8541 réponses à ce sujet

[Sunnie]

TheMarshal wrote...

I think classifying Asari as 'space lesbians' is overly simplistic. I mean, a mono-gendered species that lives upwards of 1000 years and can reproduce with any other species, WITHOUT relying on sex, is pretty amazing to think about from an anthropological point of view.

It's not "overly simplistic", its merely boiling it down to the most common denominator. Why would a mono-gendered species, who are "female", look outside it's own? Only in the wildly fantastic can this even be possible.

[Tancho]

Pacifien wrote...

Caythark wrote...

Pacifien wrote...
I never understood how anything in the game could not be considered fanservice seeing as BioWare was seeking to make a game that is of entertainment value to its fans...

yes, male fanservice;)

I will give BioWare credit that they have never denied this. "As far as men go – like with the Asari – you make her blue and give her the perfect body and you’re good to go. Women are more sophisticated than that."

They may at least attempt expanding their horizons, but they will always be boys making toys.

Thanks for the link! I like that they considered what women like when they created Thane. It shows that they care for their female gamers.

Back on topic: While Liara's character may have started as 'what gets a guy going', I still think her character ended up being so much more than that. Despite their overly simplistic 'blue and perfect bod' description, she ended up being a very key and complex character.

[oxymoo28]

But . . . Mass Effect is wildly fantastic

And isn't the ingame reason that they think the Asari gain something from mating with a different species?? Hence the whole 'pureblood' stigma Liara and other Asari meet.

And yeah Asari mating is hard to understand. Trying to figure out how Asari genetics work = Brainmelt

[Agent Sparky]

Sunnie22 wrote...

It's not "overly simplistic", its merely boiling it down to the most common denominator. Why would a mono-gendered species, who are "female", look outside it's own? Only in the wildly fantastic can this even be possible.

Really? If we look at it from a purely biological standpoint, is it not the goal of any species to ensure reproductive success to ensure continued survival? The more potential partners -- in this case, other species and males -- the greater the odds become. Why is it that some species of frog change gender?

It's actually a little ridiculous to assume that the Asari wouldn't evolve and grow, though their incorporation of other partners probably wasn't an overnight change.

[TheMarshal]

Sunnie22 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

I think classifying Asari as 'space lesbians' is overly simplistic. I mean, a mono-gendered species that lives upwards of 1000 years and can reproduce with any other species, WITHOUT relying on sex, is pretty amazing to think about from an anthropological point of view.

It's not "overly simplistic", its merely boiling it down to the most common denominator. Why would a mono-gendered species, who are "female", look outside it's own? Only in the wildly fantastic can this even be possible.

They don't need to reproduce sexually, they can delve into the mind of their partner and pick out desireable traits to use in "randomizing" their own genes for the next generation.  Why would they look outside their own?  From a cultural standpoint, particularly for a species that lives as long as the Asari, it would make sense to expand the potential "trait" pool to other races and cultures.  Doing so would expand the experience that Asari can garner from living a thousand years even further.

[AlexMBrennan]

@Tancho: I don't think that the comment was more likely about asari in general (Chora's den, midriff-baring female Citadel outfit) than Liara specifically.



Regarding asari sexuality, there is no evidence to support a preference for either sex. I think we should leave it at that until we can gather more data.

[Sunnie]

But Asari genetics, as we know it, is not hard to understand. What "is" hard to understand is why they would jump the species ship after hundreds of thousands of years of doing just fine with their own. At what point did this happen, and how? Nobody knows any of this so it makes the "thinkers" go bonkers because none of it makes much relative sense in reality.

[TheMarshal]

Sunnie22 wrote...

But Asari genetics, as we know it, is not hard to understand. What "is" hard to understand is why they would jump the species ship after hundreds of thousands of years of doing just fine with their own. At what point did this happen, and how? Nobody knows any of this so it makes the "thinkers" go bonkers because none of it makes much relative sense in reality.

Because it's what's next.  For a lifespan that is measured in centuries, you gotta imagine that knowledge and exploration are a big part of the Asari culture.  Remaining insular would do them no (extra) good in the long run, but branching out to other species would only serve to benefit their race and their society, especially given that their blood doesn't get "diluted" when doing so.  They still remain Asari.

[Tancho]

@Alex - Yeah, I knew they were talking about Asari in general, but even still, Liara is part of that group (as an asari).

[Tancho]

I kind of see the 'branching out' like this:



A little analogy:

All countries rely on other countries for materials and natural resources they can't find in their own land. If you just stay where you are, you gain nothing and are stuck with the same things. But if you start working with other countries or explore new lands, you gain much more than you already had. Hence pioneering.



So I think it's only natural for beings to look for new resources, no matter what they are. When they found out there was a whole genetic pool of untapped potential, I'm sure they saw it as a chance to further their race. Again, gaining something they couldn't get in their own land.

[oxymoo28]

Yeah I pretty much agree with TheMarshall.

And I don't think it entirely out of the realm of possibility that some Asari simply find beings from other species sexually attractive. If humanity has many different sexualities and kinks why not the Asari?

From what people have been saying it sounds like when Asari mate with other people, Asari or not, all the offspring gets from the 'father' is personality traits, so I see no reason for them not to mate with people from another race.

[jlb524]

As I mentioned, I have no problem with the in-game justifications, but I don't like the design of the asari species from a meta-perspective.

[oxymoo28]

@Tancho Great analogy, And certainly the way I always viewed it.



Anyway, about the interview posted a few pages back about DLC, their intention to make either Shep or Liara the Shadow Broker just shows how important that role will be in ME3. Hell, if they considered giving the role to Shepard it must be.



Also, what do you think to how they should handle character interaction with Liara? I'd like for there to be a difference between Sheps who romanced her and Sheps who didn't. Something alone the lines of if they interact in person, just sort of casual touches when talking, perhaps standing closer together than they would other people. And a quick peck in the cheek before Shep goes to kick Reaper ass

Admittedly it may be a lot from an animators perspective, but it would be nice if something like this was included.

[oxymoo28]

*peck on the cheek, not on my laptop so I can't edit it.

[TheMarshal]

I'm curious as to how Cerberus will play into ME3. If Shepard destroyed the base, she, at least in my mind, gave the finger to Cerberus, took their ship, and is now working for herself, in which case the Shadow Broker would become the main source of information and resources. If, on the other hand, the base was saved, Shepard still has some ties with Cerberus, who don't necessarily "play nice" with the Shadow Broker.



I'd LOVE for some romance-related animations when meeting Liara. If it were me, though, I'd probably try to avoid making a lot of personal stops to Hagalaz, because I wouldn't want anybody to be able to track down Liara. So I would imagine that most of the interactions would be through secure comm-channels.

[TMA LIVE]

I just don't like that the asari depend on other races for their reproductions, and that they have enough volunteers to make up for not dating their own. I can accept that they'd go with a male gender simply because they had 2000 years with Salarians and other races. That's 2 generations of asari now with other and more alien selections. They even go with the Hanar, which don't even looks male or female, or close to them at all.

However, just because they're now more used to more variety being in their lives from birth, doesn't mean they'd all jump ship. Same goes with every other race (unless they really are having their minds messed with by the asari). It's just bull**** that doing other races is the accepted standard for the asari, and everyone else.

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 06 janvier 2011 - 07:07 .

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

TMA LIVE wrote...

I just don't like that the asari depend on other races for their reproductions, and that they have enough volunteers to make up for not dating their own. I can except that they'd go with a male gender simply because they had 2000 years with Salarians and other races. That's 2 generations of asari now with other and more alien selections. They even go with the Hanar, which I don't even looks male or female, or close to them at all.

However, that just because they're now more used to more variety being in their lives from birth, doesn't mean they'd all jump ship. Same does with every other race (unless they really are having their minds messed with by the asari). It's just bull**** that doing other races is the standard.

I think thats the problem. I already made my viewpoint on the whole pureblood thing from a meta-gaming perspective clear. If it were handled diffrently (like I suggested), or perhaps not being there at all.

[jlb524]

oxymoo28 wrote...

Also, what do you think to how they should handle character interaction with Liara? I'd like for there to be a difference between Sheps who romanced her and Sheps who didn't. Something alone the lines of if they interact in person, just sort of casual touches when talking, perhaps standing closer together than they would other people. And a quick peck in the cheek before Shep goes to kick Reaper ass

I would like for there to be differences in animation and dialog for romanced and non-romanced Shepard, yes.

I just hope they don't forget to include these differences with a romanced FemShep again.

[pacer90]

Regardless, this issue will likely go insanely off topic, so I pose another question. Matriarch Aethya watched Liara for a very long time as far as we know. Do you think she was merely observing, content to watch or was she simply never able to find the courage to talk to Liara?

Now that Liara won't be on Ilium anymore, what do you think she will do next? She might assume that Liara was hurt, perhaps try to track her down given how dangerous the business she was/is involved in.




edit: Deleted everything else I said because it was simply off topic with regards to the intention of this thread, which is not the design of the asari in the game universe.

Modifié par pacer90, 06 janvier 2011 - 07:17 .

[Tancho]

I would love to see a difference in interactions between Liara and Shepard! I think we saw the beginnings of those differences in LotSB. I watched the 'romanced' and 'unromanced' videos, and not only is the dialogue different, but the interactions are too (to some extent).



I think Bioware may already be headed in that direction.

[TMA LIVE]

Actually, here's a request for ME3: Make the asari have something more meaningful and important then just being able to have sex with everyone, and living for a thousand years, make good strippers, and good at communicating. Show me they have more to offer then that.

[Tancho]

jlb524 wrote...

oxymoo28 wrote...

Also, what do you think to how they should handle character interaction with Liara? I'd like for there to be a difference between Sheps who romanced her and Sheps who didn't. Something alone the lines of if they interact in person, just sort of casual touches when talking, perhaps standing closer together than they would other people. And a quick peck in the cheek before Shep goes to kick Reaper ass

I would like for there to be differences in animation and dialog for romanced and non-romanced Shepard, yes.

I just hope they don't forget to include these differences with a romanced FemShep again.

You and I both. I think they want to be fair, though, they just have to create the sequence twice because of clipping. I think Bioware caught the hint, though, haha, so hopefully we'll see equal [romantic] interactions between FemShep and Liara. 

[Tancho]

I think the Matriarchs and their importance in Galactic affairs was less ****ty. Justicars are pretty beast too.

Modifié par Tancho, 06 janvier 2011 - 07:12 .