724 réponses à ce sujet

[NamiraWilhelm]

Definitely not, but if we knew the main reasons people were so attached to their wardens, perhaps then we could determine how much strict continuation would be needed. If it wasnt based on the choices they had made, we'd know how lax we could be on mentioning every single scenerio

[Ziggeh]

Nozybidaj wrote...

So your answer is yes, they all go away.  Does that make a sequel mutually exculsive with having the Warden?  I couldn't possibly see how, so that question is obvioulsy rhetorical.  In the end it doesn't really matter I suppose, but folks claiming that a sequel including the Warden would have been "impossible" are obviously exaggerting.  Now whether it is the right thing to do or not is another question entirely.

My answer was "to an extent", I wasn't quite that declarative. and I'm not saying that a Warden PC is impossible, the fact that they already did that in Awakenings would make that position nonsensical. Im saying that the only reason I can see for continuing with the Warden would be to engage in the world that you've created, at least at some level. And that, while again, not literally impossible, would be such a problem in terms of resources that I don't see how it could be done. At least well.

[Ziggeh]

NamiraWilhelm wrote...

Definitely not, but if we knew the main reasons people were so attached to their wardens, perhaps then we could determine how much strict continuation would be needed. If it wasnt based on the choices they had made, we'd know how lax we could be on mentioning every single scenerio

He was a blank canvas you could project onto. Like Neo in the Matrix. I suspect you'd find the reasons are as numerous as the people with them, but I do agree, it's an interesting question to ask, if only because it would make people think about the way they engage with stories, something I find fascinating in myself and others,

[Wulfram]

I have a lot more faith in Bioware's ability to make a new story with the Warden work, than for them to make a new story with Morrigan work without the Warden.

[DAO - Grey Warden]

StingingVelvet wrote...

Am I the only one just baffled by the "controversy" over this? Since when was it mandatory, or even common, for a sequel RPG to use the same exact main character? Fallout 2, Diablo 2, Deus Ex 2, Elder Scrolls 2-4, Fable 2-3, NWN2, etc... heck, in videogaming in general it's not even common, GTA2-4, Doom 3, Assassin's Creed 2, Rainbow Six 2-5, BioShock 2, Mafia 2, STALKER, etc...

Sure, some series have a very focused main character like Mass Effect's Shepherd or Splinter Cell's Sam Fisher, but for the most part games are not the same as movies where a big actor is usually identified with a series, thus he/she stars in every sequel. Games have more freedom than that.

Honestly I am happier it isn't the warden, rather than the opposite.

Thats fine....but some people who have played more than 60 or 70 hours with the same charachter, they want the story of the same guy to continue. i also. but i understand that bioware wants to move on with the story and achieve something different like they have with dragon age origins. is the wardens story over? no.....whether he will be mentioned or we will see him or will he be tied to some other charachter like Alistar or Morrigan, we will see. will we play again as the warden? i dont know, but like david gaider sad - warden wont be discluded from dragon age universe.  people get attached to their charachters

[Ziggeh]

Wulfram wrote...

I have a lot more faith in Bioware's ability to make a new story with the Warden work, than for them to make a new story with Morrigan work without the Warden.

I think that depends on what she and her baby mean for Thedas as a whole.

[NamiraWilhelm]

I suppose them projecting themselves onto that blank canvas is definitely the likely reason.



Do you think people would agree to a second origins if there was a set history (to a degree) we would have to adhere to, in order to carry over into it? Or would that totally defeat the purpose for most people?

[Nozybidaj]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

I have a lot more faith in Bioware's ability to make a new story with the Warden work, than for them to make a new story with Morrigan work without the Warden.

I think that depends on what she and her baby mean for Thedas as a whole.

DA3: Return of Morrigan and the God Baby, starring Umslopogaas as the PC
~ dramatic scene where Morrigan and the god baby finally meet Umslopogaas~
Morrigan:  *dramatic villain monologue voice* I am Morrigan, witch of the wilds, behold my god baby of ultimate power!
Umslopogaas :  Who?

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to that.

[Itkovian]

Nozybidaj wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

I have a lot more faith in Bioware's ability to make a new story with the Warden work, than for them to make a new story with Morrigan work without the Warden.

I think that depends on what she and her baby mean for Thedas as a whole.

DA3: Return of Morrigan and the God Baby, starring Umslopogaas as the PC
~ dramatic scene where Morrigan and the god baby finally meet Umslopogaas~
Morrigan:  *dramatic villain monologue voice* I am Morrigan, witch of the wilds, behold my god baby of ultimate power!
Umslopogaas :  Who?

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to that.

And this is _precisely_ what David Gaider said would not happen in one of his earlier replies. If Hawke or some other PC runs into Morrigan later on in the series (or DA2), it will not be that dramatically dissapointing. There will be significance in that meeting.

How? Because as the writers of the game, they get to control how dramatic and significant a character's entrance is. So when we see Morrigan again, it'll be significant even if it's Hawke or some other PC meeting her. However it is done, the Warden's contributions to Morrigan's story (or, conversely, Morrigan's contributions to the Warden's story) will be known to the protagonist.

Itkovian

[StingingVelvet]

DAO - Grey Warden wrote...

Thats fine....but some people who have played more than 60 or 70 hours with the same charachter, they want the story of the same guy to continue.

The fact I put 60 hours (85 with Awakening) into that character is one of the reasons I want it NOT to be her next time.

[Itkovian]

StingingVelvet wrote...

DAO - Grey Warden wrote...

Thats fine....but some people who have played more than 60 or 70 hours with the same charachter, they want the story of the same guy to continue.

The fact I put 60 hours (85 with Awakening) into that character is one of the reasons I want it NOT to be her next time.

I put 100+ hours with the Neverarine in Morrowind, and I didn't mind playing a completely different character in Oblivion.

Sometimes a character's journey is contained within a single game or movie or book. It was in Morrowind, and it was in DAO (even the lead writer says it was).

Itkovian

[DAO - Grey Warden]

StingingVelvet wrote...

DAO - Grey Warden wrote...

Thats fine....but some people who have played more than 60 or 70 hours with the same charachter, they want the story of the same guy to continue.

The fact I put 60 hours (85 with Awakening) into that character is one of the reasons I want it NOT to be her next time.

well, everyone is different

[Ziggeh]

Itkovian wrote...

And this is _precisely_ what David Gaider said would not happen in one of his earlier replies. If Hawke or some other PC runs into Morrigan later on in the series (or DA2), it will not be that dramatically dissapointing. There will be significance in that meeting.

How? Because as the writers of the game, they get to control how dramatic and significant a character's entrance is. So when we see Morrigan again, it'll be significant even if it's Hawke or some other PC meeting her. However it is done, the Warden's contributions to Morrigan's story (or, conversely, Morrigan's contributions to the Warden's story) will be known to the protagonist.

Indeed. I have to admit that I to imagine it happening in much the same way as Nozy, but this is why they are writers for an internationally successful story based video game and I'm some guy who posts on a forum.

[Nozybidaj]

Itkovian wrote...

I put 100+ hours with the Neverarine in Morrowind, and I didn't mind playing a completely different character in Oblivion.

Sometimes a character's journey is contained within a single game or movie or book. It was in Morrowind, and it was in DAO (even the lead writer says it was).

You're not quite accurate there, as I actually am playing (or did anyway) the same character in Oblivion as I did in MW.  Beth leaves their games and PC's open enough to interpretation as to allow just about anything.  Trying to compare that to a BW game with very defined protagonists isn't really a valid comparison.

[Nozybidaj]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Indeed. I have to admit that I to imagine it happening in much the same way as Nozy, but this is why they are writers for an internationally successful story based video game and I'm some guy who posts on a forum.

You don't have to be a professional boxer to know you don't want to get hit in the face by Mike Tyson.

Edit:  Of course if we follow conventional forum wisdom though you would have to "try it before you say you don't like it".  I wonder how well that would go for those folks?

Modifié par Nozybidaj, 18 novembre 2010 - 08:55 .

[Blacklash93]

Maybe we'll hear something about what the Warden decided to do after Witch Hunt. Maybe how he/she reacted to whatever was in the book Morrigan left for us.

[Ziggeh]

Nozybidaj wrote...
You don't have to be a professional boxer to know you don't want to get hit in the face by Mike Tyson.

Is this an analogy? What is Tyson representing?

[Nozybidaj]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...
You don't have to be a professional boxer to know you don't want to get hit in the face by Mike Tyson.

Is this an analogy? What is Tyson representing?

Hit in the face by Tyson = Awkard and contrived resolution of plot threads, see earlier example.

Edit:  I suppose Tyson would equal Mr. Gaider.  That should be a fairly ego stroking comparison.

Modifié par Nozybidaj, 18 novembre 2010 - 08:59 .

[Ziggeh]

Nozybidaj wrote...
Hit in the face by Tyson = Awkard and contrived resolution of plot threads, see earlier example.

You don't have to be a profession writer to write a contrived resolution of plot thread?

Sorry, I'm being pedantic. I understand what you mean, I just don't think that's an accurate analogy. Use of language is probably a bit ad hominem.

Modifié par ziggehunderslash, 18 novembre 2010 - 09:02 .

[Nozybidaj]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...
Hit in the face by Tyson = Awkard and contrived resolution of plot threads, see earlier example.

You don't have to be a profession writer to write a contrived resolution of plot thread?

Sorry, I'm being pedantic. I understand what you mean, I just don't think that's an accurate analogy. Use of language is probably a bit ad hominem.

No, you don't have to be a pro-writer to know you don't like one.  Was the example really that complicated?  I thought it was fairly straight forward.

[Addai]

Registering an apathy vote. I like my Wardens, but I don't need to see them in a new game, especially if it can't be implemented well. It would be fun to hear gossip about them, though. The more twisted and nonsensical the better.

[Ziggeh]

Nozybidaj wrote...
No, you don't have to be a pro-writer to know you don't like one.  Was the example really that complicated?  I thought it was fairly straight forward.

I see, I was saying that they probably know how to get around the problem.

[Ortaya Alevli]

Addai67 wrote...

Registering an apathy vote. I like my Wardens, but I don't need to see them in a new game, especially if it can't be implemented well. It would be fun to hear gossip about them, though. The more twisted and nonsensical the better.

Three greased nugs between the sheets come to mind.

[Faust1979]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

NamiraWilhelm wrote...

Definitely not, but if we knew the main reasons people were so attached to their wardens, perhaps then we could determine how much strict continuation would be needed. If it wasnt based on the choices they had made, we'd know how lax we could be on mentioning every single scenerio

He was a blank canvas you could project onto. Like Neo in the Matrix. I suspect you'd find the reasons are as numerous as the people with them, but I do agree, it's an interesting question to ask, if only because it would make people think about the way they engage with stories, something I find fascinating in myself and others,

But the Warden wasn't a blank slate, The Warden has 6 different origin stories each with a background that tell who they are, where they came from so he/she isn't a blank slate at all. You get to choose they're dialogue, whether they are good or evil or somwhere in between but who they're families are, what the lifestyle they do is already all pre chosen. So not a blank slate at all