24 réponses à ce sujet

[Erika T]

 Can someone shed light on this please?  If I destroy the Urn of sacred ashes BEFORE recruiting Wynne, what will happen?  Would she not join me?  

I wanted to try it out, so i did the Urn quest before going to the Circle.. and then stupidly killed Kolgrim before he even asked me to destroy the ashes.  I suppose I could go back to the save, but then it would mean going through the gauntlet again which for me is the worst part of the game - I hate the last room.    Anyone tried this Ashes / Wynne scenario?

Thanks in advance

[Pro_Consul]

I heard that even if you don't recruit her until after the Ashes quest, Wynne will still leave the party the first time you go to camp after recruiting her if you have already destroyed the ashes. I never tested this though, and I don't recall reading a first hand account from anyone who did.

[Erika T]

Thanks, that would be quite illogical though, wouldnt it? Her joining you, then leaving at the first opportunity? Thanks for the answer though, I will probably try it out and let you know

[Pro_Consul]

Cool, I'd really appreciate a first hand account, and I don't have a "pre-Wynne/pre-Ashes" save to check it myself. I am guessing that if the account I already read is true it plays out with some kind of forced dialog where she mentions that she has heard from the other party members that you were responsible for that blasphemous deed and so she's taking her toys and going back home. Would love to have confirmation, though. Good luck! ;-)

[Zjarcal]

The wiki states that she will leave even if you recruit her after.



I know it doesn't make sense. It's similar to Zevran being upset about killing the Dalish even if you hadn't recruited him yet.

[ejoslin]

If you visit camp after tainting the ashes but before recruiting Wynne, she won't confront you. It's only if you don't visit camp between the two events that she'll confront the warden.

[Erika T]

Visiting camp, just turning up and leaving, you mean?



So so far the scenarios I need to cover are:

1. accept kolgrims offer, destroy the ashes, recruit wynne, go to camp, see if she leaves

2. accept kolgrims offer, destory the ashes, go to camp, go to the circle, recruit wynne, go to camp, see if she leaves.



Right?



This will take me all evening, as it includes 2X going through the circle quest including the fade. I might just go and do the first scenario and report back on it later.

[Ramante]

Scenario 1:

- Defile the ashes

- Recruit Wynne (without going to camp first! So from the Temple directly to the Circle)

- Wynne will leave once you go to camp after the Cicrle quest



Scenario 2:

- Defile the ashes

- Go to camp

- Do the Circle quest and recruit Wynne

- Go to camp, Wynne does not confront you and stays in your team

[Erika T]

I tried scenario two yesterday and wynne didnt say a word about the ashes. If Ramante above is right about scenario one, then it doesnt make sense. Why would going to camp between the ashes and the circle make a difference as to whether wynne "hears" about it or not?

[IanPolaris]

Erika T wrote...

I tried scenario two yesterday and wynne didnt say a word about the ashes. If Ramante above is right about scenario one, then it doesnt make sense. Why would going to camp between the ashes and the circle make a difference as to whether wynne "hears" about it or not?

I think it might be a programming thing.  Some flags get reset when you camp (such as injury flags and the like) and so if you don't go to camp, the flag that causes Wynne to go beserk is still active when she joins your group in the circle...and that's all it takes.  OTOH, if you camp at any time, then the Urn Quest flags are closed along with the Wynne goes beserk flag, and she never hears about it.

Honestly is should be the later case in both times.  Do the urn correctly, and the only people that know you've destroyed it are your immediate companions that were with you.

-Polaris

[Ferretinabun]

IanPolaris wrote...

Erika T wrote...

I tried scenario two yesterday and wynne didnt say a word about the ashes. If Ramante above is right about scenario one, then it doesnt make sense. Why would going to camp between the ashes and the circle make a difference as to whether wynne "hears" about it or not?

I think it might be a programming thing.  Some flags get reset when you camp (such as injury flags and the like) and so if you don't go to camp, the flag that causes Wynne to go beserk is still active when she joins your group in the circle...and that's all it takes.  OTOH, if you camp at any time, then the Urn Quest flags are closed along with the Wynne goes beserk flag, and she never hears about it.

Honestly is should be the later case in both times.  Do the urn correctly, and the only people that know you've destroyed it are your immediate companions that were with you.

-Polaris

This.

But on the other hand, it makes perfect sense to me that companions you don't take with you on missions later find out what happened while you did them, from an RP perspective. I mean, are we really to believe that when your party arrives back at camp after an epic mission, none of the others at any point asks: "So, how did it go?"

[ejoslin]

IanPolaris wrote...

Erika T wrote...

I tried scenario two yesterday and wynne didnt say a word about the ashes. If Ramante above is right about scenario one, then it doesnt make sense. Why would going to camp between the ashes and the circle make a difference as to whether wynne "hears" about it or not?

I think it might be a programming thing.  Some flags get reset when you camp (such as injury flags and the like) and so if you don't go to camp, the flag that causes Wynne to go beserk is still active when she joins your group in the circle...and that's all it takes.  OTOH, if you camp at any time, then the Urn Quest flags are closed along with the Wynne goes beserk flag, and she never hears about it.

Honestly is should be the later case in both times.  Do the urn correctly, and the only people that know you've destroyed it are your immediate companions that were with you.

-Polaris

It IS a programming thing.  The way it works is this (yes, i know this for a fact)-- there's a flag set when you defile the ashes.  there is a file that is checked every time you go to camp (called party_camp.dlg) that has various dialogs that trigger in it.  If leliana was at the urn but intimidated, that sets another flag.  The flag that is set by the urn being defiled is in there, and whether you get Wynne's dialog there is determined solely by whether she's recruited or not (if she was killed, she's no longer recruited).  

Anyway, if you go to camp and Wynne is not recruited at that point, the flag still clears -- it's just that her dialog there isn't triggered.  however, if you recruit Wynne before going to camp, then you still have the flag set for defiling the urn AND you have the flag set for Wynne being recruited.

It's not a perfect system, and in fact could be fixed by just making one more flag for Wynne, but really, I'm not sure it's that big a deal that it needs to be changed.

[GlassDeviant]

Why would you want to defile the urn anyway? I like the XP from kicking Kolgrim and his buddies around the cave.

[ejoslin]

GlassDeviant wrote...

Why would you want to defile the urn anyway? I like the XP from kicking Kolgrim and his buddies around the cave.

perhaps a Dalish or a mage or even a city elf would not want to see the Chantry gain more power.  Perhaps a dwarf, who has no real exposure to the whole chantry teachings thinks this is a good way to recruit some powerful and crazy allies to their side.

[DWSmiley]

ejoslin wrote...

GlassDeviant wrote...

Why would you want to defile the urn anyway? I like the XP from kicking Kolgrim and his buddies around the cave.

perhaps a Dalish or a mage or even a city elf would not want to see the Chantry gain more power.  Perhaps a dwarf, who has no real exposure to the whole chantry teachings thinks this is a good way to recruit some powerful and crazy allies to their side.

Or you can do both.  My chaotic elf defiled the ashes and then killed Kolgrim.

Another sequencing thing that doesn't ring true is if you recruit Shale after completing the Paragon quest.  Shale still gets upset that you didn't take her along to meet Caridin. 

[ejoslin]

*grin* I did that my first time as well -- I was really annoyed that Kolgrim wouldn't join us!

[IanPolaris]

ejoslin wrote...

*grin* I did that my first time as well -- I was really annoyed that Kolgrim wouldn't join us!

Yeah, tell me about it.  I remember going back to Kolgrim with my 'evil' warden and offering them a choice place as one of my armies and then Kolgrim spouts off about how the Darkspawn are the Maker's vengeance and openly roots them on.

My Warden essentially said, "Wrong Answer" *snick* and Kolgrim, his band, and shortly thereafter the "Risen Andraste" were all dead.  This was after he killed off Lelianna and Wynne when he corrupted the Ashes (no big loss in his mind).

-Polaris

[IanPolaris]

[double post, sorry]

Modifié par IanPolaris, 17 décembre 2010 - 10:30 .

[Moondoggie]

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

[ejoslin]

Moondoggie wrote...

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

All characters except Alistair will try to leave if they hit 100 hostile. 

Edit: My character who defiled the ashes with Leliana and Wynne in the party had them at 100 love and 100 friendly respectively.  It honestly was a surprise.  

Modifié par ejoslin, 18 décembre 2010 - 01:09 .

[Moondoggie]

ejoslin wrote...

Moondoggie wrote...

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

All characters except Alistair will try to leave if they hit 100 hostile. 

Edit: My character who defiled the ashes with Leliana and Wynne in the party had them at 100 love and 100 friendly respectively.  It honestly was a surprise.  

Well i don't mean taking down approval enough so they leave i mean like crisis points such as an event that angers a character enough to attack. Wynne seems to have way more of those than anyone else.

[ejoslin]

Moondoggie wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

Moondoggie wrote...

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

All characters except Alistair will try to leave if they hit 100 hostile. 

Edit: My character who defiled the ashes with Leliana and Wynne in the party had them at 100 love and 100 friendly respectively.  It honestly was a surprise.  

Well i don't mean taking down approval enough so they leave i mean like crisis points such as an event that angers a character enough to attack. Wynne seems to have way more of those than anyone else.

Oh, yes, she most certainly does.  Makes you wonder if she really believes all of what she says about the gray wardens being the only hope for Ferelden.

[Moondoggie]

I don't think Wynne really believes anything she says. She's too busy looking for the first opportunity to try and kill you. And people say Morrigan is evil. At least she doesn't try to kill you because you think differently to her.

[IanPolaris]

Moondoggie wrote...

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

I believe there are a total of five, or six if you restore the original dialog trees in the tower which is far and away more than any other character in DAO.

There are two when you first meet her in the tower.

1.  You tell her that annulment is the only option.  Wynne attacks in defense of her charges (reasonable IMO but it's still an aggro flag).

2.  She figures out (same scene) that Morrigan is an apostate.  She will then attack the party unprovoked ("Your advisor is a danagerous apostate and you'll get to this tower over my dead body")

3. Just before you go to the Harrowing chamber, you talk with the imprisoned Templar Cullen.  If you explicitly agree with Cullen (that all up there need to die), Wynne will go aggro on you.

4. If you corrupt the Ashes during the Urn of Sacred Ashes quest, Wynne (and Lelianna) will go Aggro ("May the Darkspawn take you...")

5.  If you left Wynne in camp, and destroyed the Urn of Sacred Ashes, Wynne will still attack you (IIRC) when you return to camp.

6.  If you have the original scenes enabled, Wynne will attempt to turn you into the Templars (but ONLY if you save her precious circle...not if you annulled the circle) if you are a Bloodmage.  Unless you pass a persuade check, she will go agro and make all mages and templars go aggro as well (killing off both sides leaving you without an army from the tower).

-Polaris

[tonnactus]

Moondoggie wrote...

Here's a fun question. How many flags are there where Wynne could leave or attack the party? I know theres two in the mage tower and the one when you defile the ashes are there any more? She's such a volitile character.

When you accept the offer of Caladrius.(but 1 point in constitution shouldnt be worth that)