.

The lower I think is tied to the quest Gold Rush.

[Costin_Razvan]

Linking this again, a tribute video for the game: www.youtube.com/watch

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 06:02 .

[HoonDing]

I don't think Henselt raped Ves. I also don't think he left her alive to spite Roche. We know for a fact that Ves did confront Henselt in his tent about the fate of the Blue Stripes - and I think that is the reason why Henselt left her alive. It impressed him (also keep in mind how Ves had fought against Geralt in the arena).

And from the books (Blood of Elves, his attitude towards Queen Meve) and his attitude towards Saskia, it is clear Henselt respects strong (and beautiful) women.

Modifié par HoonDing, 23 avril 2012 - 06:54 .

[Sebby]

Queen Meve would be a good "new" character for TW3.

[Chromie]

Jan Bartkowicz wrote...

No regrets. I left because I wanted to do something else. Next FWH game has no chance to be as epic as TW2 (it's a small budget FPS). For me it's all about learning new stuff.

In the future I would love to own an independent studio, working on some revolutionary single player RPG. But that's just wishing.

Best of luck to you Jan maybe you'll get to work on some RPG's in the future!

[KnightofPhoenix]

HoonDing wrote...

I don't think Henselt raped Ves. I also don't think he left her alive to spite Roche. We know for a fact that Ves did confront Henselt in his tent about the fate of the Blue Stripes - and I think that is the reason why Henselt left her alive. It impressed him (also keep in mind how Ves had fought against Geralt in the arena).

And from the books (Blood of Elves, his attitude towards Queen Meve) and his attitude towards Saskia, it is clear Henselt respects strong (and beautiful) women.

The flashback and what he potentially tells Saskia contradicts what you're saying.
Meve is a Queen. Saskia is a peasant rouser and Ves is a commoner.

[HoonDing]

Seboist wrote...

Queen Meve would be a good "new" character for TW3.

If she and Francesca Findabair won't be in TW3, me will be very angry and disappointed.

Dol Blathanna and Lyria are both on the way to Nilfgaard, after all. It makes sense to visit both.

[Costin_Razvan]

Forget what he tells Saskia, consider what Henselt himself says when Geralt asks him about raping Ves: "Did she complain to you? I thought she liked it, she squeaked like an unoiled hinge."

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 23 avril 2012 - 07:20 .