344 réponses à ce sujet

[AdmiralCheez]

TornadoADV wrote...

It was certainly better then the hallway shooter with chest high walls AKA ME2. ME2 showed the blantant switch in game focus to attract the lowest common denomoninator for the highest amount of possible profit (Let's increase the amount of sexual content but reduce it's maturity level.) . I can't think of anything in ME1 that was actually bad.

Hey, I agree with you on those points (the sex thing especially), but seriously, ME1 had some issues as well.  Horrible inventory management, clunky combat... and a certain issue which I linked you to above.

Well, maybe not an "issue," per se.  I found it to be... quite a bonus.

Dunno, do you count "hilarious glitches" as a plus or a minus?

[adam_grif]

ME1 combat was laughable, as a third person cover shooter it was glitchy and unsatisfying, as a tactical RPG it was horrifically unbalanced and shallow. ME2 went a direction that not everybody was happy with, but at least it succeeds at something.



ME1 was also full of technical shortcomings, glitches and so forth. The Mako sections were uniformly mediocre, sometimes dipping down into "horrible" for side missions thank to ridiculous mountains everywhere that you had to scale.



Mass Effect side quests were terrible mostly, boring fetch quests and combat on the same freighter / colony that you've seen 10 times already.

[Gibb_Shepard]

adam_grif wrote...

ME1 combat was laughable, as a third person cover shooter it was glitchy and unsatisfying, as a tactical RPG it was horrifically unbalanced and shallow. ME2 went a direction that not everybody was happy with, but at least it succeeds at something.

ME1 was also full of technical shortcomings, glitches and so forth. The Mako sections were uniformly mediocre, sometimes dipping down into "horrible" for side missions thank to ridiculous mountains everywhere that you had to scale.

Mass Effect side quests were terrible mostly, boring fetch quests and combat on the same freighter / colony that you've seen 10 times already.

Okay, other than trying to degrade the first game, what is your point?

[AdmiralCheez]

@adam_grif: I totally agree with you, but let's not turn this into another ME1 vs. ME2 thread. 'Kay?

[SithLordExarKun]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

@adam_grif: I totally agree with you, but let's not turn this into another ME1 vs. ME2 thread. 'Kay?

Seconded. I don't want the fanatics strapping themselves with bombs coming out of the woodworks.

[SithLordExarKun]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

ME1 combat was laughable, as a third person cover shooter it was glitchy and unsatisfying, as a tactical RPG it was horrifically unbalanced and shallow. ME2 went a direction that not everybody was happy with, but at least it succeeds at something.

ME1 was also full of technical shortcomings, glitches and so forth. The Mako sections were uniformly mediocre, sometimes dipping down into "horrible" for side missions thank to ridiculous mountains everywhere that you had to scale.

Mass Effect side quests were terrible mostly, boring fetch quests and combat on the same freighter / colony that you've seen 10 times already.

Okay, other than trying to degrade the first game, what is your point?

You mean its not ok that people in this thread degrade ME1 but its okay to degrade ME2 and then state that ME1 is the holy grail of gaming?

[Alienmorph]

Stanley Woo wrote...

we do listen. A lot. We just don't always agree with you.

Always good to have this thing confirmed ^^

[hypothead]

I have to agree with terror keep in mind you cant listen to every one but to scrap it all together was the easiest way to do it i know im not a developer or anything like that and it probably wasnt simple but the loading screens just cut off a certain something maybe some form of realism that was added when hearing the news or squad members talking while waiting to get some where or it might just be me but back on subject does BW listen yes do they listen enough to a certain extent because they cant just go off feed back alone.



P.S. ( I hate the hammer head so much )

[Captain_Obvious_au]

True Stanley, but the problem was that Bioware took fan complaints and then magnified them to the point that those features had to be removed, not fixed, which wasn't what the majority of fans (ie your customers) wanted.



I'm not going to have a go at the plot of the ME games or anything like that, but I just wish that for ME3 the devs take fan feedback into account and use it to influence the gameplay mechanics to a less extreme extent than with ME2.

[Mister Mida]

Bioware says they're listening. That's the only thing we can truly state as a fact. If they actually listen...

[adam_grif]

Okay, other than trying to degrade the first game, what is your point?

Someone said something like "there is nothing bad in ME1" on the last page. I was chiming in to disagree strongly.

[royceclemens]

SithLordExarKun wrote...

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

adam_grif wrote...

ME1 combat was laughable, as a third person cover shooter it was glitchy and unsatisfying, as a tactical RPG it was horrifically unbalanced and shallow. ME2 went a direction that not everybody was happy with, but at least it succeeds at something.

ME1 was also full of technical shortcomings, glitches and so forth. The Mako sections were uniformly mediocre, sometimes dipping down into "horrible" for side missions thank to ridiculous mountains everywhere that you had to scale.

Mass Effect side quests were terrible mostly, boring fetch quests and combat on the same freighter / colony that you've seen 10 times already.

Okay, other than trying to degrade the first game, what is your point?

You mean its not ok that people in this thread degrade ME1 but its okay to degrade ME2 and then state that ME1 is the holy grail of gaming?

Yes it is.  I'm not saying I don't agree with you, or with adam_grif: I do, wholeheartedly.  But you have to understand that the gravest, most unforgivable sin a company that makes a niche game like Mass Effect could possibly commit in the eyes of its hardcore following is making the next game better.  Like Game of the Year better.  Then it's not theirs anymore.  This is a gaming forum.  No Mutants Allowed tendencies are to be expected.  Not that it's as bad here as it is there, but somethings are similar.  You just gotta ride it out.

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...
True Stanley, but the problem was that Bioware took fan complaints and then magnified them to the point that those features had to be removed, not fixed, which wasn't what the majority of fans (ie your customers) wanted.

Lemme get the train of thought down here.  I'm just trying to see something more clearly and I'm hoping you can help me as I try to reconstruct the chain of events...

1. Fans complain to BioWare.

2. BioWare addresses these complaints in-game.

3. Fans complain to BioWare because fans didn't complain specifically enough the first time.

Am I getting that right?

Modifié par royceclemens, 15 décembre 2010 - 08:43 .

[Jebel Krong]

frankly BW should pave their own way and ignore pretty much everything - most of the ideas you see in endless spammed threads are so terrible and cliched you wouldn't want them near any game, let alone something like mass effect. mass effect 1 was great on it's own, mass effect 2 even moreso.

[Orion55]

True. You cant please everyone.

[Funker Shepard]

Stanley Woo wrote...
@Terror_K: Perhaps while discussing and developing the "we don't like Mako and elevators because..." arguments, the development team had some other ideas that they wanted to add. i mean, we are allowed to fit our own ideas into our own game as well as fan ideas, are we not?

I'm not sure that those ideas (Mako replacements) turned out so well this time around, though.

I'll just go on record saying that I'm going to be hugely disappointed if I don't get at least one ride on the Mako in ME3, something like the Ilos or Virmire missions. 

Also, yeah, there is definitely something like listening too much to people. I kind of think it might have happened a bit already with ME2.

Modifié par Funker Shepard, 15 décembre 2010 - 09:49 .

[Turien Rebel]

Jebel Krong wrote...

frankly BW should pave their own way and ignore pretty much everything - most of the ideas you see in endless spammed threads are so terrible and cliched you wouldn't want them near any game, let alone something like mass effect. mass effect 1 was great on it's own, mass effect 2 even moreso.

Agreed Me1 was great and the irony of it is that there was little to no fan whining involved in its making. LET the Bioware employes do there job!!! they decided to go to college and make the games for a living For GOSH SAKES!!!!

In simple terms JUST LET THEM DO THEY DO BEST!!!!!

[DreDk]

Maybe Bioware listen ... But Bioware does not understand it for sure

[Fredvdp]

Stanley Woo wrote...

we do listen. A lot. We just don't always agree with you.

But is bioware still considering patching ME2? Me and many others have been complaining since launch that there are no menu hotkeys in the PC version of ME2 (press J to open journal). Would it be to difficult to still include those? I know some things are hard to fix but this seems pretty straightforward and would improve gameplay a lot.

Modifié par Fredvdp, 15 décembre 2010 - 11:05 .

[Captain_Obvious_au]

royceclemens wrote...

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...
True Stanley, but the problem was that Bioware took fan complaints and then magnified them to the point that those features had to be removed, not fixed, which wasn't what the majority of fans (ie your customers) wanted.

Lemme get the train of thought down here.  I'm just trying to see something more clearly and I'm hoping you can help me as I try to reconstruct the chain of events...

1. Fans complain to BioWare.

2. BioWare addresses these complaints in-game.

3. Fans complain to BioWare because fans didn't complain specifically enough the first time.

Am I getting that right?

No, you're not. It's more like

1. Fans complain to Bioware

2. Bioware goes overboard and goes too far in addressing the complaints

3. Fans complain to Bioware because they completely trashed things that fans wanted fixed

The problem is that for example, fans say the Mako had bad controls. Instead of fixing the Mako, they completely got rid of it, and then sort of replaced it with a very simplistic vehicle that doesn't do antwhere near the same things.

Fix =/= remove is my point.

[Chaos Gate]

adam_grif wrote...

ME1 combat was laughable, as a third person cover shooter it was glitchy and unsatisfying, as a tactical RPG it was horrifically unbalanced and shallow. ME2 went a direction that not everybody was happy with, but at least it succeeds at something.

ME1 was also full of technical shortcomings, glitches and so forth. The Mako sections were uniformly mediocre, sometimes dipping down into "horrible" for side missions thank to ridiculous mountains everywhere that you had to scale.

Mass Effect side quests were terrible mostly, boring fetch quests and combat on the same freighter / colony that you've seen 10 times already.

ME 1 was shallow? ME 1 was mediocre? ME 1 had boring fetch quests? Are you serious?

If you are suggesting that ME 2 improved on these things, then I'm going to have to vehemently disagree. ME 2 had about three sidequests that had nothing to do with the plot, lasted three minutes each, and was just about collecting ****. ME 1 was a competent RPG, whereas ME 2 completely ignored its RPG roots in order to become a poor man's Gears of War clone. I liked the Mako scenes in ME 1, I certainly didn't encounter any glitches, and the action was fine.

The game in this franchise that is shallow and mediocre, not to mention hugely disappointing, is Mass Effect 2.

[The-Person]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

TornadoADV wrote...

It was certainly better then the hallway shooter with chest high walls AKA ME2. ME2 showed the blantant switch in game focus to attract the lowest common denomoninator for the highest amount of possible profit (Let's increase the amount of sexual content but reduce it's maturity level.) . I can't think of anything in ME1 that was actually bad.

Hey, I agree with you on those points (the sex thing especially), but seriously, ME1 had some issues as well.  Horrible inventory management, clunky combat... and a certain issue which I linked you to above.

Well, maybe not an "issue," per se.  I found it to be... quite a bonus.

Dunno, do you count "hilarious glitches" as a plus or a minus?

The sexual content was decreased; the sex scenes in ME2 didn't even have the love interest nude. How is ME1 anymore sexualised?

[The-Person]

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...

royceclemens wrote...

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...
True Stanley, but the problem was that Bioware took fan complaints and then magnified them to the point that those features had to be removed, not fixed, which wasn't what the majority of fans (ie your customers) wanted.

Lemme get the train of thought down here.  I'm just trying to see something more clearly and I'm hoping you can help me as I try to reconstruct the chain of events...

1. Fans complain to BioWare.

2. BioWare addresses these complaints in-game.

3. Fans complain to BioWare because fans didn't complain specifically enough the first time.

Am I getting that right?

No, you're not. It's more like

1. Fans complain to Bioware

2. Bioware goes overboard and goes too far in addressing the complaints

3. Fans complain to Bioware because they completely trashed things that fans wanted fixed

The problem is that for example, fans say the Mako had bad controls. Instead of fixing the Mako, they completely got rid of it, and then sort of replaced it with a very simplistic vehicle that doesn't do antwhere near the same things.

Fix =/= remove is my point.

Then the fans should be more specific in what they want instead. Fans complained, but offered no other example in return, then Bioware believes that the player does not want them.

[Captain_Obvious_au]

The-Person wrote...

Then the fans should be more specific in what they want instead. Fans complained, but offered no other example in return, then Bioware believes that the player does not want them.

Hardly. The fans were clear in what they wanted - how much clearer can you be than asking for something to be fixed?

[The-Person]

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...

The-Person wrote...

Then the fans should be more specific in what they want instead. Fans complained, but offered no other example in return, then Bioware believes that the player does not want them.

Hardly. The fans were clear in what they wanted - how much clearer can you be than asking for something to be fixed?

No they were not, they were clear on what they want fixed, but not how they wanted it to be fixed.

[Captain_Obvious_au]

The-Person wrote...

Captain_Obvious_au wrote...

The-Person wrote...

Then the fans should be more specific in what they want instead. Fans complained, but offered no other example in return, then Bioware believes that the player does not want them.

Hardly. The fans were clear in what they wanted - how much clearer can you be than asking for something to be fixed?

No they were not, they were clear on what they want fixed, but not how they wanted it to be fixed.

Do you think that would have anything to do with the fact that most fans aren't game designers?