92 réponses à ce sujet

[Manic Sheep]

mineralica wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...
in teh codex it says weapons were "retro fitted" with Thermal clips and retro means old so the ship must have crashed during the first wave of Thermal clip popularity and Mechs are better than shooting down crazed stranded crewmen and women.

And Shepard may insert old clips in his gun? Hoiw caring weapon manufacturers are to do them excangable. Plus, there's enough crazy crewmember to shoot - but I'd better not imagine crew member with abilities of YMIR.

Bah thats a gameplay mechanic, just like how there are clips littering the ground in every mission and random boxes of heavy weapon ammo all around the place. Or would you prefer you didn’t have ammo for the whole mission?

The mechs should be outdated and thus not the same as the others you encounter but do you expect them to make new mech models for this one mission? Neither of these things are plot holes.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 07:46 .

[TheNexus]

How about the fact that the Collectors are so thorough with how they clean out human colonies, making sure to leave no one, yet put them on the Normandy and they little a cripple get by to compromise them.



It was actually a really fun part of the missions and I liked it for its, as Joker put it, "s*** s*** s***" quality, but... really?



"THIS HURTS YOU....NOT YOU JOKER, YOU CAN RUN BY US AND WE WONT TOUCH YOU"

[LorDC]

TheNexus wrote...

How about the fact that the Collectors are so thorough with how they clean out human colonies, making sure to leave no one, yet put them on the Normandy and they little a cripple get by to compromise them.

It was actually a really fun part of the missions and I liked it for its, as Joker put it, "s*** s*** s***" quality, but... really?

"THIS HURTS YOU....NOT YOU JOKER, YOU CAN RUN BY US AND WE WONT TOUCH YOU"

Emm... what this phrase is supposed to mean?

Modifié par LorDC, 03 décembre 2010 - 09:46 .

[SimonTheFrog]

exchange "little" with "let" and here you go.



The abducting people without a trace is really b.s. anyway. The seeker swarm will only work "outside". When i sit here typing this, i'm already safe of the seeker-swarm o.O Unless i open the window or the front door, which i wouldn't.



So, unless they search room after room in the colonies, which takes a lot of time if you want to be thorough, they won't catch all the house-wives, scientists, medicals, patients, elderly, children or whoever happens to stay inside. Also remember: once they have to gun down people (because the seeker-swarm failed, and as Shep we know they love to gun down people), there will be blood and whatever all over the place. So much for leaving no trace.

[Aeowyn]

You know, the way the shuttle/IFF thing would make sense would be if you actually do a mission (a certain number in the story, like Legion's loyalty mission or whatever) and then after you've finished it, you get the cutscene with Normandy.

[SimonTheFrog]

Manic Sheep wrote...

mineralica wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...
in teh codex it says weapons were "retro fitted" with Thermal clips and retro means old so the ship must have crashed during the first wave of Thermal clip popularity and Mechs are better than shooting down crazed stranded crewmen and women.

And Shepard may insert old clips in his gun? Hoiw caring weapon manufacturers are to do them excangable. Plus, there's enough crazy crewmember to shoot - but I'd better not imagine crew member with abilities of YMIR.

Bah thats a gameplay mechanic, just like how there are clips littering the ground in every mission and random boxes of heavy weapon ammo all around the place. Or would you prefer you didn’t have ammo for the whole mission?

The mechs should be outdated and thus not the same as the others you encounter but do you expect them to make new mech models for this one mission? Neither of these things are plot holes.

I always wondered why BioWare didn't design it so, that after clips are depleted, the weapon will still work but overheat as in ME1 (maybe even with longer cooldowns to make searching for clips and aiming carefully worthwhile).
 - This way the player could still fire his favourite gun if he wants even if he ran out of clips.
 - And it would really feel like a step forward from the ME1-period in a technological way.
 - Also it would make much more sense why people would use clips in the first place: they give actually an advantage and not just a restriction. 

Sometimes working in accordance with the lore even makes sense game-play wise... isn't that amazing? :innocent:

[Wereparrot]

Why, as a Spectre, is Shepherd answerable only to the council? Surely he owes his allegiance to his country first and foremost?

[LorDC]

Wereparrot wrote...

Why, as a Spectre, is Shepherd answerable only to the council? Surely he owes his allegiance to his country first and foremost?

a) Formally as Spectre he answers only to the Council. Alliance as Citadel race can't question or command him directly in any way.
Informally he never severed ties with Alliance. Maybe you didn't notice but he is constantly in contact with Anderson(and Hackett in ME1)
So your statement is plainly wrong.
c) And even if it was it wouldn't be a plot hole. Any person can choose where his allegiances lie.

Modifié par LorDC, 03 décembre 2010 - 05:01 .

[Wereparrot]

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Why, as a Spectre, is Shepherd answerable only to the council? Surely he owes his allegiance to his country first and foremost?

a) Formally as Spectre he answers only to the Council. Alliance as Citadel race can't question or command him directly in any way.
Informally he never severed ties with Alliance. Maybe you didn't notice but he is constantly in contact with Anderson(and Hackett in ME1)
So your statement is plainly wrong.
c) And even if it was it wouldn't be a plot hole. Any person can choose where his allegiances lie.

Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Modifié par Wereparrot, 03 décembre 2010 - 05:25 .

[LorDC]

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

[Wereparrot]

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

I did but why then would Anderson feel the need to say this, especially in a private meeting?

Modifié par Wereparrot, 03 décembre 2010 - 05:43 .

[Manic Sheep]

Wereparrot wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

I did but why then would Anderson feel the need to say this, especially in a private meeting?

What do you mean why would Anderson need to say this? It important that Shepard understands the situation he/she is in.

Shepard technically does not answer to the Alliance. He still follows the Alliance of his out of personal loyalty but they cannot give him/her an order. When the admiral comes to inspect the Normandy you can refuse him and he can't do anything about it because you don't answer to him and you are no longer part of the Alliance military. The Normandy is still and Alliance ship but it is on loan to the council.

The whole point in spectres is that they answer only to the council and preserve galactic stability. They are meant to be neutral in race politics tho for obvious reasons most won’t be.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 06:22 .

[RiouHotaru]

SimonTheFrog wrote...

Manic Sheep wrote...

mineralica wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...
in teh codex it says weapons were "retro fitted" with Thermal clips and retro means old so the ship must have crashed during the first wave of Thermal clip popularity and Mechs are better than shooting down crazed stranded crewmen and women.

And Shepard may insert old clips in his gun? Hoiw caring weapon manufacturers are to do them excangable. Plus, there's enough crazy crewmember to shoot - but I'd better not imagine crew member with abilities of YMIR.

Bah thats a gameplay mechanic, just like how there are clips littering the ground in every mission and random boxes of heavy weapon ammo all around the place. Or would you prefer you didn’t have ammo for the whole mission?

The mechs should be outdated and thus not the same as the others you encounter but do you expect them to make new mech models for this one mission? Neither of these things are plot holes.

I always wondered why BioWare didn't design it so, that after clips are depleted, the weapon will still work but overheat as in ME1 (maybe even with longer cooldowns to make searching for clips and aiming carefully worthwhile).
 - This way the player could still fire his favourite gun if he wants even if he ran out of clips.
 - And it would really feel like a step forward from the ME1-period in a technological way.
 - Also it would make much more sense why people would use clips in the first place: they give actually an advantage and not just a restriction. 

Sometimes working in accordance with the lore even makes sense game-play wise... isn't that amazing? :innocent:

Because the codex states there are mechanisms to keep guns from firing if they don't have thermal clips in them specifically so the gun WON'T overheat.  Why?  If it does it could damage components in the gun which could cause jams or misfires.

I mean really, why do folks take such issue with the "ammo mechanic"?  It works perfectly.  I never have to scour the field for clips except very early on and that's because the Mantis uses one only shot per clip.  Otherwise I was never strapped for ammo.

[Wereparrot]

Manic Sheep wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

I did but why then would Anderson feel the need to say this, especially in a private meeting?

It important that Shepard understands the situation he/she is in.

Shepherd seems like a shrewd person, I'm sure he/she wouldn't appreciate being reminded.

[Manic Sheep]

RiouHotaru wrote...

SimonTheFrog wrote...

Manic Sheep wrote...

mineralica wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...
in teh codex it says weapons were "retro fitted" with Thermal clips and retro means old so the ship must have crashed during the first wave of Thermal clip popularity and Mechs are better than shooting down crazed stranded crewmen and women.

And Shepard may insert old clips in his gun? Hoiw caring weapon manufacturers are to do them excangable. Plus, there's enough crazy crewmember to shoot - but I'd better not imagine crew member with abilities of YMIR.

Bah thats a gameplay mechanic, just like how there are clips littering the ground in every mission and random boxes of heavy weapon ammo all around the place. Or would you prefer you didn’t have ammo for the whole mission?

The mechs should be outdated and thus not the same as the others you encounter but do you expect them to make new mech models for this one mission? Neither of these things are plot holes.

I always wondered why BioWare didn't design it so, that after clips are depleted, the weapon will still work but overheat as in ME1 (maybe even with longer cooldowns to make searching for clips and aiming carefully worthwhile).
 - This way the player could still fire his favourite gun if he wants even if he ran out of clips.
 - And it would really feel like a step forward from the ME1-period in a technological way.
 - Also it would make much more sense why people would use clips in the first place: they give actually an advantage and not just a restriction. 

Sometimes working in accordance with the lore even makes sense game-play wise... isn't that amazing? :innocent:

Because the codex states there are mechanisms to keep guns from firing if they don't have thermal clips in them specifically so the gun WON'T overheat.  Why?  If it does it could damage components in the gun which could cause jams or misfires.

I mean really, why do folks take such issue with the "ammo mechanic"?  It works perfectly.  I never have to scour the field for clips except very early on and that's because the Mantis uses one only shot per clip.  Otherwise I was never strapped for ammo.

The point in the clips was that swapping them was faster than waiting for them to cool down. I found the ammo system in ME2 fine but allot of people seem to want to combine the system form ME1 and ME2 and have it so you can swap clips for extra speed when you have plenty of ammo or not eject the thermal clip and fire slower/ wait for a cool down if you strapped for clips. It would be more lore friendly that way I suppose tho having your gun overheat all the time would be bad for it.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 06:32 .

[Manic Sheep]

Wereparrot wrote...

Manic Sheep wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

I did but why then would Anderson feel the need to say this, especially in a private meeting?

It important that Shepard understands the situation he/she is in.

Shepherd seems like a shrewd person, I'm sure he/she wouldn't appreciate being reminded.

Things like that are kind of important and always need to be made very clear. Plus they need to make sure the PLAYER understands this. Mention something only once and it will get missed. Hell you can mention something 5 times and still have people completely miss it.

Also many of the lines, especially renegade ones make me question Sheps intelligence

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 06:40 .

[Shepard needs a Vacation]

they could have easily avoided the shuttle plot hole by saying the illusive man wanted to see the whole team before the suicide mission, but bioware was cheap

[Wereparrot]

Manic Sheep wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

Manic Sheep wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...
Why does Anderson say, 'You don't answer to us?' He keeps in contact through his own choices, but the alliance still say he doesn't answer to them. And, while, you can indeed choose your allegiances, you do not choose the country of your birth. The nation of your birth commands your fealty.

Did you read (a) and ( in my previous post? Try rereading one more time if you didn't understand.

I did but why then would Anderson feel the need to say this, especially in a private meeting?

It important that Shepard understands the situation he/she is in.

Shepherd seems like a shrewd person, I'm sure he/she wouldn't appreciate being reminded.

Things like that are kind of important and always need to be made very clear. Plus they need to make sure the PLAYER understands this. Mention something only once and it will get missed. Hell you can mention something 5 times and still have people completely miss it.

Also many of the lines, especially renegade ones make me question Sheps intelligence

That's fair enough I suppose, although I will likely never play a fully renegade Shepherd to ever find out because it really isn't me to be such a prat.

[Manic Sheep]

Shepard needs a Vacation wrote...

they could have easily avoided the shuttle plot hole by saying the illusive man wanted to see the whole team before the suicide mission, but bioware was cheap

Not really, they have a comm. room and the illusive man doesn’t see people face to face. There is no reason to take s shuttle anywhere to see him. Plus would the illusive man really want to be in the same room as Jack or Tali? Or even let them see his face?

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 06:57 .

[Nozybidaj]

Not sure if this qualifies as a plot hole, but something that always bugged me.

So we see in the begining of ME2 the Collectors drop out of nowhere, never having been seen or mentioned before, and attempt to blow Shepard, his crew, and his ship to smithereens.  Then sometime after they decide, "hey lets get the SB to get his body for us".  So did they not want the body when they tried to vaporize him?  If not why now? If so, why not go get him at the time of the first attack?

Okay fine, whatever.  So we move on and now Shep is alive again (/rolleyes) and the Collectors are all about killing him again, until the TIM setup mission where they want to capture him again, after which they are all about killing him again.  Well maybe not killing, its not like at anypoint in the game they are actually out gunning for you (except right at the begining), they are more just indifferent to his existence when they aren't trying to capture or vaporize him. 

Then they randomly want to capture people associated to him previously, attack a colony to get them, then kidnap pretty much everyone on the colony except the one person they supposedly came there after.  Then they don't bother going after any other previous or current associations again, except for the Joker sequence where they kidnap a bunch of redshirts and his doctor.  After which they become completely indifferent again.

Does anyone really have any clue as to what the Collectors are really after?  Do the Collectors even know what they are doing?  It seems like they are completely bi-polar schitzo's and are just kinda all over the place doing completely different things at different times.

There is simply no consistency at all to their actions.

[LorDC]

One of Harby's phrases is: "Preserve Shepard's body if possible". It pretty much sums it up. They want to capture Shepard. If possible. If they have to kill him so be it.

[wulf3n]

RiouHotaru wrote...
I mean really, why do folks take such issue with the "ammo mechanic"?  It works perfectly.  I never have to scour the field for clips except very early on and that's because the Mantis uses one only shot per clip.  Otherwise I was never strapped for ammo.

It may work fine from a "game" perspective, but in terms of the universe and story, saying thermal clips is an "upgrade" to having weapons with unlimited shots is hard to swallow.
Even if the guns do more damage because they can afford to expel more heat, i would still wan't to carry around some of my old unlimited ammo guns, just in case.

[leggywillow]

Zulu_DFA wrote...



-- it's what makes the plot cheezy.

Yaaaaaay!  The only reason I came into this thread was hoping that someone would post the adorable plothole mouse poking its adorable head out of some cheese.  So cute.

[Manic Sheep]

Not sure if this qualifies as a plot hole, but something that always bugged me.
So we see in the beginning of ME2 the Collectors drop out of nowhere, never having been seen or mentioned before, and attempt to blow Shepard, his crew, and his ship to smithereens. Then sometime after they decide, "hey lets get the SB to get his body for us". So did they not want the body when they tried to vaporize him? If not why now? If so, why not go get him at the time of the first attack?
Okay fine, whatever. So we move on and now Shep is alive again (/rolleyes) and the Collectors are all about killing him again, until the TIM setup mission where they want to capture him again, after which they are all about killing him again. Well maybe not killing, its not like at anypoint in the game they are actually out gunning for you (except right at the beginning), they are more just indifferent to his existence when they aren't trying to capture or vaporize him.

Then they randomly want to capture people associated to him previously, attack a colony to get them, then kidnap pretty much everyone on the colony except the one person they supposedly came there after. Then they don't bother going after any other previous or current associations again, except for the Joker sequence where they kidnap a bunch of redshirts and his doctor. After which they become completely indifferent again.

Does anyone really have any clue as to what the Collectors are really after? Do the Collectors even know what they are doing? It seems like they are completely bi-polar schitzo's and are just kinda all over the place doing completely different things at different times.

There is simply no consistency at all to their actions.

I don't think they really care that much about getting his/her body. They care more about killing him/her, getting the body would just be a bonus. They might not have known where sheps body ended up or even if he/she was still on the ship when it exploded.

I think they tell you that only half the colony got abducted around 3 times. He/She wasn't just a random survivor. After that the VS went back to report to the Alliance which would be citadel space and unreachable to them. They were probably just going after the VS because the opportunity presented itself . They would have hit another colony anyway, which one they go after is not important.The only reason they knew where the Normandy was when they abducted the crew was because of the virus. Again an opportunity presented itself so they took it.

They are focused mostly on abducting colonists for that giant terminator baby reaper. They would have no way of knowing where shep is most of the time so gunning specifically for him/her would be pointless especially considering shep is trying to stop them so comes to them half the time.

Edit: ahhh qoutes are not working.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 03 décembre 2010 - 10:34 .

[Zurcior]

wulf3n wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...
I mean really, why do folks take such issue with the "ammo mechanic"?  It works perfectly.  I never have to scour the field for clips except very early on and that's because the Mantis uses one only shot per clip.  Otherwise I was never strapped for ammo.

It may work fine from a "game" perspective, but in terms of the universe and story, saying thermal clips is an "upgrade" to having weapons with unlimited shots is hard to swallow.
Even if the guns do more damage because they can afford to expel more heat, i would still wan't to carry around some of my old unlimited ammo guns, just in case.

It is an upgrade and it isn't hard to swallow. In universe, the Geth created the thermal clip system after reviewing their battle logs and found that the parties that got more rounds down-range the fastest usually won. The old system was too slow and inconvenient as far as I'm concerned.