174 réponses à ce sujet

[Ortaya Alevli]

Well, I admired John Ullyatt's work, for what it's worth.

[Wulfram]

Going by american TV shows, British actors are quite capable of producing fake British accents, if that's what they think their employers are after.

Though in DA:O I didn't have any complaints about the native accents.

Modifié par Wulfram, 19 novembre 2010 - 04:30 .

[Eleinehmm]

Wulfram wrote...

Going by american TV shows, British actors are quite capable of producing fake British accents, if that's what they think their employers are after.

Though in DA:O I didn't have any complaints.

DAO RPish British was good - I do not remeber anything over the top there.

[tmp7704]

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

I think you seriously overestimate people's willingness to emulate "native" accent instead to sticking to their own -- not everyone wants to do that. Heck, even people who natively speak the language frequently won't do that because why bother when they can speak how they're used to and still be understood. How many americans strive to speak with one of british accents when in UK, or vice versa? People from other countries are no different.

[PsychoBlonde]

A lot of people don't even have the *ability* to emulate the native accent--speaking a language exclusively actually changes the way your mouth and palate develop. Some people remain flexible their entire lives and can switch accents with facility (and some practice). Some truly cannot rid themselves of their origin accent no matter how much they try.



Having traveled extensively across the U.S. and Europe, I've heard a LOT of accents, and never found that there is one archetypal accent for any group.

[Neesee]

My mother learned English as a second language and has probably been speaking it almost as long as I've been alive (maybe longer), she still has her Mexican accent after 20-some years.

[Akka le Vil]

ok go wrote...

No offense, but being French I found the Orlesian accents funny, you could tell those weren't their real accents.  I know its a resource issue but anyone feel the same about accents?

Man, you should try to make some random guy in the street speak english.
I can guarantee you that the french accents in the game are certainly very adequate. I'd probably sound even worse myself.

[Addai]

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

As others have pointed out, that's not how it works, especially if you are coming to a language as an adult.  Isolde was pretty young when she married but still an adult.  Thought and speech patterns do not change simply from exposure.  Even practicing the accent and trying to sound Fereldan, a person may simply lack the facility to mimic well.  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Isolde isn't the type of person to try all that hard to blend in.  Also we see her at a time of stress when she would naturally revert to native speech pattern.

[Addai]

Saibh wrote...

I recall there being...five Orlesians in the game. Well, six, if you count Riordan, but I don't. I think three of them share the same voice actress. Erlina and Marjolaine had the same voice actress. Then Isolde, then Liselle. And, of course, Leliana.
 

Mmm... Riordan... now there's a French accented voice I could listen to for hours.  Leliana is like nails on a chalkboard to me, however.  It could be because half the stuff she says makes me want to slap her.

I think the Welsh Dalish is pretty cool.  And as long as there are sexy British accents in the game, all is well.  Paging Steve Valentine and Simon Chadwick!

I was interested to notice the other day that Vaughn's VA also did Arl Bryland.  I love Bry-Bry's voice and would not have placed it as Nicholas Boulton.  Is that supposed to be a French accent?

[Akka le Vil]

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

You're quite wrong. Though accent soften and tend to disappear with use, it's not something that easy to get rid of. It also heavily depends on the ear of the speaker, because it requires self-correction and adaptation to native accent. And LOTS of practice.
You can have a high level of language ability and still have a heavy accent.

Marjolaine has a VERY thick french accent - but it's quite logical, as she was not living in Ferelden, just passing by. 
Isolde has a noticeable accent, but it's not an impossibility by any means.
Leliana has a faint accent, which is logical considering she learned Ferelden language as a child, even if she lived in Orlais.

I think people tend to mix TV's and other very professionnal accents with the real accent of real people. People on TV (or in game or whatever) have usually accent "for flavour" - that is, FAINT accents.
Real-life people have usually HEAVY accent. Even professionnals.

Addai67 wrote...

Mmm... Riordan... now there's a French accented voice I could listen to for hours.

Riordan's accent was so faint it was hard to even notice it.

Modifié par Akka le Vil, 19 novembre 2010 - 09:05 .

[Eleinehmm]

Addai67 wrote...

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

As others have pointed out, that's not how it works, especially if you are coming to a language as an adult.  Isolde was pretty young when she married but still an adult.  Thought and speech patterns do not change simply from exposure.  Even practicing the accent and trying to sound Fereldan, a person may simply lack the facility to mimic well.  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Isolde isn't the type of person to try all that hard to blend in.  Also we see her at a time of stress when she would naturally revert to native speech pattern.

Naturally she would lose  all the grammar - But for some reason all that she lost was her pronunciation – That I find strange…. 
And I am aware about  challenges  you go through, learning second, third, etc language as an adult, I didn’t say she would lose the accent, I said she wouldn’t  have the accent she had.

And yes -  they do change simply from exposure - I call it human nature, but in this case it is more of ape nature here -It is difficult not to change them somehow...

[Eleinehmm]

Akka le Vil wrote...

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

You're quite wrong. Though accent soften and tend to disappear with use, it's not something that easy to get rid of. It also heavily depends on the ear of the speaker, because it requires self-correction and adaptation to native accent. And LOTS of practice.
You can have a high level of language ability and still have a heavy accent.

Marjolaine has a VERY thick french accent - but it's quite logical, as she was not living in Ferelden, just passing by. 
Isolde has a noticeable accent, but it's not an impossibility by any means.
Leliana has a faint accent, which is logical considering she learned Ferelden language as a child, even if she lived in Orlais.

I think people tend to mix TV's and other very professionnal accents with the real accent of real people. People on TV (or in game or whatever) have usually accent "for flavour" - that is, FAINT accents.
Real-life people have usually HEAVY accent. Even professionnals.

Sir, I work with different people and their accents are  NOTHING like the accent you hear on "Funny foreigner TV" ™ The only time I have heard something like steriotypical accent happend on my first flight from Paris to St. Pete

[Eleinehmm]

Akka le Vil wrote...

ok go wrote...

No offense, but being French I found the Orlesian accents funny, you could tell those weren't their real accents.  I know its a resource issue but anyone feel the same about accents?

Man, you should try to make some random guy in the street speak english.
I can guarantee you that the french accents in the game are certainly very adequate. I'd probably sound even worse myself.

It  is not question of better-worse - He would sound different.

[Akka le Vil]

Eleinehmm wrote...

Sir, I work with different people and
their accents are  NOTHING like the accent you hear on "Funny foreigner
TV" ™ The only time I have heard something like steriotypical accent
happend on my first flight from Paris to St. Pete

I hear this kind of accent from the guys next to me at work, and probably from myself if I dared to record myself when I try to pronounce some english.

Akka le Vil wrote...

It  is not question of better-worse - He would sound different.

Don't see how, because it clearly sounds the same to my ears - granted, they're not the best out there, which is a reason why I'm so dreadfully incompetent with the spoken part of the language, but still.

[Neesee]

Eleinehmm wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Eleinehmm wrote...

On the level of language ability Isolde has, you can’t have that sort of accent - Only if you have never heard English in your life and learned all the rules and grammar from the books.
And this is obviously not the case here.
Ok, maybe I am exaggerating a little, but she has a lot of language-exposure – Both her son and her husband speak Fereldan (English). It is still very over the top and more of a “we think that is how the French speak” Hollywood accent thingy.

As others have pointed out, that's not how it works, especially if you are coming to a language as an adult.  Isolde was pretty young when she married but still an adult.  Thought and speech patterns do not change simply from exposure.  Even practicing the accent and trying to sound Fereldan, a person may simply lack the facility to mimic well.  I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Isolde isn't the type of person to try all that hard to blend in.  Also we see her at a time of stress when she would naturally revert to native speech pattern.

Naturally she would lose  all the grammar - But for some reason all that she lost was her pronunciation – That I find strange…. 
And I am aware about  challenges  you go through, learning second, third, etc language as an adult, I didn’t say she would lose the accent, I said she wouldn’t  have the accent she had.

And yes -  they do change simply from exposure - I call it human nature, but in this case it is more of ape nature here -It is difficult not to change them somehow...

Native speech pattern refers to pronunciation I believe. And yeah, people can change accents (good or bad) due to some circumstance. I've been called out for busting out an English accent when I get upset at my friends and I don't even notice when I do. Some folks have to work to keep their "true" accent from coming through and slip occasionally. Isolde was in distress, really shrieky accented Fereldan was fine to me (but I don't have a problem with her voice to begin with).

[Eleinehmm]

Akka le Vil wrote...

Eleinehmm wrote...

Sir, I work with different people and
their accents are  NOTHING like the accent you hear on "Funny foreigner
TV" ™ The only time I have heard something like steriotypical accent
happend on my first flight from Paris to St. Pete

I hear this kind of accent from the guys next to me at work, and probably from myself if I dared to record myself when I try to pronounce some english.

Akka le Vil wrote...

It  is not question of better-worse - He would sound different.

Don't see how, because it clearly sounds the same to my ears - granted, they're not the best out there, which is a reason why I'm so dreadfully incompetent with the spoken part of the language, but still.

You've made me interested - I should probably start  an "Accents of the World: A Guessing game" thread on the Off topic forum.  I had some weird experience while trying to guess some non NS accents and would really like to see how peoples' opinion differs in attributing the accents to the countries of origin of the speakers.

Modifié par Eleinehmm, 19 novembre 2010 - 09:57 .

[joriandrake]

you would get some weird results

hungarian accent as example is many times mistaken for serbian, german, or even swedish


don't even let me get started about maltese or Osaka accents

Modifié par joriandrake, 19 novembre 2010 - 09:54 .

[PsychoBlonde]

Eleinehmm wrote...

You made me interested - I should probably start "Accents of the World: A Guessing game" thread on the Off topic forum .  I had some weird experience while trying to guess some non NS accents and would really like to see how peoples' opinion differs in attributing the accents to the countries of origin of the speakers.

This.  I never ceased to be amazed at how bad people who complain about the "fake" accents are at actually determining someone's country of origin based ON THEIR ACCENT.  You don't get much funnier than people whinging that Leliana's voice actress had OMG WRST FAKE  ACCENT EVARRR when she's actually French.

The DDO European servers were just forced to move all their characters to the U.S. servers and we are SWAMPED with funny accents (most often Scottish/German/Irish/some type of English and a few very clipped Indians, the French and Spanish-speakers generally don't party with English-speakers because they find the high-speed no-context babble difficult to follow.  I've gotten into a few Portugese-speaking-only groups and it was really hard to figure out wtf was going on.)

[Addai]

Eleinehmm wrote...

And yes -  they do change simply from exposure - I call it human nature, but in this case it is more of ape nature here -It is difficult not to change them somehow...

That simply isn't true, not as a universal, and especially not for someone who is immersed first as an adult, even as a young adult.  As an example, my husband's family all came over from Europe as teenagers/ children.  The older siblings married Americans and worked with Americans but still have a very pronounced accent.   My father in law was a middle child and has a strong accent despite having lived and worked all his adult life with native English speakers.  He even makes small grammatical errors sometimes.  The younger siblings who came over as kids don't have accents.

Modifié par Addai67, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:13 .

[Eleinehmm]

Addai67 wrote...

Eleinehmm wrote...

And yes -  they do change simply from exposure - I call it human nature, but in this case it is more of ape nature here -It is difficult not to change them somehow...

That simply isn't true, not as a universal, and especially not for someone who is immersed first as an adult, even as a young adult.  As an example, my husband's family all came over from Europe as teenagers/ children.  The older siblings married Americans and worked with Americans but still have a very pronounced accent.   My father in law was a middle child and has a strong accent despite having lived and worked all his adult life with native English speakers.  He even makes small grammatical errors sometimes.  The younger siblings who came over as kids don't have accents.

Well, you didn't hear them in the beginning of the exposure, did you ?  Generally an adult will retain some sort of accent and some of the NS would even perceive it as heavy, but it will be very different from the "beginners" accent.

Modifié par Eleinehmm, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:24 .

[tmp7704]

But by this very token we haven't heard Isolde when she first arrived to Ferelden, either. Maybe her current accent is also already softened.

[Eleinehmm]

tmp7704 wrote...

But by this very token we haven't heard Isolde when she first arrived to Ferelden, either. Maybe her current accent is also already softened.

That is very difficult to belive in - It sounds too unpolished to be a "softened" version.

Modifié par Eleinehmm, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:22 .

[Eleinehmm]

doble post

Modifié par Eleinehmm, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:23 .

[tmp7704]

Well, we have no idea what actual Orlesian accent is like. This discussion is largely based on french accent (or more accurately just various imaginary versions of french accent people hold in their heads) ... the "real" orlesian can be quite different from that, and "heavier" than real french.

Modifié par tmp7704, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:25 .

[jon372]

Personally my beef with Leliana wasnt that she didnt sound genuinely french, she did. Its that her voice acting sounded so cheesy. <


She sounded.. too much french, like she didnt know how some words should be emphasised.. i guess its cute when you dont understand French at all, its just irritating when you do.

Modifié par jon372, 19 novembre 2010 - 10:30 .