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[LobselVith8]

Wereparrot wrote...

Have you been reading what I've said?

You mean when you mentioned how generals have said that women shouldn't serve in a discussion about how hormones can get people killed. By the sounds of it, you're making it seem like men are too inept to handle a woman fighting alongside them.

Wereparrot wrote...

I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion.

Not all warriors would agree with the practice of restraining emotion. I'm pretty sure the Viking warriors didn't practice that, especially their berserkers.

Wereparrot wrote...

The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the sames levels of self-restraint.

People are different. I see no difference in some men and women being capable soldiers, and others not being as effective. I see no issue with Alistair trusting the Warden who has lead them in battle for over a year to be the general of the armies, especially since the treaties with the Circle of Magi, the dwarves of Orzammar, and the Dalish clans compel them to ally with the Grey Wardens, not the ruler of Ferelden.

[mousestalker]

Wereparrot wrote...
Have you been reading what I've said? I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion. The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the same levels of self-restraint.

Staying calm is only needed if you are shooting a ranged weapon. Soldiers do not need to be monks to fight effectively. Quite the opposite in fact. In melee combat what's needed is to remember your strokes. That's more muscle memory and pattern recognition than anything else.

Thank you. Thanks to you I finally get to use something I learned from all my friends in the SCA. You made my day!

[Wereparrot]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Have you been reading what I've said?

You mean when you mentioned how generals have said that women shouldn't serve in a discussion about how hormones can get people killed. By the sounds of it, you're making it seem like men are too inept to handle a woman fighting alongside them.

Wereparrot wrote...

I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion.

Not all warriors would agree with the practice of restraining emotion. I'm pretty sure the Viking warriors didn't practice that, especially their berserkers.

Wereparrot wrote...

The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the sames levels of self-restraint.

People are different. I see no difference in some men and women being capable soldiers, and others not being as effective. I see no issue with Alistair trusting the Warden who has lead them in battle for over a year to be the general of the armies, especially since the treaties with the Circle of Magi, the dwarves of Orzammar, and the Dalish clans compel them to ally with the Grey Wardens, not the ruler of Ferelden.

No, I mean when I explained why women couldn't serve in the infantry.

I defy you to keep your composure at all times under all circumstances in battle. No? Jury out? You really think so? It's better to be safe than sorry.

I'm sure Viking warriors have nothing to do with our discussion 

People are different, yes, but you need the whole army must be AS ONE. Discipline is key in an effective military unit. I am not talking about Alistair and the Warden now; that's as it may be, and I suspend belief for it. Can you not treat what I am saying as an observation and a comparison to military thinking?

  

[Wereparrot]

mousestalker wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Have you been reading what I've said? I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion. The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the same levels of self-restraint.

Staying calm is only needed if you are shooting a ranged weapon. Soldiers do not need to be monks to fight effectively. Quite the opposite in fact. In melee combat what's needed is to remember your strokes. That's more muscle memory and pattern recognition than anything else.

Thank you. Thanks to you I finally get to use something I learned from all my friends in the SCA. You made my day!

So there is no stress or emotional provocation in melee combat? Thousands of medieval soldiers beg to differ.

[LobselVith8]

ejoslin wrote...

Edit; oh, ugh, this dialog is so confusing i can't tell where the flag is actually set.  But yeh, I'll fix it.

Very kind of you!

ejoslin wrote...

If Irving doesn't acknowledge the boon (if alive), then the flag wasn't set.  I really REALLY wish that file wasn't corrupted so I could check that.

Hmmm... if Irving is dead and the Cullen epilogue about him being a madman shows up if the Warden asks for the Magi boon, then would that mean that the flag for the Magi boon is active? I dislike the idea that my Warden's boon is going to be dismissed in DA2 because the devs didn't bother to fix the problems in the first game.

ejoslin wrote...

With Genetivi, a flag was used to trigger those slides that rarely would get set (you had to send him home after he saw the temple IIRC).  I changed it to them triggering if he wasn't attacked (he always dies if attacked) as per the script notes they're supposed to trigger when he's alive.

Would you happen to know if Genitivi is told that the Urn is destroyed by the villagers, but Kolgrim is spared, if the cultists epilogue shows up? I was looking to save Eamon without enpowering the Chantry or letting Genitivi kill himself once everyone calls him a fraud.

[LobselVith8]

Wereparrot wrote...

No, I mean when I explained why women couldn't serve in the infantry.

Yet there are examples of women serving elsewhere, and historically women have fought in battles. I don't see the issue here.

Wereparrot wrote...

I defy you to keep your composure at all times under all circumstances in battle. No? Jury out? You really think so? It's better to be safe than sorry.

People aren't machines. Men and women are people. I'm not certain what point you're trying to make here. In Ferelden, men and women serve in the military. Empress Celene leads Orlais, Anora has lead Ferelden in the name of her inept husband King Cailan, and Sophia Dryden was nearly the new ruler of Ferelden two hundred years ago.

Wereparrot wrote...

I'm sure Viking warriors have nothing to do with our discussion 

You made a comment about warriors keeping composure, and all I meant was that it's not a universal standard.

Wereparrot wrote...

People are different, yes, but you need the whole army must be AS ONE. Discipline is key in an effective military unit. I am not talking about Alistair and the Warden now; that's as it may be, and I suspend belief for it. Can you not treat what I am saying as an observation and a comparison to military thinking?

What's the issue of suspending your belief for a King or Queen to entrust the army to a general? The moment that Alistair takes the crown, he's going to be seen as the ruler of Ferelden, not a Grey Warden. Since the treaties all compel their new allies to side with a Grey Warden, it makes perfect sense for the Grey Warden who has been leading the moiety band against the darkspawn for over a year to be the general of the armies assembled to fight the darkspawn.

[mousestalker]

Wereparrot wrote...

mousestalker wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Have you been reading what I've said? I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion. The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the same levels of self-restraint.

Staying calm is only needed if you are shooting a ranged weapon. Soldiers do not need to be monks to fight effectively. Quite the opposite in fact. In melee combat what's needed is to remember your strokes. That's more muscle memory and pattern recognition than anything else.

Thank you. Thanks to you I finally get to use something I learned from all my friends in the SCA. You made my day!

So there is no stress or emotional provocation in melee combat? Thousands of medieval soldiers beg to differ.

That's not what I wrote. My point is that it is possible, even desirable, to be quite emotional and still be an effective melee combat fighter. Many thousands of medieval warriors do in fact agree with me on that. So do the ancient Romans and the classical Greeks. Not to mention the Norse.

[Wereparrot]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

No, I mean when I explained why women couldn't serve in the infantry.

Yet there are examples of women serving elsewhere, and historically women have fought in battles. I don't see the issue here.

Wereparrot wrote...

I defy you to keep your composure at all times under all circumstances in battle. No? Jury out? You really think so? It's better to be safe than sorry.

People aren't machines. Men and women are people. I'm not certain what point you're trying to make here. In Ferelden, men and women serve in the military. Empress Celene leads Orlais, Anora has lead Ferelden in the name of her inept husband King Cailan, and Sophia Dryden was nearly the new ruler of Ferelden two hundred years ago.

Wereparrot wrote...

I'm sure Viking warriors have nothing to do with our discussion 

You made a comment about warriors keeping composure, and all I meant was that it's not a universal standard.

Wereparrot wrote...

People are different, yes, but you need the whole army must be AS ONE. Discipline is key in an effective military unit. I am not talking about Alistair and the Warden now; that's as it may be, and I suspend belief for it. Can you not treat what I am saying as an observation and a comparison to military thinking?

What's the issue of suspending your belief for a King or Queen to entrust the army to a general? The moment that Alistair takes the crown, he's going to be seen as the ruler of Ferelden, not a Grey Warden. Since the treaties all compel their new allies to side with a Grey Warden, it makes perfect sense for the Grey Warden who has been leading the moiety band against the darkspawn for over a year to be the general of the armies assembled to fight the darkspawn.

Of course people aren't machines, which is why in the heat of moment we do rash things. In a well drilled military unit, these need to be kept in check as much as is possible.

For your last point, I would say that this is only due to the story, and you have failed to recognize what I said about not referring to DOA. We're not really on the same wavelength here if you continue to bring up the story, which I have already said many times that I accept, and am happy to.

[Wereparrot]

mousestalker wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

mousestalker wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Have you been reading what I've said? I am well aware of female warriors, but they were no doubt well aware of the need to restrain emotion. The whole idea rests on operational effectiveness, and you can't expect ever soldier in the army to show the same levels of self-restraint.

Staying calm is only needed if you are shooting a ranged weapon. Soldiers do not need to be monks to fight effectively. Quite the opposite in fact. In melee combat what's needed is to remember your strokes. That's more muscle memory and pattern recognition than anything else.

Thank you. Thanks to you I finally get to use something I learned from all my friends in the SCA. You made my day!

So there is no stress or emotional provocation in melee combat? Thousands of medieval soldiers beg to differ.

That's not what I wrote. My point is that it is possible, even desirable, to be quite emotional and still be an effective melee combat fighter. Many thousands of medieval warriors do in fact agree with me on that. So do the ancient Romans and the classical Greeks. Not to mention the Norse.

Either emotion will focus the mind, or it will corrupt it. Anything that may corrupt the mind is best left behind. As the Illusive Man say's: 'If it will affect the mission, best that you leave it behind.'

Imagine there is a company of soldiers, men and women, and that two of these are in a relationship. All fine and well, if they keep it professional. What do you think would happen if one of the persons involved had an affair with someone else in the same company? Discord, most likely, and a loss of discipline, leading to a decrease in morale not just manifested in  the three people involved, but in the whole company since discord will spread like the plague. The company will be in no mental shape to fight well. 

[ejoslin]

Wereparrot wrote...

Either emotion will focus the mind, or it will corrupt it. Anything that may corrupt the mind is best left behind. As the Illusive Man say's: 'If it will affect the mission, best that you leave it behind.'

Imagine there is a company of soldiers, men and women, and that two of these are in a relationship. All fine and well, if they keep it professional. What do you think would happen if one of the persons involved had an affair with someone else in the same company? Discord, most likely, and a loss of discipline, leading to a decrease in morale not just manifested in  the three people involved, but in the whole company since discord will spread like the plague. The company will be in no mental shape to fight well. 

So if Alistair and the warden are in a political marriage, you actually do NOT see this as an issue as they are not in a relationship.  Is this correct?

Also, do you feel that the warden should break up with their love interest before the final battle?  Or are you saying that they should not be allowed to fight with the warden in the final battle and should instead be left at the gate?

I'm not saying you're right or wrong.  I just want to understand if this is what you're saying.

Modifié par ejoslin, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:10 .

[IanPolaris]

Wereparrot wrote...

Either emotion will focus the mind, or it will corrupt it. Anything that may corrupt the mind is best left behind. As the Illusive Man say's: 'If it will affect the mission, best that you leave it behind.'

Imagine there is a company of soldiers, men and women, and that two of these are in a relationship. All fine and well, if they keep it professional. What do you think would happen if one of the persons involved had an affair with someone else in the same company? Discord, most likely, and a loss of discipline, leading to a decrease in morale not just manifested in  the three people involved, but in the whole company since discord will spread like the plague. The company will be in no mental shape to fight well. 

The Ancient Spartans had man for man some of the most brutally effective soldiers for their time and their combat skills were the envy of the ancient world....and they would strongly disagree with you.  The Ancient Spartans not only allowed but encouraged close, even romantic same-sex relationships between the men because it enhanced unit cohesiveness.

-Polaris

[mousestalker]

Not to mention the Sacred Band of Thebes. Or the relationship between Alexander the Great and Hephaestion.

[Wereparrot]

ejoslin wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Either emotion will focus the mind, or it will corrupt it. Anything that may corrupt the mind is best left behind. As the Illusive Man say's: 'If it will affect the mission, best that you leave it behind.'

Imagine there is a company of soldiers, men and women, and that two of these are in a relationship. All fine and well, if they keep it professional. What do you think would happen if one of the persons involved had an affair with someone else in the same company? Discord, most likely, and a loss of discipline, leading to a decrease in morale not just manifested in  the three people involved, but in the whole company since discord will spread like the plague. The company will be in no mental shape to fight well. 

So if Alistair and the warden are in a political marriage, you actually do NOT see this as an issue as they are not in a relationship.  Is this correct?

Also, do you feel that the warden should break up with their love interest before the final battle?  

I'm not saying you're right or wrong.  I just want to understand if this is what you're saying.

No. It's a fantasy. Who am I to judge? I wouldn't want them to break up as that would ruin immersion in the story.

As far as the political marriage goes; again, it's fantasy. I'm not going to play the killjoy here.

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

[Sarah1281]

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Alistiar's 'unit' (keeping in mind his only 'unit' would be Leliana, Wynne, Sten, ect.) might find him too worried protecting the general who may very well fight better than him? Alistair and his Queen don't actually fight with the main forces. They continue to only go with the people who know them far better than that.

[Wereparrot]

Sarah1281 wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Alistiar's 'unit' (keeping in mind his only 'unit' would be Leliana, Wynne, Sten, ect.) might find him too worried protecting the general who may very well fight better than him? Alistair and his Queen don't actually fight with the main forces. They continue to only go with the people who know them far better than that.

I'm talking about after he is king, so he wouldn't have Sten and the rest, but a whole army.

[ejoslin]

Wereparrot wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Alistiar's 'unit' (keeping in mind his only 'unit' would be Leliana, Wynne, Sten, ect.) might find him too worried protecting the general who may very well fight better than him? Alistair and his Queen don't actually fight with the main forces. They continue to only go with the people who know them far better than that.

I'm talking about after he is king, so he wouldn't have Sten and the rest, but a whole army.

Actually Sarah is right -- during the final onslaught, you're traveling with 3 companions and you can call a small unit to aid you, but that's not the bulk of the army.

Edit: I'm having a problem with the way you're jumping from the game world to the real world.  It's hard to keep track of the argument because of this.

Queen Cousland is more than Alistair's betrothed -- she is the acting leader of the Ferelden Gray Wardens.  Not much is made out of their relationship until after the blight is over.  The HNF announces she's going to rule by Alistair's side, and that's it as far as the public statements go.  My guess is most of the rank and file wouldn't even know.

But what exactly DO you expect to happen with the Queen-Consort?  She can't very well leave the gray wardens.  She has several armies who are there because of her actions, and is their leader (Alistair was clearly subservient to her when they were gathering the armies, if he was present at all).

Anyway, she is first and foremost a Gray Warden.  That Alistair makes her general of his army rather than have the gathered armies have two rulers is not a bad thing.

Modifié par ejoslin, 14 janvier 2011 - 08:48 .

[LobselVith8]

Wereparrot wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Taking one for the team? He's the ruler of all Ferelden, the last living son of Maric the Savior. You do realize that he's the King, and it's likely there are going to be people looking to protect him, right? That's why the red-armored guards are at Redcliffe, after all. I don't think any of them are expecting Alistair to take a sword to the chest to save them from I'm certain Arl Eamon's going to assign them to protect the King.

[Wereparrot]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Taking one for the team? He's the ruler of all Ferelden, the last living son of Maric the Savior. You do realize that he's the King, and it's likely there are going to be people looking to protect him, right? That's why the red-armored guards are at Redcliffe, after all. I don't think any of them are expecting Alistair to take a sword to the chest to save them from I'm certain Arl Eamon's going to assign them to protect the King.

Yes and no. Since we have gone back to being pedantic-while warrior kings were always the best protected, they also didn't shirk from what they perceived to be their military responsibility, and I would expect no less of Alistair.

[Sarah1281]

Yes and no. Since we have gone back to being pedantic-while warrior kings were always the best protected, they also didn't shirk from what they perceived to be their military responsibility, and I would expect no less of Alistair.

And people would fear that Alistair wouldn't do this if his betrothed is anywhere near him because...?

[ejoslin]

Wereparrot wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Taking one for the team? He's the ruler of all Ferelden, the last living son of Maric the Savior. You do realize that he's the King, and it's likely there are going to be people looking to protect him, right? That's why the red-armored guards are at Redcliffe, after all. I don't think any of them are expecting Alistair to take a sword to the chest to save them from I'm certain Arl Eamon's going to assign them to protect the King.

Yes and no. Since we have gone back to being pedantic-while warrior kings were always the best protected, they also didn't shirk from what they perceived to be their military responsibility, and I would expect no less of Alistair.

How is Alistair shirking from his military responsibility by replacing Loghain?  He's not creating a new commander -- he's replacing the one he just ousted.

And again, you're ignoring the fact that the Gray Wardens are now playing a major role, as few of them as there are.  This is not solely the ferelden military -- it's several armies, most of which are being commanded by the warden PC as it is.

[Wereparrot]

ejoslin wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Alistiar's 'unit' (keeping in mind his only 'unit' would be Leliana, Wynne, Sten, ect.) might find him too worried protecting the general who may very well fight better than him? Alistair and his Queen don't actually fight with the main forces. They continue to only go with the people who know them far better than that.

I'm talking about after he is king, so he wouldn't have Sten and the rest, but a whole army.

Actually Sarah is right -- during the final onslaught, you're traveling with 3 companions and you can call a small unit to aid you, but that's not the bulk of the army.

Edit: I'm having a problem with the way you're jumping from the game world to the real world.  It's hard to keep track of the argument because of this.

Queen Cousland is more than Alistair's betrothed -- she is the acting leader of the Ferelden Gray Wardens.  Not much is made out of their relationship until after the blight is over.  The HNF announces she's going to rule by Alistair's side, and that's it as far as the public statements go.  My guess is most of the rank and file wouldn't even know.

But what exactly DO you expect to happen with the Queen-Consort?  She can't very well leave the gray wardens.  She has several armies who are there because of her actions, and is their leader (Alistair was clearly subservient to her when they were gathering the armies, if he was present at all).

Anyway, she is first and foremost a Gray Warden.  That Alistair makes her general of his army rather than have the gathered armies have two rulers is not a bad thing.

But he isn't actually king at the battle of Denerrim, and the troops of the Fereldan army afterwards would well know who was queen.

According to the conversation between Anora and king Cousland in Awakening he/she can leave the Wardens.

What do you mean about two rulers?

[mousestalker]

ejoslin and Sarah are making a point that needs to be emphasized, The elves, dwarves and mages are responsible to the Grey Wardens. That's who their treaties are with. The Grey Warden they know and have reaffirmed their vows to is the Warden PC, not Alistair.

[ejoslin]

Wereparrot wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Alistiar's 'unit' (keeping in mind his only 'unit' would be Leliana, Wynne, Sten, ect.) might find him too worried protecting the general who may very well fight better than him? Alistair and his Queen don't actually fight with the main forces. They continue to only go with the people who know them far better than that.

I'm talking about after he is king, so he wouldn't have Sten and the rest, but a whole army.

Actually Sarah is right -- during the final onslaught, you're traveling with 3 companions and you can call a small unit to aid you, but that's not the bulk of the army.

Edit: I'm having a problem with the way you're jumping from the game world to the real world.  It's hard to keep track of the argument because of this.

Queen Cousland is more than Alistair's betrothed -- she is the acting leader of the Ferelden Gray Wardens.  Not much is made out of their relationship until after the blight is over.  The HNF announces she's going to rule by Alistair's side, and that's it as far as the public statements go.  My guess is most of the rank and file wouldn't even know.

But what exactly DO you expect to happen with the Queen-Consort?  She can't very well leave the gray wardens.  She has several armies who are there because of her actions, and is their leader (Alistair was clearly subservient to her when they were gathering the armies, if he was present at all).

Anyway, she is first and foremost a Gray Warden.  That Alistair makes her general of his army rather than have the gathered armies have two rulers is not a bad thing.

But he isn't actually king at the battle of Denerrim, and the troops of the Fereldan army afterwards would well know who was queen.

According to the conversation between Anora and king Cousland in Awakening he/she can leave the Wardens.

What do you mean about two rulers?

let me rephrase -- you seriously don't expect the acting leader of the Ferelden Gray Wardens to leave the Gray Wardens and stop leading the armies they gathered during a blight, just before the final battle, do you?

And I mean, when I say two rulers, of course, two commanders of the armies.  Sorry for the bad choice of words there.

Edit: QFT

mousestalker wrote...

ejoslin and Sarah are making a point that needs to be emphasized, The elves, dwarves and mages are responsible to the Grey Wardens. That's who their treaties are with. The Grey Warden they know and have reaffirmed their vows to is the Warden PC, not Alistair.

Modifié par ejoslin, 14 janvier 2011 - 09:07 .

[Wereparrot]

ejoslin wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

And as for queen Cousland being made general, or even being allowed on the frontline anyway, I think in the real world it may cause problems if the rest of Alistair's unit consider him to be more interested in protecting queen Cousland than taking one for the team, as it were, however subconscious Alistair's actions are-but again, it's a fantasy, and I wouldn't change it. There is a fine line between realism and immersion.

Taking one for the team? He's the ruler of all Ferelden, the last living son of Maric the Savior. You do realize that he's the King, and it's likely there are going to be people looking to protect him, right? That's why the red-armored guards are at Redcliffe, after all. I don't think any of them are expecting Alistair to take a sword to the chest to save them from I'm certain Arl Eamon's going to assign them to protect the King.

Yes and no. Since we have gone back to being pedantic-while warrior kings were always the best protected, they also didn't shirk from what they perceived to be their military responsibility, and I would expect no less of Alistair.

How is Alistair shirking from his military responsibility by replacing Loghain?  He's not creating a new commander -- he's replacing the one he just ousted.

And again, you're ignoring the fact that the Gray Wardens are now playing a major role, as few of them as there are.  This is not solely the ferelden military -- it's several armies, most of which are being commanded by the warden PC as it is.

I didn't say about Alistair shirking his responsibilities. I said the medieval warrior kings never shirked what was expected of them militarily no matter what protection they had, and that I would expect Alistair to be likewise, regardless of his wife's potential presence.

What are you trying to say about the Grey Wardens? It's irrelevant!

[Sarah1281]

But he isn't actually king at the battle of Denerrim, and the troops of the Fereldan army afterwards would well know who was queen.

And after the Blight is over, both Alistair AND his betrothed will not be leading troops into battle. Just as Anora ruled while Cailan was off, if Queen Cousland was going to lead troops into battle then Alistair would stay put in Denerim and if Alistair was leading troops, Queen Cousland would stay behind so there would be a ruler. Both Alistair and Queen Cousland are only going to be fighting together during the Blight where they aren't fighting with the rank-and-file soldiers but rather are on a special mission only they can do: to kill the Archdemon.