32 réponses à ce sujet

[Happycrow]

I've never messed with it much, as it's supposed to be famously wacky to work with.
But it's just too nifty to pass up, so I started.... and when I bake, I've got doorways which seem to work fine with the mesh, and others where the walkmesh is mysteriously cut -- and I could *swear* they're the exact same tiles.  Similarly, I've a room made of five tiles the same plus the sixth as the doorway... with the walkmesh cut where the single-wall tiles meet each other in the center of the room.



Anybody work with these extensively and have any hints?  Multi-level sets don't bother me (I prefer them, they're much more powerful a tool), but the walkmesh oddities are... bizarre)

[Happycrow]

Oops. Never mind, was doing something stupid. (had "grid" on and was mistaking it for a cut walkmesh).... so, um, while I'm busy embarrassing myself, anybody got any helpful pointers with this puppy?

[PJ156]

I've used it a little, the best you can do is play. You need to watch out going from an upper tile to a lower one. They dont connect properly with some tiles at the tile edge needs to take a dip before connecting with the lower tile. Not all do.

Also if you put the windows on the single wall tiel back to abck then you can see through the window once both areas are explored. That looks pretty good in game.

PJ

[Happycrow]

Spiffy, thank you.

[Alupinu]

Just finished laying the tiles for a 12x20 area with the Shadow Fortress tiles and this is what I learned. It’s a head ache!

Here is some screenies so that you will know what I’m talking about.



 

The first thing I noticed was it’s an incomplete tile set. Where the other tile sets have around 40-45 tile pieces. The SF only has 30.

The tile “Stairs_up_wall” is bugged. Won’t bake right, stairs get cut off at the top. Tried fixing this with a Flat Walkmesh Helper but no such luck, couldn’t cover the defect. Two of the stair tiles do work but I was unable to able to apply them to my situation.


“Open_Floor” tile only has one elevation where the rest of the tiles can have as many as three. Making the tile almost useless except in certain applications.

There is no  “2_wall(1door) or 2_wall(2door)” tiles often leading to a construction dead end. Actually if you do the math quite a few tiles are missing.

I was able to construct an area using mainly bridge tiles and single wall tiles. Made a large 18x10 room and then just filled it in with bridge type tiles. I was not able to insert stairs so the game is all on one level and the other level is just for environment.  Though I have considered the idea of teleporter’s.

Well that’s everything off the top of my head. It would be a great tile set if they ever finished it. (installed the rest of the missing tiles)

Modifié par Alupinu, 20 décembre 2010 - 02:16 .

[Happycrow]

I find a number of flat tiles in the one and two-door room areas. What I miss is wall-plus-one-corner... not finding that anywhere. I've gotten walkmesh helpers to help with some of the stairs, but not all.

[kamalpoe]

Alpinu has already identified the tile shortage and baking issues with the stair tile.



The other issue is that the tileset has problems with floor and wall textures. Changing the floor texture does nothing, and changing the wall texture changes both. But it's worse than that, because at least some textures will display properly in toolset but not display ingame, leading to a mess like

http://dl.dropbox.co...9894/a_mess.jpg

(using an SoZ Sunken Ruins texture) Texture problem or tileset problem, not sure.

[Happycrow]

Interesting: combining Hallway var.10, and StairUpWall var2, one time I got it to work fine, the next time, I wasn't able to get it to work at all... one assumes that some subtle difference in the placement of the walkmesh helper is involved, but search me to figure out what it is.

[Alupinu]

Happycrow wrote...

I find a number of flat tiles in the one and two-door room areas. What I miss is wall-plus-one-corner... not finding that anywhere. I've gotten walkmesh helpers to help with some of the stairs, but not all.

Yes happy Crow I believe your right I do remember finding some other open_floor tiles but why are they filed under one and two door tiles?

kamal, you say the textures are flawed as well? So far i have only used the default textures and not found anything that suggest bugged but I will keep an eye out.

Modifié par Alupinu, 13 décembre 2010 - 02:07 .

[NWN DM]

kamalpoe wrote...

Alpinu has already identified the tile shortage and baking issues with the stair tile.

The other issue is that the tileset has problems with floor and wall textures. Changing the floor texture does nothing, and changing the wall texture changes both. But it's worse than that, because at least some textures will display properly in toolset but not display ingame, leading to a mess like
http://dl.dropbox.co...9894/a_mess.jpg
(using an SoZ Sunken Ruins texture) Texture problem or tileset problem, not sure.

Hmm... and here I was thinking I had screwed something up to get that same effect... thought I had a hak conflict somewhere.

Gee... something unfinished in this game?  Say it isn't so....

Unrealised potential and promise are a buzz killer.

[Happycrow]

Yep. They're too neat a set of tiles to waste, so I'm kludging together the best I can. Limited functionality -- just trying to see what we can squeeze from it.

[Alupinu]

Well good luck Happycrow, it's a puzzle. LOL

[kamalpoe]

That earlier screenshot? Here's what it's supposed to look like. Looked spectacular in toolset.









The texture I used for the tile is a default texture for the sunken ruins from SoZ. Looked like that screenshot ingame.

[Happycrow]

All right, right off the bat, got a question: that's the wall stair-up... I couldn't get the walkmesh to gel when connecting to that one-wall stair-down jobbie (and had much the same Conan-snake-temple-style idea in mind)... did you use a wm-helper, or something else?

[kamalpoe]

The wall stair up never baked right. I wound up putting snake statues at the top.

[Happycrow]

I've successfully combined it with hallway-bridge, but not with that tile. I think I'll start making up a list of what successfully bakes with what.

[NWN DM]

kamalpoe wrote...

That earlier screenshot? Here's what it's supposed to look like. Looked spectacular in toolset.




The texture I used for the tile is a default texture for the sunken ruins from SoZ. Looked like that screenshot ingame.

Yeah, thing is it looks 'right' in the toolset but not in the game.  So what could be causing that? 

The textures have got to be there otherwise the toolset view would be Ataried as well.

[PJ156]

kamalpoe wrote...

The wall stair up never baked right. I wound up putting snake statues at the top.

When you say wall stair up, do you mean this one?

1920x1080http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/8793/stairsh.jpg[/IMG]

This one bakes okay but only to certain tiles. I have noticed that the floor on this tile set has a slight rise which falls away to the edge of the tile. If the tile does not have this slight fall at the edge then it will not bake to a lower wall tile as there will be a slight gap.

Also I have noted that when baking the area has a memory. If I place corner tile x then bake, then that becomes fixed in the area. If I now use the up arrow to change that tile, when I rebake it still remembers the old tile giving the bake in the image. To change this I have to re-lay the tile from the tileset and select the new orinentation and tyle style before left clicking the tile in place. It will then bake okay. I forgot this one in my first post on this topic. It was the only thing that gave me difficulties with this set.

I have not pushed this set hard in terms of what I want to do with it and thus have not found it incomplete. It is the most interestiing of the tilesets.

PJ

Modifié par PJ156, 14 décembre 2010 - 09:05 .

[Happycrow]

That's the Sunken Ruins tileset. And yes, it's an amazing and useful one, but different from the Shadow Fortress Set (which not only has several levels, but some really nice intermediate-to-low stuff).



I'll start coming up with a list of which tiles successfully bake with which -- or even which seem to work okay with walkmesh helpers* -- if the rest of you could as well, it might make a useful community sticky or blog post.



*would be really nice if I could figure out why I got a successful walkmesh-helper bake one time, but not the next, on that (wall-down+"hallway" platform) tile!

[PJ156]

Ooops, I knew that I was just testing to see if everybody else did.

Clearly you do, test passed. Move on.

In which case my first post in this thread shoud probably be ignored ...

The point about the slight fall is relevant to the Shadow fortress set though I am fairly sure as is the baking memory. Now I know which set I am talking about. I use stair up end hall for transition between levels (I think that has been said though).

Modifié par PJ156, 14 décembre 2010 - 03:59 .

[The Fred]

This tileset is, quite frankly, a mess. It has lots of different levels, which means you can do a lot of cool things with it, but also that it's easy to screw up. Also, as already noted, it's lacking a lot of pieces. For example, it has certain pieces on certain levels, but not on others. You kind of just have to play about with it to see what you can do.



And kamalpoe, that dungeon looks amazing! It's such a shame it doesn't seem to work in-game.

[Happycrow]

Yeah: it's a complete mess. What I'm trying to establish now is which pieces DO bake successfully with others -- particularly those which engage in level-transitions, which is where the set shines visually. If you know that certain tile variations bake cleanly with others, please post it for us. For instance, the stair up end hall transition seems to work smoothly on the upper level, but I've found NO transitions thus far correctly linking the lower-level tiles. Anybody have any luck there? If not, we're dealing with workarounds like rubble on the stairs tied to ropes, ladders and other transition-point workarounds.

[The Fred]

For linking lower-level sections to each other, or for linking lower to upper?

[Happycrow]

Specifically the latter, but even many of the lower sections don't seem to bake correctly: known correct baking is a good thing™.

[Happycrow]

Stair Up Hall End var0 bakes correctly with 1_Wall var0 and with Hallway var9.