443 réponses à ce sujet

[Xewaka]

philbo1965uk wrote...

I don't think he would take too kindly to being called Enoguh.....perhaps try Mr Woo.

Curse my chubby fingers. Corrected.

[Ortaya Alevli]

I don't know about the motivation aspect, but I agree human nobles end up doing better than other origins. They have the option to be coronated, and females can work things out on better terms if romancing Alistair. What possessing relevant information beforehand has to do with it is another matter.

Maria Caliban wrote...

TwistedComplex wrote...

My face   ;:|

O_o

You might want to have that looked it. It's not normal to have that many eyes.

Unless you're Batarian.

[TwistedComplex]

Maria Caliban wrote...

TwistedComplex wrote...

My face   ;:|

O_o

You might want to have that looked it. It's not normal to have that many eyes.

Face of Evil wrote...
Ferelden at least allowed the elven people to be free, unlike Orlais or the Tevinter Imperium.

Slavery is illegal in Orlais. The alienages are worse because cities in Orlais are much, much bigger and have overcrowding problems.

Those are eyebrows and eyes with a mouth

[Face of Evil]

Ortaya Alevli wrote...

I don't know about the motivation aspect, but I agree human nobles end up doing better than other origins. They have the option to be coronated, and females can work things out on better terms if romancing Alistair.

That's assuming you want the throne. I have no aspirations to rule Ferelden, especially if it means marrying that ice queen Anora.

And while it's great and all for the female HN who gets to keep Alistair after he becomes king, that decision essentially condemns Ferelden to plunge once again into a civil war within a generation, as two Wardens cannot have a child. The lack of an heir will just lead to another succession crisis.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 18 novembre 2010 - 08:50 .

[Ortaya Alevli]

Face of Evil wrote...

That's assuming you want the throne. I have no aspirations to rule Ferelden, especially if it means marrying that ice queen Anora.

Want it or not, the extra option is still there. That's what I meant. You want your Cousland to forget the throne and keep hacking away at darkspawn? By all means. You want your Mahariel to become king? Fat chance of that.

And while it's great and all for the female HN who gets to keep Alistair after he becomes king, that decision essentially condemns Ferelden to plunge once again into a civil war within a generation, as two Wardens cannot have a child. The lack of an heir will just lead to another succession crisis.

Alright. And? Still an extra option for female Couslands.

[Adanu]

David Gaider wrote...

silentassassin264 wrote...
It really didn't take meta-ing information.  My first character I made was a city elf because when I saw the trailer and stuff for that origin, it really seemed to resonate with me.  I played through the origin story and through Ostagar but as I went through after that, I steadily lost interest.  My city elf could not even go back into the alienage to see her family.  She is tasked with dealing with a bunch of human noble politics which she really doesn't care for especially since she was kidnapped by one and her cousin is raped by the same one.  I got bored of being compelled to do things my character would not have done (as I said I would have broken back into the alienage immediately).  

This disinterest caused me to try other origins.  The first one that I could actually feel engrossed in was the human noble (before I had tried mage, dalish, and dwarf noble).  Considering the guy who wiped out my family was working all along with the guy who through Ferelden into chaos was a great motivator.  It also helped that I actually had an allegiance to Ferelden being in the second royal family of Ferelden.  As you can tell from this, the first origin I actually finished the game with was the human noble.  For people who only finish the game once, they would have probably encountered the same thing I did and just opted to play human noble.  I did not look up any extra information on the game on the internet or anything until after my first playthrough was done.

Okay... so you use this thinking as the basis to challenge what? The idea that only 15% of people ever played an elf because the human noble was so important? Never mind that the vast majority never finished the game or tried it more than once to go and agree with your line of thinking that they needed to play the human noble origin to get their "optimal" playthrough?

Sorry. Don't buy it. Not sure why you're selling it, either.

David, people play role playing games with motivations in mind. What makes my character want to do anything? The human noble, whether you agree with it or not, has a *lot* more motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics. The rest feel stale in comparison. if you don't want to admit that your team did not put as much motivational stuff into all the other origins, that is fine, but we still see it differently, and *we* are the ones who buy the game.

Take Riordans comment about even if you leave the Wardens, the darkspawn will still hunt you. Fact is, this not only implies you can leave the wardens, but the drunken Alistair ending means that it is not impossible to survive on your own. Our character could have left the country after going through the blood drinking stuff and let the country burn. Why would a Dalish elf care if Fereldan dies? The Dalish want nothing to do with humans for the most part.

[Ziggeh]

Face of Evil wrote...

And while it's great and all for the female HN who gets to keep Alistair after he becomes king, that decision essentially condemns Ferelden to plunge once again into a civil war within a generation, as two Wardens cannot have a child. The lack of an heir will just lead to another succession crisis.

This might just be an impression I took away rather than a fact, but they seem to have a slightly more open approach to succession than say, european royalty. Something like a lack of the divine right of kings. They seem quite happy to put a bastard on the throne, for example.

I think using the term "bastard" in a legitmate sense deserves a small fist pump.

[Sylvius the Mad]

David Gaider wrote...

Consider what you already know: the PC is the only character who is going to be actively swapping multiple armor models throughout the game. If you're only looking for one reason, there it is-- and it's no small one. And "resizing" the armor is simplifying the issue... it's work, and multiplied across all equippable armors in the game, times 2. We could do that work, but where would you like it to come from?

The new art and models.

DAO already had perfectly cromulent models.  By changing the art style and building new models for everything, you created this problem.

Simply not having created it would be the solution.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 18 novembre 2010 - 09:11 .

[Ortaya Alevli]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

This might just be an impression I took away rather than a fact, but they seem to have a slightly more open approach to succession than say, european royalty. Something like a lack of the divine right of kings. They seem quite happy to put a bastard on the throne, for example.

I think using the term "bastard" in a legitmate sense deserves a small fist pump.

He's not just a bastard but a royal bastard.

Sorry, carry on.

[Ziggeh]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

DAO already had perfectly cromulent models.

True, I wouldn't argue they were "good" though, and "acceptable" is probably not what they're shooting for.

[Addai]

Adanu wrote...

David, people play role playing games with motivations in mind. What makes my character want to do anything? The human noble, whether you agree with it or not, has a *lot* more motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics. The rest feel stale in comparison. if you don't want to admit that your team did not put as much motivational stuff into all the other origins, that is fine, but we still see it differently, and *we* are the ones who buy the game.

Please speak for yourself and drop the "we."

[Face of Evil]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

This might just be an impression I took away rather than a fact, but they seem to have a slightly more open approach to succession than say, european royalty. Something like a lack of the divine right of kings. They seem quite happy to put a bastard on the throne, for example.

You are absolutely correct. But where is this hypothetical bastard heir going to come from? Since the female Warden cannot bear Alistair's child, he will have to take another woman as his lover. Is Alistair and his new queen simply going to be "okay" with Alistair keeping a baby momma on the side?

Modifié par Face of Evil, 18 novembre 2010 - 09:20 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

ziggehunderslash wrote...

True, I wouldn't argue they were "good" though, and "acceptable" is probably not what they're shooting for.

Every screenshot I've seen so far has stolen graphical quality from the environments to improve the characters.  That's not a good trade-off, in my opinion.  I think everything in the world - the characters and environments both - should be of comparable graphical quality.

[Wulfram]

Face of Evil wrote...
So where is this hypothetical bastard heir going to come from? Since the female Warden cannot bear Alistair's child, he will have to take another woman as his lover. Is Alistair and his new queen simply going to be "okay" with Alistair keeping a baby momma on the side?

Just bung a Guerrin or Cousland on the throne.  After all, they accept a Mac Tir

[Ziggeh]

Face of Evil wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...

This might just be an impression I took away rather than a fact, but they seem to have a slightly more open approach to succession than say, european royalty. Something like a lack of the divine right of kings. They seem quite happy to put a bastard on the throne, for example.

So where is this hypothetical bastard heir going to come from? Since the female Warden cannot bear Alistair's child, he will have to take another woman as his lover. Is Alistair and his new queen simply going to be "okay" with Alistair keeping a baby momma on the side?

I mean they're more likely to be okay with a high ranking land owner being next in line. The male human noble can become king (or prince consort) by marrying the former queen, despite neither being of the royal line.

[Addai]

It's silly to argue about whether or not an HNF-Alistair mix is better or worse than others. I gather that the point being made was that people play HN's because you get to be consort with that ending. If that's the case, they aren't going to give a hoot about some hypothetical future heir crisis (leave alone the fact that Anora doesn't appear exactly motivated to provide an heir herself). I imagine this does contribute to some percentage of the popularity of the HN origin, but it can't account for all of it, since you'd have to know spoilers to know this was possible.

[Face of Evil]

That assumes the succession will be decided amicably by the nobility. More likely, the lack of an heir leads to another civil war.

Ortaya Alevli wrote...

Want it or not, the extra option is still there. That's what I meant. You want your Cousland to forget the throne and keep hacking away at darkspawn? By all means. You want your Mahariel to become king? Fat chance of that.

But all of the origins have an extra option to how they want to end the game. And becoming the consort of the current ruler isn't really that fantastic. I sure as hell wouldn't choose it.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 18 novembre 2010 - 09:30 .

[Ziggeh]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

ziggehunderslash wrote...

True, I wouldn't argue they were "good" though, and "acceptable" is probably not what they're shooting for.

Every screenshot I've seen so far has stolen graphical quality from the environments to improve the characters.  That's not a good trade-off, in my opinion.  I think everything in the world - the characters and environments both - should be of comparable graphical quality.

I wouldn't disagree with that last statement, but I do know that addressing the model sizing issue would have been among the first things I'd be writing down when it came to issues with the first game. But as you say, it's a trade off. One I'm happy and comfortable with, but I completely understand why you wouldn't be.

[Ziggeh]

Face of Evil wrote...

That assumes the succession will be decided amicably by the nobility. More likely, the lack of an heir leads to another civil war.

Unless the current incumbent were to pick sides, which I think would come up if everyone was aware that they were both sterile and would end up wandering into the deep roads within the next few decades. It would be pretty irresponsible not to address it before doing so. Not that that wouldn't be challenged or anything.

[Faust1979]

 I don't really care and there are plenty of roleplaying games where you can't change your characters race. Heck you could only be human in Star Wars knights of the old republic and Jade Empire and they are both awesome games so it doesn't bother me at all. Another thing is that unless playing a certain race actually effects the game besides a few lines of dialogue it's rather pointless. Just let Bioware tell the story they want to tell

[Arrtis]

Wait for the finished product.

*echo from many months ago*

[Adanu]

Addai67 wrote...

Adanu wrote...

David, people play role playing games with motivations in mind. What makes my character want to do anything? The human noble, whether you agree with it or not, has a *lot* more motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics. The rest feel stale in comparison. if you don't want to admit that your team did not put as much motivational stuff into all the other origins, that is fine, but we still see it differently, and *we* are the ones who buy the game.

Please speak for yourself and drop the "we."

Please drop the semantic crap and learn that we means people who buy the game.

[Stanley Woo]

Adanu wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Adanu wrote...
David, people play role playing games with motivations in mind. What makes my character want to do anything? The human noble, whether you agree with it or not, has a *lot* more motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics. The rest feel stale in comparison. if you don't want to admit that your team did not put as much motivational stuff into all the other origins, that is fine, but we still see it differently, and *we* are the ones who buy the game.

Please speak for yourself and drop the "we."

Please drop the semantic crap and learn that we means people who buy the game.

Please dont' be rude to fellow community members, and remember that for every "you" who has an opinion about the game, there thousands who are not "you." Addai67 is requesting that you not speak for everyone who bought the game, a group which, presumably, also includes Addai67.

And "you" should consider that the game isn't as unbalanced as your sensationalist hyperbole makes it sound. the human noble has an additional motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics: he's a human noble who was dispossessed by Howe. Done.

Everyone else has the same reasons for dealing in Fereldan politics: to get support from the Landsmeet against the darkspawn. this does not mean we put any more or less work or thought into non-human noble origins. in fact, we worked even harder on non-human nobles so their stories would feel and play just as well as human nobles.

Whether you agree with it or not, the dwarf noble has a *lot* more motivation in dealing with Orzammar politics.
Whether you agree with it or not, the dalish elf has a *lot* more motivation in dealing with the werewolves in the Brcilian Forest.
Whether you agree with it ot not, the Circle mage has a *lot* more motivation in dealing with the Chantry politics.
Whether you agree with it or not, the city elf has a *lot* more motivation in dealing with Denerim politics.
Whether you agree with it or not, the dwarf commoner has a *lot* more motivation in dealing with the Orzammar carta.

You are free to disagree with us. discussion from a bunch of different perspectives is certainly one reason this community and this forum exists. But please don't believe that yours is the most popular, best, or only opinion being discussed. Thank you.

[Arrtis]

I disagree with you Adanu.

[Addai]

Adanu wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Adanu wrote...

David, people play role playing games with motivations in mind. What makes my character want to do anything? The human noble, whether you agree with it or not, has a *lot* more motivation for dealing in Fereldan politics. The rest feel stale in comparison. if you don't want to admit that your team did not put as much motivational stuff into all the other origins, that is fine, but we still see it differently, and *we* are the ones who buy the game.

Please speak for yourself and drop the "we."

Please drop the semantic crap and learn that we means people who buy the game.

You do see the DAO and DAA badges under my avatar, yes?  I've played all the origins, and have played all the origins to completion except the dwarf and a human mage.  My favorites by far are Dalish and elf mage. 

So, as long as your "we" is "people who think exactly like me," we're cool.  If by "we" you mean everyone who played the game, you're presuming a lot.

Modifié par Addai67, 18 novembre 2010 - 10:32 .