8541 réponses à ce sujet

[Kaldarm]

Well if Liara and Samara got together and produced a daughter between them, then that child would have a higher percentage chance of being an A.Y. Now that's a cut-scene I'd really love to see in ME3.

[Owlbread]

Nerevar-as wrote...

A-Y odds aren´t that high when the other parent isn´t Asari.

Ah, but are you certain? I had thought Samara was definitely a pureblood, but I wasn't so sure about her daughters. 


I just don't want to have to regret letting Ashley die on Virmire for the sake of my unborn, virtual, alien children. If bioware turn into swines, she might be a better choice for a mother. With an attitude like her's, she would certainly bring forth men children only.
t

Modifié par Owlbread, 04 février 2011 - 07:14 .

[Tancho]

Kaldarm wrote...

Obviously young eh? I wish!! I'm mid 30's and have lived a pretty stressful and diverse life so far (including military service) and whilst I've seen plenty of people change (especially after deployments) I just don't think the changes fitted the character and her experiences.

First, I'll just say that I understand your feelings on this. Liara is so different and given the beauitful relationship they had in ME1, it's hard to deal with her in ME2. 

While I haven't had your military experience, I have dealt with tragic loss - whether it be an accident or, unfortunately, suicide. Altogether, the main point is that it was sudden. 

People definitely changed. I think we expect people to grieve in a certain way, but grief tends to turn us into something unrecognizable. It can bring out a part of us we didn't know existed. Not always, but I've certainly witnessed my fair share of friends changing drastically due to grief. 

So, if we apply this to Liara, I think we can confidently say that her experiences warrant a hard change.

1. Shepard ordered her to leave the ship and Liara probably regrets following that command. 
2. Shepard dies suddenly, without warning, and Liara didn't have a chance to say goodbye. To make things worse, their relationship had been relitvely short lived. A few months at most.
3. Not only is she headhunted by Cerberus and betrayed by Feron, she has to pry Shepard's body out of the clutches of the Collectors and the Shadow Broker.
4. Cerberus then begins to work on the body and Liara, knowing that Shepard wasn't a fan of Cerberus, feels like she betrayed her/him. Not only that, but her main motivation was that she couldn't let Shepard go. 
5. Feron sacrficed himself for her and now she has to fight an immesurably powerful and ambiguous enemy to get him back. 
6. She then spends two years in a brutal business, mourning Shepard and working against impossibly odds to save someone who may actually be dead. 
7. Being an information broker is not for nice people. Nice people don't need kenetic barriers around their windows in case of assassination attempts. 
8. Anger is part of grief. On top of that, she's seen enough to lose her innocence and be hardened towards optimism.

So, I mean, she has been thrown into a loop of hell for the past two years.

Her change in attitutde, although regrettable, seems very in line with her experiences. 

[Nerevar-as]

I don´t remember if Samara said if her children were by the same parent, I gues they were as they seemed to be of similar age.

If I remember correctly, A-Y odds for pureblood children was 1/100, which is pretty high. Before asari first contact it must have been a serious problem.

[Owlbread]

Nerevar-as wrote...

I don´t remember if Samara said if her children were by the same parent, I gues they were as they seemed to be of similar age.
If I remember correctly, A-Y odds for pureblood children was 1/100, which is pretty high. Before asari first contact it must have been a serious problem.

My point here is that if Samara had actually conceived her children with an individual from another species, perhaps the children of Liara would be Ardat-Yakshi? Don't say I didn't warn you fellows.
ss" />

Modifié par Owlbread, 04 février 2011 - 07:23 .

[Kaldarm]

Tancho wrote...

Kaldarm wrote...

Obviously young eh? I wish!! I'm mid 30's and have lived a pretty stressful and diverse life so far (including military service) and whilst I've seen plenty of people change (especially after deployments) I just don't think the changes fitted the character and her experiences.

First, I'll just say that I understand your feelings on this. Liara is so different and given the beauitful relationship they had in ME1, it's hard to deal with her in ME2. 

While I haven't had your military experience, I have dealt with tragic loss - whether it be an accident or, unfortunately, suicide. Altogether, the main point is that it was sudden. 

People definitely changed. I think we expect people to grieve in a certain way, but grief tends to turn us into something unrecognizable. It can bring out a part of us we didn't know existed. Not always, but I've certainly witnessed my fair share of friends changing drastically due to grief. 

So, if we apply this to Liara, I think we can confidently say that her experiences warrant a hard change.

1. Shepard ordered her to leave the ship and Liara probably regrets following that command. 
2. Shepard dies suddenly, without warning, and Liara didn't have a chance to say goodbye. To make things worse, their relationship had been relitvely short lived. A few months at most.
3. Not only is she headhunted by Cerberus and betrayed by Feron, she has to pry Shepard's body out of the clutches of the Collectors and the Shadow Broker.
4. Cerberus then begins to work on the body and Liara, knowing that Shepard wasn't a fan of Cerberus, feels like she betrayed her/him. Not only that, but her main motivation was that she couldn't let Shepard go. 
5. Feron sacrficed himself for her and now she has to fight an immesurably powerful and ambiguous enemy to get him back. 
6. She then spends two years in a brutal business, mourning Shepard and working against impossibly odds to save someone who may actually be dead. 
7. Being an information broker is not for nice people. Nice people don't need kenetic barriers around their windows in case of assassination attempts. 
8. Anger is part of grief. On top of that, she's seen enough to lose her innocence and be hardened towards optimism.

So, I mean, she has been thrown into a loop of hell for the past two years.

Her change in attitutde, although regrettable, seems very in line with her experiences. 

You know, you sum it up pretty well there - enough to make me think more on the subject. I still don't like the direction the character took and I think it will probably negatively influence the choices my 'Canon' char takes but I'll at least go easier on her for her actions in ME2 now.

Cheers

[Owlbread]

iOnlySignIn wrote...

Good Heavens! There's so much more to a relationship than making babies. If Shepard wants their excellent genes to pass on, they can donate some stem cells, so that billions in the universe yearning to have Shepard's babies get their wish.

Yes, yes, I am aware that Shepard could easily conceive a child through other means. It was just that it seemed logical for Bioware to do something like that... a twist, if you will. I certainly hope you fellows are correct.

Modifié par Owlbread, 04 février 2011 - 07:34 .

[TheMarshal]

A Good Night Chapter 3 is up! After rewriting the whole damn thing, I thought it would have been longer than 4k words...



Enjoy!

[Tancho]

TheMarshal wrote...

A Good Night Chapter 3 is up! After rewriting the whole damn thing, I thought it would have been longer than 4k words...

Enjoy!

My heeeeeeroo! 

Nicely done, Marshal! Thanks for the update. 

[Sticken Chuffing]

TheMarshal wrote...

A Good Night Chapter 3 is up! After rewriting the whole damn thing, I thought it would have been longer than 4k words...

Enjoy!

Thanks for the update TheMarshal.

I'm greatly enjoying this story!

[jlb524]

TheMarshal wrote...

A Good Night Chapter 3 is up! After rewriting the whole damn thing, I thought it would have been longer than 4k words...

Enjoy!

Yay!

[Xilizhra]

Technically, asari are pansexual. I also suspect that they were deliberately engineered by... someone... to be able to mate with anyone, because as products of evolution, they make no sense whatsoever.

If Shepard doesn't go blue, though, Miranda could work... but since Liara is all but the canon LI anyway, I don't think it matters.

Also, awesomesauce on the story update.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 04 février 2011 - 09:14 .

[Xilizhra]

Reasonable, and others have the same complaint from a more scientific perspective. I am, however, willing to take this blow because the whole "reproduce with anyone" thing will let me have natural children with Liara, and that makes me happy.

[Xilizhra]

I don't think she will. If Shepard doesn't romance Liara, I think that she'll try to find someone who wasn't connected to her life related to Shepard at all. Whether it'd be another asari or not... well, Liara grew up with pureblood-related taunts and I'm not sure if she'd want to have that happen to her own children. But if she met another asari whom she fell in love with, she might be able to move past that.

[TheMarshal]

Xilizhra wrote...

Technically, asari are pansexual. I also suspect that they were deliberately engineered by... someone... to be able to mate with anyone, because as products of evolution, they make no sense whatsoever.

My theory is that they evolved from some sort of parasitic lifeform.

Asari - Highly advanced brain slugs!

[Xilizhra]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I don't think she will. If Shepard doesn't romance Liara, I think that she'll try to find someone who wasn't connected to her life related to Shepard at all. Whether it'd be another asari or not... well, Liara grew up with pureblood-related taunts and I'm not sure if she'd want to have that happen to her own children. But if she met another asari whom she fell in love with, she might be able to move past that.

See, this is why I think it would be preferable for an unromanced Liara to date another asari, as far greater story potential exists. She's in open defiance of the pureblood stigma, and seeks to expose it as the bigoted and prejudiced rubbish that it is. If Liara were to meet and fall in love with another asari, I think that she'd be more than willing to discard such archaic bigotry.

After all, Liara herself is a pureblood, and she has succeeded in becoming the most powerful, influential and intelligent asari in the entire galaxy.

There is one tiny problem, though. I may be being paranoid, but purebloods having pureblood children... well, I'm sure that the odds of Ardat-Yakshi are still tiny, but...

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Xilizhra wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I don't think she will. If Shepard doesn't romance Liara, I think that she'll try to find someone who wasn't connected to her life related to Shepard at all. Whether it'd be another asari or not... well, Liara grew up with pureblood-related taunts and I'm not sure if she'd want to have that happen to her own children. But if she met another asari whom she fell in love with, she might be able to move past that.

See, this is why I think it would be preferable for an unromanced Liara to date another asari, as far greater story potential exists. She's in open defiance of the pureblood stigma, and seeks to expose it as the bigoted and prejudiced rubbish that it is. If Liara were to meet and fall in love with another asari, I think that she'd be more than willing to discard such archaic bigotry.

After all, Liara herself is a pureblood, and she has succeeded in becoming the most powerful, influential and intelligent asari in the entire galaxy.

There is one tiny problem, though. I may be being paranoid, but purebloods having pureblood children... well, I'm sure that the odds of Ardat-Yakshi are still tiny, but...

But you are afraid that video-game logic will dictate that Liara/Asari child will be an AY because she's the offspring of an important character?

Granted that possiblity is always there, but I wouldn't worry too much.

[Xilizhra]

Also, come to think of it, we really shouldn't be using "pureblood" this casually. It sounds as though it's equivalent to... well, at least "colored" if not the nastier N-word.

[Tancho]

Yeah, the word 'pureblood' reminds me of 'mudblood' from Harry Potter. Very similar words, carrying very similar connotations.

[TheMarshal]

Yeah... I suppose ultimately it's not an important distinction to make, unless you're talking about the stigma attached to having two asari as parents, which makes the whole thing ironically self-perpetuating...