138 réponses à ce sujet

[upsettingshorts]

AlexXIV wrote...

Well the other question is, would you really want to run around in armor all day? Even if you are not fighting, and say, go shopping in Denerim? How is wearing armor all day more realistic than not doing it anyway?

That's a good point. While not wearing armor in situations where the characters expect to be in combat does require suspension of disbelief, the idea that you'll just wear it all the time just in case is pretty absurd as well.

Granted, being able to customize your inventory would mean switching between normal clothes and armor when contextually appropriate if the player so desired, but if the companions' armor/clothing is fixed we can't do that.

Still, fixed outfits are going to demand some mild suspension of disbelief about something at some time or another.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 11 novembre 2010 - 09:48 .

[Fishy]

Aermas wrote...

leonia42 wrote...

Aermas wrote...

Lomopingseph wrote...

Armor is for the weak.

& death is for the unprepared. Armor gives you survivability it is just plain ludicrous that your companions wouldn't wear armor. The 300 Spartans wore bronze breastplates & bronze helms, & leather peripheral armor. Armor stops you from taking a sword in the gut. Plot armor is for pansies. Real men wear plate.

Armour that doesn't protect your gut.. well won't be protecting your gut. Look at Leonidas there. Yes, it's fictional so the rules are bent a little bit. Also, have you ever worn plate? That stuff is really hard to move around in and takes forever to put on and take off. Most men wore chainmail, much more practical.

The companions do wear armour in the game, it just might not be your idea of realistic armour, however. But that's the beauty of a fictional setting isn't it.

Yes I have worn plate (it's not called plate mail that is an inaccuracy) & I have worn 4-1 mail. Plate armor feels like very light weight sports gear. It does take a minute to put on but after that it isn't an issue. Mail on the other hand weighs on the shoulders heavily & when in battle shift it's weight & throws you of balance if you aren't trained. Mail was worn not because it was preferable but because it was cheap & an unskilled laborer could make it instead of a trained smith. I think you have been reading too much Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court.

So if you was an adventurer in a world where magery and fireball it's common (For you to fight)Running hundred of miles .. Adventuring in the world! ..  You opt to fight tons of ennemy into something like that?Walking in plate armor in your driveway might be different  than fighting for week in dungeons.


I prefeer studded armor.

Modifié par Suprez30, 11 novembre 2010 - 09:49 .

[Sir JK]

Just to point something out regarding the maille/plate discussion. They're not contemptories. The plate gradually replaced the maille (actually it replaced the brigandine type armours, which had replaced pure maille). They didn't coexist (excepts as parts of the same suits of armour. Plate cuirass and maille for the limbs for example).

The primary difference is that maille is very poor at stopping arrows (but quite good at everything else) where plate is very good at it (not inpenetrable mind). They costed about as much to make (maille is more labour intensive though, so all other things being equal maille is more expensive), are about as cumbersome (if you got a proper suit that fits you like a glove that is), and were at their heyday worn by comparatively the same amount of soldiers (all of them except the skirmish screen).



On topic:

A thing about armour is that it is actually a thing of war. You don't don it unless you have a chance to prepare for battle (soldiers are always prepared on the march). In many cities in Europe, the town watch explicitely forbade people from wearing armour within the city walls on pain of death. Why? Because you only don armour if you prepare for combat. So donning armour in a city means you expect a fight. The town watch's job is to keep the peace. Thus they forbade armour.

The idea that people actually wear armour outside of battles and warfare is a old trope of fantasy, just like that you can be a decent shot with the longbow if you're a lithe and dextrous character. Neither is particulary true (jousts, parades and ceremonies are of course exempt).



That said, I fully endorese wearing armour in game. But to expect everyone to wear armour out of some sense of realism is a flawed premise. Plenty of people never wore armour outside of war. They still fought and killed each others. They still got -very- good at fighting. As a point of reference, many fechtbuchs dedicate a large amount of their pages for unarmoured manouvers for duels. Unarmoured fighting was not possible. It was common.



As such, the fact that some characters (from what we've seen only) haven't any armour is not a big deal to me.



Besides, it's probably a bit premature to tell. For all we know most of those actually do acquire armour early.

[Lotion Soronarr]

No different than walking trough town with a large backpack...easier actually, as the weight is distributed evenly.



And reason to go running when you're off shopping?

[AlexXIV]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Well the other question is, would you really want to run around in armor all day? Even if you are not fighting, and say, go shopping in Denerim? How is wearing armor all day more realistic than not doing it anyway?

That's a good point. While not wearing armor in situations where the characters expect to be in combat does require suspension of disbelief, the idea that you'll just wear it all the time just in case is pretty absurd as well.

Granted, being able to customize your inventory would mean switching between normal clothes and armor when contextually appropriate if the player so desired, but if the companions' armor/clothing is fixed we can't do that.

Still, fixed outfits are going to demand some mild suspension of disbelief about something at some time or another.

Yeah I was thinking what game mechanic would be necessary to make the player put on his armor when needed and wearing casual clothes when not. Obviously wearing armor does neither slow you down or disturb you in any other way. We will just have to settle with it being not real life, but a game

[Fishy]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

No different than walking trough town with a large backpack...easier actually, as the weight is distributed evenly.

And reason to go running when you're off shopping?

Now if i go to a battlefield .. yes..
But i prefeer my practical armor when adventuring.

So you're going to shop with a huge backpack + a platemail ?

Merchand : Why plate armor?
Hero : You never know *look around nervously*

Modifié par Suprez30, 11 novembre 2010 - 09:52 .

[AlexXIV]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

No different than walking trough town with a large backpack...easier actually, as the weight is distributed evenly.

And reason to go running when you're off shopping?

Maybe you should buy yourself a platemail cuirass and wear it every day for like a month and see how comfy it is in everyday situation. Like if you are trying to grab your purse or go for a dinner in a restaurant or even just for a walk in park. I mean there is a reason why we all wear clothes and not armor, even though probably armor would be saver.

[Fishy]

AlexXIV wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

No different than walking trough town with a large backpack...easier actually, as the weight is distributed evenly.

And reason to go running when you're off shopping?

Maybe you should buy yourself a platemail cuirass and wear it every day for like a month and see how comfy it is in everyday situation. Like if you are trying to grab your purse or go for a dinner in a restaurant or even just for a walk in park. I mean there is a reason why we all wear clothes and not armor, even though probably armor would be saver.

Lol imagine it .. You run across the wood with your companions.Suddently you hear a NOISE!!!

Hero :The PLATE ARMOR!!! FAST!!!! FIght might HAPPENS!

ZIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIP

HERO:YEAH i'm READY! Bring it on!

*See a squirrel looking at you*

Varric : Sight .. Why i signed with this bozo?

[Dingul]

Why some guys are talking about the cubersome of the steel plate armour and that wearing it will make it difficult for the user to even walk. This guy here seems to take it pretty well.

[Arassi]

I think the real question is which is scarier? Someone dressed in plate armor? Or a naked crazy person waving a sword running at you?

[Dingul]

Definately a guy dressed in menacing plate armor. I also feel that when I get slain, I at least have some dignity that I was killed by a guy in awesome looking clothes. As for the naked crazy guy, I'll probably die from sheer laughter rather than his blade.

It's a common fact that REAL men use armor and sometimes PAULDRONS! Or gigantic collars that block all peripheral vision and adds 9999999999999+ intelligence (in turn, gives the tactical genius ability).

Modifié par Dingul, 11 novembre 2010 - 12:36 .

[JoHnDoE14]

It troubles me a bit, that's for sure, but I think that a decent explanation will be given

When the explanation will be given, however, is an excellent question...

[Lotion Soronarr]

AlexXIV wrote...
Maybe you should buy yourself a platemail cuirass and wear it every day for like a month and see how comfy it is in everyday situation. Like if you are trying to grab your purse or go for a dinner in a restaurant or even just for a walk in park. I mean there is a reason why we all wear clothes and not armor, even though probably armor would be saver.

Don't be redicolous. Of coruse you won't be wearing plate armor for everyday simpel activities. Not only it's unlikely you could afford it, but you wouldn't wear ANY armor for every day activities. So thats a downright stupid argument.

If you're going to a dangeroud dungeon, to a area where you expect comabt, than any armor is advised - the better the armor, the better. If you wear heavy armor, you pack lightly.

At the end of the day, a soldier in plate and with basic gear ends up carrying roughly the same as your average modern soldier. They don't fall off from fatigue after marching a few miles, now do they? It is tireing, but so is scale mail. Chainmail even moreso. Hence why soldeirs have to be fit... war and adventuring is no job for a couch potato anyway.

[Ziggeh]

Aermas wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Aermas wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I'm telling you, Thedas metals while solid take quite a bit to puncture flesh, partly because of lack of developing such technology because of Magic which has rendered technological advancements mostly pointless, so even though Dragon Age takes place in the future much of their tech is both advanced and really really old.

What kind of backwards logic is this? Magic didn't hinder technological advancement. Our old world had it's "magic" Roman soldiers would preform "spells" before battle, it didn't make them shirk wearing armor.

Their magic isn't reality like Thedas magic

Really can you tell me which incantations that may be lacking from our or their libraries of arcane study?

This really doesn't need saying, but I'm a pedant.

In reality "magic" is formal or informal ritual designed to make people feel differently about certain things. It is essentially prayer. In Thedas magic is a demonstrable method of creating and using energy from out of thin air.

Very few accounts of pre industrial warfare involve skeletons, enemies paralysed by ethereal tendrils or waves of cold that temporarily turn men into ice. And I'm fairly sure that sort of thing would have been noticed.

[Lotion Soronarr]

www.youtube.com/watch

Also, in Ye Olde days, people believen in magic, even without the flashiness.

[tmp7704]

AlexXIV wrote...

Well the other question is, would you really want to run around in armor all day? Even if you are not fighting, and say, go shopping in Denerim? How is wearing armor all day more realistic than not doing it anyway?

If anything that's an extra strike against the concept of fixed character appearance, isn't it? No single design fits all situations.

In DAO i had the fighters wear light stuff and clothing in town, and armour in Deep Roads. Because yeah, it made more sense and i could.

[Aermas]

I don't care if they wear clothes in Kirkwall, as long as the game has armor penalties in effect, but when I decide to leave Kirkwall, Carver &/or Aveline better be in at least a coat of plates. If you have ever seen Brigandine it looks like a doublet. So it's not like it's a huge stretch of the imagination to think that they have armored clothing but they need to give in-game penalties/excuses for not wearing armor.

[Aermas]

 

This is not hard to run around in

[Embrosil]

Aermas wrote...

 Why isn't anyone wearing armor?

Because they found it a great idea in ME2 and even thousands of threads telling them how idiotic it is could not change their mind.

[filetemo]

wait a second



is people questioning the need of armor in a medieval fantasy game?



really?

[upsettingshorts]

filetemo wrote...

wait a second

is people questioning the need of armor in a medieval fantasy game?

really?

I'd question the "need" for including something within anything that's described as fantasy.

[filetemo]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

filetemo wrote...

wait a second

is people questioning the need of armor in a medieval fantasy game?

really?

I'd question the "need" for including something within anything that's described as fantasy.

no, you're just antagonizing to the max the opposite side of the discussion.
questioning armor in a medieval based rpg... come on.

[upsettingshorts]

filetemo wrote...
no, you're just antagonizing to the max the opposite side of the discussion.
questioning armor in a medieval based rpg... come on.

No. I'm actually thinking that some characters will have armor and some won't, but the fact Isabela probably won't be donning much of it isn't going to bother me one iota, Aermas' - and apparently your - militancy on the subject notwithstanding.

It's not like all warriors in fantasy wear a ton of armor, either, you know. 

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 12 novembre 2010 - 03:25 .

[Xewaka]

I think part of the problem is that we haven't seen yet the PC or any companion wearing anything which deserves the name of "proper armor" for DA:2, yet.

I, for one, would like to see if massive armor still looks as good.

[upsettingshorts]

Well, we've seen Cassandra wearing a pretty nifty set of armor. Not the PC or a (likely) companion, but still - there it is.