276 réponses à ce sujet

[Revan312]

Malanek999 wrote...

Every single one of those is related to the control sceme. Which one of those is unrelated to the control scheme?

They have nothing to do with the controls themselves, they're gameplay changes which change aspects that once were, for both versions. But not having hotkeys for anything besides powers, no mouse wheel support for text entries and a single key that does three seperate things when on a keyboard you have a ton of unused realestate to seperate them on is sloppy porting, period.  ME1 was ported to be a PC game, ME2 was a sloppy hand me down of the XBox 360 version..

I just hope we don't get the same in DA2..

[Onyx Jaguar]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Maria: Wow! I beat the giant spider queen! I am so awesome.
Game: Thank you Mario! But our Branka is in another castle.

Because the greatest innovation of JRPGs (ok so Mario isn't but I swear I'm goin' somewhere with this) is the endless stream of end bosses at the end of the game that can completely destroy you if you are unequiped for the fight even if the previous 60 hours you were perfectly well suited.

In Dragon Age: Origins, lets put this in the middle of the game!

*cues Deep Roads*

Actually the Circle Quest also traps you but I don't think the difficulty factor isn't that much of a jump compared to the rest...

[Malanek]

Revan312 wrote...
They have nothing to do with the controls themselves, they're gameplay changes which change aspects that once were, for both versions.

You are wrong here. The targetting assist for instance is different in ME2 between the PC and X-Box versions to take into account the difference between the mouse and the gamestick. In ME1 it was the same, as far as I am aware, which led to PC gamers being able to hit targets quite a few pixels away from where the target actually is. If it was different for the PC it was an absolutely terrible implementation.

And even if it was a game change that led to the controls working better for both platforms, why is this undebateable?

[Lord_Anthonior]

The only thing that I don't like much so far of DA2 in the design is if the Demo and gameplays shown before are true to the game, then the way the characters portraits appear, I like it better the circle portraits to the left and top instead of the 2 bars for life and stamina or mana on the left bottom corner, that's is one thing I would've prefered to remain the same way.

[Brockololly]

Lord_Anthonior wrote...

The only thing that I don't like much so far of DA2 in the design is if the Demo and gameplays shown before are true to the game, then the way the characters portraits appear, I like it better the circle portraits to the left and top instead of the 2 bars for life and stamina or mana on the left bottom corner, that's is one thing I would've prefered to remain the same way.

Agree 100%.

I really don't care for the look of the new portraits and the health/mana/stamina bars take up way too much room. And shoving them down in the bottom left takes up too much valuable screen space where most of the action occurs anyway.

[ProfessionalPirate]

I agree, but I hold out hope that will change. I believe the devs said it was a demo made a few month ago and doesn't reflect the game as it is now, and well, a lot can change in six months (four months now). and portraits are probably easy to change

[Rake21]

For me, while it's not a terrible thing, I am a little disapointed with the addition of a dialogue wheel.

[hexaligned]

Numero Uno: Game length. If an RPG isn't at least 50-60 hours long, I feel I've been robbed. I've never played one that could fit both a decent story arc, and gameplay, into a shorter length than that. Something always ends up suffering, the game feels incomplete and rushed to me. Right now (other than lack of a toolset) this is the one thing that has me being "ehhhh" about DA2.



2: Being a Pantheist , I usually try and RP a more neutral, nature minded/greater good type character, as it helps me relate more to the story and get more intellectually involved in it.

Bioware (in general) is pretty bad about shoehorning you into only being able to "RP" very select roles, usually polar extreams. The dialogue in DAO felt restricting enough, it seems like it's going to be even more so in DA2.

[Revan312]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Maria: Wow! I beat the giant spider queen! I am so awesome.
Game: Thank you Mario! But our Branka is in another castle.

Exactly

Malanek999 wrote...

And even if it was a game change that led to the controls working better for both platforms, why is this undebateable?

Because it's not what we were discussing, which was the quality of ME1 and ME2 in relation to each's port to PC. More care was considered in ME1's i.e. hotkeys, separated action keys and a mouse wheel that works with text.

Boiled down one last time, Bioware's in house ME2 port was sub-par compared to Demiurge's ME1 when comparing them on the amount of consideration given to the PC's capabilities.

On topic, I'm conflicted on my worries pertaining to DA2 on PC. On one hand you have DA:O which was a great show of what a PC game should be as everything I wanted was there when talking about controls, yet ME2 was a bad show of how a game should be made for the PC. I'm hoping the DA2 devs are more competent and considerate to the PC's abilities than the ME2 devs were..

relhart wrote...
Bioware (in general) is pretty bad about
shoehorning you into only being able to "RP" very select roles, usually
polar extreams. The dialogue in DAO felt restricting enough, it seems
like it's going to be even more so in DA2.

"Praise the maker!"
or
"Get your pathetic beliefs out of my face!"
Your telling me those didn't offer enough middle ground to feel comfortable

Modifié par Revan312, 24 novembre 2010 - 01:40 .

[AlanC9]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...
Because the greatest innovation of JRPGs (ok so Mario isn't but I swear I'm goin' somewhere with this) is the endless stream of end bosses at the end of the game that can completely destroy you if you are unequiped for the fight even if the previous 60 hours you were perfectly well suited.

Which brings me back to KotOR. For my second play I tried a defense build. Worked beautifully all the way up to the last battle, when suddenly I'm fighting someone who hits any defense 60% of the time.

[Monica83]

I don't think dragon age 2 will be much changed for the final version... The difference from the actual version and the demo presented are of some months.. I Don't think can change a lot...

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

Which brings me back to KotOR. For my second play I tried a defense build. Worked beautifully all the way up to the last battle, when suddenly I'm fighting someone who hits any defense 60% of the time.

And yet, KotOR's final battle accommodated non-combat characters quite well.

Malak could be defeated easily without ever engaging him.

[AlanC9]

Well, you still have to engage him a little, don't you? Anyway, this was a combat character, but her combat mode suddenly failed in the last battle.



Since KotOR had an even worse potion mechanic than DAO's, it's not like the battle was actually hard. It just wasn't much fun.

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

Well, you still have to engage him a little, don't you?

Not really.  Literally running away as soon as combat starts is a winning tactic as long as you've prepared the battlefield using your Demolitions skill.

You don't even need to deal with his living batteries.

[Crimson Invictus]

Maria Caliban wrote...
Almost by definition, sarcasm reads the same as sincerity.

Example: A voiced protagonist is the greatest improvement to cRPGs in the last 10 years.

Was that sincere or sarcastic?

Not that it makes any real difference to your point, I'd say that is more irony than sarcasm.

Modifié par Liana Nighthawk, 25 novembre 2010 - 06:35 .

[So your Larry]

I just want hawke to flip people the finger......

[1varangian]

My biggest concern is the simplifying or "streamlining" of the rules that is taking place. That concern extends to the cookie cutter classes and limiting build options from the player. Stuff like "warriors don't do ranged" and "all melee Rogues dual wield". Sigh.



Those changes also make way for my second biggest concern: no multiplayer. I would really like the DA franchise to conquer NWN style multiplayer in the future with deep and flexible system.

[Monica83]

The funny thing varagian is the community don't want multyplayer option for the fear that the single campaing will be streamlized in content or plot in favour of multyplayer....



But they are ready to accept a steamlized short limited single player game...

A thing i never understeand



Since i love to roleplay i did it in on Roleplay server on nwn2 and its awesome the adventure never finish but its seems people lose the pleasure to roleplay online with other people....



They think: if i want a multyplayer ropleplay game i play a MMO...



MMO's are note roleplay in fact most of that are dungeon crawling.. mob killers.. or hack and slash you don't have to ROLE your character you only have to kill monster and get better equipment and level up.... THis is a sad thing

[AlanC9]

I never had that pleasure in the first place. Games are something I do to get away from other people, not to engage with them. When I want to deal with people I do it ITRW.

[Monica83]

NWN was a great game because allow you to make a nice experience on online worlds..



-You can create your own world of game

-You can join roleplay server

-You can have great adventure followed by a DM



This is a nice thing for me.. Since i love the roleplay in single player and in multyplayer in fact roleplay is born like a social thing to enjoy with others....

[Lotion Soronarr]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Yes, yes there should.

Why?  The game is designed around party combat.  Restricting to only one character breaks the game.  The Fade quest was broken and tedious and the end of KOTOR completely threw out all of hte gameplay rules established in that games previous 35 hours.  Its a cheap challenge trick just to through a wrench into your strategy and thus it breaks the strategic aspect of a game.

Learn to adapt you wuss.
And use proper strategy.

And are you arguining against breaking up the party at certain plot point, or bad boss/class balancing?
Because it seem like you're arguing the latter.
Would you have complained if you could beat Malak in 5 minutes?

[Ziggeh]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Yes, yes there should.

Why?  The game is designed around party combat.  Restricting to only one character breaks the game.  The Fade quest was broken and tedious and the end of KOTOR completely threw out all of hte gameplay rules established in that games previous 35 hours.  Its a cheap challenge trick just to through a wrench into your strategy and thus it breaks the strategic aspect of a game.

Learn to adapt you wuss.
And use proper strategy.

And are you arguining against breaking up the party at certain plot point, or bad boss/class balancing?
Because it seem like you're arguing the latter.
Would you have complained if you could beat Malak in 5 minutes?

He's saying that the final fight gave you a task unrelated to the fight system you'd spent multiple hours learning. Now that's not bad per se, but when the fight system is party based, balanced around that aspect, removing it from the party is going to at best be an awkward experience.

Modifié par ziggehunderslash, 26 novembre 2010 - 12:06 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Well, it's not like each class is useless at it's own. At it's not like there's not a dozen possible approaches to a problem.



Fight systems can be BOTH party-based and still perfectly viable for a single player. In the end he did beat the end boss even using sub-optimal strategy, did he not?



The idea that you must always have a full party in a RPG is redicolous.

[Xewaka]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The idea that you must always have a full party in a RPG is redicolous.

In each and every RPG, yes. In a party-based tactical rpg, not so much.
I mean, I enjoyed the Fade section because it was more an elaborate puzzle rather than the "kick door, kill monster, take loot" approach that the rest of the game took. Solo parts should be spiced up, add variety to the gameplay. Otherwise, you're restricting the players options for no discerning reason. "Kick door, kill monster, take loot" approach doesn't work for the solo part.

Modifié par Xewaka, 26 novembre 2010 - 01:20 .