152 réponses à ce sujet

[moneycashgeorge]

 I actually know that nukes were mentioned in the ME1 WMD Codex entry, so they are part of the universe, but it appears that they are going to quietly ignore them for Mass Effect 3. Cuz come on, giant machine devils, as cool as they are, don't really compete with a good multiple warhead nuclear bomb. 

P.S. While typing this I remembered Virmire. I apologize for this momentary lapse in ME nerdiness.

So what do people think of the Reapers decision to forego nuclear (or orbital mass accelerators, or Anti-Matter) weapons in favor of the more outdated "stomp around and shoot lasers like a War of Worlds tripod" method?

[LPPrince]

While I'm sure they'll lay waste to everything, they need to make sure certain planets remain habitable.



If not using nukes accomplishes that, then there's your reason.

[moneycashgeorge]

Good point, nukes would leave fallout radiation that would prevent new life from flourishing after the extermination.

[HopHazzard]

It's established in ME2 that they want the people alive. At least until they grind them up to make terminator babies.



Likewise anyone wanting to continue living on a planet after driving the reapers off would also be reluctant to light off hundreds of nuclear weapons in their upper atmosphere. Nukes are off the table for both sides, though for different reasons.

[ViSeiRa]

Besides I think think they intend to harvest some humans to grow them into a reaper like they tried to do with the Protheans, so they probably don't want to use any of those weapons.

[Shepard Lives]

Silly Americans and their ironclad belief that nukes solve everything.

[SimonTheFrog]

WELLLLL.... this brings up the big question: what the heck is their plan anyways?



The cycle of extinction, the salvation ("our and yours") through destruction has not yet been fully explained (if it will ever be).



So, the cycle has been disrupted in ME1 (i hope this is not considered a spoiler, really). But it still it's a big deal for them i suppose. So, whatever they do might be in accordance with their original plan. How stomping around london is in accordance with whatever plan they had is still a mystery to me... is it really just the killing?

[Inverness Moon]

When I first saw that trailer, I did think the death count was rather low for what you could get with some nukes or an orbital bombardment from a dreadnought. So I'm guessing the reapers aren't just there to kill everything.

shepard_lives wrote...

Silly Americans and their ironclad belief that nukes solve everything.

Do you have anything to say that actually contributes to the thread? Preferably something that is also accurate, unlike your post.

[Big I]

Nukes are obsolete in Mass Effect, replaced by mass accelerator weapons. The gunnery chief talking about Sir Isaac Newton in ME2 illustrates how a dreadnought is able to fire a 20 kilogram slug fast enough that it impacts with the force of a 38 kiloton bomb...every 2 seconds.

[Shepard Lives]

Inverness Moon wrote...

shepard_lives wrote...

Silly Americans and their ironclad belief that nukes solve everything.

Do you have anything to say that actually contributes to the thread? Preferably something that is also accurate, unlike your post.

Awwrright, fine.
I don't really think Reapers would use nukes, seeing as they want planets to remain life-compatible and they have probably found a more elegant method of causing large-scale destruction anyway. I don't really think it'd make much sense to use one (or more than one, even) on them because they seem to be attacking inside the atmosphere, and bombing them would be environmental suicide.
As for humans, mass-accelerator cannons of sufficient size seem to be able to wreak just as much havoc, and the Thanix Cannon has recently been discovered, not to mention all the tech that could be scavenged from the Collectors. I think nuclear weapons are quickly becoming obsolete in ME.

[Kyle]

Like Glass93 said, why use a complex nuke when you can just shoot a solid chunk of metal at insanely quick speeds.



Off topic a little bit, did you know that a few Navies, I think the US and British, are developing a similar type gun. While the speed is nowhere near as quick as in Mass Effect, a solid metal rounds muzzle velocity (as soon as it leaves the gun) is Mach 7. The metal round literally is moving so quick that it starts the air around it on fire. (This information may be a little dated, it has been a while since I researched the Railgun.)

[alickar]

so if you shot ten nukes at a reaper it might kill him but now u have nuclear fallout
[Edit: Image removed. If an image translates into words that are not within the Site Rules, the image does not get to stay. - Pacifien]

Modifié par Pacifien, 12 décembre 2010 - 04:00 .

[Archereon]

LookingGlass93 wrote...

Nukes are obsolete in Mass Effect, replaced by mass accelerator weapons. The gunnery chief talking about Sir Isaac Newton in ME2 illustrates how a dreadnought is able to fire a 20 kilogram slug fast enough that it impacts with the force of a 38 kiloton bomb...every 2 seconds.

WROOOOOONGGG!!!

Mass Driver weapons don't create massive electromagnetic pulses, and can't wipe out all electronics on Earth if used wisely.

Relativistic weapons would be better for destroying a planet though.

[Jigero]

1. Nukes are obsolete in the Mass Effect Universe.

2. Nukes don't work in space, The majority of the destructive power of a nuke comes from it's pressure wave, you can't create a pressure wave in a vacuum. The only that that would effect it is the radiation. But that would be like trying to melt a steel plate with a single match, Seeing as how Reapers travel through space full of radiation thousands of times more potent then anything a nuke could create.

3. a Reaper would to shrug off a nuke, remember it took an entire fleet of ships each firing weapons hundreds of times more powerful then nukes at it to take it out.

[Inverness Moon]

Jigero wrote...

1. Nukes are obsolete in the Mass Effect Universe.
2. Nukes don't work in space, The majority of the destructive power of a nuke comes from it's pressure wave, you can't create a pressure wave in a vacuum. The only that that would effect it is the radiation. But that would be like trying to melt a steel plate with a single match, Seeing as how Reapers travel through space full of radiation thousands of times more potent then anything a nuke could create.
3. a Reaper would to shrug off a nuke, remember it took an entire fleet of ships each firing weapons hundreds of times more powerful then nukes at it to take it out.

Maybe you didn't notice, but this thread was about how the reapers could kill many more people if they just bombarded Earth with nukes. Obviously, the nukes wouldn't be in space, and obviously whether reapers can shrug nukes off or not is irrelevant since they aren't the ones being targeted.

Maybe you should try reading the OP next time.

[Eludajae]

I think the bigger question will be at the end, what to do about using Dark Energy like we have been. In ME2 Tali is investigating a stars premature death, the relays, biotics, everything is based on dark energy manipulation and hence reaper technology. The true question is if you defeat the reapers, how do you maintain a galactic society without using the reaper based technology that every races technology is based on? The same technology that is devouring the very stars themselves?

[Spartas Husky]

There is no reason too. Energy used to produce them far outweights their usefullness.



Mass effect drives, destroy everything but dont leave a radioactive dead zone. Plus nukes can't be launched too fast for they too work, unless it has a trigger inside.



Overall, why use a complicated weapon that destroys a town, when you have a simple gun powerful enough to have the same impact. At lesser the cost, lesser the upkeep, and plus doesn't leave a radioactive dead zone.

[Wut555]

Inverness Moon wrote...

Jigero wrote...

1. Nukes are obsolete in the Mass Effect Universe.
2. Nukes don't work in space, The majority of the destructive power of a nuke comes from it's pressure wave, you can't create a pressure wave in a vacuum. The only that that would effect it is the radiation. But that would be like trying to melt a steel plate with a single match, Seeing as how Reapers travel through space full of radiation thousands of times more potent then anything a nuke could create.
3. a Reaper would to shrug off a nuke, remember it took an entire fleet of ships each firing weapons hundreds of times more powerful then nukes at it to take it out.

Maybe you didn't notice, but this thread was about how the reapers could kill many more people if they just bombarded Earth with nukes. Obviously, the nukes wouldn't be in space, and obviously whether reapers can shrug nukes off or not is irrelevant since they aren't the ones being targeted.

Maybe you should try reading the OP next time.

Uhhhh nukes ARE irrelevant though because them firing hunks of metal from space would do much more damage. The astriod the batarians were going to use on Terra Nova would have wrecked the whole planet in one shot (just like the dinosaurs). Anything, even something relatively small falling fast enough from space is AMAZINGLY more destructive . Also with the clear knowledge that reapers want humans they arent going to entirely wreck the Earth or they would have done so with "stronger than nuke solution from orbit". Also one wonders if the reapers even need to fire that many shots, it seems that indoctrination eventually would do just as good of a job as overt means of warfare, also it preserves any resources the reapers might want to maintain.

[Hathur]

Humanity firing nukes at the reapers would be tantamount to suicide. Concussive blasts from it + nuclear fallout would render Earth uninhabitable... If you're a fanatical, maniacal suicide bomber, sure that's swell... but most reasonable humans would fight tooth and nail to survive... not obliterate themselves alongside their enemy in nuclear fire.

[Inverness Moon]

Wut555 wrote...

Uhhhh nukes ARE irrelevant though because them firing hunks of metal from space would do much more damage. The astriod the batarians were going to use on Terra Nova would have wrecked the whole planet in one shot (just like the dinosaurs). Anything, even something relatively small falling fast enough from space is AMAZINGLY more destructive . Also with the clear knowledge that reapers want humans they arent going to entirely wreck the Earth or they would have done so with "stronger than nuke solution from orbit". Also one wonders if the reapers even need to fire that many shots, it seems that indoctrination eventually would do just as good of a job as overt means of warfare, also it preserves any resources the reapers might want to maintain.

I shouldn't have to explain why building and firing a couple thousand strategic nukes from a ship is more convenient and can be done much more quickly after an immediate exit from FTL than locating an asteroid and changing its course to intercept Earth over a period of hours, days, or months without being detected.

Next, I thought I already mentioned that IF the reapers had been intending to wipe out humanity, that nukes would be faster. And since they're not doing that, they must have some other intention.

Next, indoctrination occurs over a period of weeks. The reapers can't just hover over cities for weeks and expect everyone to just stay there or not end up with several fleets firing at them.

[Wut555]

Inverness Moon wrote...

Wut555 wrote...

Uhhhh nukes ARE irrelevant though because them firing hunks of metal from space would do much more damage. The astriod the batarians were going to use on Terra Nova would have wrecked the whole planet in one shot (just like the dinosaurs). Anything, even something relatively small falling fast enough from space is AMAZINGLY more destructive . Also with the clear knowledge that reapers want humans they arent going to entirely wreck the Earth or they would have done so with "stronger than nuke solution from orbit". Also one wonders if the reapers even need to fire that many shots, it seems that indoctrination eventually would do just as good of a job as overt means of warfare, also it preserves any resources the reapers might want to maintain.

I shouldn't have to explain why building and firing a couple thousand strategic nukes from a ship is more convenient and can be done much more quickly after an immediate exit from FTL than locating an asteroid and changing its course to intercept Earth over a period of hours, days, or months without being detected.

Next, I thought I already mentioned that IF the reapers had been intending to wipe out humanity, that nukes would be faster. And since they're not doing that, they must have some other intention.

Next, indoctrination occurs over a period of weeks. The reapers can't just hover over cities for weeks and expect everyone to just stay there or not end up with several fleets firing at them.

Sorry if I misunderstood you but sorry still that you missed my point lol

I used the meteor to illustrate the principals behind the sheer energy of ME conventional weapons. Regardless of what nukes may do, the reaper's normal weapons are easier to use and more destructive than nukes, the Newton is dealiest sob arguement is valid (someone already mentioned this before I think), just normal shots from the reaper ships would be more destructive than nukes, the force behind them far exceeds nuclear blasts and even council and alliance dreadnoughts are capable of dishing that out.

[pacer90]

It is likely that a nuclear device could simply be destroyed in-flight by defense systems. However you would have quite the time trying to destroy a mass accelerated particle.

[Inverness Moon]

Wut555 wrote...

Sorry if I misunderstood you but sorry still that you missed my point lol

I used the meteor to illustrate the principals behind the sheer energy of ME conventional weapons. Regardless of what nukes may do, the reaper's normal weapons are easier to use and more destructive than nukes, the Newton is dealiest sob arguement is valid (someone already mentioned this before I think), just normal shots from the reaper ships would be more destructive than nukes, the force behind them far exceeds nuclear blasts and even council and alliance dreadnoughts are capable of dishing that out.

First of all, ME dreadnought power per shot was compared to a 20 kiloton nuclear bomb. We have nukes that are 1,000 times more powerful than that. I don't believe each reaper has 1,000 times the power per shot compared to a typical dreadnought.

Secondly, dreadnought weapons are designed for piercing power which is what you would want when fighting other dreadnoughts in space. That is not the most efficient way to wipe out a city.

A single shot from a typical dreadnought is not going to be more effective at destroying a city than a 20 MT nuclear bomb.

Edit: So lets review

Destructive power of Alliance dreadnought: 20,000 tons of TNT

Destructive power of most powerful nuclear device detonated on Earth: 50,000,000 tons of TNT

There is a clear difference there.

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 12 décembre 2010 - 10:45 .

[bastz]

The reapers want the cycle of life to continue, so they can harvest the next civilizations in 50k years. Nuking the hell out of planets wouldn't make their goal possible because the nuclear fallout would prevent life from forming for millions of years

Modifié par bastz, 12 décembre 2010 - 10:38 .

[BP20125810]

Well, WHY would they destroy entire galaxies. The answer to your question on their method lies in the motive.

Modifié par BP20125810, 12 décembre 2010 - 10:37 .