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[Mithran88]

jamesp81 wrote...

Robhuzz wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...

That change was really brought home when she leaped out that window and started chasing full bore after a Spectre.  I was cheering her on while I was picking broken glass out of my hair :happy:

"Yeaaaahhhh!!!!!  I mean...  ouch!"

Yeah I hear broken glass in your hair can be unpleasant.
I pretty much applauded her (Liara's) courage at that moment. If vasir would've stopped running and fought her 1 on 1, there's no way Liara would've won.

But Liara wouldn't have been alone.  Shepard's M-98 Widow would have some say in this.

That scene really was awesome the way she tossed everthing out of her way as she ran after Vasir. The two agents never had a chance lol. LotSB was a great content download well worth it. I was happy to get Liara back, look forward to some ME III with Liara! 

[Mithran88]

jamesp81 wrote...

JiGsAw2453 wrote...

jamesp81 wrote...
I was cheering her on while I was picking broken glass out of my hair :happy:

I was thinking... "Oi! I'm hurt over here! I need some love to get better" :L 

I'm just too gung ho.  I was thinking....."YEAH!  My little blue librarian is GOING TO KICK YOUR ASS YOU MURDERING ****!"

likewise haha she was all over that. 

[jlb524]

Lizardviking wrote...
I could list more. But my point is Liara is perhaps the only character who truly ever had a "damsel in distress" (emphasis on distress), first impression are important and Liara sorta gave the feeling of being completely helpless on her own. The fainting sure as hell did not help.

It's true.  I think that's kind of what they were going for when they designed her character and what they wanted in a first impression.  Do I like it?  No.  However, it definitely hasn't turned me off from her character as I see her as a strong 'woman' (or 'asexual but female looking alien' if you are Casey Hudon).

[Mithran88]

jlb524 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...
I could list more. But my point is Liara is perhaps the only character who truly ever had a "damsel in distress" (emphasis on distress), first impression are important and Liara sorta gave the feeling of being completely helpless on her own. The fainting sure as hell did not help.

It's true.  I think that's kind of what they were going for when they designed her character and what they wanted in a first impression.  Do I like it?  No.  However, it definitely hasn't turned me off from her character as I see her as a strong 'woman' (or 'asexual but female looking alien' if you are Casey Hudon).

At least now it would seem she is more able and doesnt need help all the time. Can deal with problems more on her own.  I liked her b4 and still like her character now even after the changes. 

I was simply happy we got her back as LI.

Modifié par Mithran88, 25 mars 2011 - 09:18 .

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

jlb524 wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...
I could list more. But my point is Liara is perhaps the only character who truly ever had a "damsel in distress" (emphasis on distress), first impression are important and Liara sorta gave the feeling of being completely helpless on her own. The fainting sure as hell did not help.

It's true.  I think that's kind of what they were going for when they designed her character and what they wanted in a first impression.  Do I like it?  No.  However, it definitely hasn't turned me off from her character as I see her as a strong 'woman' (or 'asexual but female looking alien' if you are Casey Hudon).

I think her moment of strenght in ME1 was how well she dealt with her own mother's death.

[jlb524]

@Lizardviking

I agree with that.

Mithran88 wrote...

At least now it would seem she is more able and doesnt need help all the time. Can deal with problems more on her own.  I liked her b4 and still like her character now even after the changes. 

I was simply happy we got her back as LI.

I think she was always capable, I think it's just that the devs wanted to present her to the player in a certain way inthe initial meeting.  

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

[Mithran88]

jlb524 wrote...

@Lizardviking

I agree with that.

Mithran88 wrote...

At least now it would seem she is more able and doesnt need help all the time. Can deal with problems more on her own.  I liked her b4 and still like her character now even after the changes. 

I was simply happy we got her back as LI.

I think she was always capable, I think it's just that the devs wanted to present her to the player in a certain way inthe initial meeting.  

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

very true on both accounts  We as Liara fans were very lucky to get her back! 

I'm sure Mass Effect III will tie everything together for most players. To an extent I think everyone will be happy with ME3 and what they have planned out for it. I have high hopes with what I want to see happen with Liara LI, the story, and all our other squad mates. Always room for them to mess it up, yet I think it will work out.  

Modifié par Mithran88, 25 mars 2011 - 09:38 .

[TheMarshal]

jlb524 wrote...

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

Me too, but I doubt they could have done a DLC that would have done BOTH characters justice.  They just damn well better do the VS relationship justice in ME3!

[Mithran88]

TheMarshal wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

Me too, but I doubt they could have done a DLC that would have done BOTH characters justice.  They just damn well better do the VS relationship justice in ME3!

at least we know the dev team likes Liara as much as we do lol. Gives me constant hope it will be done right. 

[Robhuzz]

Mithran88 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

Me too, but I doubt they could have done a DLC that would have done BOTH characters justice.  They just damn well better do the VS relationship justice in ME3!

at least we know the dev team likes Liara as much as we do lol. Gives me constant hope it will be done right. 

Very true. With Liara being given this much attention, it would be downright shamefull not to give her a proper ending in ME3. Unfortunately we'll still have to wait like 9 months before we get to see it. I'm not really worried though. I'm convinced we'll get a satisfying and proper end of Shepard and Liara's story in ME3.

[Mithran88]

Robhuzz wrote...

Very true. With Liara being given this much attention, it would be downright shamefull not to give her a proper ending in ME3. Unfortunately we'll still have to wait like 9 months before we get to see it. I'm not really worried though. I'm convinced we'll get a satisfying and proper end of Shepard and Liara's story in ME3.

I think so as well.. I know there are so many months ahead till we finally get to Mass Effect III but I'm completely convinced we will get that ending we all look forward to with Liara and Shepard's LI. 

[drwells123]

Still working on the next chapter of Duet. Hoping to wrap up late tomorrow/early Sunday. Thanks readers for your patience

[JiGsAw2453]

Robhuzz wrote...

Mithran88 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

But yeah, I'm happy we got the DLC for her.  Though, I feel awful b/c it seems Ash/Kaidan won't get the same

Me too, but I doubt they could have done a DLC that would have done BOTH characters justice.  They just damn well better do the VS relationship justice in ME3!

at least we know the dev team likes Liara as much as we do lol. Gives me constant hope it will be done right. 

Very true. With Liara being given this much attention, it would be downright shamefull not to give her a proper ending in ME3. Unfortunately we'll still have to wait like 9 months before we get to see it. I'm not really worried though. I'm convinced we'll get a satisfying and proper end of Shepard and Liara's story in ME3.

We damn well better :L... BioWare said that she did not have a big role in ME2 becuase they could not risk her dying in the Suicide Mission, and this is becuase she will have a very large role in ME3 (same wih the VS)...

[Khaos2000]

Only thing about the VS and ME3 that worries me is how much are they going to spend on voice actor time and development time for a character that half the people (I am guessing) aren't going to even see? That somewhat worries me. At least with Liara, she stays alive for -everyone- and we can be assured she will get some solid dev time.

[Robhuzz]

Khaos2000 wrote...

Only thing about the VS and ME3 that worries me is how much are they going to spend on voice actor time and development time for a character that half the people (I am guessing) aren't going to even see? That somewhat worries me. At least with Liara, she stays alive for -everyone- and we can be assured she will get some solid dev time.

That has been a main concern for me as well. As certain squadmembers can be dead in certain playthroughs, the question is: Will BioWare spend as much time on these characters (mainly ashley/kaidain) as either of them won't appear in 50% of all playthroughs (I'd imagine the ashley/kaidan death would be 50/50)

On the other hand, ME3 has been in production at about the same time as ME2 so BioWare has been working on it for a very long time, assuring every character can have a lot dev time.

As for Liara staying alive for everyone... gotta love plot armor. Hope she keeps it for one more game:) (Though I'm afraid I'm just fooling myself on this one) ahh well, as long as her potential death isn't mandatory I won't have to snap my ME3 disk in half.

Modifié par Robhuzz, 26 mars 2011 - 09:07 .

[JiGsAw2453]

Khaos2000 wrote...

Only thing about the VS and ME3 that worries me is how much are they going to spend on voice actor time and development time for a character that half the people (I am guessing) aren't going to even see? That somewhat worries me. At least with Liara, she stays alive for -everyone- and we can be assured she will get some solid dev time.

That is why I believe that Liara will have the largest (or one of the largest) roles in the game, becuase she cannot die ... But Garrus can die and hes my second favourite Mass Effect character

[TheMarshal]

drwells123 wrote...

Still working on the next chapter of Duet. Hoping to wrap up late tomorrow/early Sunday. Thanks readers for your patience

Take your time!  Good to know that you're still mortal! 

[Goodwood]

Goodwood's Shepards want to give LiLi a big hug...

Modifié par Goodwood, 26 mars 2011 - 09:26 .

[TheMarshal]

At this point I'm worried about ALL of the squadmates, and how they're going to handle the possibility that any one of them could be dead in any given scene. They kind of wrote themselves into a corner with that, but hopefully they'll have some decent attempts at pulling themselves out, rather than relying on a cheap plot device like "oh, everyone who was dead is now alive again!" or worse "oh, everyone else dies, too!"

[JiGsAw2453]

TheMarshal wrote...

At this point I'm worried about ALL of the squadmates, and how they're going to handle the possibility that any one of them could be dead in any given scene. They kind of wrote themselves into a corner with that, but hopefully they'll have some decent attempts at pulling themselves out, rather than relying on a cheap plot device like "oh, everyone who was dead is now alive again!" or worse "oh, everyone else dies, too!"

I think BioWare will keep popular characters like Garrus and Tali as squadmates in Mass Effect 3 (for those who kept them alive) as for those less popular... They will probably be cameos of some sort :\\

[Robhuzz]

JiGsAw2453 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

At this point I'm worried about ALL of the squadmates, and how they're going to handle the possibility that any one of them could be dead in any given scene. They kind of wrote themselves into a corner with that, but hopefully they'll have some decent attempts at pulling themselves out, rather than relying on a cheap plot device like "oh, everyone who was dead is now alive again!" or worse "oh, everyone else dies, too!"

I think BioWare will keep popular characters like Garrus and Tali as squadmates in Mass Effect 3 (for those who kept them alive) as for those less popular... They will probably be cameos of some sort :

Problem is, in certain rare playthroughs (or playthroughs of weird people who like to see just about every squadmember die) only Shepard and 1 or 2 other squadmembers will have survived. That'd mean you'd need a great amount of new squadmembers in ME3, all with their own dialogue and (maybe) assignments.

But of course BioWare could also continue the game with any squadmember you have left in ME2 and just add a few more. Those  who killed off all their squadmembers (which, in a 2nd playthrough and on are rarely unintentional deaths) will just be missing out on a lot of content then. But isn't it just great that Liara will be in ME3 and be playing a big role no matter what? 

[Khaos2000]

I'm really worried that practically EVERYONE in ME1 and ME2 will be cameo's or important, but only for brief limited durations. Like I could easily see them writing Tali as going back to the migrant fleet and becoming an admiral for example (Though I guess you -could- have had her exiled, dunno) the sheer options they have given, to take account of all of them (As they say they are doing) And the easiest and most efficient way to do that, is to make all of those decisions have impact, but not large scale impact. Otherwise they'd need to write fifteen dvd's worth of game. Which while that would please us greatly I am sure, isn't likely to happen.

Liara at least, is a given as to where she will be, no choice you make will change the fact that she is the shadow broker. No choice you make changes the fact that the VS is still in the alliance, so can expect cameo's there. I don't expect them to keep all the squad mates from ME2 however as playable squadmates. People like Zaeed and Kasumi are pretty much gone I figure as the collectors have been dealt with and thus, their contracts are over.

Grunt could return to Tuchanka, Legion goes back to the Geth, etc. The fact that all of them can die, makes it easier to write them off into cameo's than to make them squadmates again, which sets us up for a whole new crew, bleh.

At least, Liara will always be there waiting on Hagalaz for us.

[JiGsAw2453]

Khaos2000 wrote...

I'm really worried that practically EVERYONE in ME1 and ME2 will be cameo's or important, but only for brief limited durations. Like I could easily see them writing Tali as going back to the migrant fleet and becoming an admiral for example (Though I guess you -could- have had her exiled, dunno) the sheer options they have given, to take account of all of them (As they say they are doing) And the easiest and most efficient way to do that, is to make all of those decisions have impact, but not large scale impact. Otherwise they'd need to write fifteen dvd's worth of game. Which while that would please us greatly I am sure, isn't likely to happen.

Liara at least, is a given as to where she will be, no choice you make will change the fact that she is the shadow broker. No choice you make changes the fact that the VS is still in the alliance, so can expect cameo's there. I don't expect them to keep all the squad mates from ME2 however as playable squadmates. People like Zaeed and Kasumi are pretty much gone I figure as the collectors have been dealt with and thus, their contracts are over.

Grunt could return to Tuchanka, Legion goes back to the Geth, etc. The fact that all of them can die, makes it easier to write them off into cameo's than to make them squadmates again, which sets us up for a whole new crew, bleh.

At least, Liara will always be there waiting on Hagalaz for us.

BioWare has been working on Mass Effect 3 for a very long time (since Mass Effect 2 came out I believe), and there are apparently oer 1000 variables importing into Mass Effect 3. I just hope that they will make these variables have an impact on Mass Effect 3 other than "Oh hey Garrus, the Reapers are invading The Milky Way, can you help me?" "I'm sorry Shepard, can it wait for a bit, I'm in the middle of some calibrations"... :L

Considering that this is the last Mass Effect game in Shepard's story arc, I am hoping that BioWare will put a lot more effort into dialogue for characters that could be dead.

My personal opinion, to make things easier for BioWare; Would be if Shepard and all the crew survived the Suicide Mission, then make all the ME2 crew members return in ME3 as SM. If a minimum of 2 survived (which is the minimum, otherwise Shepard dies), then the player should have to play the game with ONLY those 2 squad members. 2 Squad members is all you need for a mission as well, so I think this would be a good idea; it would also punish people who didn't bother "Helping" out their team (loyalty missions), Shame on you! :L

That would also provide the ultimade "Continue" experience It's about time BioWare made people pay for making bad decisions :L

[Khaos2000]

That's a ton of work however, a ton of work that people might not even see. Then again, going through the SM without losing anyone is pretty easy to do... though it's easy to pick Samara thinking she has most experience for a team lead and lose people.

Still if you did all the loyalty missions you should lose, at worst, 3 people, maybe 4. Considering you can succeed only losing 5 if you've only done 1 loyalty mission. But... that's a bit off topic.

I've just grown to be afraid of that 'EA' tag, it tends to -ruin- sequels. While the gameplay was better for ME2 imho, the story was better in ME1. I'm just afraid they'll turn it into pure shooter territory. Ah well. If I had my way we'd be able to take Liara as a Squad Mate, and give her different armor if we wanted to, and customize that armor, along with her guns

[emmanuelsieyes]

Mithran88 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

Honestly, 'rescuing' Liara didn't bother me that much. She got herself trapped in what I felt was an endearingly klutzy manner, which befits her character when we first meet her. As for 'saving' her, well, we 'save' damn near every member of the crew at one point or another. Tali in the Wards (and again on Haestrom), Garrus on Omega, Ashley on Eden Prime. Not every recruitment mission can be as easy and straight-forward as Zaeed's.

Agree 100%...

Almost everyone has been rescued at some point. But when it comes down to it, most of the squadmates weren't cowering in the corner. Tali (in ME1) is fighting, Garrus is kicking ass, etc. I don't mind pulling Liara out of the stasis field (however, I really want to know why Shepard is just able to whack some buttons on the panel and have Liara drop out unharmed. If the person who's been studying Prothean tech for the last 50 years screwed up, how is Shepard going to handle it?). I don't like how she's cowering in front of that Krogan and depending on Shepard to save her.

One of the things in my earlier post was that I see Liara and Shepard as being equals. I think that the relationship has an excellent balance to it. Liara clearly respects Shepard, however, it's a two way street. The writing is such that it's obvious how much Shepard trusts Liara.

My first impression of Liara was pulling her out of Therum (classic damsel in distress), after which she promptly fainted on board the ship. I can understand that she's not at full fighting capacity after spending days without food or water. However, I think that the fainting is just too much.

Of course, those issues were all hammered out in LoTSB. However, I don't think that nervous Liara is dead and buried. She shows some moments of vulnerability in LoTSB, right after she sends out the transmission. I see her as switching between 'badass mode'--which is the entirety of the Azure sequence, and 'actual Liara mode' which is just when she's talking to shepard.

Khaos2000 wrote...
I've
just grown to be afraid of that 'EA' tag, it tends to -ruin- sequels.
While the gameplay was better for ME2 imho, the story was better in ME1.
I'm just afraid they'll turn it into pure shooter territory. Ah well.
If I had my way we'd be able to take Liara as a Squad Mate, and give her
different armor if we wanted to, and customize that armor, along with
her guns

I get your sentiment, although I really like Liara's LoTSB armor. There is just something about that waistcoat I think is totally awesome. I wish Shepard could borrow it from Liara. I mean Liara does have that purple dress, she could wear that around the shadow broker base and then I could take out the waistcoat on missions.

I also like how she actually wears clothes! 

Modifié par emmanuelsieyes, 27 mars 2011 - 03:09 .