126 réponses à ce sujet

[So your Larry]

What type of Villian would you like to see?

i was always interested in people like Vlad the Impaler,  someone who put fear in his enemies to avoid a fight.  i can seriously see a vlad like qunari.

spoiled children with high ranking faters like Cesare Borgia are always interesting but there are to many of those

personallly I want Hawke to have a Arch Nemesis you get into acouple fights with,  im hoping Cassandra will be hawke's arch nemesis.

[Mythrael]

The best villians are always the ones who believe that they are the ones on the right side and persuing good and feeling righteous about it.

[Shadow Warior]

A trickster, puppeteer, a shadow that can be anybody so Hawke or the warden or... will always wander if he is still out there. I can see a character like that become part of the DA world.

[DarthCaine]

The one that has a lot of screentime. That's the problem with BioWare villians, they only appear in a few scenes.

Look at The Dark Knight for how it should be done.

Modifié par DarthCaine, 25 novembre 2010 - 07:16 .

[Shepard Lives]

Ronald McDonald.

[silentassassin264]

The puppeteer. It is much better when the villain is not an obvious evil guy that you can point out as soon as you see them.

[Shepard Lives]

DarthCaine wrote...

The one that has a lot of screentime. That's the problem with BioWare villians, they only appear in a few scenes.

Look at The Dark Knight for how it should be done.

Caine has a very good point. Loghain remains an exceptional character, but he (and Saren) would have benefited from some more scenes.

[Nerivant]

silentassassin264 wrote...

The puppeteer. It is much better when the villain is not an obvious evil guy that you can point out as soon as you see them.

Varric, you lying bastard!

[Maria Caliban]

The best villain is a matter of taste.

I do like it when the hero and villain have an emotionally intense relationship, however.

[Gavinthelocust]

A Magnificent bastard.
tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagnificentBastard

Modifié par Gavinthelocust, 25 novembre 2010 - 07:41 .

[Lord Gremlin]

It's either The Beard or The Cake. An invisible evil force behind everything.

[Crimson Invictus]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

A Magnificent bastard.

One might imagine the problem with that is the danger of the player liking the bad guy more than the hero.

[Wozearly]

Dunno - Darth Malak didn't have an especially huge amount of airtime, but what he did have was used to excellent effect and in the round I feel he was an excellent villain - not just because of his villainy nature, but because of the part he plays in your own story.



Generally, I agree with Mythrael. Some of the best villains are those who, in their own minds, aren't villains at all. Loghain was done fairly well in that regard, although the limited sympathy for him throughout the game and the fact that he seemed utterly incompetent at preparing for the Blight put him more in the pantomime villain box rather than a Renegade in Mass Effect, which is where I feel he should have been.



In my ideal world, by the time you got to the Landsmeet, toppling Loghain to place your own preferred king/queen on the throne should have been a hellish decision of "Are we sure we're better placed to defeat the Blight than Loghain is? If we stand against him, could we trigger a new wave of the civil war and doom Fereldan? Am I actually doing this for the right reasons, or is this a desire for vengeance after Ostagar? Can we back down now without him locking us up or executing us..."



At risk of bringing yet another Warhammer IP into my recent posts, for those who've read the Eisenhorn trilogy from 40K, that did a marvel of having the main character himself move from 'hero' to 'villain', at least from a puritan perspective. The main character in his hero days thwarts the schemes of his compatriots who are using villanous methods, believing them to be corrupted or insane, no matter how much they claim they're doing it for the greater good.



...and when he finds himself in their shoes at a later stage, and has to face down puritans calling him corrupted and insane, he remains absolutely convinced he's right and that what he's doing is for the greater good and is infuriated by their blinkered attempts to stop him.



In an IP where 'good' and 'evil' have an awful lot of grey shades and dependence on perspective, it was an excellent way to explore that part of its nature.

[dgcatanisiri]

I like villains who can be seen to be doing the wrong things for the right reasons. Someone who, under just slightly different circumstances, could have been the hero and the hero the villain. And they definitely cannot just be doing it for the evulz. A fallen or misguided hero is more engaging as a villain than a straight up 'mua-ha-ha'-ing evil doer.

In the first game, I was actually disappointed when I realized there was more to the game after the Landsmeet because Loghain had been more the driving force and main villain of the game. The battle with the archdemon felt more like an afterthought, a segment of game shoved on us because they remembered 'oh, yeah, there was a reason the Landsmeet was happening - stopping the blight. Better show that ending.' From the villain, I want them to be the driving force, the one we are going to face, not their proverbial dragon. Make it personal for the hero, even if it was only Tuesday for the villain, make the hero want to stand up and face this person and bring them to justice, medieval or other.

I also like the villain in plain sight, like Kreia from KOTOR 2, though this is one that has to be done very carefully - I prefer it when the signs don't point to them being the villain from the prologue to the reveal and then treating that as if it's some great shock. Many of us saw that coming from a long way off. Don't overplay your hand, but don't underplay it either. If you're going to do this, then you play it just enough to get the player to think 'Hey, maybe they're the bad guy... Nah, don't be silly. They can't be.'

[RandomSyhn]

I enjoy the concept of villany in general from the amoral to the misguided. As much as I enjoyed Logain as a villan I never felt it was that personal, my second playthrough was Cousland and the entire time I felt like I was more concerned about killing Howe than anyone else.

I agree making the Villan a personal demon of the protagonist is a good way to do it even as dgcatanisiri said "even if it was only Tuesday for the villain" engaging the player into thinking like the protagonist and working to meet personal goals.

I personally do enjoy a story with manipulation and puppetering from the backgorund, I can see alot of setup for that in th DA2 whether its political or Flemeth related.

I would like to see a villan who know's their the bad guy and likes the press, so to speak. Though that might make a more dynamic character if that character is helping out the protagonist.

Either way I'm really excited to see what villany Bioware has come up with to oppose us in DA2.

[Captain Iglo]

I always wish for a beloved teammate who turns into the or one of the mainvillain(s) troughout the history of several games (like in a trilogy...He/she starts as a great companion in part 1...turns in part2 and is the main foe in part3)

Modifié par Captain Iglo, 25 novembre 2010 - 08:23 .

[So your Larry]

oh it would be great, LI turned evil.

[Sylvius the Mad]

The ideal villain is always the player character.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 25 novembre 2010 - 08:48 .

[marbatico]

i'd like a villain that, when we first meet him is just the lackey of a real badguy, later on kill said badguy and takes his place. then, ofcourse, he is consumed by power.

[Wozearly]

So your Larry wrote...

oh it would be great, LI turned evil.

One of my Origins characters attempted to (possibly successfully) kill his LI.

Do I get an achievement for being pretty darn close, just the wrong way round?

[Brockololly]

Somebody with some connection to the PC or who otherwise does something to motivate the PC to action- like an Irenicus type. Problem in Origins was the Archdemon was just sort of a force of nature type thing and the Blight never really affected the PC in a personal way outside of the Dalish origin story.

And have them voiced by Jeremy Irons or Ian McShane.

[Dave of Canada]

Somebody who you can see their point of view and agree with them, though fight it because you know there's no other way. I loved Loghain for example.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 25 novembre 2010 - 10:29 .

[Shepard Lives]

Brockololly wrote...

And have them voiced by Jeremy Irons or Ian McShane.

I'm with this guy.

[Heavenblade]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The ideal villain is always the player character.

I agree, but I'm not sure if it's for the same reasons. For me, in almost any good story, the true obstacle and enemy of the player character is the player character himself. Sure, there can be any number of moustache twirling evil doers or insane wizards with a god complex, but at the end of the day, it is the characters struggle against his own weaknesses and failings that make or break things. All the "bad guys" are just obstacles against which the character must confront himself and reveal his own true nature.

A question, or a desire, or a belief held by the protagonist can all be formidable enemies when the PC is forced into a situation where these things must be analyzed and balanced against one another. I think this is doubly true in any story where the end game includes godlike levels of power.

/rantoff

[Xewaka]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The ideal villain is always the player character.

This I agree with.