129 réponses à ce sujet

[Chuvvy]

I think the series as a whole should have been layed out differently. ME1 should have been you getting your specter status. You'd do various missions with Nihlus and there would subtle hints to the reapers. The game would end directly after Edan Prime. ME2 would pick up where ME1 left off with Shepard waking up in the Medbay. ME2 would essentially have been ME1 but you would have a more personal drive to stop Saren based on the fact that he killed Nihlus.

[SSV Enterprise]

No, that version of ME1 wouldn't work. The main plot would be disconnected with the threat of the Reapers and how Saren would kill Nihlus at the end. You'd also end with a cliffhanger, rather than having a self-sufficient story that fits in a larger overarching story. Mass Effect 1 feels like a complete story, despite the looming threat of the Reapers at the end.

[Code_R]

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

[nelly21]

SSV, you are my new favorite forumite. Right on bro.

[N0touchi]

I would post what I think about this, but I have some calibrations to do.

[SSV Enterprise]

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?
Who are all these people?
How'd Garrus get those scars?
How'd Wrex suddenly unite his species?
Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?
Why do these geth suddenly have my back?
Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?
(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

Modifié par SSV Enterprise, 17 décembre 2010 - 08:31 .

[JrayM16]

Slidell505 wrote...

I think the series as a whole should have been layed out differently. ME1 should have been you getting your specter status. You'd do various missions with Nihlus and there would subtle hints to the reapers. The game would end directly after Edan Prime. ME2 would pick up where ME1 left off with Shepard waking up in the Medbay. ME2 would essentially have been ME1 but you would have a more personal drive to stop Saren based on the fact that he killed Nihlus.

That kind of serial plot arc is more suited to books than videogames.  Videogames, more than any other medium, really need a strong plot resolution with alot of excitement, especially when its an actiony kinda game.

[JrayM16]

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?
Who are all these people?
How'd Garrus get those scars?
Why do these geth have my back?
Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?
Why do these geth suddenly have my back?
Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?
(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

And this points back to the fact that ME2 is a set up plot rather than filler plot.

Post of the day.

[Praetor Knight]

[Code_R]

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?
Who are all these people?
How'd Garrus get those scars?
How'd Wrex suddenly unite his species?
Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?
Why do these geth suddenly have my back?
Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?
(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

Yep, filler. All completely trivial when you actually stop and think - the Reapers are STILL sat on the edge of the galaxy, waiting for ..... ME2's useless story line to end so they can invade? I enjoyed all the loyalty missions and character stuff, but the whole Collector thing is unecessary and waters down the real threat.

[SSV Enterprise]

Code_R wrote...

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?
Who are all these people?
How'd Garrus get those scars?
How'd Wrex suddenly unite his species?
Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?
Why do these geth suddenly have my back?
Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?
(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

Yep, filler. All completely trivial when you actually stop and think - the Reapers are STILL sat on the edge of the galaxy, waiting for ..... ME2's useless story line to end so they can invade? I enjoyed all the loyalty missions and character stuff, but the whole Collector thing is unecessary and waters down the real threat.

Praetor Shepard wrote...



[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie]

So, Wrex uniting the krogan is filler?  Mordin getting the cure is filler?  Getting geth help is filler?  Potentially using the Reapers' own technology against them is filler?  So, you wouldn't mind if all those results happened, and probably helped defeat the Reapers, for NO REASON AT ALL in ME3?

Idiot (id-ee-uht): 1.  A person without any sense of reason or intelligence 2.  People who don't think Mass Effect 2 had a story, ex.  Code R.

Modifié par SSV Enterprise, 18 décembre 2010 - 09:52 .

[Veex]

I the think the game's structure tends to interfere with the story's presentation. It isn't that the story isn't complete, but rather that the build up to the suicide mission and the missions involving the collectors get lost in a lot of character exposition. You spend so much time getting to know some interesting characters and their histories that the collectors becomes a secondary focus in the game.



It isn't that the story isn't complete but rather that it gets lost behind the real strength of the game, the characters.

[Rebel42]

I don't think that it's unnecessary, i think that it doesn't flow perfectly. There is a huge amount of focus on getting your team together and that kind of strays away from the central idea of the reapers. It could be better connected.

[clennon8]

Mass Effect is about the characters and the setting, which are tremendous. The plot is little more than serviceable. Just enjoy the ME games for what they are. BioWare has created something special.

[SSV Enterprise]

Those who say the plot was "minimal" or poorly presented are OK doing that. That's simply a matter of opinion, and they are entitled to it. It's just that those who say "there is no plot at all" or that the plot was filler and nonessential get me irritated. For goodness' sake, wait until ME3 comes out before indicting ME2 as pointless and a waste of time! What if TIM uses the Collector base to counter-indoctrinate the Reapers and enslave the galaxy under human rule? Would ME2 be so pointless then? NO!!!

[Zlarm]

I tend to agree with the OP.   And while enjoying a story is entirely subjective I'm not convinced that the quality of a story is entirely subjective.  

The fact of the matter is that 5/6 of ME2 was spent prepping for the last 1/6, which I find kind of disappointing.  It was also pretty much identical to the middle two chapters of DAO (gather allies and then confront side enemy) minus the actual conclusion.  That said the characters were all really well thought out and there was some good dialogue.   Hopefully the writers can come up with something a little substantial for the mainstoyline for the 3rd.  

Actually there's a good article over robot geek (ignore the inflammatory headline) that lists some pretty valid (IMO) complaints against  ME2 (story is one of them):  robotgeek.co.uk/

 I'm hoping that BioWare will address some of these for their third installment.

Modifié par Zlarm, 18 décembre 2010 - 10:52 .

[Dominus]

I may get flamed into the pit of hades for saying it, but what exactly is the point anymore of adding to this topic? ME2 has already been released, it's a fair guess by now that BW got the idea from countless topics like these, and considering how much plot is going to have to be concluded in ME3, it's safe to assume that the problems you may have found in terms of narrative from ME2 will be laid to rest.

[KingDan97]

Official description of ME2's STORY from the EA Store.



"Two years after Commander Shepard repelled invading Reapers bent on the destruction of organic life, a mysterious new enemy has emerged. On the fringes of known space, something is silently abducting entire human colonies. Now Shepard must work with Cerberus, a ruthless organization devoted to human survival at any cost, to stop the most terrifying threat mankind has ever faced.



To even attempt this perilous mission, Shepard must assemble the galaxy’s most elite team and command the most powerful ship ever built. Even then, they say it would be suicide.



Commander Shepard intends to prove them wrong.



The second chapter in the Mass Effect trilogy takes you to the darkest reaches of space, where you must uncover the mystery behind the disappearance of humans across many worlds. Prepare yourself for a suicide mission to save mankind. Travel the galaxy to assemble a team of soldiers and combat specialists, and launch an all-out assault on the heart of enemy territory."



Wow, how strange, they explicitly state that recruiting your team IS the story. Those weren't side missions and just because YOU don't view that as being the story doesn't mean it isn't. I could say Harry Potter was completely off topic because from the start it was CLEARLY all about Griphook and they barely even mentioned him but that doesn't mean that's what it was ACTUALLY about.



They made the game, they wrote the story and they decided from the onset what it was about. You are not deconstrucing literature, you're complaining because you missed the focus of a game. That's not on Bioware, it's on you.

[ReveurIngenu]

KingDan97 wrote...
Wow, how strange, they explicitly state that recruiting your team IS the story. Those weren't side missions and just because YOU don't view that as being the story doesn't mean it isn't.

Let's look at it from this point of view then: Just because YOU see it as being a story doesn't mean it is.

What happened at the end of ME1?  Without really going into spoilers, at the end of ME1, you expected to continue Shepard's mission to save the galaxy from the Reapers.  In ME2, what was the bulk of the game?  Recruiting members.  For what? For a trivial little mission that really doesn't mean crap when you look at the threat that the Reapers represent.

The whole little "Human colonies are disappearing" crap.  Who the hell cares about some human colonies when the entire galaxy is being threatened by the Reapers?  It's like worring about your couch burning when your entire house is on fire.  It's like, what the heck is that?  That's not what's important!  How the hell does that advance the story that you have to inform the galaxy of the Reaper threat, and then rally them up to fight off the Reapers?

ME2's story is so trivial and pointless to the big story (if looking at my example, the big story is that your whole house is burning, not just your unimportant little couch that can be so easily replaced, so why are you only worring about your damn couch?).  The big story in ME being the fight against the reapers.

ME2 fills perfectly its title of being a "side mission" in the big picture that is the fight against the reapers. You ask what is to be thought of irrelevant subjects such as Wrex unifying his people, etc.  In that case, why not have made ME2 be about Shepard having to go buy milk because he had run out.  It would be interesting (not really, but you get my point) but it's completely irrelevent to the story.  That's all backstory, that's all side story, that's all side missions, that's all bonus.  In no way does it constitute the continuation of the story that is the fight for the Galaxy against the Reapers.

ME2 is just one-big side mission made to put humans in the spotlight for the upcoming human-centered conclusion.  :pinched: The more I reflect on it, the more I feel like Bioware and EA really take us for brainless morons and the more I dislike ME2 and feel I will be heavily disappointed in ME3 (that is, if I even buy it).


Let's use my example one last time to demonstate how ridiculous the ME trilogy seems to be after ME1: 
ME1 -> Shepard notices the house is on fire, but no one else in the family notices.  ME1 is Shepard trying to inform the household of the threat that is the fire. 
ME2 -> Shepard, for an unknown reason, decides that only the couch is important.  While the whole house is starting to burn, his only concern is for the couch, which has begun taking flames.
ME3 (My guess) -> Shepard tells the other members of the househould that the couch is burning, and that if they don't all help put out the fire on the couch, it will spread to the rest of the house.  Except, the fire has no reason to start and to stop at the couch and the house could and should burn down because it is burning elsewhere, somewhere unrelated to the couch.  So why are they only concentrating their efforts on the couch?  Or rather, why is the fire only concentrating its efforts on the couch?  Why are we talking about the couch so much when the whole freakin' house is at stake???!!!

Prove me wrong Bioware!!  You had better<_<<_<

[PrinceLionheart]

Honestly ME2 felt more like a glorified expansion pack to me, from a simple storyline to streamlined gameplay and menus. Reveur posted a pretty good analogy for it, because, once again to me, a lot of the side missions felt like filler more than anything else.



People tend to use the "Middle of the Trilogy" defense, but even if then the game's story should be able to stand on it's own two feet instead of rely on being a lead in for the third part.

[ArmCast]

Mass Effect 2 was a gret game. It is in no way, shape or form as good as Mass Effect 1, but it is a great game in it's own right.



The loyalty missions and lack of comprehensive story killed it, IMO. Less is more, just look at the ME1 character roster - memorable characters. I would love to forget about Miranda, Jacob, Jack and friends.

[Skilled Seeker]

Code_R wrote...

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?
Who are all these people?
How'd Garrus get those scars?
How'd Wrex suddenly unite his species?
Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?
Why do these geth suddenly have my back?
Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?
(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

Yep, filler. All completely trivial when you actually stop and think - the Reapers are STILL sat on the edge of the galaxy, waiting for ..... ME2's useless story line to end so they can invade? I enjoyed all the loyalty missions and character stuff, but the whole Collector thing is unecessary and waters down the real threat.

This is a stupid argument. I could call ME1 filler then since the Reapers were sitting in dark space throughout that game too.

[Gibb_Shepard]

SSV Enterprise wrote...

Code_R wrote...

Totally agree, ME2 lacks a real central plot and is mostly filler. Skip it and go to part 3 and nobody would notice.

That's stupid. Skip it and there would be a LOT of weird questions in ME3.

Like, why the hell is Shepard working for Cerberus?

I think we can all safely assume that Shepard isn't working for CErberus in ME3. I mean in the description of the game it even says "Shepard, an Alliance Marine".

Who are all these people?

Can easily be introduced in ME3, Complete non issue.

How'd Garrus get those scars?

The man is not a mute, he can tell you what happenned.

How'd Wrex suddenly unite his species?

He has done no such thing. Most clans hate the way Wrex want the Korgan species to be.

Who is this salarian scientist and how'd he get the foundation of a cure?

Pretty insignificant buddy, the Krogan cure will take a very long time to finalize.

Why do these geth suddenly have my back?

I'll give you that one.

Why are the Reapers focusing on Earth and Humanity rather than hitting the whole galaxy equally?

This was such an unfortunate part of ME2. Making humans the only significant species to the reapers, making the series now human centric. Such a stupid and cliche, overdone way to take the story. But on-topic, yes that is a significant part of ME2.

(possibly) What are these weird humanoid bug that are working for the Reaper?

They're dead.

All these questions, and more, would go unanswered if you just skipped ME2.

In the end, their are little significant parts to ME2's story, and these could easily be incorporated into ME3. There wasn't much significance in the plot of ME2.

Modifié par Gibb_Shepard, 19 décembre 2010 - 01:38 .

[Skilled Seeker]

No the characters cannot be introduced in ME3 with the same level of depth and quantity as ME2. ME2 has a character driven story opposed to the narrative driven story of ME1. ME2's importance to the overarching plot will therefore depend on the treatment and impact of the ME2 characters in ME3.