52 réponses à ce sujet

[pharos_gryphon]

Comet wrote...

Actually I think it is about time consoles start to have support for user created mods. I'm not saying they'll get the toolset, but there should be support to download user created mods using an in game system of some kind. I really don't understand why consoles can't have that sort of content. As far as user created content bricking your console, you just need to present an agreement screen stating that neighter Bioware or Microsoft are responsible for damages that may occur when playing user created mods

As was stated earlier, Bioware has gone on record to say that yes, console versions will be able to download user created content.  The how and where and when haven't been specified to the best of my knowledge.  They just won't be able to make any of their own. 

As has been said by others, part of the fun of titles on the PC is specifically toolsets and modding communities.  Consoles cant themselves support the toolset systems, and modding for other games is more a coding thing than having a program to sit down build in.

[Jassper]

Well, if we add memory, high end vid card, Keyboard and mouse to the Consoles then maybe. . . . Oh wait, thats a computer.

[Beerfish]

pharos_gryphon wrote...

Comet wrote...

Actually I think it is about time consoles start to have support for user created mods. I'm not saying they'll get the toolset, but there should be support to download user created mods using an in game system of some kind. I really don't understand why consoles can't have that sort of content. As far as user created content bricking your console, you just need to present an agreement screen stating that neighter Bioware or Microsoft are responsible for damages that may occur when playing user created mods

As was stated earlier, Bioware has gone on record to say that yes, console versions will be able to download user created content.  The how and where and when haven't been specified to the best of my knowledge.  They just won't be able to make any of their own. 

As has been said by others, part of the fun of titles on the PC is specifically toolsets and modding communities.  Consoles cant themselves support the toolset systems, and modding for other games is more a coding thing than having a program to sit down build in.

I've never seen this on record part so you have a link?  I've heard them say 'we would like' to be able to have that kind of stuff for consoles but I've never seen an 'on the record' statement that yes this will be available.

[Nexus_Void]

Adinos, i obviously don't have the the expertise on computers or the inner workings of Bioware that you do...what can i say, i just don't have that much free time. What I am saying is that Epic were able to play PC created mods on the PS3 on Unreal Tournament 3. The PS3 version did not have a toolset. But you could play PC mods on the PS3 by downloading them from www.ut3mod.com. These mods did not have to be altered so they could play because my friend created a mod on his PC and minutes after he sent it to the site administrators, we could download and use it on his PS3. So clearly, your wrong there.



Also, I don't appreciate being talked to like a child



"*sigh* How many times does this topic have to be brought up?"



If you payed any attention in anything but how good you are with computers, you'd notice that this is my first forum, i wasn't around to hear the other versions of "this topic" so I didn't know that this had already been discussed. This is the first time i've spoken to you and I can already tell from reading your other comments that your a bloody know-it-all who thinks he's always right. Also, the fact that you were the first to answer with a mile long comment shows that you are a competitive narcasist who believes that he has the answers to everything and that noone else's opinion is even necessary. I have a masters in human phycology. Science doesn't lie pal. Think twice next time before you play prometheus.

[Shadow180]

Nexus_Void wrote...

Adinos, i obviously don't have the the expertise on computers or the inner workings of Bioware that you do...what can i say, i just don't have that much free time. What I am saying is that Epic were able to play PC created mods on the PS3 on Unreal Tournament 3. The PS3 version did not have a toolset. But you could play PC mods on the PS3 by downloading them from www.ut3mod.com. These mods did not have to be altered so they could play because my friend created a mod on his PC and minutes after he sent it to the site administrators, we could download and use it on his PS3. So clearly, your wrong there.

Also, I don't appreciate being talked to like a child

"*sigh* How many times does this topic have to be brought up?"

If you payed any attention in anything but how good you are with computers, you'd notice that this is my first forum, i wasn't around to hear the other versions of "this topic" so I didn't know that this had already been discussed. This is the first time i've spoken to you and I can already tell from reading your other comments that your a bloody know-it-all who thinks he's always right. Also, the fact that you were the first to answer with a mile long comment shows that you are a competitive narcasist who believes that he has the answers to everything and that noone else's opinion is even necessary. I have a masters in human phycology. Science doesn't lie pal. Think twice next time before you play prometheus.

Look man, there are many of these threads on the front-page of the toolset forum. There have been many before on the previous forum. Currently, a lot of the members including him are tired of these posts and we have VERY good reason to be like that. 

I reviewed his post and did not find anything that would indicate any of the things you accused him of being. 

I think you will find that his post was infact around the same length as yours and that his post largely consisted of quotes - which were your post.

He stated facts. Because of this, it makes him a competetive know-it-all? So Einstein was one too? All those other great scientists?

Modifié par Shadow180, 27 octobre 2009 - 10:11 .

[Nexus_Void]

Look, i appreciate him trying to help, but the way he did it was a bit unfair. I came on the forums and clicked on the first thing that related to my confusion and the first person to give me answers has an attitude towards people who know less than him. I had no idea that this was an issue, but - you must admit - for him to admit that i did, even tho it was clearly my first blog, was wrong. If that's the way he acts to anyone who is unaware of his annoyance. And I know a know-it-all when I see one. And the fact that he answered my question, even tho he was annoyed, he gave me a lengthy answer. Because he hates when people think he doesn't know the answer. So he has no choice but to answer. That is what a know-it-all is. I apologize to yourself and him for my ouburst. But I will not apologize for telling the truth and showing my sincere opinion and feelings.

[Xonze]

The UT3 mods are in a different format for ps3, but what Epic did was decide on it early to allow the tool set to make mods for ps3, There is a different way set tools for saving out the mod. The issue is that there are limits on memory as the ps3 does not have a lot, and it has no virtual memory. So the more involved mods can't come to consoles for the fact that PCs have more memory to access.



Anyway, the post was about a tool set for the consoles: its not going to happen. Fan made content making it to a console? A real possibility, but that's up the Bioware, and whether their tools are simple and easy to use, otherwise no mod maker would care to make it ready for PS3.

[Adinos]

Xonze wrote...
 So the more involved mods can't come to consoles for the fact that PCs have more memory to access.

Eh, no... that's not the issue.  Keep in mind that the game itself runs on the consoles, and it is much, much larger than any community-created mod is ever likely to be.

[Xonze]

Keep in mind that things are optimized for the console: textures, poly-counts and everything else. A pc mod, especially when talking about UT3 maps, can not be as large or as detailed as a pc map could be for the very fact of memory( an Epic developer even said this: planetunreal.gamespy.com/pagetools/pagetools.php.) There are limits that need to be taken into account when making a console version of something,

Modifié par Xonze, 28 octobre 2009 - 12:16 .

[Gurney9999]

Not sure if it's still like this, but Amazon's 360 and PS3 pages included info about the toolset. I don't own either, so it doesn't affect me, but I hope people don't buy it looking for the toolset....

[slickesq]

Does no one remember Halo 3? There was this little thing called the forge. It was a level designer. I believe that qualifies as a toolset on a console. Only thing you need to step up from there is be able to script commands for npcs.

[CID-78]

so making your own levels isn't anything new on consoles. you could make your own levels to the old NES classic like wrecking crew, excite bike, it just need to be taken in consideration when you make the toolset. and in this case they rather have a powerfull toolset then a striped down basic one.

[xKMAx DevaST8]

Also Far Cry 2 has a map editor ,both 360 and ps3 can use it.  

Modifié par xKMAx DevaST8, 01 novembre 2009 - 04:53 .

[Lord_Rian]

xKMAx DevaST8 wrote...

Also Far Cry 2 has a map editor ,both 360 and ps3 can use it.  

The Far Cry 2 editor, like Forge, is a joke. It has absolutely no modding capabilities and only allows you to create simplistic multiplayer arena's. There is no comparison to the DAO Toolset, at all. Apples and Oranges.

We need someone from Bioware to sticky a firm "Not on consoles, ever, end of story" notice at the top of the forum and lock it to end further useless clutter in favor of the idea.

[Nexus_Void]

Would it not be possible for console owners to buy the toolset seperately in disc form? As long as it didn't cost too much. But you prob could fit it on a disc. You could put the full PC level toolset plus a small add on that allows you to test your builds without having to change the game in the console. I'm probably wrong but it would be easy to do and they would make money out of it.

[AS_Dodger]

Lord_Rian wrote...

xKMAx DevaST8 wrote...

Also Far Cry 2 has a map editor ,both 360 and ps3 can use it.  

The Far Cry 2 editor, like Forge, is a joke. It has absolutely no modding capabilities and only allows you to create simplistic multiplayer arena's. There is no comparison to the DAO Toolset, at all. Apples and Oranges.

We need someone from Bioware to sticky a firm "Not on consoles, ever, end of story" notice at the top of the forum and lock it to end further useless clutter in favor of the idea.

It's a bit harsh (and elitist imo) to call that editor a joke.  For what it is, and for what it's intended use is, it is a pretty amazing feat for a console.

I'm by no means a toolset guru (tinkered with NWN1 & 2) but I do agree with the sentiment that, even if it were possible on the console, it would be pretty limited in scope and tricky to use.  Maybe on the PS3 with mouse/keyboard, but Microsoft seem pretty against that setup, so there's an obstacle there as well.

[AS_Dodger]

Apologies, net fritzing up and double post.

Modifié par AS_Dodger, 04 novembre 2009 - 12:51 .

[cainx10a]

Didn't BioWare mention something like the best Custom Made mods will be ported to console?

[SabreMerc]

I just wanted to throw my $0.02 in. I was on the forums back in the day - did some heavy modding, and all for NWN. The project I worked on (ShadowrunnerNights - google it before you start flaming lol), I was running off a crappy old toshiba satellite that spent a lot of time with me out in Iraq. That being said, I also had a crappy gfx card (integrated) and barely any ram. That being said, I spent a lot of time optimizing all the code so it would run on my PC - because the main reason I started the project was to _play_ it when it was done. That being said, how limited the mods going over to console would be really depends on who's creating the mods - if it was just a giant copy and paste type job then I'd agree that it'd probably be as limited as UT3 (as far as things like size of the mod/level/etc).

Second, I thought that I might mention that most of the coding I did was in notepad. That being said, creating a mod _on_ the PS3/360 is feasible, if devs wanted to spend the time on a modified toolset. Will they? I doubt it, especially if they already said they won't. It would take a lot more effort, and honestly, there will probably be plenty of things to go in there and patch now that the game has been released - so why dedicate all the talent and effort to something like that? But as far as editing goes - it could be done on consoles. You'd probably need to edit everything seperately, i.e. one editor for scripting (keyboards work on PS3 and 360 - and what about the in console keyboard emulator?), one for creating new items/npcs/etc, one for maps - but if broken down I think it definitely is do-able. I'm sure the emulated keyboard would be a nightmare and a half to try to code with - but it would be plenty for a small change, or writing a brand new -and short- script.

What I'm really interested in is how they approach the possibility of porting mods over - I'd love to get back into modding and do an updated version of ShadowrunnerNights (although with the crappy M$ game I'm sure I'd need to change the name...), but when I had my laptop and external jacked (and a few years later ended up losing a desktop as well) I got fed up... and really do most of my gaming on the PS3 - simply because I don't have to worry about investing countless hours on projects - and investing tons of money on equipment/upgrades and losing it all. The whole console vs pc drama going on is honestly retarded - is as bad as the PS3 and 360 fanboys - those of you that have been going off on rants on "consoles should never have what we have cause pcs are where the true geekiness belongs!" really should get over their inferiority complex

Just a couple of thoughts...

*edited to clarify a few points*

Modifié par SabreMerc, 04 novembre 2009 - 04:32 .

[jpo598]

I find it rather comical that some of you PC players are getting all bent out of shape over console players asking for a toolset.



Some of you are really going to have hurt feelings if something like this ever happens?



Seriously.....why would you care? Why get all stressed over it?



More toolset access is a good thing. Who cares if it's someone on a console or someone on a PC? It's more content for everyone.

[Eoweth]

jpo, there's really nothing a console player can do, not do, have done to them or not done to them that won't ****** off a PC player.

[Direbrute]

cainx10a wrote...

Didn't BioWare mention something like the best Custom Made mods will be ported to console?

I'm thinking what they mean is if a user mod becomes insanely popular and they may rub some Bioware polish on it, package it up real nice and release to the consolers. But I'm willing to bet no more than a dozen or so mods get this treatment - and the only mods to make the leap will be your standard quest/character ones.

On the flipside PC users will get hundreds of mods ranging from very low-level engine tweaks, weapon and armor mods, new and updated models and textures, and maybe a few total conversions.

[heavyrazor95]

They could maybe do so that the user created content could be used but not make it.



Like you could maybe download custom maps, that would extend the game without relying on DLC, and DLC won`t come out forever!

[Tikigod60]

Alot of the time the problem is less 'Can it be done?' and more 'What are Sony and/or Microsofts demands to make it happen?'.

I am sure a Toolset-lite could of been developed that offered some of the options of the full toolset but streamlined to make it efficient for console use (there is a reason '60 FPS' is a game feature marketed seperately for console games as many are not capable of it).

But even if Bioware had the time and resources to create a 'lite' version, they would still have to then showcase it to Sony and Microsoft seperately, let them review it, and then they would have to meet any demands they may make on what needs to be changed, what can and can not be done and so forth... and that's just for MAKING content, that's not even touching on the seperate rules Sony and Microsoft have for publishing and distribution of content made from said toolset.

At the end of the day, I can't see how it is practical to go to such lengths for platforms that are well known for it's wide audience of instant gratification for no investment players.

Modifié par Tikigod60, 27 novembre 2009 - 11:15 .

[corrosivechains]

Tikigod60 wrote...

Alot of the time the problem is less 'Can it be done?' and more 'What are Sony and/or Microsofts demands to make it happen?'.

I am sure a Toolset-lite could of been developed that offered some of the options of the full toolset but streamlined to make it efficient for console use (there is a reason '60 FPS' is a game feature marketed seperately for console games as many are not capable of it).

But even if Bioware had the time and resources to create a 'lite' version, they would still have to then showcase it to Sony and Microsoft seperately, let them review it, and then they would have to meet any demands they may make on what needs to be changed, what can and can not be done and so forth... and that's just for MAKING content, that's not even touching on the seperate rules Sony and Microsoft have for publishing and distribution of content made from said toolset.

At the end of the day, I can't see how it is practical to go to such lengths for platforms that are well known for it's wide audience of instant gratification for no investment players.

this is exactly the point.  It's not about whether or not the consoles can do it, it's whether or not the companies which produce the consoles can make money off of it.  In the case of player made mods, they cannot legally.