125 réponses à ce sujet

[Legbiter]

Terror_K wrote...

CmdrKankrelat wrote...

If there wasn't any explanation for how the Reapers got to the galaxy (which I highly doubt - that's a pretty big question), then it's not a plot hole - we just revert to the answer hinted at in the end of ME2: they flew.

That's pretty weak. If it's that simple, then pretty much the entire plot of ME1 would just be silly.

Not really. It means they can't have seized control of the entire mass relay network while decapitating the Citadel races. Which should give us meatbags a chance.

[Soahfreako]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

1) Redundant jump array.

2) They can create jumps without the mass effect relay, but it drains them... which is why the Council races are eventually able to win.

They use the same method that Sovereign used before ME1... no one noticed a giant Reaper wandering around the galaxy during the events of ME1... Or am I not remembering that part right?

No one did, until Saren found it in Revelations.

[atheelogos]

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

The Reapers built the mass relay system, while the current galactic races have only unlocked a few of the functions of only a few relays. Since we don't know the timeframe of ME3's plot, it's perfectly reasonable that the Reapers hiked it the hard way from beyond the galactic rim to the nearest relay and just took it from there.

ME3 might well take place a few years after ME2.

That sounds about right to me.

[atheelogos]

NvVanity wrote...

I'm guessing the Reapers have access to means of travel more advanced then Mass Relays but it has a downside like draining their power or something along those lines making them more vulnerable to attack.

The downside is losing the element of surprise. imo

[atheelogos]

Xivai wrote...

They had to place all of the relays in the first place. My bet is they have some form of travel faster than what other species can do, but still not anywhere near as fast as the relays.

This answer has to be right.

[atheelogos]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

i dont think the reapers would only have plan A. as a matter of fact why do you think soveriegn gives up all that info so easily. he WANTS shepard to think the relays are the key.

practice makes perfect and the reapers sure have had alot of practice!

Collectors were Plan A.

Sovereign was either rogue, or crazy or some sort of lost-left-behind-and-lonely Reaper, which screwed up and made Harby trigger the Plan A early.

No rachni was plan A

[Zulu_DFA]

atheelogos wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

i dont think the reapers would only have plan A. as a matter of fact why do you think soveriegn gives up all that info so easily. he WANTS shepard to think the relays are the key.

practice makes perfect and the reapers sure have had alot of practice!

Collectors were Plan A.

Sovereign was either rogue, or crazy or some sort of lost-left-behind-and-lonely Reaper, which screwed up and made Harby trigger the Plan A early.

No rachni was plan A

No Rachni queen was lying too, and its lies were even more nonsensical than Vigil's:

What use would the Reapers have had of a Galaxy with barely a few colonized systems? And it was only 48K years, not 50K.

[Broken Orange]

 I am thinking some sort of backdoor technology on mars that allows some of the reapers, a few at a time, to come here and cause all sorts of trouble. Maybe the Reapers need some sort of technology hidden on earth (as in Halo 3) or in the Volus system to bring back the rest of the Reapers to the Milky Way.

[Hwalkerl]

Just would seem like if it was a small fleet they would have gone straight to the citadel to do what was not completed in ME1 if they were the precursor to the main fleet. IF they have faster then light technology greater then that of all known species it kind of makes the whole Mass Relays useless and the plot of ME1 pointless. Every cycle instead of just using the citadel they could just leave 5 years early and make there way back from dark space instead of using the "Main gate" and that way no suspicion would be drawn to their dealings. I hope the writers have come up with something better then more ""Faster then" faster then light travel" it dumbs down the pseudo sci fi aspect of it

Modifié par Hwalkerl, 12 décembre 2010 - 07:02 .

[Annihilator27]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

atheelogos wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

i dont think the reapers would only have plan A. as a matter of fact why do you think soveriegn gives up all that info so easily. he WANTS shepard to think the relays are the key.

practice makes perfect and the reapers sure have had alot of practice!

Collectors were Plan A.

Sovereign was either rogue, or crazy or some sort of lost-left-behind-and-lonely Reaper, which screwed up and made Harby trigger the Plan A early.

No rachni was plan A

No Rachni queen was lying too, and its lies were even more nonsensical than Vigil's:

What use would the Reapers have had of a Galaxy with barely a few colonized systems? And it was only 48K years, not 50K.

What do you think the Queen was lying about?

[SmokePants]

Hwalkerl wrote...

Just would seem like if it was a small fleet they would have gone straight to the citadel to do what was not completed in ME1 if they were the precursor to the main fleet. IF they have faster then light technology greater then that of all known species it kind of makes the whole Mass Relays useless and the plot of ME1 pointless. Every cycle instead of just using the citadel they could just leave 5 years early and make there way back from dark space instead of using the "Main gate" and that way no suspicion would be drawn to their dealings. I hope the writers have come up with something better then more ""Faster then" faster then light travel" it dumbs down the pseudo sci fi aspect of it

They needed the Citadel relay, not just for transportation, but to ambush and capture the Citadel, before it can be closed. That's why Seren had to board the station via the Conduit to capture the control room and keep the arms from shutting.

Without the use of the Citadel as a relay, the civilizations in control of the Citadel would have plenty of time to turtle the station and keep the Reapers out. The shell is a nearly seamless, impenetrable material. Even if the Reapers could blast through it, they would risk destroying the station, which would be a disaster, because they would be unable to control the relays.

The bottom line is, they CAN'T get the Citadel, because there needs to be a game here. We need the Mass Relays working to go places in the Normandy.  So, don't be disappointed that something that CAN'T happen isn't happening.

[greatgeek]

Hwalkerl wrote...

Just would seem like if it was a small fleet they would have gone straight to the citadel to do what was not completed in ME1 if they were the precursor to the main fleet. IF they have faster then light technology greater then that of all known species it kind of makes the whole Mass Relays useless and the plot of ME1 pointless. Every cycle instead of just using the citadel they could just leave 5 years early and make there way back from dark space instead of using the "Main gate" and that way no suspicion would be drawn to their dealings. I hope the writers have come up with something better then more ""Faster then" faster then light travel" it dumbs down the pseudo sci fi aspect of it

never mind


Sovereign was only able to access the Citadel relay controls because Saren closed the station's arms, protecting it from the Citadel fleets, and shut down the the relays, preventing reinforcements from arriving and slowing the spread of information to the Citadel species. 

The

Modifié par greatgeek, 12 décembre 2010 - 07:36 .

[DarthCaine]

Fast travel

[DarthCaine]

About the timeframe. Retribution and Inquisition take place 1 year after ME2 and there's no Reapers. It's safe to assume ME3 takes place at least 2 years after ME2

[Shotokanguy]

I'm going with they didn't - the teaser trailer isn't a very accurate depiction of how the story will play out.

[Hwalkerl]

SmokePants wrote...

Hwalkerl wrote...

Just would seem like if it was a small fleet they would have gone straight to the citadel to do what was not completed in ME1 if they were the precursor to the main fleet. IF they have faster then light technology greater then that of all known species it kind of makes the whole Mass Relays useless and the plot of ME1 pointless. Every cycle instead of just using the citadel they could just leave 5 years early and make there way back from dark space instead of using the "Main gate" and that way no suspicion would be drawn to their dealings. I hope the writers have come up with something better then more ""Faster then" faster then light travel" it dumbs down the pseudo sci fi aspect of it

They needed the Citadel relay, not just for transportation, but to ambush and capture the Citadel, before it can be closed. That's why Seren had to board the station via the Conduit to capture the control room and keep the arms from shutting.

Without the use of the Citadel as a relay, the civilizations in control of the Citadel would have plenty of time to turtle the station and keep the Reapers out. The shell is a nearly seamless, impenetrable material. Even if the Reapers could blast through it, they would risk destroying the station, which would be a disaster, because they would be unable to control the relays.

The bottom line is, they CAN'T get the Citadel, because there needs to be a game here. We need the Mass Relays working to go places in the Normandy.  So, don't be disappointed that something that CAN'T happen isn't happening.

I understand that they needed The citadel in the first game.  It was just an observation as to why they attacked earth first I am going of the premise that there was a group of other "Vanguards" left as mentioned earlier in the post that may be the precurser to the entire invasion fleet to come I was just thining if they really wanted to screw things up wouldn't they go after the citadel first. 

W/E  I think you misinterpreted my point, which was that I hope that Bioware has a better explanation the "faster then faster then light travel " as the method of transit for the reapers to come back which is not a mute point as you seem to think.  Like I mentioned it would go against the pseudo sci fi aspect that they were building not that faster then light travel is actually possible in the first place it just goes more into the relam of unreal.

[SmokePants]

Hwalkerl wrote...

SmokePants wrote...

They needed the Citadel relay, not just for transportation, but to ambush and capture the Citadel, before it can be closed. That's why Seren had to board the station via the Conduit to capture the control room and keep the arms from shutting.

Without the use of the Citadel as a relay, the civilizations in control of the Citadel would have plenty of time to turtle the station and keep the Reapers out. The shell is a nearly seamless, impenetrable material. Even if the Reapers could blast through it, they would risk destroying the station, which would be a disaster, because they would be unable to control the relays.

The bottom line is, they CAN'T get the Citadel, because there needs to be a game here. We need the Mass Relays working to go places in the Normandy.  So, don't be disappointed that something that CAN'T happen isn't happening.

I understand that they needed The citadel in the first game.  It was just an observation as to why they attacked earth first I am going of the premise that there was a group of other "Vanguards" left as mentioned earlier in the post that may be the precurser to the entire invasion fleet to come I was just thining if they really wanted to screw things up wouldn't they go after the citadel first. 

W/E  I think you misinterpreted my point, which was that I hope that Bioware has a better explanation the "faster then faster then light travel " as the method of transit for the reapers to come back which is not a mute point as you seem to think.  Like I mentioned it would go against the pseudo sci fi aspect that they were building not that faster then light travel is actually possible in the first place it just goes more into the relam of unreal.

I don't think it's a stretch to imagine that they have better FTL than "we" do. I try to think about science fiction in terms of internal logic, because if I try to apply anything I know about physics, it all falls apart. But if you have FTL, why would there be a cap on how fast you can go?

I do agree with you in the sense that there has to be a "cost" to their arrival. Either they're weaker from using energy reserves or they had to canibalize their own to get out of dark space. There has to be some reason this was Plan F. If it comes off as, "why didn't they do this all along?", then that is a problem.

Modifié par SmokePants, 12 décembre 2010 - 10:53 .

[Hwalkerl]

SmokePants wrote...

Hwalkerl wrote...

SmokePants wrote...

They needed the Citadel relay, not just for transportation, but to ambush and capture the Citadel, before it can be closed. That's why Seren had to board the station via the Conduit to capture the control room and keep the arms from shutting.

Without the use of the Citadel as a relay, the civilizations in control of the Citadel would have plenty of time to turtle the station and keep the Reapers out. The shell is a nearly seamless, impenetrable material. Even if the Reapers could blast through it, they would risk destroying the station, which would be a disaster, because they would be unable to control the relays.

The bottom line is, they CAN'T get the Citadel, because there needs to be a game here. We need the Mass Relays working to go places in the Normandy.  So, don't be disappointed that something that CAN'T happen isn't happening.

I understand that they needed The citadel in the first game.  It was just an observation as to why they attacked earth first I am going of the premise that there was a group of other "Vanguards" left as mentioned earlier in the post that may be the precurser to the entire invasion fleet to come I was just thining if they really wanted to screw things up wouldn't they go after the citadel first. 

W/E  I think you misinterpreted my point, which was that I hope that Bioware has a better explanation the "faster then faster then light travel " as the method of transit for the reapers to come back which is not a mute point as you seem to think.  Like I mentioned it would go against the pseudo sci fi aspect that they were building not that faster then light travel is actually possible in the first place it just goes more into the relam of unreal.

I don't think it's a stretch to imagine that they have better FTL than "we" do. I try to think about science fiction in terms of internal logic, because if I try to apply anything I know about physics, it all falls apart. But if you have FTL, why would there be a cap on how fast you can go?

I do agree with you in the sense that there has to be a "cost" to their arrival. Either they're weaker from using energy reserves or they had to canibalize their own to get out of dark space. There has to be some reason this was Plan F. If it comes off as, "why didn't they do this all along?", then that is a problem.

I agree we have to look at the game with an internal logic for there to be believeability for most of the concepts presented.  My only argument agaisnt the faster then light travel is that it almost defeats the purpose of the Mass Relays and thier neccesity that Soverign made them to be in ME1.  Not that it is not necessarily a logical fallacy with the context of the internal logic of the game.  Its just a plot point that kind of stick out to me.  I am sure they will explain it all very well I mean it is a big issue. If you are right and it is a FTL method there should be some cost. Personally I am just hoping for a better explanation for thier return then just FTFTL.

[archurban]

or we can eat them all. there are many ways to cook cuttlefish.

Modifié par archurban, 13 décembre 2010 - 12:00 .

[MassEffect762]

Black hole/worm hole caused by "dark energy".

[The Smoking Man]

They traveled through a plot hole.

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

[quote]AdmiralCheez wrote...

Just occurred to me: maybe they usually went to the Citadel first in order to shut down the relays to corner their prey? They may not need the relays themselves, but with the system still active, the rest of the galaxy can run as fast as they can.[/quote]

[/quote]

This is win!  I'm making this my new pet theory.

[Hwalkerl]

The Smoking Man wrote...

They traveled through a plot hole.

Best explanation...I wonder if Bioware ever planned the story arc out completely for the trilogy I mean beyond just a "rough outline" before they started ME2?

[Hwalkerl]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Just occurred to me: maybe they usually went to the Citadel first in order to shut down the relays to corner their prey? They may not need the relays themselves, but with the system still active, the rest of the galaxy can run as fast as they can.

if they are distracted by a few reapers on earth maybe the real threat ends up taking place at the citadel and thats where the ending culminates?

[Giantevilhead]

You'd think that a race as advanced as the Reapers would have a back up plan like another Citadel somewhere else in the galaxy. Unless they're going with the whole "done in by their own arrogance" idea.