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The Agent - A Guide to the "Other" Infiltrator (w/videos)


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#1
Tony Gunslinger

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This is something I’ve been toying around with for a while now, and I shall update this whenever corrections and changes are necessary.  It is recommended for people who are familiar with the Infiltrator and want to have a new experience with this class, especially on NG+, to fully take advantage of the weapons and powers available to you from the beginning.

For those who need more information about the Infiltrator class, I recommend OniGanon's Invasive Maneuvers, since a lot of the tactical principles I'm using, the weapon selections I've made, as well as my skill distributions are explained in detail in his guide and videos. Also check out Thisisme8's Controlling the Battlefield for general assault tactics.



I. The Agent

Skill Distribution
4 Squad Disruptor Ammo
4 Improved Cryo Ammo
4 Assassination Cloak
1 Incinerate
0 AI Hacking
4 Agent / Assassin
4 Improved Flashbang / Frag Grenade

Recommended Weapons
M-97 Viper
M-96 Mattock
M-4 Shuriken / M-9 Tempest
M-3 Predator / M-6 Carniflex

Videos
I'm calling it the Agent Infiltrator for now based on its dependence of the Agent’s passive bonuses. As you can see, it is almost the opposite build of a Widow Infiltrator, swapping the evolved versions of Disruptor and Cryo ammos, using the Agent in place of Assassin, and (yeah, it’s blasphemous) you’re not using the Widow or the shotgun. Flashbang is also the key addition that makes the Infiltrator class uniquely efficient at locking down the battle field. I’ve chosen AR specialization for reasons that will be outlined below. I've thought about other names, such as the CryoInfiltrator, but this build relies more than just Cryo Ammo, and more than just using Flashbang. It's the combination of all of the powers, passives, and weapons together that makes this build the way it is. I've made this guide to simply show another variation of the class, and hopefully to let fellow players see how flexible this class can be.


Squad Disruptor / Improved Cryo Ammo
The main focus of the Agent Infiltrator is to neutralize multiple enemies as quickly as possible, while killing is a secondary priority. Improved Cryo Ammo does indeed have a noticeable increase in chance to freeze, how quickly in which the target becomes fully frozen, and duration of the freeze, so you will use it on all of your weapons for all enemies with possible exception when facing the Geth (where either one is preferable.) While it is certainly feasible to use Squad Cryo ammo, the Improved version is superior when facing a group of three or more enemies; the chances of neutralizing their threat are faster, and it keeps them neutralized longer. Squad Disruptor Ammo is chosen since your role is to neutralize opponents, your squadmates’ primary function is to strip defenses, in which your squad will be able to do 40% quicker. The squad version also insures the added bonus of disabling enemy weapons when they’re stripped of their defenses, giving you more opportunities for offense.

Update on Improved Cryo Ammo. I claimed that ICA has a faster freezing speed, but it was based on a faulty test. Upon further discussion and testing, there is no solid evidence to support this as of now, so in real practical gameplay, ICA's freezing speed is the same as SCA.

Assassination Cloak
There is no advantage in Enhanced Cloak, as you will be mostly using Cloak as a damage booster, and even during CQC, you will rarely ever need the added time to close the distance. If anything, Enhanced Cloak hurts your squadmates since enemies will attack them for a huge chunk of time.


Incinerate
Only one point in this skill Is enough. It is mostly for stopping health regen, the occasional annoying Heavy that’s behind cover, and mostly a final humiliation move.


Agent/Assassin
Agent is the recommended passive for its +15% power duration boost to Cryo Ammo and Flashbang, and somewhat better power CD. It is overall the better choice than Assassin. That said, if you want to focus more as a sniper rifle user, the 60% time dilation may be more beneficial to you, however your rate of killing will be slower at the beginning of the game because won’t be dealing much damage while you're Cloaking less, and throwing less grenades. If you really want to use Assassin, I personally recommend switching to it after Horizon, not before.


Flashbang Grenade
Here is the power that complements the Infiltrator’s inherent abilities and passives so seamlessly. Unlike Dominate, AI Hacking and Neutal Shock, Flashbang works on all enemy types with a very large radius. If Flashbang hits at the right spot, it guarantees either one of two outcomes: A) large amount of enemies staggering or B) a large amount of enemies incapacitated. If it’s A), you will have the opportunity to take down their defenses + 1 more shot to freeze, which is much faster than taking down defenses and spending the extra time and bullets to take down that target’s remaining health, so it increases your chance to shoot another target, all in one move. If it’s B), then you have already taken control of the battlefield for the next  7 – 10 seconds, doing whatever you feel like. Flashbang + Cryo Ammo guarantees locking down enemies, the freedom to move, more CD time for your squad, and opens up other attack options. If done right, the Agent Infiltrator will rarely be stuck under cover from enemy fire, you will be constantly on the offense and on the move.

So, Frag Grenade or Improved Flashbang? If an enemy has 119 shields left, Frag Grenade’s 120 damage will destroy the shield and the target will get knocked down. Frag Grenade also increases the chance to shatter frozen enemies, which is icing on the cake. That said, Improved Flashbang is far more reliable with is massive 9m radius, a very long incapacitate duration, and it also helps detonating crates and containers that are farther. So unless you’re an expert grenade thrower and want to show off, use Improved.


Using the Viper, aka chaining together a series of time dilation
Some shotgun CQC Infiltrators already know this trick. Zoom in, you get 2+ seconds of bullet time, enough to fire off 2-3 Viper shots. Then zoom out and immediately zoom right back in. Another two seconds of bullet time, another opportunity to fire off 2-3 more shots. You can do this forever. If you’re worried abut taking damage, consider that Heightened Arush does exactly the same thing. Because you are also taking damage at a much slower rate, you will have more than enough time to gauge your rate of damage, and more time to assess the situation to decide if you want to shoot or pull back under cover. And because the Viper has 12 shots, you will never need to waste time reloading like you do with the Widow or Mantis. If the Incisor wasn’t so badly designed ammo capacity-wise, I would use that in a heartbeat.


The Mattock
Because your primary weapon will be the Viper, you will not need the Widow, allowing you to use either a shotgun or an assault rifle. If you chose the shotgun, you will primarily be a CQC infltrator, you'll have less opportunities to use Flashbang since you’ll often be in front of people’s faces to begin with. Also with shotgun users, it’s better to choose another powers like ED/Dominate/Neural Shock for their faster CD and instant cast abilities, whereas with Flashbang, you can knock yourself out in close quarters. Like the Viper, the Mattock is extremely effective with Cryo Ammo, guaranteed to freeze a defenseless target with 1 shot 97.454% (sic) of the time. The Mattock is your backup to the Viper, which is not too shabby. It is used when you get closer to enemy lines, and also handy when you do not want to use Flashbang through the scope with the Viper.


Shuriken/Tempest
Because your SR and AR are your primary weapons, your SMG is now used as a dedicated shield and barrier destroyer, specifically against YMIRs, Praetorians, Geth Primes, to conserve ammo, and to go in for some CQC action and cleanup. I’ve done the Overlord DLC pre-Horizon, and tested both the Tempest and Shuriken on the last level where you destroy the VI core’s connector orb things. With only two upgrades, the Shuriken is clearly faster, using only 1 clip of 24 bullets at point blank range, while it took the Tempest almost its entire clip, therefore almost twice the amount of time. That said, the Tempest’s bigger ammo clip may be preferable to players as a safety net, not worrying too much about reloading in middle of a flanking maneuver. And if you're able to get off an entire clip, the Tempest does enormous damage. So either one is good. While the Locust Is a great general-purpose weapon that deal equal amount of damage between shields, barriers and armor and it has high accuracy, it’s a role you’ve already filled with the Viper and the Mattock. Keep in mind that SMGs' chance to freeze is more unpredictable, so you'll need to stay shooting at a target longer to make sure it's really frozen.


Predator/Carniflex
These are really backup weapons, you will rarely use them. But there are some cases where pistols are helpful in conserving ammo, such as the last Scion on the Collector Ship. But generally, the Predator is very versatile while the Carniflex deals fast enough shots to be taken under cloak. The Phalanx is ok, but it’s too slow to get off more than one shot under cloak, if that’s what you’re after.


Attack Method: The Delayed Viper Cloak
As some CQC Infiltrators have already found out, the best time to shoot the Viper is when the time dilation ends, giving you anywhere between 5-6 shots of Cloak bonus damage. To add even more damage on top, do not activate cloak before you aim. During the time dilation, you still have the advantage to shoot off 2-3 rounds, so take them first if it looks good, even try a headshot. Wait for the time dilation to end, and then you activate Cloak to empty the entire clip. Headshots are not a high priority; stripping defense and freezing one or multiple enemies in that timeframe is. The one weakness with this method is when facing against enemies with homing projectiles (heavies, warp from Vanguards and Harbinger, etc). Cloak will not hide their homing abilities, so use the time dilation to assess the situation first. If the enemy is already in motion with casting projectiles, you probably won’t have enough time to shoot and go back in cover without getting hit.


Attack Method: Using Flashbang with Mattock/SMG
if you have the first attack, throw Flashbang to stun and then pop 3-4 shots to each affected enemy to disable defense and /or freeze. Or, if you are under fire, use a squad power to strip defense/stagger/stun, shoot + Flashbang to freeze/knock out. The best time to use it is right before you storm between covers or before turning a corner. Lob a grenade, run for cover, and time it so that the instant it explodes, you pop out and shoot. Take advantage of the environment, bounce grenades around corners, throw them over or around walls and head-high covers before the enemy has a line of sight of you, and then rush in. When using Flashbang with sniper rifles, keep in mind that it will be very hard for you to see where you’re throwing while aiming, so try not to stick to covers when you can, and only stand behind high covers when it’s there.

numotsbane has an excellent guide on using Flashbangs, highly recommended:
Flash Delirium: getting the most from flash grenade


II. When the Agent infiltrator is superior

The Agent Infiltrator can deal massive amounts of damage to any tight group of enemies, as well as charging enemies that do not have ranged attacks such as husks, klixens, varrens. Krogans are the easiest to deal with due to their slow speed and using only shotguns. Here are some notable situations where the Agent clearly outperforms the Widow Infiltrator:

- Eclipse attack, Garrus’ recruitment
Move back a bit and spam Flashbang over the balcony before the enemies get a line of sight from you, chain the Viper time dilations to activate squad powers under scope and pick off multiple enemies to freeze. While running for ammo, continue lobbing grenades down the balcony.

- Closing the shutters, Garrus’ recruitment
Flashbang/Cryo Ammo with Viper/Mattock slows down vorchas, varrens, and krogans instead of killing all of them, delaying respawns.

- Initial attack, Stolen Memory
Doors open, a tight group of mercs, perfect for the Viper and Flashbang.

- Initial attack, Jack’s recruitment
Charging armored melee enemies are rendered usless with Viper/Mattock/Cryo Ammo

- Overlord DLC
Squad Disruptor Ammo + Flashbang + Garrus’ Overload = easy

- Horizon
Flashbang takes care of husks, and can be thrown at very long distances. Combined with the Viper’s multiple shots in slo-mo, not many Collectors are actually shooting at you.

- Tali’s recuitment
Squad Disruptor Ammo + Flashbang + Garrus’ Overload = win

- Elevator surprise, Thane’s recruitment
Viper + Squad Disruptor Ammo + Flashbang  in tight area = decimated krogan and Engineers

- Dracon Trade Center and Hotel Azure, LotSB
Lots of tightly grouped enemies, especially the trucks

- Grunt’s LM
Hi Klixens; meet my friends Cryo Ammo and Flashbang

- “You talk too much,” Mordin’s LM

- Reaper IFF
Very slow moving husks, meet very large explosion radius

- Legion’s LM
Any knocked out or frozen enemies float in zero G



III. FAQs

Q: What’s the point of shooting a couple of rounds with the Viper if you can just kill in 1 shot with the Widow?
A: Because the OSOK method is not always the best for all circumstances. The majority of the fights are based on you and your squad facing waves of enemies. Some will flank you, and some will spawn more if you do not advance the area fast enough. In the time for the Widow to kill, take cover and reload, I can incapacitate and/or stagger 2 – 3 enemies in conjunction with Cryo Ammo and Flashbang, if not outright killing at least one along the way. Even though I am not OSOK’ing things, I am controlling the battlefield, and because no one is shooting at me, I can shoot back even more, I advance the area faster, and ultimately the rate of kills for me increases exponentially because the more time passes, more enemies are on the ground, unable to attack. Incapacitating enemies instead of killing all of them also helps delay more enemies from spawning, allowing you more time for you and your squad to set up their positions, picking up spare ammo, and wait for cooldowns (defending outside SB’s ship, for example).


Q: The Mattock overlaps with the Viper, why can’t you simply use the same build with either a Widow or shotgun?
A: The fact that the Mattock overlaps with the Viper is precisely why it is a good choice. The chance to freeze per bullet is largely determined by damage, and both the Viper and the Mattock have very high damage and high rate of fire in case the previous shot didn’t proc (rarely but still happens). Shotguns are also the best at proc because of their multiple pellets. But as mentioned before, shotgun users are in and of itself a different breed and do not need Flashbang as much, they are designed for quick close range kills. The Widow user will never use it to freeze enemies, and the only weapons available for them to freeze are the pistol and the SMG, both of which cannot compare to the overall damage dealt and versatility in the Mattock and the Viper. Plus, the Widow user will more likely pick up AP /Warp Ammo or another power to use such as ED. The Vindicator is a viable alternative, but it’s fixed burst fire rate makes it less flexible to run-and-gun as you would with the Mattock, of which you will most likely be doing if you are rocking it the right way.


Q: What makes this build unique? Soldiers and Vanguards have Cryo Ammo as well, and anyone can get Flashbang.
A: I’ve tested them out, and to me, those classes don’t have the same synergy with Flashbang as the Infiltrator class does. Soldier’s ARush is pretty much the only power they’ll ever use, any other powers added to them is really window dressing, and they don’t have the CD passives to make Flashbang efficient. Both the Vanguard and Adept already have Pull and Shockwave for CC. Sentinels’ and Engineers’ primary powers are focused on stripping defenses, and you will rarely ever get to sacrifice a CD just to use Flashbang when you could to use other powers to strip defenses / kill. Plus, they don’t have Cryo Ammo. The Infiltrator’s unique quality is the sniper rifle time dilation that does not sacrifice a use of power to perform. This can be taken advantage of, especially if the gun you’re holding has lots of ammo in one clip. Adding Cryo Ammo to the Viper and the Mattock transforms them into the best ranged CC weapons available in the game. Flashbang has the largest radius of any CC powers, and can shatter frozen enemies. The + time duration, + cooldown passives from Agent make theses two powers even more effective. Synergy.

Q: You seem to say only nice things about your own build. Is there anything that it sucks at?
A: Yes. Jack’s recruitment covers a lot of ground, and the Agent Infiltrator will have trouble throwing Flashbang at long distances to make it land exactly at the right place. And freezing enemies from that long distance will cause them to fall behind cover often, making the overall mission longer to execute. Also, Grunt’s recruitment mission has a lot of heavies and the Viper cannot take them out as fast as the Widow can. These are the instances is when OSOK is preferred. Having played both types a number of times, I can say that those are cases where the Widow clearly does very well. The Widow Infiltrator is a pure Assassin, it is every effective and efficient, it is evolved around one weapon and the use of stealth. The Agent Infiltrator on the other hand, deals a lot of CC in a lot of ways to neutralize sections of the field with tactical superiority and perfect power CD management.

Other things that suck about this build:

- The Viper eats a lot of ammo and to fully restock is a pain sometimes. Dropped clips gives you only 4 rounds, stationary / respawnable ones give you 8. So you need at least 8 respawnable clips to fully restock, and the Widow in comparison only need 6. This is why switching weapons often is recommended to conserve ammo.

- In fights in which the enemies are spread out over a wide area in front of you, Flashbang loses its value as a CC power. In those battles, you become a typical Cloaking infiltrator. The OSOK Widow beats the Viper because it narrows the enemy line much quicker.

- As you know, frozen enemies do drop behind covers, which can be annoying. That said, there are pluses to frozen/knocked out targets: they can be used as roadblocks in tight passageways, and the enemies behind them will get stuck and become easy prey. They also can be used as meat shields, as demonstrated by the Cryoguard.

- As mentioned, be wary of enemies with homing projectiles, it’s easy to get greedy with the Viper, spending too much time exposed, and unaware of other attackers.

- You can't OSOK, therefore every word in this guide is heresy.

Well, that’s really it about the bad parts of this build. I’ll try to think of more.



IV. New Game vs. New Game +
When most people play the Infiltrator on insanity, they chose to play a new game instead of NG+ because they heard it’s much tougher. This means that up until the Collector Ship, all Infiltrator builds are pretty much the same: you got your sniper rifle, your smg and your pistol, you’ve prioritized your points into passives and Cloak. And up until that point, you’ve been a pure sniper using the Mantis, and you’ve relied on that setup and play style for a very big chunk of the game. But because the Viper is such a different beast, and because you get it so late in the game and so near the point of getting the Widow, most people ditch it and never fully looked into how to use the Viper in conjunction with the Infiltrator’s abilities. The same can be said with other classes and powers as well. Cryo Ammo, for instance, is an underrated power because it is the last priority to invest points in during character level progression. If you never played NG+, you never will know what it’s like to use Cryo Ammo Mordin’s recruitment, or use the Revy on Garrus’ recruitment. So the experience between a new game and NG+ is very different, where a new game is very much about role-playing, NG+ lets you concentrate on tactics and game mechanics, and finding out new ways to play. NG+ is also much easier on tech-oriented characters because they can get 3 upgrades before Horizon, and especially easier on the Infiltrator with 3 sniper rifle upgrades so early. It’s the biotic classes who gets the shaft on NG+, however.



V. Exploits and Bugs

- It’s known that Flashbang nullifies Harbinger’s powers, so Horizon and the Collector Ship missions are easier because of it. However, it doesn’t work all the time, and I would not rely on it too much. The build can take out multiple Collectors just fine without the glitch to begin with.

- Like all powers, both Cryo Ammo and Flashbang will eventually fail every once in a while due to other powers and / or effects interfering, such as biotics. Both powers seem to fail most often when the target is still in the middle of it's getting back up animation, so be aware of these instances.

- Another thing happens often is if an enemy has been knocked down multiple times, he/she will never be able to get up, and will never stop screaming. Sometimes they can get knocked in between doors and walls, so unless you can shoot them, the game won’t let you continue and you have reload.

- Bozorgmehr discovered that Flashbang can sometimes instantly kill protected husks, right now there's no way to determine how this gets triggered, but it happens very often.


VI. Squadmates
I think this is pretty much up to each player’s preferences, and the general strategy for them are not that different from other popular builds, but I’ll add in some of my experiences with them. The most useful squadmates are the best defense strippers in the game like Miranda, Garrus, and Samara. Mordin and Grunt are also incredibly useful because they set people on fire. I find Jack the best suited to go on SB’s ship because you can already strip shields with the lightning rods, and her constant Shockwave spam knocks them out into space. Generally, it’s better to conserve squad powers because you always need at least one available in case you’re exposed and you're waiting for CD or regen, so can you use that remaining power to disrupt them from attacking you. For instance, if Garrus has already used Overload on a group, you don’t need to use Grunt’s concussive if you have Cloak or Flashbang available. You save that for the time when both you and Garrus are waiting for CD and you need a distraction.




PS: Thank you all for your inputs and contributions, I've done this because I've been inspired by all the great people here!

Edit1: Added link to numotsbane's guide to Flashbang and Squadmates section.
Edit2: Added videos.
Edit3: Added random insta-kills against protected husks in the exploits section.
Edit4: Added link to OniGanon's Invasive Maneuvers, Thisisme8's Controlling the Battlfield, and some minor edits.
Edit5: Updated to Cryo Ammo's freezing properties. Still up for investigtion.

Modifié par Tony Gunslinger, 12 janvier 2011 - 04:45 .


#2
Miss Yuna of Atlanta

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This is a really fantastic idea. I appreciate you bringing this to widespread attention. I'll probably give this build a shot really soon.

#3
Praetor Knight

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Yes, I second, great post.

#4
Sparrow44

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Yeah nice idea for Infiltrators Tony, never heard of a build including Assault Rifle training though. I too wish to see some vids of this in action.



Would you say this build is strictly for NG+ or can be done on New Game too?

#5
thisisme8

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I used to love playing the Infiltrator in a similar fashion. Never used Flashbang with it though. Sounds like fun. I have to admit, to me, this is a thinking man's class as anyone who has seen my videos knows... my style with the Vanguard and the Sentinel were all about getting in and straight blowing sh** up.

#6
Tony Gunslinger

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Thanks Miss Yuna, I'll be updating this whenever I can. Some of the things I've mentioned do require practice, such as grenade throwing, which is probably not everyone's cup of tea. There's a good guide about that somewhere in here and I should link it when i find it.

If you have the Normandy Crash site mission, you can actually do back down to Alchera even after you've completed the mission to practice grenade throwing, trying out different weapons, rearrange yout skills, or anything else. I think it's a bug that the game allows you to go back there, but whatever.

@ Sparroww, yes, you can play this on a new game, it's just that because you'll be getting Cryo Ammo, the Viper, and weapon specialization so late in the game, you still need to play a classic sniper Infiltrator for the majority of time. You can always play at a lower difficulty to get the weapon specialization, it's also a nice way practice before you decide to go on insanity.

thisisme8 wrote...

I used to love playing the Infiltrator
in a similar fashion. Never used Flashbang with it though. Sounds like
fun. I have to admit, to me, this is a thinking man's class as anyone
who has seen my videos knows... my style with the Vanguard and the
Sentinel were all about getting in and straight blowing sh** up.


Ha, I'm pretty pedestrian with the Vanguard. I have a pretty good aim and can fire quickly, but I don't see the field as well as some people here. I think people who are good at Vanguards can also be good quarterbacks... they just see things and react much faster.

#7
PrinceLionheart

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Tony Gunslinger wrote...

Thanks Miss Yuna, I'll be updating this whenever I can. Some of the things I've mentioned do require practice, such as grenade throwing, which is probably not everyone's cup of tea. There's a good guide about that somewhere in here and I should link it when i find it.


I think you're referring to Flash Delirium.

#8
Miss Yuna of Atlanta

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Ah, jeez. x_x
I've always sucked with grenades in every game I've ever played. It makes life hell for me in Uncharted 2, I tell you what. I might just have to change the bonus talent to Neural Shock. Would be nice for consistency, actually, considering that I used Neural Shock as my Infiltrator's bonus talent in the first game as well.

Modifié par Miss Yuna of Atlanta, 21 novembre 2010 - 06:01 .


#9
Sparrow44

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Flashbang is one of those powers where if you manage to get used to throwing 'em and are catching targets with them it is quite rewarding; v.large radius and decent duration of knockdown. Bit of a love it or leave it power.



That said Neural Shock seems like a good choice for this build also, especially the area version. Might try this build next, think I've got a post-SM Infiltrator save that I can use for NG+, cheers for the reply Tony I figured a build like this one would be better used earlier on with a lvl 30 character.

#10
Guest_m14567_*

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Thanks for taking the time to write this up, I'll need to take a shot at trying this, I've never really bothered with flashbang. I don't have the mattock, have you tried it with the vindicator? Can't imagine it is that much different.

#11
ScroguBlitzen

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 Nice guide Tony.  I've been trying to come up with a good Cryo+Flashbang Infiltrator technique, but you're way ahead of me.  I'll try this out and make some videos of it when I get enough time.

Couple questions though:  You claim that Improved Cryo Ammo has an increased chance to freeze and faster freezing animation.  Do you have any scientific evidence to back this up?  If not, then do you think we can bribe Sinosleep (our ME2 Chief Scientist) to check this out?

#12
Tony Gunslinger

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ScroguBlitzen wrote...

 Nice guide Tony.  I've been trying to come up with a good Cryo+Flashbang Infiltrator technique, but you're way ahead of me.  I'll try this out and make some videos of it when I get enough time.

Couple questions though:  You claim that Improved Cryo Ammo has an increased chance to freeze and faster freezing animation.  Do you have any scientific evidence to back this up?  If not, then do you think we can bribe Sinosleep (our ME2 Chief Scientist) to check this out?


The only time I’ve ever tested it was against Klixens at the beginning of Mordin’s LM. Squad Cryo Ammo froze them almost 3 secs, maybe 2.9, whereas Improved took close to 2 secs, maybe 2.2 at the most. Unfortunately I don’t have a stopwatch, so I don’t have the exact numbers. But I’m pretty sure the freezing speed is faster with Improved. As for chance to proc freeze, I’ve only tested when comparing different types of weapons, not as much on Improved vs. Squad when using the same weapon because it’s so random. SMGs sometimes proc as soon as the first shot, but can be as late as the 5th pull of the trigger. Something like that needs a lot of data and testing. As far as weapons go, the Mattock and the Viper always proc during the Klixen test. If there was ever an instance when it didn’t, I don’t remember it at all. That said, in real combat there were a few times when either weapons didn’t proc, but it’s hard to determine if it’s because another power or effect was overriding it or not.

But yeah, I’d love to get Sinosleep settle this. Vids always are more convincing :D

And thanks princelionheart, I’ll update this after I’m done with writing some info about squadmates and other minor edits. 

#13
Njorls

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Wow, what a great build and writeup. I read it, gave it a shot (reloaded a game prior to 1st collector ship, tried insanity, talk about trial by fire) and it's doing pretty well.



Infiltrator was by far my least favorite class, and this 'control through gunfire' approach is nice and novel. Thanks!


#14
Kronner

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Nice build!
I do have an Infiltrator, but with Shotgun and Neural Shockwave bonus power (OniGannon's build). I might switch to Flashbang for NG+. Is the Flashbang really that effective? Why not just use Kasumi? A video would be cool :)

Modifié par Kronner, 21 novembre 2010 - 07:21 .


#15
yuckygeo

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Kronner wrote...

Nice build!
I do have an Infiltrator, but with Shotgun and Neural Shockwave bonus power (OniGannon's build). I might switch to Flashbang for NG+. Is the Flashbang really that effective? Why not just use Kasumi? A video would be cool :)



Here's a video I made playing around with the Flashbang during the beginning of Kasumi's LM and Garrus' RM.  I'm playing a Vanguard and it's only a Level 2 FB but it does a great job of CC.  Here's another using FB on the two Scions on Horizon.

#16
Tony Gunslinger

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m14567 wrote...

Thanks for taking the time to write this up, I'll need to take a shot at trying this, I've never really bothered with flashbang. I don't have the mattock, have you tried it with the vindicator? Can't imagine it is that much different.


To be honest, if the Mattock wasn't around, I would have never considered making this build and I would have chosen shotgun and made a CQC build instead. Still, if you do want to use it, I think the Vindicator will hold up decently, just not as effective as the Mattock. I can control the Mattock's fire rate, especially against multiple enemies and moving targets. Besides dealing somewhat less damage, the Vindicator's fixed burst fire is too robotic for me to handle changing situations. The Vindicator also doesn't guarantee freeze in every shot (it's still very high, like maybe 80-90%), it's very minor in actual combat, but something to think about. I play a pretty aggressive style, and I depend on guaranteed freezing on the 1st shot at a stripped target so I can move on to the next, but you may not need to do that.

yuckygeo wrote...

Kronner wrote...

Nice build!
I
do have an Infiltrator, but with Shotgun and Neural Shockwave bonus
power (OniGannon's build). I might switch to Flashbang for NG+. Is the
Flashbang really that effective? Why not just use Kasumi? A video would
be cool :)



Here's a video I
made playing around with the Flashbang during the beginning of Kasumi's
LM and Garrus' RM.  I'm playing a Vanguard and it's only a Level 2 FB
but it does a great job of CC.  Here's another using FB on the two Scions on Horizon.


Cool... I don't see vids on flashbang that often. It kind of shows you that flashbang is not a "direct" power in that it doesn't use the game's targeting to home in a projectile on an enemy. If you had neural shock or overload, you have no choice but to cast it on the YMIR because the mercs are far behind it and out of the game's targeting range. You can throw flashbang all the way across the bridge, against the wall in which the mercs come, bypassing the YMIR, and if you're an Infiltrator, you can snipe them at the same time. That's an example of what flashbang can do... you usually cast it in between running from one cover to another, not after it, so that you use the delay to set up a strike by the time you've established your new position. Neural Shock is a direct power and is instant, so it has its advantages too. But to me, two things: one, I prefer to use my gun to freeze/kill and not waste a power CD in those situations, and two, grenades are friggin fun!

#17
Lleuen

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Good stuff! I usually use assassin as the passive power if I've got an assault rifle or just the Widow. My Agent build is for the most part, crowd-control/CCQ



Skill Distribution

3/2 Disruptor Ammo or

1/2 Cryo Ammo

4 Assassination Cloak

2 Incinerate

4 Area AI Hacking

4 Agent

4 Area Dominate - or in the case of non-organic enemy missions, Heavy Reave or GSB.



Recommended Weapons



M-97 Viper

Geth Plasma Shotgun

M-12 Locust

M-3 Predator / M-6 Carniflex - I prefer the M-3 over all the pistols

Heavy Weapon of choice?: Flamethrower/Avalanche/Arc Projector/Blackstorm



This build can be pretty dependant on squad ammo powers from party members: specifically those with Incendiary, Jack's Warp or Garrus' Armor-Piercing rounds. As for armor upgrades, I like using anything that'll boost my storm speed and melee (Kestrel/N7 mixed), or for RPing purposes, stick it with the Inferno Armor.


#18
Bozorgmehr

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Excellent guide (and read) Tony, well done!

I see you've perfected the Viper/Mattock Infiltrator. I believe you mentioned a similar build in OniGanon's Invasive Maneuvers Infiltrator guide a while ago; and although you explained your playstyle a little, I still considered it to be a rather 'odd' Infiltrator build (Improved vs Squad Cryo Ammo; the other way around with Disruptor Ammo; and Flashbang ... ). But this guide convinced me.

I've got to try this build, never really tried Flashbang, just couldn't find/think of a class/build to make it worthwhile - your build might prove me wrong :)

#19
PseudoEthnic

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Very nice build, good sir! However, I think that I will stick with my Tech Assassin.

#20
Sailears

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Nice guide, I remember you mentioning this in the other thread, but this is detailed and well explained. Would be lovely to see a video of it in action one day.


#21
Tony Gunslinger

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Yes, it was around that time that I started this build out. I was loving the Vanguard and planned to make a CQC Intfiltrator, but then after reloading an old save at the DCV, I screwed around with the AR thought "oh what the hell". AR training in and of itself wasn't that great, but when I added cc powers like flashbang and used cyro ammo, everything seemed to make sense. It took a while to re-learn how to snipe with the Viper... it's completely the opposite of using one-shot SR's, as well as getting used to flashbang. Afterwards I just got addicted to throwing grenades.

I'm trying to see if anyone I know have a capture card / recorder so I can post up videos of the things I've mentioned.

Modifié par Tony Gunslinger, 23 novembre 2010 - 10:23 .


#22
ScroguBlitzen

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I'm working on a character with your build. I just did IFF. Flashbang doesn't help much there, but using the Viper seems to be more effective vs Husks than the Widow. You just zoom and shoot them twice to remove armor and once to freeze, then re-zoom on another and do it again. You only need two shots to kill them if the first is a headshot. Breezed right through IFF first try with this build though.

#23
yuckygeo

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Here's a video I made comparing the Agent Infiltrator and a more "traditional" Infiltrator.  I was more interested to see how the Improved Cryo/Squad Disruptor ammo worked since I think most people would go with Squad Cryo/Heavy Disruptor ammo. 

The video is the first part of Jack's RM since I thought it would be a good place to use the Flashbang. 
The first part is using the Agent Infiltrator build with the Mattock, Viper, and FB.  The second part is my "normal" Infiltrator build using Squad Cryo, Tempest, Viper (shotgun training), FB.

It was a lot easier with the Agent Infiltrator build than my normal build (2 Critical Mission Failures).  The longer freeze duration of the Improved Cryo coupled with Disruptor ammo and FB made a noticeable difference.

#24
Tony Gunslinger

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yuckygeo wrote...

Here's a video I made comparing the Agent Infiltrator and a more "traditional" Infiltrator.  I was more interested to see how the Improved Cryo/Squad Disruptor ammo worked since I think most people would go with Squad Cryo/Heavy Disruptor ammo. 

The video is the first part of Jack's RM since I thought it would be a good place to use the Flashbang. 
The first part is using the Agent Infiltrator build with the Mattock, Viper, and FB.  The second part is my "normal" Infiltrator build using Squad Cryo, Tempest, Viper (shotgun training), FB.

It was a lot easier with the Agent Infiltrator build than my normal build (2 Critical Mission Failures).  The longer freeze duration of the Improved Cryo coupled with Disruptor ammo and FB made a noticeable difference.


Nice, yuckgeo. I actually thought you did a bit better on the Squad Cryo Ammo run. Did you mod your save so that you have both builds, or did you actually played both through? Congrats if you did the latter and have both available for comparison. I'm curious if Squad version can be better.

So, I finally got my hands on some capturing equipment. Here's a sample run of LotSB, I think it was done right after the Collector Ship. I got a bit sloppy at points in the game, but here it is:



A few more are on the way...

#25
InfiniteCuts

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Tony Gunslinger wrote...

Nice, yuckgeo. I actually thought you did a bit better on the Squad Cryo Ammo run. Did you mod your save so that you have both builds, or did you actually played both through? Congrats if you did the latter and have both available for comparison. I'm curious if Squad version can be better.

So, I finally got my hands on some capturing equipment. Here's a sample run of LotSB, I think it was done right after the Collector Ship. I got a bit sloppy at points in the game, but here it is:



A few more are on the way...


Well that was a hell of a lot more interesting than anticipated... so much versatility displayed in that vid.  I didn't think it could be done but I will be trying out an AR infiltrator sometime soon.