969 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

Disgust at such callous glee, if you need it spelled out. The gore usually doesn't concern me all that much.

It's a video game and the guy had caused far more suffeing than just what Anora suffered. So yes I was gleeful.

What I was supposed to feel bad that Karma bit him in the ass? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:38 .

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Disgust at such callous glee, if you need it spelled out. The gore usually doesn't concern me all that much.

It's a video game and the guy had caused far more suffeing than just what Anora suffered. So yes I was gleeful.

What I was supposed to feel bad that Karma bit him in the ass? 

I don't care if it's a game or not. I do not care how you justify an innocent's suffering because more suffering has been caused by her father. All I see during that moment is human tragedy. I will never understand those who are gleeful at such horror. Be it this or Alistair being led away to be executed. Gets to me just as much. Like I said, until you have watched one of your parents die (As I have), you may never understand the traumatic horror of such an experience.

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...
I don't care if it's a game or not. I do not care how you justify an innocent's suffering because more suffering has been caused by her father. All I see during that moment is human tragedy. I will never understand those who are gleeful at such horror. Be it this or Alistair being led away to be executed. Gets to me just as much. Like I said, until you have watched one of your parents die (As I have), you may never understand the traumatic horror of such an experience.

And the only thing I see is someone getting what they deserve.

An innocent? Really? You and I have vastly different views of what an innocent is.

And I love how you assume you know what I've experienced. Really get the hell off your high horse. It's not impressive.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:48 .

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...


I don't care if it's a game or not. I do not care how you justify an innocent's suffering because more suffering has been caused by her father. All I see during that moment is human tragedy. I will never understand those who are gleeful at such horror. Be it this or Alistair being led away to be executed. Gets to me just as much. Like I said, until you have watched one of your parents die (As I have), you may never understand the traumatic horror of such an experience.

And the only thing I see is someone getting what they deserve.

And I love how you assume you know what I've experienced. Really get the hell off your high horse. It's not impressive.

Good for you, if that is all you see.

I'm not keen on impressing you. If you've gone through this too and still don't feel a sliver of sympathy, I'd feel even more repulsed by such glee. Nothing against you, personally. I simply never understood it. And I hope I never will.

[Addai]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

falloutseriesfan wrote...

 Uhhh....  Why all the hate for Eamon? 

Because Eamon planning to help Alistair become a good and strong king automatically means he's is a power-grabbing puppetmaster.

Or something.

(husband)

But Eamon is two faced, he is so in a very amiable way but nevetheless it is true.

Here's on example.    If you are a Cousland male and happen to hint that you are thinking about courting the queen, he talks about how it "wouldn't be proper for her to marry so soon after her last marriage".

If you however mention the same thing but with Alistair he seems to like the idea at saying something like it wasn't his first choice but it would be an ideal strategy to gain support.(he of course later seems to get cold feet regarding this option)

Anyway its obvious that he is just trying to subtely steer the player character in the right direction.   If he thought this was a universal faux pas why not mention it when Allistair marriage option is presented?

Modifié par Addai67, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:48 .

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...
Good for you, if that is all you see.

I'm not keen on impressing you. If you've gone through this too and still don't feel a sliver of sympathy, I'd feel even more repulsed by such glee. Nothing against you, personally. I simply never understood it. And I hope I never will.

You think I care about you impressing me?

Anyways whatever about the glee. You should hope to never understand it. And I'm not being saracastic. There is no feeling like being wronged and wanting to rip someone apart. Nothing.

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...
I don't care if it's a game or not. I do not care how you justify an innocent's suffering because more suffering has been caused by her father. All I see during that moment is human tragedy. I will never understand those who are gleeful at such horror. Be it this or Alistair being led away to be executed. Gets to me just as much. Like I said, until you have watched one of your parents die (As I have), you may never understand the traumatic horror of such an experience.

And the only thing I see is someone getting what they deserve.

An innocent? Really? You and I have vastly different views of what an innocent is.

And I love how you assume you know what I've experienced. Really get the hell off your high horse. It's not impressive.

You watch your parent die day by day from AIDS? Hm? Watch them shrivel away like dust? Did you? Did you go through her abusing you because she was sick and spent your last moments as a five year old child clutching her arm and begging her to wake up? Did you? 

I watched my mother die of cancer day by day for 4 1/2 years. Yes, she shriveled away like dust. I was 19 when she died. Telling her it was alright to let go. That I'd take care of my youngest sister while my father was screwing another woman & drinking 5 bottles of wine per day.

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Good for you, if that is all you see.

I'm not keen on impressing you. If you've gone through this too and still don't feel a sliver of sympathy, I'd feel even more repulsed by such glee. Nothing against you, personally. I simply never understood it. And I hope I never will.

You think I care about you impressing me?

Anyways whatever about the glee. You should hope to never understand it. And I'm not being saracastic. There is no feeling like being wronged and wanting to rip someone apart. Nothing.

You brought the impressing bit up, not I.

Oh, I know the feeling. Only I've come to the conclusion that ripping someone apart is not worth it. It doesn't give me peace. Revenge never gave me peace. But that's just me.

As for innocence...what crime has Anora committed to deserve such a punishment? Such harrowing pain?

Modifié par Persephone, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:50 .

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...


I watched my mother die of cancer day by day for 4 1/2 years. Yes, she shriveled away like dust. I was 19 when she died. Telling her it was alright to let go. That I'd take care of my youngest sister while my father was screwing another woman & drinking 5 bottles of wine per day.

So we have that somewhat at least.

Ah whatever. If you don't get it you don't. And maybe the glee disgusts you but the fact that anyone can forgive him disgusts me.

[Addai]

Persephone wrote...

Maybe that, especially if you talked to her before, you'd keep your end of the bargain and spare her father. It's not such a wide logical leap. But many even promise to support her, let her keep her end of the bargain...only not just to kill her father but to betray her. I've always been honest with Anora. Especially since many harp on her "turning" on you, what justice is there in turning on her so completely?

I don't ever promise her that.  The Warden can't promise it, anyway- who are you to say what the Landsmeet will do?  I usually say "justice must be done, don't you think?" and leave it at that (to which she agrees).

I generally am honest with her, too, unless I'm playing a PC who's very political and willing to play her game.  I can't feel all that sorry for Anora, though, either way.  Not only does she turn on either the Warden or her father, she lies about whichever one she's throwing under the bus (accusing her father of deliberately killing Cailan and kidnapping her, for instance, whereas in private she expresses doubt about the former and knows very well the latter is Howe's doing).  Some people see this as cunning and find it admirable, even find that it makes her more qualified for the throne.  In games where I put her on the throne, however, I have to do so with my nose held.  She's not quite as bad as Bhelen, but she's not far off.

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

You brought the impressing bit up, not I.

Oh, I know the feeling. Only I've come to the conclusion that ripping someone apart is not worth it. It doesn't give me peace. Revenge never gave me peace. But that's just me.

You're right it's just you.

Who said impressing me. I brought up being impressive in general. Really though the whole "how disgusting!" wasn't even necessary to start with. IT was a joke. Grow some thicker skin. 

As for Anora I didn't say she deserved to have her father killed in front of her. But she threw my Warden who was only trying to help her under a bus twice. (Once when she called Ser Cautherine) and again at the Landsmeet when ou don't agree to support her. (Or tell her straight out you're killing Loghain.)

Modifié par Ryzaki, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:53 .

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...


I watched my mother die of cancer day by day for 4 1/2 years. Yes, she shriveled away like dust. I was 19 when she died. Telling her it was alright to let go. That I'd take care of my youngest sister while my father was screwing another woman & drinking 5 bottles of wine per day.

So we have that somewhat at least.

Ah whatever. If you don't get it you don't. And maybe the glee disgusts you but the fact that anyone can forgive him disgusts me.

And we agree on the Mako being superior to the Hammerhead! 

As for forgiveness.... I was taught to forgive and found much peace in it. I forgave my father, as my mother did. My Wardens do not "forgive" Loghain. He does not even want that, I believe. Yet...judge not, lest you be judged. In the Redeemer ending I found my "ideal" canon ending. (I do have Saves where he makes it into DAA, you never know what may happen in DA2 if he lives......)

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

You brought the impressing bit up, not I.

Oh, I know the feeling. Only I've come to the conclusion that ripping someone apart is not worth it. It doesn't give me peace. Revenge never gave me peace. But that's just me.

You're right it's just you.

Who said impressing me. I brought up being impressive in general. Really though the whole "how disgusting!" wasn't even necessary to start with. IT was a joke. Grow some thicker skin. 

As for Anora I didn't say she deserved to have her father killed in front of her. But she threw my Warden who was only trying to help her under a bus twice. (Once when she called Ser Cautherine) and again at the Landsmeet when ou don't agree to support her. (Or tell her straight out you're killing Loghain.)

You betrayed her first by revealing her identity when she explicitly asked you not to.

And can you name any queen or child who will support those who tell them that they plan to supplant her (She can add 2+2, Alistair OR Eamon will have her killed) and/or kill her father? How are you helping her by doing these things?

Edit: And I'm not the only one who finds little of substance in revenge.

Modifié par Persephone, 29 novembre 2010 - 07:57 .

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...


I watched my mother die of cancer day by day for 4 1/2 years. Yes, she shriveled away like dust. I was 19 when she died. Telling her it was alright to let go. That I'd take care of my youngest sister while my father was screwing another woman & drinking 5 bottles of wine per day.

So we have that somewhat at least.

Ah whatever. If you don't get it you don't. And maybe the glee disgusts you but the fact that anyone can forgive him disgusts me.

And we agree on the Mako being superior to the Hammerhead! 

As for forgiveness.... I was taught to forgive and found much peace in it. I forgave my father, as my mother did. My Wardens do not "forgive" Loghain. He does not even want that, I believe. Yet...judge not, lest you be judged. In the Redeemer ending I found my "ideal" canon ending. (I do have Saves where he makes it into DAA, you never know what may happen in DA2 if he lives......)

It is thought. The Hammerhead is made out of tissue paper I swear!

Forgiveness...doesn't make much of adifference in my experience when the one you're trying to forgive keeps making the same mistakes over and over.

I guess the only way I'm not disgusted is if he's feed to the Archedemon. All those lives he ruined with his obsession with an old war. Just from a refusa lto let go.

I don't mind being judged personally. And my ideal canon ending is DR. It used to be US but OGB has finally won me over.

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

You brought the impressing bit up, not I.

Oh, I know the feeling. Only I've come to the conclusion that ripping someone apart is not worth it. It doesn't give me peace. Revenge never gave me peace. But that's just me.

You're right it's just you.

Who said impressing me. I brought up being impressive in general. Really though the whole "how disgusting!" wasn't even necessary to start with. IT was a joke. Grow some thicker skin. 

As for Anora I didn't say she deserved to have her father killed in front of her. But she threw my Warden who was only trying to help her under a bus twice. (Once when she called Ser Cautherine) and again at the Landsmeet when ou don't agree to support her. (Or tell her straight out you're killing Loghain.)

You betrayed her first by revealing her identity when she explicitly asked you not to.

And can you name any queen or child who will support those who tell them that they plan to supplant her (She can add 2+2, Alistair OR Eamon will have her killed) and/or kill her father? How are you helping her by doing these things?

Edit: And I'm not the only one who finds little of substance in revenge.

I never meant to say you were the only one. I'm not the only one who finds an eye for an eye to be a good policy either.

Uh no. Cautherine shows up there magically despite Howe's own men not knowing he's dead? Only way she could know is if Anora told her.

She would not necessarily be killed. Hell Eamon asks her to swear fealty so they can avoid that! But she clings to the throne! 

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...


I watched my mother die of cancer day by day for 4 1/2 years. Yes, she shriveled away like dust. I was 19 when she died. Telling her it was alright to let go. That I'd take care of my youngest sister while my father was screwing another woman & drinking 5 bottles of wine per day.

So we have that somewhat at least.

Ah whatever. If you don't get it you don't. And maybe the glee disgusts you but the fact that anyone can forgive him disgusts me.

And we agree on the Mako being superior to the Hammerhead! 

As for forgiveness.... I was taught to forgive and found much peace in it. I forgave my father, as my mother did. My Wardens do not "forgive" Loghain. He does not even want that, I believe. Yet...judge not, lest you be judged. In the Redeemer ending I found my "ideal" canon ending. (I do have Saves where he makes it into DAA, you never know what may happen in DA2 if he lives......)

It is thought. The Hammerhead is made out of tissue paper I swear!

The Hammerhead made me ditch Overlord for months due to frustration. I HATE that thing.

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

You brought the impressing bit up, not I.

Oh, I know the feeling. Only I've come to the conclusion that ripping someone apart is not worth it. It doesn't give me peace. Revenge never gave me peace. But that's just me.

You're right it's just you.

Who said impressing me. I brought up being impressive in general. Really though the whole "how disgusting!" wasn't even necessary to start with. IT was a joke. Grow some thicker skin. 

As for Anora I didn't say she deserved to have her father killed in front of her. But she threw my Warden who was only trying to help her under a bus twice. (Once when she called Ser Cautherine) and again at the Landsmeet when ou don't agree to support her. (Or tell her straight out you're killing Loghain.)

You betrayed her first by revealing her identity when she explicitly asked you not to.

And can you name any queen or child who will support those who tell them that they plan to supplant her (She can add 2+2, Alistair OR Eamon will have her killed) and/or kill her father? How are you helping her by doing these things?

Edit: And I'm not the only one who finds little of substance in revenge.

I never meant to say you were the only one. I'm not the only one who finds an eye for an eye to be a good policy either.

Uh no. Cautherine shows up there magically despite Howe's own men not knowing he's dead? Only way she could know is if Anora told her.

She would not necessarily be killed. Hell Eamon asks her to swear fealty so they can avoid that! But she clings to the throne! 

Shows up magically....yup, plot hole. How was she supposed to contact Cauthrien through a magically sealed door?

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

The Hammerhead made me ditch Overlord for months due to frustration. I HATE that thing.

Ha did you get stuck in that air vent thing? I kept getting stuck in the corners and rage quitted.

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...
Shows up magically....yup, plot hole. How was she supposed to contact Cauthrien through a magically sealed door?

Door wasn't magically sealed until you got there.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 29 novembre 2010 - 08:03 .

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

The Hammerhead made me ditch Overlord for months due to frustration. I HATE that thing.

Ha did you get stuck in that air vent thing? I kept getting stuck in the corners and rage quitted.

That. And those effin' LAVA Streams!!!! ARGH!

[Ryzaki]

Persephone wrote...

That. And those effin' LAVA Streams!!!! ARGH!

ah. The Hammerhead is the one reason I never finished Overlord. A Shame but I really couln't take the HH. I'll probably end up using a SGE when ME3 comes out.

[Addai]

Persephone wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Hanz54321 wrote...

Um . . .  I have to say that Loghain threw himself under the bus.  The chain of events starting at Ostagar became more and more distasteful and tyranical.

Sure.  And if all that is true, she should support the Warden unconditionally, as she also promises to do if you question her request to rescue her out of Howe's estate.  But she doesn't do so if her own political ambitions are at stake.  Hence, she is just as big a political animal as Eamon.  I would say moreso

I can think of no queen/ruler who'd happily be supplanted and support those who want to replace her with an untrained, inexperienced boy who doesn't even want to be king. Neither can I think of a daughter who'll happily support those who tell her not only the above but that they also plan to kill her father.

(husband)

I think people objection to Anora is based on her single mindedness about it.   Folks like Eamon, while they have their faults will support your character even if they don't get their way because they recognize that their still is a common good in doing so to defeat the Blight, end the Civil way etc.

Anora help however is predicated only getting the position as Queen Regnant.   While some say "the power was her's" etc. that not really true.   (We've already had dozens of discussing about the difference between consort and Regnant  monarchs).

Anora was trained and groomed to rule and naturally expected too.   But that wasn't the only option available.   There were other obvious options that the game doesn't give you for the sake of drama.   Here's a good example,, if Anora sensed she was going to loose the Landsmeet, otherwise not have enough leverage to be queen rather than vow to never except Allistair, she could have brokered a deal to have Gwarn transfered to her and maybe even be made a chancellor.   That would have given her plenty of power and wealth.    But Anora is not one to accept second place.....

Modifié par Addai67, 29 novembre 2010 - 08:06 .

[Persephone]

Ryzaki wrote...

Persephone wrote...

That. And those effin' LAVA Streams!!!! ARGH!

ah. The Hammerhead is the one reason I never finished Overlord. A Shame but I really couln't take the HH. I'll probably end up using a SGE when ME3 comes out.

And Dr. Archer has Loghain's voice....how could you even touch it?!