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[JamieCOTC]

Lizardviking wrote...

JamieCOTC wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

As for what kind of drama/tension Liara and Shepard will face in ME3. I did think the whole "Darkside/Lightside Liara" thing had a possibility of happening before LOTSB was released, back then, we didn't know how the hunt for the SB would end and perhaps it would result in some sort of moral choice that will change Liara's alligment in ME3.
But with LOTSB I think any sort of "Liara will go crazy with power/revenge etc." plot is out the question. I still think ME3 should bring up the whole thing regarding being the SB without breaking your morals, it should just not be a major theme of Liara's character in ME3.

As for a indoctrination subplot. I would like it, but it should be reserved for someone else (Anderson maybe?).

The writing is less than consistent in Liara’s missions.   

“Wait a minute Liara, one second ago you wouldn’t let me help you with the Shadow Broker and now you will?  Girl, I love you to death, but wtf?” 

Don't know if I should take that as an agreement or not.

Still, funny screenshot is funny.

Yes, you should. I agree completely.  Sorry, I should have said something. 

Top 'o page Liara


"Go ahead, make my day ... dammit!" 

Modifié par JamieCOTC, 31 décembre 2010 - 12:30 .

[jbauck]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...
<snip>
You've touched upon something that I believe to be ideal regarding this desire for some form of mild strife in the Shepard/Liara relationship in ME3. I absolutely adore the idea of Shepard and Liara confiding in each other whenever either of them feel overwhelmed, frustrated or distressed. This was witnessed during both the locker scene in ME1, and the cabin scene at the end of LotSB.
<snip> 

And those are the two scenes I think of when I think of what makes Mass Effect my favorite series.  So, yes please, more of this!  The locker scene in ME1 was the emotional core of that game, and the big lack of anything equivalent in ME2 is what made ME2 feel unfinished for me until LotSB came out.  I still feel bad for ME1 players who chose the VS and haven't gotten a LotSB-cabin-scene equivalent.

ACC3SS wrote...
I think we need a signature banner for this.
"I SUPPORT PARAGON INTERRUPT KISSES"

Oooohhhhh ... If that had a FemShep/Liara LotSB kiss on it, it would likely overcome my legendary apathy, and I would find myself willing to spend a few minutes figuring out how set up a sig.

JamieCOTC wrote...
Liara in future games

Depending on when those games are set, it could be easy. If set 200 years in the future, Shep would be gone. Even w/ the super happy ending, they could do it. <snip>

I can't be the only one who would want Liara to be an LI in a future ME game if it were set a respectable amount of time after Shep's death, can I?  I mean, I wouldn't want her to be alone forever, and I think only a PC could kool-aid through the super-intimidation factor of knowing this woman is the legendary Commander Shepard's widow ... and can toss around Geth Armatures with her mind.  And who else other than a PC could ever be as cool as Shep?  Only another PC has any chance of not being a big step down.

Uhh ... provided, of course, that being related to Shepard or Liara isn't the ME-continuity-hook for a future non-Shepard PC in a hypothetical future ME game.  Because ... ewwww.  NM in that instance. 

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

In a certain way, the original Liara scenes on Illium can almost be considered non-canonical, due to the fact that LotSB features the content and elaboration that Liara's ME2 character development required. It's almost become superfluous.

I still incorporate it into my headcanon however, as I see it as a vital part of the Shepard/Liara love story. It's the rocky and difficult second chapter.

I disagree. While the Illium cameo could certainly be written better. I think that picking all the "angry Shepard" dialog options and NOT getting the confession then proceeding to wait to the DLC after suicide mission is a decent set-up for LOTSB itself.

But it could certainly have been written better.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

I disagree. While the Illium cameo could certainly be written better. I think that picking all the "angry Shepard" dialog options and NOT getting the confession then proceeding to wait to the DLC after suicide mission is a decent set-up for LOTSB itself.

But it could certainly have been written better.

I know, but I've developed a decent enough RP reason for Shepard's derp response to Liara's confession, in which I incorporate elements of my Shepard's backstory. I think it works quite well, and that's why I continue to use it in my headcanon.

Can't deny that I also use good amount of my own headcanon to give reason why Shepard acts rather angry during the Illium cameo.

[JamieCOTC]

Lizardviking wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

In a certain way, the original Liara scenes on Illium can almost be considered non-canonical, due to the fact that LotSB features the content and elaboration that Liara's ME2 character development required. It's almost become superfluous.

I still incorporate it into my headcanon however, as I see it as a vital part of the Shepard/Liara love story. It's the rocky and difficult second chapter.

I disagree. While the Illium cameo could certainly be written better. I think that picking all the "angry Shepard" dialog options and NOT getting the confession then proceeding to wait to the DLC after suicide mission is a decent set-up for LOTSB itself.

But it could certainly have been written better.

Actually, that's what I do, but it's still screwed up.  Liara is like, "We can't discuss it." then bam, "Let's discuss it."  It makes more sense if her secretary is gone, I'll give it that, but it's still screwed up to me.
 
As to Liara being a LI in another game, maybe I'm screwed up, but that just feels wrong for me.  I don't necessarily want her to be alone either, but she and Shep are an iconic pairing. But that’s just me.  Then again, it would be an interesting option to play the poor schmuck trying to live in the shadow of Commander Shepard. 

[jlb524]

Oh, I wouldn't want Liara as an LI in another game either...that would be too weird...like you're backstabbing yourself. I hope they let any future Liara pairings open to the imagination of the player so I can pair her up with whomever I want if/when I write a fic involving her post-Shepard's death XD

Modifié par jlb524, 31 décembre 2010 - 01:00 .

[jbauck]

I concede the point to you both on the weirdness factor. But I stand by the idea that only a PC has a snowball's chance in hell. I can only imagine that romancing a Post-Shepard Liara is a place NPC's fear to tread. "Poor schmuck" indeed.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

JamieCOTC wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

LesEnfantsTerribles wrote...

In a certain way, the original Liara scenes on Illium can almost be considered non-canonical, due to the fact that LotSB features the content and elaboration that Liara's ME2 character development required. It's almost become superfluous.

I still incorporate it into my headcanon however, as I see it as a vital part of the Shepard/Liara love story. It's the rocky and difficult second chapter.

I disagree. While the Illium cameo could certainly be written better. I think that picking all the "angry Shepard" dialog options and NOT getting the confession then proceeding to wait to the DLC after suicide mission is a decent set-up for LOTSB itself.

But it could certainly have been written better.

Actually, that's what I do, but it's still screwed up.  Liara is like, "We can't discuss it." then bam, "Let's discuss it."  It makes more sense if her secretary is gone, I'll give it that, but it's still screwed up to me.
 
As to Liara being a LI in another game, maybe I'm screwed up, but that just feels wrong for me.  I don't necessarily want her to be alone either, but she and Shep are an iconic pairing. But that’s just me.  Then again, it would be an interesting option to play the poor schmuck trying to live in the shadow of Commander Shepard. 

I assume you're talking about how she doesn't want to talk during the Illium cameo, but once you activate LOTSB you're suddenly able to.

Well to start, she still tries to dogde the question regarding their relationship until the SB have been defeated. As for why Shepard does not ask about it during Illium, well..... That's where headcanon comes in!

I roleplay it as Shepard is rather bitter when he lands on Illium. Anderson giving the cold shoulder, Alenko accusing him of being a traitor, the fact that the council basicly pissed on his grave and make him look a like a raving lunatic. So when he meets Liara he finally snaps (so to speak).
The result is the meeting between Liara and Shepard ends on a rather sour note. Shepard spends alot of time afterwards cooling down and thinking things through.

[oxymoo28]

Well I could totally see Liara being in an ME game set maybe a few hundred years in the future, I think I'd also be uncomfortable romancing her with a character that isn't Shepard. However, I definitely see the appeal, otherwise I probably wouldn't be posting in this thread



I'll try to put my opinion on her behaviour on Illium in another post, when it isn't quite so late at night here. However it definitely suffered from poor writing and Shepard apparently having quite the derp moment.

[JamieCOTC]

Lizardviking wrote...


I assume you're talking about how she doesn't want to talk during the Illium cameo, but once you activate LOTSB you're suddenly able to.

Well to start, she still tries to dogde the question regarding their relationship until the SB have been defeated. As for why Shepard does not ask about it during Illium, well..... That's where headcanon comes in!

I roleplay it as Shepard is rather bitter when he lands on Illium. Anderson giving the cold shoulder, Alenko accusing him of being a traitor, the fact that the council basicly pissed on his grave and make him look a like a raving lunatic. So when he meets Liara he finally snaps (so to speak).
The result is the meeting between Liara and Shepard ends on a rather sour note. Shepard spends alot of time afterwards cooling down and thinking things through.

Liara refuses to talk about the SB because she fears she is being recorded, that the galaxy doesn't work that way, but give her the data and suddenly the galaxy works that way and she's eager to get on w/ the mission.  Like I said, it plays better if what'shername, Liara's secretary, is dead, but you still have to do the writer's work for them.  Then again, you have to do that a lot in ME2. 

That's a cool way to RP it. 

[Ajosraa]

jlb524 wrote...

JamieCOTC wrote...

Reapers die - Shepard and Liara go off to have little blue children.
Reapers die - Liara remains the Shadow Broker and she and Shepard remain lovers. 

I'll take one of these two, depending on the Shepard. 

Personally, my ideal ME3 ending for Shepard and Liara would be a combination of these two.

I would like Liara to remain the SB, but I also would want to start a family. There are plenty of people who have children while working. This way the best of both can be retained, imo.

Also, I dont really like the idea, after ME3, of Shepard just retiring and withering away. I think Shep still has plenty of years left in him/her and I feel it would be too mundain and normal to just fade away after that with no choise other then a normal existance. I would like to imagine years after ME3 where both Liara and Shep are still active, perhaps as galactic commanders fighting the remnants of the Reapers ( just throwing an example out there).

Of course for those who want to retire to a normal life I can understand the draw and a similar option should remain imo.

[TMA LIVE]

jlb524 wrote...

Oh, I wouldn't want Liara as an LI in another game either...that would be too weird...like you're backstabbing yourself

I was kind of worried Dragon Age might do the same thing.

Anyways, what kind of story role do you guys think Feron will have in ME3? Will he be a squadmate? Liara's stand in? And do you think we'll also get more intel on people in ME3 from the SB base? Like read their emails and such?

[jbauck]

Well, so far, liking the idea of Liara as an LI again in a respectably-distant post-Shepard future for a new PC (henceforth referred to as NewPC) really is just me. I'm oddly okay with that. Maybe it's because of the way I'm really looking at it ... which is, in a game in which Liara appears, is single, and age-appropriate, I cannot imagine a possible LI that will not pale in comparison, as Liara is my favorite.



If it did turn out to feel far too weird (and again - that's a valid point that honestly escaped me ... if this were an option, I might ditch out of it due to feeling weird), I might end up just bypassing romances in such a game. Best for me if this hypothetical game is set far enough in the future that she's a Matriarch and not at all age-appropriate for NewPC ...



But here's a question for anyone taking the "Definitely No, That's Too Weird" position: if Liara were a Samara-like Non-LI, where there's something there but ultimately ... she decides NewPC Just Isn't Shepard and turns NewPC down ... would you Go There?



I can't answer my own question yet - I need to think about it. On the one hand, Sad Liara Is Sad gets to me ... on the other, more Liara content, and it would sort of post-affirm how awesome the Shep/Liara relationship is. Of course, any inclusion of Liara in a hypothetical future ME-franchise game would have to be vague on the point of whether or not she and Shepard were together because it's not canon, but I like that we're ignoring that

[TMA LIVE]

Lizardviking wrote...

I assume you're talking about how she doesn't want to talk during the Illium cameo, but once you activate LOTSB you're suddenly able to.

Well to start, she still tries to dogde the question regarding their relationship until the SB have been defeated. As for why Shepard does not ask about it during Illium, well..... That's where headcanon comes in!

My head canon is that, since Liara pulls away and shakes her head, Shepard doesn't know what to do, or how to act. He's more of hoping she'll talk first (since she started the kiss and pulled away), but she doesn't. Instead she wants him to help with some illegal hacking, and he's like "What the hell's going on?". But she doesn't want to talk. So he helps her out, and then hears her quest to execute the Shadow Broker. And after that, he leaves, and needs some space. Because the girl he remembers being with a week ago is now a completely different person.

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 31 décembre 2010 - 02:01 .

[jlb524]

TMA LIVE wrote...

I was kind of worried Dragon Age might do the same thing.

They are kind of with Isabela, thought that's not the same as the Warden can't romance her. 

TMA LIVE wrote...

Anyways, what kind of story role do you guys think Feron will have in ME3? Will he be a squadmate? Liara's stand in? And do you think we'll also get more intel on people in ME3 from the SB base? Like read their emails and such?

Either Liara's stand in when she becomes a squad mate, or they might use him as a squad mate also. 

Modifié par jlb524, 31 décembre 2010 - 01:46 .

[jlb524]

Ajosraa wrote...

Also, I dont really like the idea, after ME3, of Shepard just retiring and withering away. I think Shep still has plenty of years left in him/her and I feel it would be too mundain and normal to just fade away after that with no choise other then a normal existance. I would like to imagine years after ME3 where both Liara and Shep are still active, perhaps as galactic commanders fighting the remnants of the Reapers ( just throwing an example out there).

My main Shepard just wants to relax and be a housewife...she's been fighting since age 12.  She's tired of it.

[pacer90]

Put it this way, if Liara manages to drag my shep through all this reaper/collector/geth/saren/shadow broker business in one piece, he's lucky to step out of the house again.



Liara may live to 1000 but she has no patience for dashing around the galaxy trying to save his corpse again.

[goofyomnivore]

jlb524 wrote...

My main Shepard just wants to relax and be a housewife...she's been fighting since age 12. She's tired of it.

Hah my Shepard wants to relax as well. Being an orphan and all, he has always wanted a true family. Although the idea of Spectre Shepard+Shadowbroker Liara being together is intriguing. Those two working together would probably make them the most powerful force in the galaxy, and making them the untitled king/queen and queen(if you're feeling dramatic) of the galaxy.

Modifié par strive, 31 décembre 2010 - 02:55 .

[jlb524]

Yeah, my Shep's an Earthborn orphan who has known nothing but violence in her life. A change would be nice XD

[JamieCOTC]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but if the job were offered, UJ Shepard would be the next human councilor. She does have a keen diplomatic mind.

[jlb524]

JamieCOTC wrote...

I can't believe I'm saying this, but if the job were offered, UJ Shepard would be the next human councilor. She does have a keen diplomatic mind.

Heehee, I could see some of my Shepards doing that too.  Not my main, Rachel...she hates politics/politicians/Udina.

Really hates Udina.

I think Liara would support the budding politician, though

[pacer90]

JamieCOTC wrote...

I can't believe I'm saying this, but if the job were offered, UJ Shepard would be the next human councilor. She does have a keen diplomatic mind.

Andrew would have a very short lived career, on account of cutting the turian's life short with his fists.